Nephilim Jetfighter - Homebrew/House Rules

[Master Avoghai]

 

Have at it buddy, I am sure with your infinite game design experience you know exactly how it would effect a game.

That's not a problem of inifinte game design experience, and by the way you don't need to use a this superiot tone when discussing...

 

If YOUR fantastic tactical mind may find that 180pts for the current Nephilim version is fine then I think that all the DA subforum is totally yours and waits fot it... 

 

What I do is proposing a solution to make Nephilim more playable, just like do the OP... But of course, it's always easier to criticize.

 

Like I've said, I'm opened to any proposition, I just DO think that 180pts for A11 no transport flyer with such weapon is too much. S7 would not resolve the problem. It may be better of course, but would not make them worth 180pts. 

[shortysl]

The Tau flyer is not bad... 360° arc of fire with interception...And cheaper than ours...

Anyway... What about S7 rending?

+++EDIT+++

And yeah it was sarcasm

Yep its a decent flyer. Its not over the top and its priced appropriately. I believe that the current state of the Jetfighter a points reduction would make it viable. Like 20ish points would be good. Because if we wanted to be in the Tau flyer range we'd have to start dropping AV.

And rending, I might be able to get behind this. But it would have to remain at S6 rending. I don't think there is anything out there that is S7 Rending(I know GKs get it but they pay 20ish points to upgrade to it )

>I honestly don't think that people are trying to get an overpowered flier here, we're making suggestions as to how it can perform it's intended role effectively. It's supposed to be an air superiority fighter but it can't successfully engage fliers. I think you'll find there are a number of reasonable suggestions for houserules on here.

I agree with you here. But Smurfalypse was only saying that because he believes, as do I, that adding Armor Bane to these missiles would make them over the top. When creating homebrewed rules that are balanced, one has to look at other things in the game to draw inspiration from. Now I just did a quick look in the new codices and the Reference chart for weapons in the BRB and found no ranged weapon with armor bane. So one has to assume that it wasn't meant to be on a ranged weapon.

Oh I completely agree about Armourbane. Too much.

[cypherkk]

Yes but if it was armor bane and sky fire, it would be snap firing at ground targets. Another option would be to make them hunter killers, but I think that would be over board vrs. Ground targets.

 

As its it's about 40 pts. More than a comparably equipped storm talon, if not more.

[Master Avoghai]

@cypherkk : I get what you mean. The only problem is how the flyer rule are made. They state the flyer may choose if it passes in a flyer or ground shooting mode at the beginning of the turn. Hence, Flyers are ALREADY considered as skyfire BUT also have the possibility to shoot at ground target. What you propose enters in contradiction with the generic rule and leaves room for interpretation and hot debate :D

 

Maybe rending is enough. It wouldn't change anything against light flyer (since a 6 already means a penetrating hits for them) but helps against heavy flyers.

[cypherthefallenangel]

I think the nef really just needs a little tweeking like.

Cost 150pts

Mega bolter change to 48”, 5shots, S6 ap3 ,pinning.

Black sword missiles change to 48”, S7 ap2

optional- replace heavy bolter with tllc for + 20 pts.

with just these small changes you could actually fill several roles well.

Air to air (anti-teq)

2 tllc and 6 missiles for 170pts.

Air to ground(anti-infantry)

Mega bolter, tl heavy bolter, and 6 missiles for 150pts.

Air to ground(anti-tank/mc)

Mega bolter, tl lascannon, and 6 missiles for 170pts.

With these changes alone, I think that its better balanced and point effective, but not so OP that everyone must take in every list.

[Azrell]

The thing that always got me about the neph is that the missiles are basically the same as the storm talon on the model yet far far worse. It may have been that GW just forgot to add some super awesome missile rules into the rulebook or more likely they made the new guy do the codex no on wanted to do and he phoned it in. But it might be worth changing them to be in line with the storm talon ones that are Heavy 3, 60' range, str7 ap4 and TL those bad boyz. That makes it a slightly better auto cannon but much more useful vs all kinds of targets. 

 

If its going to remain a missile it really needs to make you wanna use a 1 shot weapon sparingly, like in the case of oh say every version of the stormraven. So armor bane, rending or even BLIND! (keeping with the apparently new DA theme), maybe the option to pick from a list of 3 special rules when you shoot like sternguard ammo,  would be better suited to them. Interceptor would be nice one too, as missiles are one shot and firing 2 in the movement phase dosnt degrade your next shooting phase because you just fire 2 different missiles! 

 

Another thing i noticed about both planes is that one may have originally been the upgrade of the other, considering target lock would have worked on the dark talon but was on neph. Again i think vetock just sent it right to print without testing or even prof reading. 

[captain sox]

I think the NJF needs minor tweeking as stated.

 

Avenger should be bumped to Heavy 7, about half the rate of fire for the Vulcan Mega Bolter. There should be the option to swap out the TLHB for a TLLC... or better yet, TL Plasma Canons! If not that swap, at least make the Missiles Strength 7.

 

I love the look of the Neph, and I really want to use one, or 2 (or 3)... I'm like most, I just find it's stats are a bit "meh".

 

Sox