Death Company power weapon options

[Sanguine Eternal]

So I have 10 more DC jumpers to build.  I typically run per 10 man squad 2 power weapons, 2 power fists and a thunder hammer.  I don't think it's too over kill, as it gives me a good variety of what I can assault and wipe out.

Now, my main question is regarding the power weapons.

I have 2 power swords in the first squad, and I wanted to mix it up maybe in my second squad.  So lets look at the options!

I was really thinking 2 power lances...  I know they are only good on the charge, but thats only against MEQ, and nothing should be alive after first round anyways, but besides that, a str.6 ap 3 on the charge at initiative is pretty damn good.

Power axes are an option as well.  But with 2 power fists in their already for the high strength AP 2 attacks, is it worth it?

Or do I just stick with the meat and potatoes power sword?

I wasn't really going to bring up the power maul, because I don't think its a serious option for +2 Str AP 4 (even though hitting at str 7 on a charge is nice.)  Plus 1 power maul is enough with a chaplain...

So their it is.  What are your thoughts given my load current load out to accompany the 2 additional power weapon slots??

 

[marine7312000]

I'd say take the swords. But I simply like BA with swords.

[knife&fork]

Power fists. They can hurt anything in the game and there are more high T targets out there than ever.

Lances are really bad when you get countercharged or stuck in combat. Everyone who plays fantasy know how much trouble you can get when you roll poorly on the charge....

Axes are too weak to be worth going at I1.

Swords are ok I guess, but kinda expensive on an already costly unit.

Hammers are not that bad, but the 5 extra points you pay for concussive are very situational.

Mauls just suck because of the AP4. Can't remember the last time a chaplain killed anything...

[Kanis]

I'm actually in the same boat while finishing/building my DC! I've got 2 powerfists planned, and wanted to try using a sword and Hammer as well, but wasn't sure if the hammer is too much with two fists already? x-x Tis tough deciding with such a squad, Brothers!

[Xenith]

Large squads (8-10) should take two powerfists, imo.

 

Smaller cheap squads (5-6) can take an axe or two to deal with stuff, as anything that you would need a powerfist to kill will more than likely kill off a smaller squad first.

 

If you have other stuff to deal with 2+ saves, then take either swords, or more marines. 

[knife&fork]

2 fists sounds tempting, but together with a pod and melta pistol that's 100 pts in upgrades on a 200 pt unit.

 

Usually you can force a few wounds by numbers alone. DC really shouldn't tangle with mass 2+ anyway...

[Sanguine Eternal]

@knife&fork

Yes the power lances seem very situational.  I guess I'm really using all my of games with 20 dc as a reference.  Any unit that they have charged, was wiped out.  They have rarely been locked in combat, other than a few with a mc at the end of a game, which I had a power fist left only anyways.  Failed charges shouldn't be happening with jp's unless I'm attempting a 6"+ charge.  JP's get the re-roll if they were not used in the movement phase.

 

But at the same time, I don't exactly want to be forking over points for a power lance for it to be treated basically as a chainsword.  If my opponent knows what's good for him, he would charge my dc to prevent me from getting re-rolls in combat.

I already have the 2 fists, though having an extra or 2 would guarantee me taking down a wraithknight for sure turn 1 assault.  I lucked out the other day charging one with Astorath and 2 dc, 1 with pf.  Killed it with full wounds, but just barely.

Fists are good, I will try to wiggle some points in their for some, but I don't know if I can without taking away marines.  Other than that, I guess I'll just stick with power swords I guess.  Unless someone else sways me a different direction.

In regards to charging a unit of 2+.  They can absolutely do it if they have 2 fists and a hammer.  Average squad size will be 5 unless its DA. (Who plays them anyways :P )  12 str.9 ap 2 attacks with re-rolls.  Their all dead.  I'd say 10 of those of getting through.  Lets not forget the amount of 1's that will be rolled when 30+ wounds are inflicted with chainswords as well...

[Sanguine Eternal]

@Kanis

I don't think the hammer is too much with the fists.  On the other hand, as was mentioned before, 5 additional points for concussive...  Their isn't anything alive usually after first round charge with 10+ dc if you have 2 fists, 1 hammer, and 2 power swords.

It's worth it if you plan to tangle with a mc for a couple turns though.

[knife&fork]

@knife&fork

 

In regards to charging a unit of 2+.  They can absolutely do it if they have 2 fists and a hammer.  

 

Of course they can, 10 DC with a chaplain even have decent chance of wiping 10 hammernators on the charge with just BPs and chainswords. :)

 

It's more a question of what's points effective. 

[Sanguine Eternal]

This is true.  Even just the bare bones bp/cs in a squad of 10 are just lethal.  Can't say I have really encountered a situation where I have found myself assaulting a squad with a 2+ at the moment anyways.

EDIT:

I found myself really wanting the power lances, so I decided to convert 2 of the blade encarmines to lances by using the power axes shafts to extend the base of the swords.  Situational, yes.  But I think combined with furious charge they will come in handy.  Wounding on 2's for a lot of cases at initiative is pretty nice.  Plus I like my models to stand out and look different.

I finished kitbashing the last 5 that will accompany Lemartes, now I have to kitbash the last 5 that will go with Astorath.  

[Judaz]

Why is everyone dismissing the maul so fast? I face a lot of Eldar, and those Wraithblades are kinda hard to bring down with S4-5. And when those cowardly Eldar witches cast that hellish power that lowers my strength, I love having a couple of power mauls in the squad. I usually bring just one fist and two mauls in my 10 man DC. 

 

Most other enemies, with T4, goes down to pistol whipping. 

[knife&fork]

Why is everyone dismissing the maul so fast? I face a lot of Eldar, and those Wraithblades are kinda hard to bring down with S4-5. 

 

Because it's AP4 :P

 

Just about everything in an eldar list has a 3+ save, losing two thirds of inflicted wounds to saves usually matter more than a blip of strength. There are situations where the maul is better than other power weapons, but they are not very common. And in the situations where the maul excels the fist is better still.

[Sanguine Eternal]

As knife&fork said.  It's AP4.  Might as well be a chainsword at that point.  Striking at Str.7 (with furious charge) is nice and all, but when it's AP4 it doesn't really matter since that high toughness model that you're trying to wound and benefit that str.7, is going to have a regular armour save of probably 3+ or better.

I just think I would rather inflict str.5 or 6 AP 3 over str.7 ap4 any day (at initiative) and force an invulnerable save.  In a perfect world we're getting the assault, so we are getting our re-rolls.  Which is HUGE.  That is also why I went with 2 power lances in my last squad of 10 DC.  The str.6 ap3 on the charge should help against the higher toughness units.  I'll play test it out next week and see how it goes, hopefully against some eldar as well.  I've been having a hard time with their shenanigans.

[Office temp]

Except my reclusiarch has killed many chaos champs with his crozious, wounding on 2s forcing them to take a lot of saves

[Sanguine Eternal]

Yes, but a str.5 power sword with AP3, and wounding on 3's  on a T4 character with re-rolls will probably work out to roughly the same. The big difference is your are potentially forcing an invul save.  Power mauls are junk in 6th.  I love the idea of clubbing someone to death with a mace, but I wouldn't ever purchase them.

That is why I give all my chaplains or reclusiarch's power fists as well.

[Judaz]

But I would still rather wound a Wraithblade on a 4 than a 6, even if he gets his 3+. When it comes to those blades, they usually have a 2+ anyways, so the sword ain't doing anything. 

 

Sword, wounds on a 6 (5 on the charge, unless the DC is debuffed), removes armoursave if the witches hasn't buffed it up (down) to 2+

Axe, wounds on a 5 (4 on the charge, unless blah blah), removes all armoursaves, hits last.

Maul, wounds on a 4 (3 on charge), most armoursaves allowed. 

Fist, kills all, hits last.

 

You pay 15pts for a sword that, vs a 2+ enemy, don't do anything a chainsword and slugga boltpistol won't do equally good. 

And I agree, the fist is better, but it also costs a lot more. In a perfect world I could afford fists on half the squad. 

 

And as I said, I face a lot of Wraithblades, so that +2 S is worth more than AP3. 

 

Damn Eldar trickery.

[Sanguine Eternal]

Sounds like we are both just using our games as reference.  You see, I've never fought wraithguard/bladses.  I've fought wraithknights.  The highest toughness units I find I am fighinting lately would be either a wraithknight or riptide, surrounded by T3 or T4, and the MC are easily dealt with the fists.

So I find that swords or AP3 is handled better at my LGS where as you are finding mauls are better used.

 

[Office temp]

And that's why I magnetize my DC, so I can swap the beat stick based on seasonal meta. Chainswords if I'm running cheap, power sword for meq, and the maul for lots of Zeno or mechanized (5 st 7 blows to the rear armor rarely fails).

[Crusader Bob]

I think a maul or two will not harm, there are a lot of uses. I know AP4 is a turn off, but against high T models or tanks has a place. It's concussive, which is no small bonus, acts at initiative and gets the second weapon bonus. Not as strong as a PF, but looks very good all things considered.

Seems mauls are vastly underestimated, i personally like them, though i admit i'm not a competitive player so minmaxing a list is not something i do.

If you ask me, i'd sprinkle every kind of PWs in a army, to be flexible.

[Sanguine Eternal]

Both very good points.  I don't magnetize anything because I like to glue them in a custom pose, and I've never really tried to do it with how my models are positioned anyways.  I just buy more models if I need the options!  It's not exactly an economical choice, but I really like how they all turn out.  Plus like seeing a giant blob of Death Company.

I will eventually get around to posting up some pics of my Death Company army.  I have 2 more dreadnoughts to build, and waiting for forgeworld DC rhino doors.

Things to paint: 10 more jp DC, 2 dreads, 2 drop pods, 1 rhino.

Maybe I will model some power mauls in there in the future just for fun.

[Memento Of Prospero]

At the very least, magnetize your Jump Packs brother. It's an easy process and will give you much flexibility when you look to field a mob of 25 DC in a spartan Land Raider.

[Sanguine Eternal]

That's easier said than done for at least 10 of them... I kitbashed the sang guard wings on the 10 that accompany Astorath.  I repositioned the wings and had to glue them to both the back and jump packs, even to the tops of some of the shoulders, they were tricky little buggers.  The other 10 go with Lemartes and have the standard jump packs.
 

I do have 10 with bolters and no jps, so I can always make more!  I'm always a sucker for more DC!  I should be more frugal with my money...  But I like having lots of models.

 

I did look for some the other day at Michaels, but they were all out of those really small, super strong ones.  Another time perhaps.  I don't think I will risk cutting back packs off while their all painted and fragile though.  When I decide to start magnetizing, I'll do it from the beginning.

I just looked up that Spartan LR from FW.  Looks like 300 points of awesomeness.  Too bad its 'experimental' rules, but that would be awesome to try out.

[Memento Of Prospero]

I will be converting one once the rules become approved. The trolling potential is just too good to pass.

[knife&fork]

And I agree, the fist is better, but it also costs a lot more. In a perfect world I could afford fists on half the squad. 

 

Look at it this way; the fist will almost triple the wound output while having the added benefits of a S8/9 AP2 weapon against other targets. Isn't that worth a measly 10 pts compared to the maul? 

 

 

At the very least, magnetize your Jump Packs brother. It's an easy process and will give you much flexibility when you look to field a mob of 25 DC in a spartan Land Raider.

 

I think having about 30 of each is the optimal solution. :P 

[Sanguine Eternal]

And I agree, the fist is better, but it also costs a lot more. In a perfect world I could afford fists on half the squad.

Look at it this way; the fist will almost triple the wound output while having the added benefits of a S8/9 AP2 weapon against other targets. Isn't that worth a measly 10 pts compared to the maul?

>At the very least, magnetize your Jump Packs brother. It's an easy process and will give you much flexibility when you look to field a mob of 25 DC in a spartan Land Raider.

I think having about 30 of each is the optimal solution.

I'd say odd's are you are killing more with a fist as well, and at str.9, your able to auto glance most vehicles to death in the rear. 10pts well spent.

I am well on my way!

Minor setback in the priming tonight. Have to strip the 10 dc, and the dread. Shouldn't have rushed it. I primed them outside tonight, and the colder weather screw them up. The black primer dried grey first coat, so I sprayed again, same thing, but now all the detail is gone, and its still a whitish grey. Not very happy about it. Sets my plans back a couple days now. Should have just waited till the morning to prime...