First foray into Guard, (several questions)

[Guest]

Hello fellow guard players, I have just started collecting and putting together a guard army to serve (initially) as allies for my DIY space marine chapter. I have several questions that I am looking for input on.

 

First, how to play them:

Massed infantry has always appealed to me, this is somewhat how I play my space marines as I usually field 3-4 full tactical squads, but obviously with guard, the numbers are even greater. What I'm looking to do is use my guard to provide some long-range fire support to my closer range space marines. To this end, I've acquired several squads of guardsmen, some heavy weapons teams, a few basilisks and a Leman Russ, hopefully ill be adding more of everything to the collection shortly. Any suggestions on how to best synergize with my space marines? I'm currently envisioning a gun line, providing general suppressive fire for the more surgical strikes of my SM, who will be moving up the board in rhinos or other transports. I've built one squad of mortar teams to this end and have three basilisks needing work, to provide that long range support. I also plan on using an infantry platoon to provide a buffer around the tanks and to park on any home objectives. Any thoughts, suggestions or ideas for what to acquire next or how to build what I already have are appreciated.

 

Second, how to model them:

The background I am currently writing for them, has my Chapter and their Guard allies fighting in defense of the hive city Tryrain. Therefore I have been modeling their bases in an urban rubble strewn manner. I feel like with the SMs which i have already done, the rubble is too generic and does not show that they are fighting in a city well enough, to that end, I am trying to show more of the city streets in my basing and have tried something new with the heavy weapons squads which I've done so far. So now some pictures to illustrate what I've done and what I'm currently trying:

bases which I've already done for my Space Marines:

http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz322/mgm6241/Mobile%20Uploads/B9285438-D5DF-4FF8-AB80-D0F38D3C8245_zps8uywv3lb.jpg

I feel like this is effective, but not quite to the level that I would like my basing to be, especially for larger bases

 

Attempt at something a little more involved for the base of my Knight:

http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz322/mgm6241/Mobile%20Uploads/8CCC8374-D7CF-4983-90BD-D547DFDD1B5A_zpsfenw0c9y.jpg

I like the sculpted crater, but feel like its just kinda stuck there and doesn't quite blend with the rest of the base. 

 

And a base from Secret Weapon Miniatures which is my inspiration for what I would like to achieve eventually:

http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz322/mgm6241/Mobile%20Uploads/5884D9AC-CBA0-4CC0-9F31-5760CA945533_zpsehkt4lde.jpg

 

Finally heres what Ive done so far with my heavy weapons bases:

http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz322/mgm6241/Mobile%20Uploads/A522C0E7-8552-4B05-ADEC-775B5DD3969D_zpsonsmxfkw.jpg

 

http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz322/mgm6241/Mobile%20Uploads/33905B52-0E74-433C-985B-71397F1B8248_zpsbvtyes75.jpg

 

http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz322/mgm6241/Mobile%20Uploads/647CCA6F-D6CB-44C4-9669-7F210169B7F4_zpsqwak04yd.jpg

 

Im trying to use cardboard rectangles to represent the pavement underneath all the rubble and such which I think will bring across that its not just an ash wasteland, but a ruined city that my army is fighting across. Has anyone tried anything similar or have any other suggestions? The other thing i was thinking about was investing in some of the GW pavement textured paint. Has anyone used this and have any suggestions on how or whether it might help? Sorry for the length of this post, but I have a lot of questions for the IG community. Thanks in advance for your help. I really excited about starting this new army. 

[Vash]

Well you could go with many approaches with the Guard. 

How to get a good synergy with them and SM is totally up to your play style and choices. Hard to answer. But what the SM have is durability. So I would focus on getting objective holding SM for your guard. In that way your guard can focus on killing the enemy form afar, while the space marines go for the objectives. 

[WarriorFish]

Welcome to the Guard, you'll find a good match between them and Marines :D As Vash said they're opposites in the elite and numbers scale so can easily fit to those roles and support each other for mutual gain. A force to hold back and provide long ranged fire is a solid and reliable Guard army to work with your Marines plus they can offer numerical support on the advance too with infantry or veterans and Chimeras too.

 

The Guard codex is versatile so there is much that can be done, but it looks like you have a good idea of what you want to do already :) Be careful lobbing pie plates of doom around such as Basilisk shells as they could easily cause some friendly fire! Your themes sound cool too, the bases look good and I reckon they'll turn up well once you've got some modelling sand and paint on them :tu:

[Guest]

Thank you both for your encouragement and advice, I'm looking forward to seeing where this goes. My dream eventually is to play an apocalypse game with a full company of space marines supported by a large number of Guard in a super fluffy battle against the enemies of the imperium. This is the first step towards that goal. I will definitely be updating my progress as i go. 

One more question: I've built my two infantry squads with grenade launchers, thinking that the range would synergize better with the lasgun than would a flamer. Ive also built my first heavy weapons team as mortars, is this generally considered a good idea or no? I like the range and flexibility offered by indirect fire - though obviously ill have to be careful not to hit my own guys. I was thinking that my next heavy weapon squad would be lascannons to provide some long range anti-tank. What's the general consensus on how to kit out special weapons and heavy weapons in infantry platoons?

[Thoqqu]

Autocannons provide a good mixture of firepower and shots so that seems to be the weapon of choise for platoons.

It's not a lascannon when it comes to killing but the thing with guard is numbers. Keep it cheap and have many of it.

If you want to have hwt with a lascannon put it in a command squad that has bs4.

 

When it comes to special weapons people generally suggest flamers to compensate for the bs 3 of regular guardsmen but grenade launchers can work.

Not sure about how effective mortars are but I intend to get some later on just for style. Same as taking enginseers with heavy bolter servitors...

 

If you want something akin to mortars that is effective then go for Wyverns.

[WarriorFish]

Even better, a full company of Marines with Guard support will be a sight to see! :D

 

Grenade launchers are a good infantry squad weapon as they're cheap and offer some versatility. Along with flamers they're my favourite weapons for them as they can also stay mobile. Mortars are overshadowed by Wyverns now, but they have the advantage of being part of a Platoon and scoring so I still like to use a squad to hold ground in my deployment zone and lob death.

 

As Thoqqu said autocannons are a great weapon in general and also well suited to infantry squads. Lascannons are heavy hitters but expensive, especially on a BS3 platform - you'll want to supplement them somehow by using orders for example. Melta and plasma guns are very useful special weapons, but being more expensive and used against some of the nastiest foes you'll mostly see them on BS4 models to get a better chance of hitting like Veteran squads.

[Vash]

Grenade launchers are an excellent choice if you ask me. As you say, it works well with lasguns. If you miss with the grenade launcher, you won't cry a river over it. If it hits, it will hurt your opponent :)

Against most armies (except Space marines/Chaos space marines) the AP4 the grenade launcher provides is really good. And vs horde armies, the frag grenade is a good option. 

 

As for heavy weapon squads, they need to complement what you are missing. If you need anti tank, go for the lascannons. Sure its expensive, but still pretty cheap compared to others. 

Add a psyker of some kind and you can cast divination spells to get re-rolls. 

Mortars are not bad, but as others have said, the Whyvern has rendered it less interesting as a choice. 

I usually think of the weapon choices like this:

 

Lascannon - Anti Tank AV12-14, and 2+ heavy units (terminators)

Autocannon - Anti transport, usually AV 10 - 12. Also good vs infantry of any kind (good volume of fire and high strength). 

Heavy bolter - Anti infantry

Missile launcher - Anti transport, anti infantry. Combined with for example plasma guns in a veterans unit this combo can be devastation vs space marine units. Expensive though. 

Mortar - Anti horde

 

For fluff reasons I usually take Missile launchers or heavy bolters. I could go for mortars too. I field a mobile army, and heavy weapons that slow the units down to much, doesn't fit in the army theme. 

[Guest]

I like the idea of just putting weapons which fit thematically into the army. To that end I'm thinking about adding lascannons, missile launchers and either heavy bolters or auto cannons. Theme has alway been more important to me than a purely competitive list. Thank you for your suggestions.

[Guest]

My second batch of guard figures have arrived (thank you ebay) I now have an entire Cadian Defense Force to construct. My first project will be the CCS. Considering that my planned tactics involve a mostly stationary gun line, I am thinking that building this squad to support my other forces is going to be the way to go. Im thinking that all additional points spent on them will be to keep them alive rather than to make them more killy. I'm thinking banner, vox and medic and then armor and camp gear. Thats pretty much it. I think ill keep them with las-guns as far as weapons go. Thoughts?

[WarriorFish]

That's a good build, should give them good survival odds. You could save points by dropping the banner and one of the carapace or camo upgrades if you needed. A Chimera is the best protection for a CCS though!

[Guest]

so I've started work on my first few models to try out the color scheme. I've got a leman russ and a cadian worked up. i went for a dark urban camo which i hope will work well with my space marines without felling like they're matched too intentionally. neither model is 100% finished but i wanted some feed back.

here they are. let me know what you think:

http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz322/mgm6241/Mobile%20Uploads/790ECA33-8A66-40E0-A1C1-4C1482148495_zpsgbznf5ab.jpg

http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz322/mgm6241/Mobile%20Uploads/BCED23A5-A19A-47BD-837B-6028D8C9EA71_zpsm8trzqo2.jpg

http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz322/mgm6241/Mobile%20Uploads/59F8970A-29AB-4010-99F5-D0068367E349_zpskxi4br5c.jpg

http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz322/mgm6241/Mobile%20Uploads/DD5D787D-F44E-405C-8BD5-AA55F4FACB8C_zpsnf4tsly1.jpg

 

[WarriorFish]

The trooper looks good though I'm not sure on the red details. The tank's camouflage is really nice, I'll be very keen to see more tanks painted up like that :tu:

[Guest]

the red details are to tie the guard force to my space marine chapter's colors. I think I might add some sort of insignia on the shoulder armor or helmet to help it look like the red details aren't quite so random. the trooper was painted in a method designed to be as quick as possible so that I could re-create it in an efficient manner with the 50+ guardsmen that I have managed to acquire.

 

I'm glad that the vehicle camo turned out alright. Its my first time trying to camouflage a vehicle and i was not quite sure how it would work.

I have 3 or 4 basilisks to do as well as 2 more leman russes and a chimera so there will be many more vehicles with the same camo. 

[Guest]

http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz322/mgm6241/Mobile%20Uploads/43EE1630-8E59-4390-AB73-C4266312A2AB_zpsxdbdlxdm.jpg

 

Well I've certainly started guard. On the table I have: 3 leman russes, 3 basilisks, 1 chimera, 15 heavy weapons teams, 1 commissar, and at least 80 guardsmen, probably closer to 100, maybe more including command squads, some are on sprue, some need primer, some need repair, some need to be stripped and re-painted, and a lone guardsman is painted at this point. With this many models on my plate, I think it's time that I start an official WIP thread. Im going to put it into the general WIP section to showcase some of the previous power armored models that I've completed, and will begin to work in some of the fluff of this particular detachment. Look for that to be posted in the next few days. Thank you for all your help in getting this going, I really appreciate all the input i got from you all. 

[WarriorFish]

A sight to see, the start of a good Guard army :D You'll be a master of production line work by the time you're finished with these sprues :tu: I look forward toy our WIP topic as we can never have enough of them :)