Convinced! Need help with Night lords

[KBA]

Jasp - Has it gotten that bad?

[ThatOneMarshal]

Thanks guys for all the help so far. I never realized how much enthusiasm there is on this subforum. I had to turn off my phone in the middle of class today because I kept getting replys from everyone lol. I was wondering if I were to start would I start with the legion book and isstvan campaign book? Would I be missing a lot of things if I choose to go that way instead of buying all if the books seperatly?Also I saw someone mention 20 man squads...YOU CAN DO THAT!? That is amazing because the next army I was considering was funny enough a horde army. I was also wondering how are close combat troops? There was a thread were it was said that assualt squads are pretty expensive so no one uses them because of points.

 

And for the final question picking a legion. All of them look exciting. I was thinking of just reading the books. I'm reading horus rising and the sons of horus look fun. Also black templars I mean imperial fists or night lords I'm leaning a little bit on. Though I'm open for suggestions on how to figure it out.

 

I think I'm convinced lol. You people are heretics who plant the seeds of Corruption in people. Also price will work out due to my birthday coming up in a couple of week so I might end up buying the books and a small squad and go on from there...

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

And for the final question picking a legion. All of them look exciting.

 

Eventually, something you read about one or more of the Legions will sink its hooks into you. The books are always recommended, but they don't cover all of the Legions in equal amounts. If you get the first three Heresy books from Forge World, there is a lot of history on each Legion covered in their respective book and this might go further to helping you choose one.

 

Something else to keep in mind is where in the timeline you want to put your army. At the start of the Great Crusade when all were still essentially loyalists? In the throes of the Heresy where the shock of betrayal has worn off and both sides are now fully engaged in killing the other? Or at the tail end, leading up to, or even at, the Siege of Terra?

 

Not to make you decision even harder, but there a lot of angles to consider that will ultimately determine the character and flavor of your army.

[KBA]

I'd also strongly factor the color of paint your chosen Legion subscribes to. I've been a Heresy Raven Guard faithful for a couple years now, and am just now rethinking my entire decision as I don't really like painting black. At all. Money down the drain!

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

Ah yes, the paint. Good point, KBA. Some colors, like yellow, black, and white are notoriously difficult to do well. There's also the risk of getting bored with it, as KBA mentioned, so there's yet another important factor to consider.

[GhostMalone]

Jasp - Has it gotten that bad?

You got no idea how bad the nerds in my area is turning out :/

 

Gotta say that's putting it lightly

 

Edit: on topic 30k is about love of the hobby

[Castiel]

Jasp - Has it gotten that bad?

Yes. When people start bringing transcendant C'tan or 7 wave serpents to games you know all the joy has been sucked out of it.

[Brother-Chaplain Kage]

More on topic, a lot of this same info has been covered in the pinned Legion for You thread.

[Kor'Vesh]

Just a further note on the forgeworld books for you marshal - the two red books give you the most upto date rules for the legion army list, and each of the 12 legions that have rules. These books are the quick way in to the game. The big books are all about the hobby really - the first three cover four legions. Each has some stunning background on them, great artwork and the rules for legion specific units. There are various campaign systems too, as well as the background to the campaigns they cover. I love my big books, and can't recommend them enough!

 

Book 1 has the original legion astartes list, along with rules for world eaters, death guard, sons of Horus and emperor's children.

Book 2 has iron hands, salamanders, word bearers and night lords. There is also the legio cybernetica list, and some additional units for the astartes in general.

Book 3 has imperial fists, iron warriors, raven guard and alpha legion. There is the full mechanical list too.

Book 4 dosent have legion rules, but a bit more background, particularly on sons of Horus and death guard. It has rules for solar auxillia and Knights. It is actually an amazing book - the background and campaign system is great.

 

If you have a good idea of you legion already, and it's in a big book, then I'd recommened that big book soon. If not the red books and some black library heresy books are a good idea.

 

The heresy is awesome, and you can take it as slow or fast as you like (or can afford). Everyone on here is really enthusiastic and encouraging, so share your work with us, and we'll help all we can!

[jeremy1391]

The way I find my crack... Errrrr I mean hobby is I pull out a $20 every week when I put gas in my car, over a few months I've amassed a few hundred dollars that I'm planning on on dropping on a resin order from forge world :)

 

Also play fists because we have a Sigusmund ;)

[Relict]

If you are teetering on 30K and want to see an actual army, you are welcome to check out mine. I see you are in the San Francisco Bay Area as well. I typically go the GW store in Union City for paints and such. PM me and we can schedule a meeting or something. 

[ThatOneMarshal]

So I found that nice pinned topic were I can ask about the legion for me so I'll head over there something I was wondering is there any really weak and really strong legions? I was wondering because in 40k the chapter tactics aren't exactly balanced all the way for example when compared to ultra marines the raven guard chapter tactics are weak. I just finished reading horus rising (which is absoultely amazing) and I was wondering what is the second book in the series also what legions are in the book and is it good?

 

The big question I have is how shall I get started model wise? Any bundles of models you would recommend that can be used with any of the legions? I was wondering are the bundles that forgeworld provide like the GW ones were it just saves you a click or do actually get something out of it? Also not something with tons of detail I've never worked with resin so it would be nice to learn to ropes a bit.

 

Book wise I was wondering if the three main books contain a lot of fluff and artwork that isn't from the black library. By that I mean is there a lot of copy and paste material in their? Also soemone said that the book is written like a military campaign which sounds awsome. Is the book worth $110? I'm leaning towards the big books a bit because they seem to have more going on with them and that I wanted to go slowly with the legions.

 

@relict I'll have to stop by sometime! I live in concord so union city around 40 minutes for me. I'm down at black diamond games as well.

 

As whole thank you guys so much. You have been very helpful! It a funny but it feels weird to not had any form of doom and gloom at all it feels....unnatural. :)

 

Happy crusading.

[1ncarnadine]

FW bundles actually give you a 10% discount, which is nice. So definitely try and find bundles that work for you if you can.

 

The 2nd book is False Gods, and the third part of the intro trilogy is Galaxy in Flames. 

 

As far as rules go, yes there's a slight disparity with the legion-wide rules themselves although sometimes the special units or characters make up for it. The Iron Warriors are a great example: weak legion rules, amazing Tyrant Siege Terminators, solid characters, beastly primarch. Iron Hands, Imperial Fists, Salamanders and Alpha Legion are usually considered the top tier for legion rules, if you're wondering.

[depthcharge12]

You can't go wrong with getting the third book as that has all the IF fluff and special rules in it, however you'll also need to get the first red small book too (crusade legions list).

 

I assume you are going IF yes?

 

Any of the bundles are discounted and an awesome deal. I'd recommend getting 2 squads of 20 marines (yes you can do that in the HH!!! And give them additional ccws! :D).

 

For the fists the basic tactical blob will be your bread and butter and you can add apothecaries to them as well to increase their durability. All IF get +1 BS when using bolter weapons...so enjoy.

 

Other than that, you'll need a praetor (chapter master equivalency, but better) unless you want a consul of some choice.

 

Your next purchase should either be a Sicaran tank or a contemptor mortis dreadnought with two kheres assault cannons. Both are pretty commonplace, especially in new lists, as they put down a hell of a lot of superior firepower for their points cost.

[Slips]

Or wait for Polux to drop for your HQ choice.

[1ncarnadine]

Or rather than a Contemptor Mortis, grab the new Deredeo if its aesthetic works for you. Some seem to hate it; I love it. As an AA/fire support platform it's pretty much better in just about every way compared to the Mortis, except maybe the twin Kheres or twin Lascannon Mortis, but those suffer from limited range and limited shots respectively.

[Slips]

Or rather than a Contemptor Mortis, grab the new Deredeo if its aesthetic works for you. Some seem to hate it; I love it. As an AA/fire support platform it's pretty much better in just about every way compared to the Mortis, except maybe the twin Kheres or twin Lascannon Mortis, but those suffer from limited range and limited shots respectively.

Then again, with 4 S8 Sunder Shots and 3 S6 Missiles at 60" which can fire at different or the same targets, the Deredeo will technically have an easier time bringing armor and flyers down than a Lascannon/Autocannon Mortis.

 

The only thing that puts the Kheres ahead is volume of fire and Rending. But it has half the range and costs as much as a kitted out Deredeo.

 

The missile can also hit things not in LoS; so turn 1, at 60" you can +/- kill 3 marines right off the bat since its Ap 3. It also has pinning to boot.

 

 

Edit: So, for starters, you can make a decent 1k Heresy force that can serve as a starting point.

 

HQ: 

Alexis Polux ~165

 

Troops:

20 Man Tac Blob; Artificer Armor, Power Fist, Vexilla 285

20 Man Tac Blob; Same as Above 285

 

Heavy Support:

Deredeo Dreadnought; Missile Launcher, Autocannons 220 (240 with armored ceramite)

 

Leaves you with 45 Points to play with; maybe add an Apothecary to the Squad Polux will be joining.

[Durfast Spiritwolf]

Or wait for Polux to drop for your HQ choice.

Which is tomorrow ;)

[awfulawful]

The way I find my crack... Errrrr I mean hobby is I pull out a $20 every week when I put gas in my car, over a few months I've amassed a few hundred dollars that I'm planning on on dropping on a resin order from forge world :)

 

Also play fists because we have a Sigusmund ;)

You haven't sold your car to buy more resin? Pfft, amateur. ;)

[Wyvern]

Im in the process of selling my guitar to fund my crac.... Erm resin habbit

[depthcharge12]

Was there a certain theme you were aiming for with your army?

[ThatOneMarshal]

Hmm that's diffrent I never relalised that forgeworld gives discounts in bundles. That's a nice change!

 

For a theme I like the idea of an aggressive force and go maybe a little on the horde side. Something that's marching towards you with some armoured support. And some terminators as well. A bit like the armies from ww2 kind off except with power armoured screaming bald men.

I would rather stay away from gunlines they are terribly boring.

 

I don't know if this is normal but I came into te heresy liking imperial fist except now well... All the other legions amazing to play. It's horrible and awsome at the same time lol. Well my as well get false gods and hope I read something that gets me to pick the perfect legion for me lol. After reading horus rising the sons of horus don't look so bad. How's their rules? Love them in the book I don't know why but they have this cool feel to them.

 

Also whatever legion I get I'm definelty getting a contemptor those things look so damn cool. Also a 20 power armored squad with fnp sounds epic. And I can use those sweet looking apothecary models.

[jeremy1391]

Sons of Horus aren't bad, they get improved reserves and combat bonuses if you outnumber your opponent at I1 (more attacks)

 

The reaver squads with bane strike rounds are pretty awesome marine killers. Justaerian terminators are cool but they are way over priced :-/

 

Also they have a Horus ;)

[Slips]

If ever the existential question of "OH LORD WHICH LEGION DO I CHOOSE!???!!??!?!?!?!" gets too much for you, feel free to brainstorm here: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295015-the-legion-for-you-community-assistance-thread/ Thats the threads purpose, after all.

 

SoH are good but their Legion Specific units are...kinda meh compared to their Generic Counter-Parts. Characters are ok, but could be better. Its their Rules that make them decent.

 

Oh and...yeah.. this is a thing you can do: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/295668-murderface-a-slipstream-list-named-by-depthcharge/?hl=%2Bmurderface&do=findComment&comment=3857338

[1ncarnadine]

For a theme I like the idea of an aggressive force and go maybe a little on the horde side. Something that's marching towards you with some armoured support. And some terminators as well. A bit like the armies from ww2 kind off except with power armoured screaming bald men.

I would rather stay away from gunlines they are terribly boring.

 

Consider the Word Bearers, they love mass infantry assaults and work pretty well as an aggressive force with Cut Them Down. Gal Vorbak are beastly assault units, and their legion-wide morale boost (True Believers) is just a useful rule in general.