Deschenus Maximus Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Gents, This is a review of the Codex I posed on 3++. It may be of use to new players looking to start a Blood Angels army. =============================================================================================================== Army-wide Special Rules Blood Angel armies can rely on the standard Space Marine special rules: And They Shall Know No Fear (ATSKNF) as well as Combat Squads (though not every infantry unit has access to the latter, as we shall see later). In addition, all their non-vehicle units as well as their Dreadnoughts have Furious Charge. Given that this is basically their equivalent of a Chapter Tactic (from the vanilla SM book), one could say it is middle-of-the-road. It's not terrible like the Iron Hand or Raven Guard CTs, but it's no White Scars or Imperial Fist CT equivalent.The Blood Angel faction-specific Detachments add some extra special rules; these will be covered below. Detachments The Blood Angels have been blessed with not one, but THREE Faction-specific detachments.-Baal Strike Force: This detachment is found in the Blood Angels Codex, and it is arguably the most useful. In exchange for losing Objective Secured on your Troops, and only being able to reroll your Warlord Trait if you roll on the Blood Angels table, all your models gain +1 Initiative on the turn they charge. For a nominally Assault army, that is pretty damn significant, as it allows you to strike before other Marines and at the same time as most Eldar units - thereby increasing a squad's survivability in the first case (by virtue of killing off enemy models before they get to strike) and offensiveness in the latter (due to getting a chance to swing that a model wouldn't have had had it been striking at Init 4). The detachment's Force Organisation Chart is basicaly the same as the one from the Combined Arms Detachment, but it adds an extra Elite slot which MUST be filled. Given how many good units BA have in that slot, that is not actually much of a downside. The only thing that irks me is that, as we shall see at a later point, the BA Warlord Traits are mostly TERRIBLE; ergo, you are mostly better off giving up one of your detachment-specific bonuses and just going with the BRB's Strategic (or Command) traits and living with the unrerollable result.-Archangels Strike Force: Coming to us from the Shield of Baal: Exterminatus campaign book, this is the detachment that Dark Angels players will use to do counts-as Deathwing lists (I would imagine, anyways). The FOC for this detachment is a bit peculiar: the mandatory slots are one HQ and two Elites, and you may take up to 14 other Elites and an additional HQ. In addition, you are only allowed to take units that are part of the 1st company: Terminator Squads, Assault Terminator Squads, Vanguard Veterans, Sternguard Veterans, Furioso Dreadnoughts and Librarians, Chaplains and Captains (including Captain Karlaen from Shield of Baal: Leviathan) who MUST be wearing Terminator Armour. On top of that, you can only take up to 10 squads of Termies and Veterans (in any combination) and up to 6 Furiosos. The detachment special rules allow for rerolling Warlord Traits on the Archangels table and for rerolling failed Reserve rolls for units with Deep Strike. In addition, units in this detachment scatter one less D6 when Deep Striking. Overall, this is probably not the most competitive detachment in the world, but it can probably hold its own reasonably well. Most of all, it looks like it'd be pretty fun to play, what with a rain of podded Fragiosos coming in T1 to wreak havoc followed by more dreads and termies coming in on T2.-Flesh Tearers Strike Force: Another detachment included in Exterminatus, this one is more generaly useful than the Archangels one, but still mostly pales in comparison to the Baal Strike Force. The detachment requires 1 HQ, 1 Troop and 1 Fast Attack and allows for 3 Elites, 3 more Troops, 3 Heavy Support and FIVE additional Fast Attack slots, on top of the usual Lord of War and Fortification slots. The detachment's bonuses include the usual Warlord Trait reroll (again, only on the detachment-specific table) in addition to the Explosion of Bloodlust rule (lol GW, what a silly name for a rule) that states that any unit in the detachment that rolls 10 or higher when determining charge length gains the Rage special rule until the end of the assault phase. That is nowhere near as good as the Baal Strike Force's bonus, but at least you guys with 60 Assault Marines will get to continue using them. The silver lining is that the Flesh Tearers' Warlord Traits table is much better than the BA one, so the WT reroll might get some use. On another note, I'm kinda horny for a FT bike + fast Vindi force. Relics The Blood Angels really lucked out with their Relics. Rarely will so many of them be actually useable.-The Angel's Wing: A Jump Pack that costs the same as 5 meltabombs, it allows you to reroll the scatter dice when Deep Striking, and any enemy unit shooting Interceptor shots at the squad containing the model bearing this Relic may only fire Snap Shots. Useful though kinda situational. Note: as immersion-breaking as it might be, there is nothing prohibiting you from using this Relic to reroll the scatter when the bearer is attached to a squad of Deep Striking Assault Terminators... Food for thought.-The Crown Angelic: A deathmask that forces Fear tests at -2 Ld. Ah if only Fear wasn't almost universaly ignored... At the cost of two meltabombs, it's not awful, but I don't think I'd bother in a TAC list. Potentially devastating in a tailored list against armies that are affected by Fear tests.-The Veritas Vitae: One of the best Relics in the game, hands down. This little beauty allows you to roll for an extra Warlord Trait on the Strategic table. For the cost of a single plasmagun, that is BADASS. You should take this anytime you aren't planning on using Dante.-Galian's Staff: A Force Staff that allows you to reroll 1s when conducting Psychic tests that comes with the minor downside of taking a wound if your second roll is also a 1. At the cost of a single combi-weapon, this is a must for any Libby.-Fury of Baal: That is all sort of bad. A MCed plasma pistol that doesn't Get Hot. At the same price as a power fist, you should take this... never.-Valour's Edge: It's a power sword, but with Ap 2. It costs 5 more points than a regular power sword. A pretty solid Relic when you remember that a BA character will be striking at Init 5+ and at S5 when part of a Baal Strike Force detachment.In addition to the Relics in the Codex, both the Archangels detachment and the Flesh Tearers Strike Force have access to unique Relics that they may take IN ADDITION TO (as opposed to "instead of" that has been the norm in all supplements so far) the ones in the Codex... and its a bloody good thing too because most of these are terrible:-Banner of the Archangel Host: This Archangels relic may be taken by a Terminator Assault Squad instead of a company banner. It does the same thing as said banner but in addition, every model in the bearer's unit gains Prefered Enemy. Costs the same as 6 meltabombs. I am honestly unsure as to wether its worth it. To make it worthwhile, you'd want to put it in a 10-man squad of Hammernators (since LC termies already get rerolls to wound anyways (and, well... just suck, really)), but since such a squad is already ridiculously deadly, adding the banner might just be overkill, and poor use of points.-Archangel's Edge: For the cost of a single meltabomb, you get to replace a terminator sergeant's power sword with... another power sword, but one that gains Instand Death on a To Wound roll of 6 when striking Monstrous Creatures. I can't begin to describe how awful this Relic is, even at its low cost. Seriously, normal Terminators are awful to begin with, and putting them up against a Monstrous Creature - whose CC hits are Ap2 at Initiative - is just... dumb. If you want proof that GW doesn't understand its own game, look no further.-The Executioner's Hood: A Librarian with this Relic ignores the effects of Shadow in the Warp. Cost: a single meltabomb. Paaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaass!-Bones of Baelsor: The first Flesh Tearers relic. This is basicaly glorified Extra Armour only for Dreadnoughts that also treats Penetrating Hits from Tyranid bio-plasma, bio-plasmic weapons and venom cannon weapons as Glancing Hits instead. For the cost of a single Plasmagun, this relic is just laughably bad, even in a tailored list set to fight Tyranids.-Slayer's Wrath: The least terrible FT relic, this boltgun fires Sternguard Hellfire ammo. While this is sort of neat, at the cost of a standard combi-weapon, it is too expensive.-Shield of Cretacia: A suit of bog-standard power armour that makes the wearer immune to Poison. Whoopdee-freaking-doo! Even at 5 pts, this is useless. Warlord Traits The Sons of Sanguinius have not been blessed with particularly impressive Warlord Traits, generally speaking.Blood Angels: 1. The Warlord has Rampage. Terrible.2. The Warlord gains +1 Initiative. Again, terrible.3. One of the Warlord's weapons (which can't be a Relic) becomes Mastercrafted. Give me a "t"! Give me an "e"! Give me an "r"! (And so on)…4. Your Warlord has Adamantium Will. Good god, GW really broke out the bottle of terrible with these Traits, didn't they?5. Every Jump, Skimmer and Flyer unit in the Warlord's Detachment rerolls failed Reserve rolls. In addition, Jumper and Skimmers scatter one less D6" when Deep Striking. This is Dante's default Warlord Trait, and the only way to reliably build a list around it. It's... an interesting Trait, and while having extra reliability when trying to bring your Stormravens in is nice, the whole Deep Striking aspect leaves me somewhat unexcited. This isn't 5th ed anymore, and Deep Striking melta lost a lot of relevance. Overall, I think having extra reliability when calling in the Ravens is the main appeal of this Trait, with maybe Deep Striking a suicide melta unit or two.6. Friendly units from the Armies of the Imperium within 12" of the Warlord are Fearless. This the Sanguinor's Warlord Trait. If Sanguinor wasn't even more terrible than he once was, he'd be an interesting option as an Allied HQ for Guard or Sisters thanks to this Trait. Sidenote: I really wish this the WL Trait "sane Tycho" had. Might have had a reason to use him, then.Good God these are some bad Traits. Even when playing a Baal Strike Force, don't hesitate to roll on the BRB Traits tables.Archangels: 1. The Warlord is Fearless. Heh. Most of the time, ATSKNF is superior to Fearless.2. The Warlord and his unit gain Counter-Attack. Already better, but still nothing to write home about.3. The Warlord rerolls all failed To Hit rolls in a challenge. Oh god, the fail.4. The Warlord and his unit have the Objective Secured special rule. That is actually pretty decent. Nothing says “this objective is MINE!” like 10 hammernators with ObSec.5. Blood Angel units within 12 inches of the Warlord may reroll failed Morale and Pinning tests. Again, heh.6. The Warlord has Preferred Enemy. This is fairly solid, since it transfers to the squad the WL is with.So, two good Traits, two ok-ish ones, one that is pretty bad and one that is awful. With the reroll from the detachment special rules, you have a good chance to roll something decent. Still, the main rulebook tables are probably a safer bet, even without the reroll.Flesh Tearers: 1. Your Warlord and his unit have Hatred. For a CC army, this is pretty nice.2. Your Warlord has Rampage. Still bad.3. Your Warlord and his unit have Hammer of Wrath. Not bad. Not great, but not bad.4. Your Warlord and every Blood Angel unit within 12 inches of him gain Crusader. That is actually pretty damn useful. Its crappy on Black Templars because they're not a good assault army to start with, but for BA? Yeah, I'll take some of that.5. Your Warlord and his unit have the Rage special rule. That's pretty good, again.6. The Warlord has Feel No Pain. *sad trombone*Overall, this is probably the strongest set of Traits available to BA, though it fails to compensate for the fact that Explosion of Bloodlust is just flat out worse than Red Thirst.Taking all the Traits together, you no doubt won't be surprised that I recommend sticking to the BRB Traits, except maybe in the case of the FT detachment. Sanguinary Psychic Discipline The Blood Angels Psychic Powers are pretty decent, all in all.Primaris - The Quickening: The psyker or a friendly character within 12 inches of him gains Fleet and +D3 Attacks and Initiative. Like a lesser version of the Biomancy power, but one that you can rely on always getting. Its not bad, but its really at its best on a Librarian Dreadnought, because other Characters won't be taking much advantage of Fleet, and because getting more S10 Ap2 Force attacks is always nice.1- Fear of the Darkness: A Malediction with a range of 12 inches. The target unit must immediately take a Morale test at -2 Ld. Not a bad power though a lot of armies won't care much/at all.2- Unleash Rage: A Blessing with an 18 inch range. The target unit gains Rage, or if it already has Rage, gains +1 Attack. That is a pretty damn solid power, especially when used on a big DC unit.3- Shield of Sanguinius: A Blessing that targets the Psyker. The Psyker and his unit gain a 5+ invulnerable save. Combined with FnP, this power is pretty good. Without FnP, its pretty blah.4- Blood Boil: A Focussed Witchfire with an 18 inch range. The target must pass two Toughness tests, and loses a Wound with no save of any kind for every fail. In addition, if the model is slain, he causes a large S4 Ap5 Ignores Cover blast centered on him. That is a godawful power, and the fact that its WC 2 just makes it worse.5- The Blood Lance: A 12 inch Beam power with S8 Ap1 Lance. Not awful, but not amazing either. And its WC2 too.6- Wings of Sanguinius: A Blessing that allows one friendly Infantry unit to do a 12 inch move in the Psychic Phase. There been some debate as to whether this allows Jump Infantry units (as they are still Infantry units since Jump is not a unit type in and of itself). If it does, its great. If not, its not as fantastic.All in all, not bad, as I said earlier. The key question, though, is: is it better than rolling on Divination? If you are running a Libby Dread, most likely. In all other instances, I think Divination is the way to go. Wargear The Blood Angels have access to a couple unique pieces of wargear as well as most of the stuff available to vanilla SM. I will only detail those that are available to more than one unit type in the book; the rest will be covered in the relevant unit entries.Blood Talons: Oh how the mighty are fallen! What used to make Furiosos such fearsome meatgrinders have been shamefully nerfed into the dirt: now they are basicaly power fists with Shred. Worse, GW makes you pay 10 pts for these on Furiosos and DC Dreads. Save the points.Glaive Encarmines: Unchanged from the 5th ed BA Codex, those are two-handed mastercrafted sword or axes. Ah if only GW had remained consistent and just made these Relic Blades (which BA Captains can access, strangely), it would make so much more sense, and would have been awesome on Sanguinary Guard. Alas, it was not to be.Auspex: The little beauty is a must-take item for any BA character that can take one. It functions the same as the SM version: one unit within 12 inches of the bearer suffers a -1 to its cover save. The bearer can't shoot in return but his unit can fire at another target. As BA chars will likely be close to the enemy anyways, this 5 pts item is just great.Combat Shield: Same as the SM version, still a terrible 6++.Company Standard: Same as the SM version, again. Possibly not bad on a Terminator Assault Squad, but too expensive on a Command Squad.Death Mask: A model with a Death Mask has the Fear special rule. Fear sucks, so nothing to write home about.Digital Weapons: Allows a single failed To Wound roll to be rerolled in the assault phase. The only time I might maybe consider this item is when paired with Valour's Edge, as at 10 pts, its silly-costly for what it does.Jump Pack: Gains the Jump unit type. Its pretty telling of the disparity between jump and bike units that I really rather take bikes than jump packs on my character; the +1 toughness, the twin-linked boltgun and Jink make a mockery of the 5 pts difference between the two.Locator Beacon: Same as the SM version, once again. Possibly more useful since BA have a lot of units capable of Deep Striking.Narthecium: Gives the bearer's unit Feel No Pain. Between Sanguinary Priests, Sanguinary Initiates in Command Squads and DC having it natively, looks like an all-FnP army is still not far from a possibility, despite the loss of the 5th ed Codex's Sang Priest FnP bubbles.Space Marine Bikes: As I mentioned above, I prefer to give my Characters bikes over Jump Packs. Sad, really, because I do like Jump Packs more, from an imagery standpoint.Storm Shields: 3++ combined with Feel No Pain. What!Teleport Homer: Same as the vanilla version.Magna-Grapple: The grapple lost its ranged attack, but is now a free replacement for a Furioso or DC Dread's smoke launcher. It gives the dread Move Through Cover and allows the model to reroll failed charges when assaulting a vehicle. Must-take item.Overcharged Engines: Makes a tank Fast. Must take on Preds and Vindies. I really wish it was optional on Rhinos because it is not worth the 10 pts supplement over a normal Rhino. Generic HQs Captains: Blood Angels Captains have been brought in line with the Vanilla counterparts. Sadly, unlike said counterparts, they do not unlock any new Troop types. That in itself is not surprising, as 7th ed codices are all doing away with FOC swaps, but it does mean that there are very few reasons to ever want to include a Captain in your list. There are better beatsticks available to us, and other HQs are more useful to the army as a whole. Give this guy a pass.Chaplains: BA Chaplains have this very important advantage over their Vanilla colleagues: they are featured in a Codex that contains a host of good Assault units for them to buff. Sadly, they remain an inferior choice to most other HQ units. They even lost the rule that allowed Death Company squads they joined to reroll To Wound rolls on the charge in addition to their To Hit rolls (Astorath is the sole source of this ability now). With that said, if - for fluff or style reasons - you REALLY wanted to run a Chaplain as your HQ, you wouldn't be hamstringing your competitiveness quite as significantly as you would be if you did the same with say Vanilla marines.Librarians: A longtime staple of most BA lists, the Librarian is getting some competition this time around, but likely remains top-dog nonetheless. Though lacking access to the Telepathy discipline, they can still use the very solid Divination tree as well as the BA-exclusive Sanguinary tree. In the very vast majority of instances, Divination should be your go-to; while Sanguinary has some good stuff in it, Prescience is just a better Primaris than the Quickening ever will be. Also, never leave home without Galian's Staff!Sanguinary Priests: The main challenger to the title of "Best BA HQ", the Sanguinary Priest delivers a solid performance at a reasonable cost. Although they no longer provide a bubble of Furious Charge and Feel no Pain, they got an extra wound and now provide +1WS and FnP to the squad they are attached to. While this is awesome, making efficient use of this ability isn't necessarily straightforward; you sort of have to build a squad for him to buff. That is not a crippling limitation by any stretch of the imagination, but it does mean that the libby remains more useful overall in my eyes.Librarian Dreadnought: Now this is interesting... a vehicle HQ that is actualy useable... Although kind of pricy, it has the potential to make a lot of MCs very unhappy with its S10 Ap2 Force Weapons striking at up to Init 8 on the charge with The Quickening. Av13 in the front means most MCs would have to Smash to even hurt it in return. I'd likely run it with a Heavy Flamer in a Drop Pod, though if you already have a lot of template weapons, the meltagun isn't the worst option in the world. Overall, not my top pick but certainly more useable than a lot of other HQs.Techmarine: Heh. Well, ok, so the Techmarine in the BA Codex isn't as bad as it is in the Marine book by virtue of being a really cheap way to fill your Mandatory HQ slot, and being able to get a free Jump Pack if you drop your Servo Arm. Still, he's far from fantastic. The best use for him, as far as I figure, is to give him a Jump Pack and have him behind a wall of Vindies to (try to) fix them up. Doing that automatically precludes him from being your Warlord (which means passing up on that tasty Veritas Vitae) and from carrying an Auspex (since you want him to fix your tanks and he can't do that AND use an Auspex), however, so its a less than ideal situation. All in all, though, I am not totally discounting the Techmarine as a valid HQ choice. If, for some reason, your list can't make good use of any of the other good choices, you could do worse than a 50 pts dude who boosts a cover save and fixes tanks. Unique HQs BA were not graced with good special chars this time around, at least as far as HQs go. This is regrettable, as some of these models are quite beautiful.Corbulo: Taken at face value, Corbulo seems like an awesome HQ: cheap-ish, nice-ish stats, and useful abilities. Really, the only thing that is obviously bad about him is his Warlord Trait. When you stop to actualy really think about things, though, good ol' Corbs isn't quite as awesome as he at first seems. The two things that take some of the shine off are 1) lack of a jump pack (or better yet, a bike) and 2) the limited range of his area of effect. As it stands, its really less than simple to make his bubble work. As a result, whenever I try to make him work in a list, I end up going with a different HQ instead. Shame, really, because his abilities are quite solid otherwise.Sanguinor: It's hard to believe that GW managed to make this guy even worse than he once was. They dropped his points too, but no way near as much as he would have needed. I'm not sure what game the Design Studio is playing, but out here in the real world, T4 3W 2+/4++ doesn't last long. If he was an IC, he'd actually be pretty alright, but as it stands, avoid him like the plague. The least-terrible idea I had for using him was to attach Dante and a Priest to for a pseudo-Deathstar unit, but at the price that unit comes out at, its performance is far from garanteed to match.Astorath: Astorath is now the only Chaplain that still allows DC to reroll To Wound rolls on top of To Hit rolls when charging. While that sounds great at first, that makes DC a little too deadly. A big DC unit will just utterly destroy whatever it charges and will then get shot to pieces in your opponent's shooting phase. Even is axe is now massively worse than it was; it now has Instand Death on a To Wound roll of 6, and is otherwise just a normal two-handed power axe. Fail. Just give this guy a pass.Captain Tycho: Just... lol. Even to the unitiated, Tycho is just... bad. So bad. He lost everything that made him semi-useful: his leadership boost, his Special Issue Ammo and his Dead Man's Hand. So... what's left? Nothing, is what.Tycho the Lost: It's Tycho, but slightly more expensive and with Rage and Relentless. Yeah... no thanks.Mephiston: A lot of BA players are quite happy with the new Mephiston... and I just don't get it. Yes, he's and IC now, but the other changes he went through made him less useful overall. No Wings, T5 he can't use outside of challenges, Fleet he can't really make use of at all, and a crapload less wounds just begs the question: what role does he fill? Beatstick? There are better options. Buffbot? Normal libbies do it just as well for cheaper. I will make the following prediction: not a single competitive list that actualy does well in a tournament 6 months down the line will have Mephy in it. Captain Karlaen: Good God GW really thinks Captains are way better than they actually are on the tabletop. The only really significant thing about Karlaen is that his fixed Warlord Trait is something you could build a list around. Still, he’s awfully expensive, even for that. I say if you’re not building some sort of crazy null deployment list around this guy, give him a pass. Troops As everybody is well aware now, BA no longer have access to Assault Marine Squads as Troops. It's a real shame, but not unexpected.Tactical Squads: FINALY, Tactical Squads can pack a Heavy Flamer! I've been waiting for this for years! I really, REALLY hope they make this standard across all SM Tac Squads. In any case, the addition of the portable BBQ makes BA Tac Squads pretty alright in a CAD list - 10 dudes, meltagun, heavy flamer, drop pod... good times. Outside of a CAD, though, I think I'd rather go with some cheap Scouts to minimise my "Troop Tax". One gripe: Tacs STILL can't purchase an additional CCW, even though it would totally make sense that they would. Oh well, maybe GW will get it FULLY right by 8th ed...Scout Squads: The much maligned Scouts... still as bad as ever, although within the context of a Baal Strike Force or Flesh Tearers Strike Force, they fill that Troop Tax fairly cheaply, at least. One or two squads of 5 guys (depending on the Strike Force you're going with), BP/CCW (and maybe a combi-grav on the sarge)… infiltrate them where they get to cause trouble for some weak backfield squad if they're not taken care-of, and profit (sorta...). Cassor the Damned : The last of the Troop Dreadnoughts. Cassor is 5 pts more expensive than a normal DC Dread with a similar loadout; maybe because he’s a Character? In any case, like all DC Dreads, Cassor isn’t too great. The question is then: does the fact that he is a Troop rather than an Elite make up for his overall suckiness? I am not convinced. The fact that he is a Character is interesting, at least; it allows you to challenge the odd power fist/meltabomb-wielding sergeant before he gets a crack (geddit? :P) at Cassor’s armour. Raphen’s Death Company : One could summarise this squad thusly: too many toys in too few bodies. Again the “Troop Tax” issue has to be addressed, and again, I don’t feel that compensates enough for the issues with that squad. Elites This is where things get good...Command Squads: When I first looked at this unit, I was like "?". With a little more thought, however, I've come to the conclusion that this is one of the Codex's hidden gems. While everyone is splooging over DC (with good reason, mostly), I've realizsed that while the CS' damage output is lower than the DC's due to the lack of Rage, it's a much more versatile unit. Equipped with 3 shields and 3 meltas, you have a unit that is able to pull off several different tasks with a fair measure of effectiveness. Take some meltabombs and make a real pain of yourself. Along with Bikes, probably one of the best units in the Codex.Death Company Squads: This is the unit every BA player is howling with joy over. Although they've lost WS5 during the transition to this edition of the 'dex, they also are now able to score, and their Jump Packs went down to a mere 3 pts per model. As we know, assault units functionally so much better when they have they ability to move 12+ inches in a turn, so this is a HUGE bonus for them. Word of warning: don't go overboard when equipping these guys. 1-2 powerfists and you should be good. Otherwise, you'll run into a lot of situations where your guys overkill their target and end up with their asses hanging in the wind.Lemartes: Awfulness, thine name is Lemartes. Seriously, if you can't figure out why he's bad on your own... just PM me I guess, and I'll explain. But really, it should be pretty obvious.Sanguinary Guard: Much improved, thanks to a significant price drop. Sadly, still not quite there. Sang Guard pack a mean punch, but without an invul, they lack the ability to soak up low AP shooting and CC attacks that is necessary for a high-end assault unit. Right now, they continue to sit in that uncomfortable zone where they are overkill against rank and file troopers and are not tough enough to go up against the bigbads. Sad, really, as I do quite like the models... Oh well!Dreadnought: Can be summed up thusly: we have better firesupport units, and better close range shooty units. Hence, the normal dread just doesn't really fit anywhere. Ergo, pass.Death Company Dreadnought: Like a Furioso Dreadnought, but worse! This guy lost the one attribute over the FD that made him worth considering: Fleet. Now that Blood Talons are crap, and since he can't take a Frag Cannon, there are no valid reasons to take him beyond Rule of Cool.Furioso Dreadnought: Spared the ignominy of the DC Dread's fall into irrelevance, the Furioso should only ever see game time when equipped with Frag Cannon. All other loadouts are inferior. Put him in a pod, and enjoy the fireworks.Terminator Squad: Suffers from the same problem all "Tactical Termies" suffer from: extreme allergic reaction to Ap2 shooting. Until these guys get a 1+ armour save, I don't see any reason to bother with them.Terminator Assault Squad: The availability of Fast Attack pods make these guys interesting. Five hammernators dropping on T1 anywhere you want with relative safety is worth giving some thought.Vanguard Veterans: Slightly less useless than their Vanilla counterparts, VV still fail to impress when compared to the plethora of other Jump units available to BA. I've seen people suggest a squad of 10 with a couple Stormshields and joined by a Priest... that's probably as good as its going to get.Sternguard Veterans: Still a solid unit, but not necessarily quite as home with BA than with SM. We can revisit once GW understands that not being able to charge after shooting with Rapid Fire weapons is retarded and not at all representative of how things are done IRL. Squad Alphaeus: It’s a Terminator Squad with Preferred Enemy (Tyranids). *Shakes head* Fast Atttack A.k.a. the Bike slot.Rhinos: Slightly cheaper than it used to be, still too expensive. Why oh why couldn't GW make overcharged engines optional here?Razorback: Fast Plasmabacks bring the pain, but they unfortunately go down so fast to Serpents and Broadsides... *le sigh*Drop Pod: This is where its at. Nothing like being able to put down a squad nearly anywhere on the board without your opponent being able to do much about it. If you unit doesn't come with a jump pack or bike, it should always be in a Pod rather than in a Rhino or Razor. Plus, empty FA pods make for some fun shennanigans, whether intra-codex (assault termies) or through Allies (Gravturions).Land Speeder Squadrons: I love my Speeders, but I'd be hard pressed to call them good. Deep striking double MM speeders with Dante could technically work... but why bother? This isn't 5th ed anymore, and melta ain't all that.Assault Squad: Not being Troops anymore, I'm just not seeing much of a reason to take them over Bikes. A lot of BA players have a huge hardon for pod-borne suicide melta ASM, which leads me to believe their regular opponents must not know about this thing called "bubblewrap"…Bike Squad: This is where it's at. Yes, BA Bike squads aren't as good as White Scars bikers, but that doesn't make them not awesome still. Better yet, they can make much better use of Concussive on the gravguns than the Scars, since the BA book has much better options for assault. I'm pretty much convinced that a BA list without Bikes is hamstringing itself.Attack Bike Squad: Doesn't have gravguns, and thus, is inferior to normal Bike Squads.Scout Bike Squad: Call me back when these guys are Troops. In the meantime, avoid like the plague. Heavy Support BA Heavy Support really benefits the most from the Overcharged Engines upgrade. If your tanks don't have it, ask yourself some questions.Stormraven Gunship: Slightly nerfed due to losing Bloodstrike Missiles, the Storm Raven is the Blood Angels' only Flyer... strangely enough. You'd have thought they'd gotten access to Storm Talons at least... Oh well. Given that its your only effective choice for anti-air, you really have to think hard as to wether you need that in your list, given its 200 pts price tag. While it does have a transport capacity, using it is rather risky due to the severe penalties Crash and Burn inflicts on your troops.Devastator Squad: Much improved due to its heavy weapons costs being brought in line with the other Marine books', Devs are fairly solid fire support. I can't help but feel that using them is kinda not playing to BA's strengths, though.Baal Predator: Moving to the Heavy Support slot and losing Scout has really hurt this tank. Its sponsons did drop in cost, but that is nowhere near enough to justify the nerfs it suffered. Take a pass on this Rending Poney.Predator: Fast Preds were all the rage in 5th, and while they have shed some points, they just don't quite impress anymore. Part of that is due to the weakness of the autocannon in this day and age, which combined with the absurd cost of the Twin Lascannon upgrade, leaves the tank in a lose-lose predicament. It's not the worst firesupport unit in the game, but it is far from being top-notch.Vindicator: In spite of its numerous issues - chief amongst which is the silly AV11 side armour - the Vindi is probably the strongest (or rather, least-weak) choice in the Heavy Support section. It dropped a lot of points compared to its 5th ed incarnation, and being Fast makes it so much more useable. Not only does it help a lot with its short-ranged gun, but it also makes positioning it to limit what can shoot at its flanks much easier. All in all, not a great unit, but decent enough to use.Whirlwind: I'm baffled this tank is still so terrible after soooo many years. Avoid at all cost.Land Raider (all variants): This damned thing is still way too expensive for what it does. Until these guys start cost 175-180 pts, leave these guys on the shelf. Lords of War Seth: Why is this guy a Lord of War? WHY? Putting aside the fact that he really has no place being a LoW, he is seriously godawful. A choppy character that isn't really all that choppy. Avoid.Dante: Dante has certainly improved a lot since his last iteration, but I am uncertain that he is good enough for competitive games. While he is reasonably handy in a fight, and handing out Hit and Run to the unit he is attached to is assuredly nice, the rest of his abilities are not that impressive. That wouldn't be so bad were it not for his hefty pricetag. I guess at the end of the day, he is more a flavour piece that is not too much of a handicap to a BA list. Concluding Thoughts While the BA book had lost a considerable amount of flavour in its transition from 5th to 7th ed, it gained a lot in the competitiveness department. I still think it isn't as strong as Vanilla Marines, but I do believe that there is enough in there to make a list that will give most opponents a run for their money. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
shandwen Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Re-check the points cost for the relics, it seems at least one is listed wrong. Oh, and this reads so much like a 1d4chan view, that it throws out many useable units as "garbage". Scouts, and Astorath I fully believe to be listed as better than garbage (atorath now having an invuln should at least be mentioned, and scouts hitting at i5 str5 make a huge difference over the still useable scouts of the vanilla dex). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971609 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrunTeufel Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Re-check the points cost for the relics, it seems at least one is listed wrong. Oh, and this reads so much like a 1d4chan view, that it throws out many useable units as "garbage". Scouts, and Astorath I fully believe to be listed as better than garbage (atorath now having an invuln should at least be mentioned, and scouts hitting at i5 str5 make a huge difference over the still useable scouts of the vanilla dex). Astorath always had an invul save though. He had a rosarius. I do agree that many of the units that are discarded as useless can be utilized quite nicely. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971613 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted March 8, 2015 Author Share Posted March 8, 2015 Re-check the points cost for the relics, it seems at least one is listed wrong. Which one? Oh, and this reads so much like a 1d4chan view, that it throws out many useable units as "garbage". Scouts, and Astorath I fully believe to be listed as better than garbage (atorath now having an invuln should at least be mentioned, and scouts hitting at i5 str5 make a huge difference over the still useable scouts of the vanilla dex). In the world of Serpent spam, Wraithspam, MC spam and all the craziness, Astorath as no place in a competitive BA list. Sorry, but its the truth. BA Scouts are indeed better than their Vanilla cousins, but they still are way below what I would deem worthy of including in a tournament list (aside from filling the troop tax in a BSF/FTSF list). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971757 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Since we have to have troops, scouts versus Tacticals is a fair question. Neither are great. But you have to take 2 units in most cases. Right now I am leaning towards scouts for the cheapness. Astorath everytime I decide to field him I end up running a Librarian instead. I want to like Astorath, but I don't see him as better than a Priest or Librarian in pretty much any case. I would love to see this expanded to include the units from Deathstorm or the formations from WD or Exterminatus. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971768 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodTzar Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 BA w.out FW just dont make it in competetive world of xenos. 7th has been nice to us until you face all the new toys of GW-xeno-love... On the other hand, nice review, at some points I do find it different; ASM as it used to be(10man 2melta,fist)still valid choice, perhaps gets outshined now by 3 man bike sq full of grav/combi grav... Its matter of time we are going to see "blood rodeo" back Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971787 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted March 8, 2015 Author Share Posted March 8, 2015 Since we have to have troops, scouts versus Tacticals is a fair question. Neither are great. But you have to take 2 units in most cases. Right now I am leaning towards scouts for the cheapness. For BSF & FTSF, that would be my pick as well. Astorath everytime I decide to field him I end up running a Librarian instead. I want to like Astorath, but I don't see him as better than a Priest or Librarian in pretty much any case. Yep. If Asto was quite a bit cheaper, my judgement of him wouldn't be so severe. As it stands, he's just second fiddle to a libby or priest. I would love to see this expanded to include the units from Deathstorm or the formations from WD or Exterminatus. I plain ol' forgot about the Deathstorm units. I'll try to take a look and write up something on them. Formations I may do at some point in the future but my general dislike of formations is curbing my enthusiasm for the task. Comments in red. BA w.out FW just dont make it in competetive world of xenos. 7th has been nice to us until you face all the new toys of GW-xeno-love... It certainly is an uphill battle most of the time. Hopefully, GW will get around to 7th-ising Eldar and Tau sooner rather than later. On the other hand, nice review, at some points I do find it different; ASM as it used to be(10man 2melta,fist)still valid choice, perhaps gets outshined now by 3 man bike sq full of grav/combi grav... Its matter of time we are going to see "blood rodeo" back I think there is just too little insentive to run ASM over bikes if you are looking to play competitively. I fully expect a blood rodeo-type list to pop up but with DC and or Command Squads running with the bikes instead of ASM. Comments in red. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971816 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted March 8, 2015 Share Posted March 8, 2015 Well, the dislike of Formations is probably ok. As much as I want the formations to be good, I generally can't justify them versus the Baal Strike Force. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971823 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 Well, the dislike of Formations is probably ok. As much as I want the formations to be good, I generally can't justify them versus the Baal Strike Force. Having just had a quick look the ones in Exterminatus, I have to agree with that assessment. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971851 Share on other sites More sharing options...
infyrana Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Reading this and 1d4chan pretty much makes it feel as though most of my BA collection is useless :) Lovely to see that it has changed so much since I last purchased a unit. Thankfully it looks like I can run my DC with JP's happily enough since their price has been reduced. Never thought I'd say this but - bring on 8th ... that or FW Heresy 30k BA's. So ... does this make HB dev squads useable in any way ? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971871 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Well, I'm not a fan of Devs no matter how they are armed. I prefer mobility. Don't worry about units being declared useless. that generally means there are better/more efficient options (I don't think Astorath is useless as an example, but there are generally better choices) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971878 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joasht Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 An interesting take on the BA dex. I'm all for critical reviews, and I do have a question for the OP...... What do your BA lists look like nowadays? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971903 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 Reading this and 1d4chan pretty much makes it feel as though most of my BA collection is useless A lot of units aren't flat out useless... just suboptimal. So ... does this make HB dev squads useable in any way ? Yeesh... HB devs aren't great to start with, but in a BA army that already has oodles of anti-infantry... doesn't look good. Comments in red. An interesting take on the BA dex. I'm all for critical reviews, and I do have a question for the OP...... What do your BA lists look like nowadays? They gravitate around the following units, generaly: librarians, command squads, death company, tactical squads (in a CAD list), scouts (troop tax in BSF/FTSF lists), grav bikes and vindicators. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971927 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaezus Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Nice to see someone putting the time into a complete and lengthy review. On the note of tournament competitiveness, it is worth remembering that the current dominance of the eldar owes something to the under-costing of hornets, which GW admitted is due to a typing error (i.e. omitting a digit), a la serpent shield range. It's also worth noting that the one thing these eldar are afraid of is the Sicaran; a good BA list with two or three Sicarans is as absolutely as competitive as top-tier eldar. It's just waiting to happen, that's all. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971946 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solrac Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 -Archangels Strike Force: Coming to us from the Shield of Baal: Exterminatus campaign book, this is the detachment that Dark Angels players will use to do counts-as Deathwing lists (I would imagine, anyways). I could see why you would assume this but no, DA players wouldn't use this Detachment at all as playing out of the BA book to use this Detachment and saying they are "Deathwing" won't make them perform any better. You yourself have said in this review not to bother with Tactical Terminators (which are the bread and butter of a Deathwing army). A pure Deathwing list made from the DA codex is way more competitive when compared to any other pure Terminator list you can make (Archangels Strike Force and Strike Force Ultra). I am not saying the rules from this Detachment are bad as they would be very useful to an all Terminator army, I am just saying that to lose our Deathwing rules and unique units to use the Archangels Strike Force rules isn't worth it. Having said that though both Strike Force Ultra and the Archangels Strike Force do give us DA players a lot of hope that we will one day get our own Deathwing Detachment that will add useful rules like these to the rules that our units already hold. I did find your overall review a very good read and informative (Blood Angels being one of my other favourite Chapters). Well done! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3971990 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Good review, if a little jaded at some points. As anything critical I agree and disagree with some points (command squads woo!). If this is to be a resource for new players I'd suggest adding counter comments from other fraters quoted under the unit entries to maybe give people some other opinions or options for using units you mightve missed or been unaware of. I know for one Mort may have something to say about the Vanguard ;D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3972050 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 I could see why you would assume this but no, DA players wouldn't use this Detachment at all as playing out of the BA book to use this Detachment and saying they are "Deathwing" won't make them perform any better. You yourself have said in this review not to bother with Tactical Terminators (which are the bread and butter of a Deathwing army). A pure Deathwing list made from the DA codex is way more competitive when compared to any other pure Terminator list you can make (Archangels Strike Force and Strike Force Ultra). I am not saying the rules from this Detachment are bad as they would be very useful to an all Terminator army, I am just saying that to lose our Deathwing rules and unique units to use the Archangels Strike Force rules isn't worth it. Is a DW Tactical Terminator list more competitive than an Archangels Hammernator list, though? Having said that though both Strike Force Ultra and the Archangels Strike Force do give us DA players a lot of hope that we will one day get our own Deathwing Detachment that will add useful rules like these to the rules that our units already hold. One can only hope. I think Terminators in general could use a bit of help. Outside of Hammernators, they just suffer too much from the overwhelming amount of AP2 weaponry out there in the current meta. I did find your overall review a very good read and informative (Blood Angels being one of my other favourite Chapters). Well done! Thanks! Comments in red. Good review, if a little jaded at some points. As anything critical I agree and disagree with some points (command squads woo!). If this is to be a resource for new players I'd suggest adding counter comments from other fraters quoted under the unit entries to maybe give people some other opinions or options for using units you mightve missed or been unaware of. I know for one Mort may have something to say about the Vanguard ;D I am open to having my mind changed. I have no qualms about going back and revisiting the entries if its warranted. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3972159 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solrac Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 I could see why you would assume this but no, DA players wouldn't use this Detachment at all as playing out of the BA book to use this Detachment and saying they are "Deathwing" won't make them perform any better. You yourself have said in this review not to bother with Tactical Terminators (which are the bread and butter of a Deathwing army). A pure Deathwing list made from the DA codex is way more competitive when compared to any other pure Terminator list you can make (Archangels Strike Force and Strike Force Ultra). I am not saying the rules from this Detachment are bad as they would be very useful to an all Terminator army, I am just saying that to lose our Deathwing rules and unique units to use the Archangels Strike Force rules isn't worth it. Is a DW Tactical Terminator list more competitive than an Archangels Hammernator list, though? Deathwing would still be a better list as we have a lot more versatility. We have mixed squads not a dedicated Tactical and Assault Terminator unit. My squads always run with at least 1 TH/SS in each squad to tank AP2 shots. We can have our 3+ Invul for survivability but we can also shoot back. We don't have to roll for reserves if we choose to Deep Strike Turn 1 or 2 they just automatically come on. We also get Twin-linked ranged weapons on the drop. To top it off all Deathwing units are Fearless which means we can't get pinned and we don't run when we get shot at (comapred to just ATSKNF). Our tax is we have to pay for an expensive HQ to make Termies Troops (and Obj Secured) however he has a nifty rule that he doesn't scatter when he Deep Strikes. One of my favourite units is a 10 man Squad of Deathwing wuth 2 Heavy Flamers with the HQ that doesn't scatter and gets Twin-linked weapons when it comes down. Super deadly Alpha Strike. Lastly our added versatility comes with our unique units. Deathwing Knights are one of the best Terminator units in the game and the Deathwing Terminator Command Squad gives us access to some very unique Banners the creme of the crop being the Fortitude Banner giving all untis within 12" FNP and the Devastation Banner giving all Boltguns, the Bolter part of Combi-bolters and Hurricane Bolters Salvo 2/4. Ths doesn't sound that great when Termies have Storm Bolter's but build a dual LRC list and then you have each Land Raider Crusader shooting 24 Boltgun shots at 24" per turn. The Archangel Detachment get's your Termies in the fight safely (1D6 scatter is actually quite amazing) and +1 rolling for reserves but other than that they are still slow and easy to kite. EDIT: Just noticed that Deathwing Terminators have the Split Fire special rule where Vanilla Termies do not. Do BA Termies have Split FIre? Split Fire has always been a huge deal. Besides the obvious of Split Firing your Cyclones at a Tank whilst Storm Bolters shoot at Infantry one of the best uses is to Split Fire one Storm Bolter into the squad you want to charge and the rest into a different squad. This adds heaps more versatility as you don't waste the squads firepower or gimp your charge range. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3972978 Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun03 Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Nice to see someone putting the time into a complete and lengthy review. On the note of tournament competitiveness, it is worth remembering that the current dominance of the eldar owes something to the under-costing of hornets, which GW admitted is due to a typing error (i.e. omitting a digit), a la serpent shield range. It's also worth noting that the one thing these eldar are afraid of is the Sicaran; a good BA list with two or three Sicarans is as absolutely as competitive as top-tier eldar. It's just waiting to happen, that's all. In regards to Sicaran being it relic of armory how are you feilding more than 1 or 2 if going cad/bsf. Hands down sicarans are the best tanks out there for shutting down elders and are crippling the flyrant spam out there. I looking to take my BA to event in early April where I know I am up agsint straight cheese list with eldar and maxed out flyrants. And been looking at ways to get 2 Sicarans 3 would be great in to my list but don't see how. Is there another book that has sicarans in them that removes relic of armory rule? Or I am missing something? To the OP thanks for putting in the work for the write up. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3973800 Share on other sites More sharing options...
shandwen Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 I looked at the relics in the book again and you are most definitely correct on the costs... and dang is that pistol waaaaaaaaay overcosted. I thought it was a meltabomb cheaper and even at that cost it was too much. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3973824 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Priest Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 As a new player I enjoyed this review, right to the point without pulling punches. I second the interest in your opinion on the Deathstorm units, since that set is where I'm starting my army. Regarding Sanguinary Guard, you mention they aren't quite tough enough for bigger threats. Do you believe adding a Sanguinary Priest is enough of a boost them to acceptable performance in that regard? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3974478 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 As a new player I enjoyed this review, right to the point without pulling punches. I second the interest in your opinion on the Deathstorm units, since that set is where I'm starting my army. Regarding Sanguinary Guard, you mention they aren't quite tough enough for bigger threats. Do you believe adding a Sanguinary Priest is enough of a boost them to acceptable performance in that regard? No. The problem with the Sanguinary Guard is the lack of Invul saves. FNP helps a little against stuff like Plasma, but is useless against melta. I would rather put a Priest with a Vanguard so I can have an invul save and FNP (or go with the suggestion of Command Squads and not bother with the priest like Deschenus Maximus made in another thread) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3974499 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ushtarador Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 I think the efficiency of Sanguinary Guard depends a lot on your local meta as well. In my area, they are actually quite durable because the only AP2 seen in abundance is grav spam lists (seriously - why even mention plasma, nobody plays that anymore..). Meltaspam lists are even more rare and specialized. There should als be some terrain to grant cover (unless you play on empty tables), with 12'' move it's not that hard to stay behind or inside, and then they are quite durable. With the points drop I think they have really become an option now, you still can't go and hunt the big baddies, but you will be very efficient against most units and you tank a lot of non-AP2 fire. At least in my meta they are a lot more efficient than vanguard vets who just get hosed down by massed low-AP fire (hello broadsides, tyranids and wave serpents). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3974683 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Njjesters4 Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Sweet write up. Thanks for taking the time. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3974702 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted March 12, 2015 Author Share Posted March 12, 2015 Deathwing would still be a better list as we have a lot more versatility. We have mixed squads not a dedicated Tactical and Assault Terminator unit. My squads always run with at least 1 TH/SS in each squad to tank AP2 shots. We can have our 3+ Invul for survivability but we can also shoot back. We don't have to roll for reserves if we choose to Deep Strike Turn 1 or 2 they just automatically come on. We also get Twin-linked ranged weapons on the drop. To top it off all Deathwing units are Fearless which means we can't get pinned and we don't run when we get shot at (comapred to just ATSKNF). Our tax is we have to pay for an expensive HQ to make Termies Troops (and Obj Secured) however he has a nifty rule that he doesn't scatter when he Deep Strikes. One of my favourite units is a 10 man Squad of Deathwing wuth 2 Heavy Flamers with the HQ that doesn't scatter and gets Twin-linked weapons when it comes down. Super deadly Alpha Strike. Lastly our added versatility comes with our unique units. Deathwing Knights are one of the best Terminator units in the game and the Deathwing Terminator Command Squad gives us access to some very unique Banners the creme of the crop being the Fortitude Banner giving all untis within 12" FNP and the Devastation Banner giving all Boltguns, the Bolter part of Combi-bolters and Hurricane Bolters Salvo 2/4. Ths doesn't sound that great when Termies have Storm Bolter's but build a dual LRC list and then you have each Land Raider Crusader shooting 24 Boltgun shots at 24" per turn. The Archangel Detachment get's your Termies in the fight safely (1D6 scatter is actually quite amazing) and +1 rolling for reserves but other than that they are still slow and easy to kite. EDIT: Just noticed that Deathwing Terminators have the Split Fire special rule where Vanilla Termies do not. Do BA Termies have Split FIre? Split Fire has always been a huge deal. Besides the obvious of Split Firing your Cyclones at a Tank whilst Storm Bolters shoot at Infantry one of the best uses is to Split Fire one Storm Bolter into the squad you want to charge and the rest into a different squad. This adds heaps more versatility as you don't waste the squads firepower or gimp your charge range. I understand that if you look purely at the abilities of DW units, they are better than their BA equivalent, but when you factor in the cost of Belial and the extra points each DW termie costs, don't you think it might balance out in favour of the Archangels? In regards to Sicaran being it relic of armory how are you feilding more than 1 or 2 if going cad/bsf. Hands down sicarans are the best tanks out there for shutting down elders and are crippling the flyrant spam out there. I looking to take my BA to event in early April where I know I am up agsint straight cheese list with eldar and maxed out flyrants. And been looking at ways to get 2 Sicarans 3 would be great in to my list but don't see how. Is there another book that has sicarans in them that removes relic of armory rule? Or I am missing something? To the OP thanks for putting in the work for the write up. Forgeworld says to get a Chaplain to act as the Keeper of Relics (is that the right title?) until they update the rules from IA Vol II. I looked at the relics in the book again and you are most definitely correct on the costs... and dang is that pistol waaaaaaaaay overcosted. I thought it was a meltabomb cheaper and even at that cost it was too much. Yep. GW's costing of pistols remains one of the most puzzling aspects of their game design. As a new player I enjoyed this review, right to the point without pulling punches. I second the interest in your opinion on the Deathstorm units, since that set is where I'm starting my army. Regarding Sanguinary Guard, you mention they aren't quite tough enough for bigger threats. Do you believe adding a Sanguinary Priest is enough of a boost them to acceptable performance in that regard? As JamesI said, it doesn't. Without an invul, they are just not able to leverage their hitting power effectively. I would gladly lose the 2+ AS for a 4++ with these guys. I think if one really wants to use SG, go with small squads and just butcher normal infantry. Sweet write up. Thanks for taking the time. My pleasure! I'm just really happy people are finding it useful. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/304390-blood-angels-codex-review/#findComment-3974728 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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