Road to Veteran's 2016

[Xenith]

Cowmooflage?

[Morticon]

Having probs uploading my pics! But, the army is out and having finishing touches put on!! its looking great ^_^ 

[Morticon]

Tournament was a huge success and BA/DA combo kicked all sorts of ass! Will fill you guy in soon.  

 

 

Tristan wound up taking it in the end with a very good over-all score and 4 of 5 solid victories -almost securing his victory on day one, actually.  I did face him in the fourth and get a considerable amount of points from him, but my composition was 0 (of 60) as noted in the OP, so i was comfortably behind the top running candidates. 

 

Games were all amazing, armies were great and generally an amazing 2 days! 

[CaptainHelion]

Sounds like an absolute blast! Can't wait to hear more.

[Morticon]

Army overview:

For those of you who didn't follow i went with my "Children of Sanguinius" home-brew successor chapter that i've been playing for over ten years now. As i've mentioned a few times in the forums, recently I've moved away from a strict adherence to the BA codex in terms of rules, because of the issues we have at competitive play. That being said, I like to stick relatively closely to BA theme. For me that was always 2nd and 3rd ed fluff of "codex adherent with a leaning towards assault and mobility".

So, the DA double demi provided all the strength the BA lacked (in terms of the numbers and firepower) and then used the BASF to give me that old school BA feel, complete with 3 jumpy squads. These jumpy squads were all buffed by the various characters. The Chappy leading the DC, the Master leading the ASM (tanking for the weaker of the group, and providing a hard hitting comeback in assault thanks to the s7, ap3 mace) and then the Priest giving WS5 and FNP to the vanguard - giving me 2 squads with FNP!

I really enjoyed the WS5, and think the vanguard pairing was solid here. The rerolls on the DC were defs needed now that theyre no longer WS5, but it would have been even better with someone like Astorath giving them hit and wound rerolls.

I think point for point, our vanguard are now a little redundant given that the DC are only 1 point more expensive and come with FNP and Fearless and more attacks. So, unless you are going with storm shields, I dont believe there is really any point.

Playing the DA and SM rules recently, ive found the assault marines to be absolutely underwhelming, bordering on "useless". The difference the BASF makes however with +1S, +1I is just awesome. Theyre still not "amazing" fullstop - but the rules completely change them up to being a very solid unit. So, quite liked using them. The DC and the Vanguard did exactly what they say on the box, the vanguard with extra special weapons, and then WS5 making up for the DC extra attacks and rerolls. Again, with +1 strength and init, these guys were absolutely stellar.

The sicaran was as usual, a solid workhorse. Sadly, i didn't come up against any players with flyers, except Tristan, and in that game, we were playing the mission with "Damned if you Do.." - which effectively renders one weapon in the army useless - > so....sarosh was crappy. If i had to play exact same tourney over with same opponents, Scorpios would have been miles and miles better in every case.

The scouts in a BASF were also a big surprise, putting out 15 s5, init5 attacks. That's pretty damned good for 55 points. I think id work these guys in again somehow if i used a BASF.

Cassor was a little bit of a let down, but only because of luck. Game 1, which was the tourney changer for me, he charges a squad of grey hunters- and with his massive amounts of attacks, doesn't land one single hit. So disappointing. Only gets 2 kills subsequent turn, and then takes 3 krak grenades to the face. In another battle he failed a very average charge, costing me the game. I think he needs a raven. But, the WS4 is a bit meh. Almost feel a furioso would be better -though, the troop slot benefit is where he shines.

I wont spend too much time on the DA stuff. It does what it says on the box. Biggest benefit being full BS overwatch for everything, which is all sorts of magic. Slow razors and rhinos are a pity. But grav is welcomed and needed.

The master with the Mace is the clear winner from that dex.

All in all, loved the list. Would only make the one change with the scorpios and ya! Would love to see BA get something like this

Here'es the list followed by a pic:

BASF

Priest - Axe, JP, Veritas, BP (WL)

8x Vanguard Vets - JP, Axe, Maul (Sarge), Fist

8x Death Co. - JP, Axe, Fist

1x Cassor

1x Pod

5x BA Scouts - bp/ccw

8x ASM - JP, Fist, 2MG

1x Sicaran - Legacy of Sarosh

DA - Double Demi

Master - JP, Uber-mace, Artificer Armour, auspex

Chaplain - JP

5x Tac - MG, Cmbi-MG

__1x Pod
5x Tac - MG, Cmbi-MG

__1x Pod
5x Tac - GG, Cmbi-GG

__1x Pod
5x Tac - MG

__1x Razor - las/plas
5x Tac - PG
__1x Razor - las/plas
5x Tac - Flamer
__1x Razor - las/plas

5x ASM - Flamer
__1x Razor - las/plas
5x ASM - 2Flamers

__1x Pod

5x Dev - 2Grav Cannon
__1x Rhino
5x Dev - 2Grav Cannon
__1x Rhino

http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb447/Brindleysa/Veterans%202016/IMG_20160701_231549_zpsyu2oi8oy.jpg

[Charlo]

Awesome awesome awesome :)

 

Great insight and glad to hear you did well even with 0 comp etc!

 

If you took the vanguard again would you give them shields then or any other upgrades?

 

I like them and think they're super fluffy for us (RIP Veteran Assault Squad 3rd Edition) but as you are no doubt aware we debate them a hell of a lot on here compared to DC/ SG.

 

Can't wait to see how a list like this does when we get a Decurion, I can see us being SO. GOD. DAMN. BRUTAL.

[Morticon]

I think if I found the points somewhere, maybe a shield or three! 

[Jolemai]

So with the event over I guess it's kind of safe to ask how you play mounted MSU?

[Morticon]

So with the event over I guess it's kind of safe to ask how you play mounted MSU?

Will go into a full breakdown fairly soon! But, in addition to the complexity of the missions, Vets is also known for its thematic and dense tables.  Lots of LOS blocking. Lots of cover.  So, the "parking lot is full" syndrome hit quite hard in terms of mobility and bringing to bare some good synergy.  Added to that, with slow razors, it was a lot tougher.  

 

The jumpies more than made up for it though, where the razors whittled things down, and the various Hammer-lite squads cleaned up, or broke the backs of units enough for the razor occupants to mop up.  

 

But will give some break downs soon.

 

For now though...

 

http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb447/Brindleysa/Veterans%202016/IMG_20160703_160218_zpsqomst7fg.jpg

 

[Morticon]

Game 1. 

 

Sadly, my phone died on day one  :( so i wasnt able to take pics.  

Huge apologies there. 

 

But, first game I was up against a new player.  Much to my detriment, I had completely and utterly underestimated him and didn't bother to ask about the rules of his list.  Just heard, okay, bunch of thunderwolves, bunch of rune priests, bunch of pods and some fancy dreads- cool.  

Found out very quickly it was a blackmane detachment, with all the pods coming in turn one. 

(sorry about the shakey pic) 

 

I deployed like this:

 

http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb447/Brindleysa/Veterans%202016/IMG_20160702_095206_zps8frun4bb.jpg

 

I deployed in a way that I could push through to the central objective - which was the secondary.  Primary was maelstrom and tertiary was "veterans Rising" where two units were marked for death, but gained special rules.  Set up type was "tight wedge" - a narrow triangle from the corner of each long board edge to the center point, with a 12" radius bubble.

 

I got first turn.  3 Pods came down, 1 targeting the dread, 1 deploying Cassor so that I could counter charge later and then 1 in the top right to claim a maelstrom objective.  The meltas both duffed <_< 

Everything else jumped forward where possible and the long fangs were shot at too (being my other marked for death squad). Luckily they break, but sadly, i dont have first blood yet. 

 

In his turn (much to my surprise) all the pods come in.  Oh dear.  He places a melta squad of hunters next to my sicaran (though he did put the meltas closer- so maybe Sarosh could come into play). 

 

He starts shooting the crap out of me and i take various marine casualties, he also gets of sanctuary on the shield thunder wolves - so i have 2++ to contend with.  <_< 

 

In his psychic phase, the evil lightning power doesnt go off- so im safe for now.  Luckily for me Sarosh scores 2 or 3 hits, and then 2 rends, taking out the two closest meltas ! My sicaran is safe for a turn! Also, quite luckily, he failed his charge with his dreads on the melta squad that targeted the dreads in the first place.

 

In turn two, i move into position with my DC, and with my ASM - but freaking FORGET to move my VanVets - SO bleak. 

My grav and then the DC and Commander ASM charge take out most of the downed pod squads.  But - freakin Cassor (as mentioned previously) duffs every single one of his 8 attacks on the charge.  I was SO bleak.  So, SO bleak.  WS4 man, eep. 

The bonus was that all 10 men had to clump around me and prevented the TWs from smashing cassors face in. 

...or so I thought.  Next turn saw me take krak grenades to the face and he rolls three 6s <_< so, all in all with 14 attacks, i killed 2 models.  Well done.  <_< 

Other than Cassor, pods came down to help take out his dreads/ancients. I took out the shield one. 
The game was going very slowly unfortunately (new player) - and we were running out of time. 
 

There was a bit of back and forth, he was taking heavy, heavy casualties and i was in the lead on strategic objectives.  
 

In the course of the next two turns, his Twolves smashed around my left flank and started eating up things.  His dread charged a DA squad with plasgun, and wound up losing two hullpoints as a result- dying before combat. 

I stayed alive for as long as I could, and cleaned up the rest of his army.  I just didnt have enough time to kill his 1 remaining model in the longfang squad, meaning we were both on 1 unit killed for marked units- meaning no one scored the tertiary.

 

Secondary was nearly mine!!! But damn that objective secured on the blackmanes ><; He moved to a point where I couldnt take the secondary (a central relay post).  We ended 4th turn and it was 17-2 to me.  Not terrible- but, out of 36 points, thats a very average score.

Had it gone on another turn, i would have killed the last long fang, and repositioned to get the secondary- though its likely he could have contested that too - its unlikely i would have gotten it without considerable luck vs the TWs.

Solid game, and a scary, scary list!  

 

[ThatOneMarshal]

Awesome batrep Morticon! I feel your pain about the Thunderwolves, they've haunted me since 5th edition. I think you may have given me hope about the BA. If you don't mind, I have some questions:

 

1: I'm interested to here why you chose the DA as your battle company? Wouldn't a Gladius with white scars work better as you could get scout on your vehicles, alleviating some of the issues you had with mobility? And hit and run seem like quite a bit better traits.

 

2: could you see this list working at a lower points level like 1850 or 2000? Or would it become too points dense into the battle co?

 

3: and finally did you feel like the BA were a tax and it would have been more effective just to go full DA? It seemed like the BA pulled their weight the first battle, interested to hear about the other games.

[CaptainHelion]

Mort was talking about how useful the jumpers were proving in the pregames. Definitely interested in hearing how much that carried forwards

[Morticon]

Awesome batrep Morticon! I feel your pain about the Thunderwolves, they've haunted me since 5th edition. I think you may have given me hope about the BA. If you don't mind, I have some questions:

 

1: I'm interested to here why you chose the DA as your battle company? Wouldn't a Gladius with white scars work better as you could get scout on your vehicles, alleviating some of the issues you had with mobility? And hit and run seem like quite a bit better traits.

 

2: could you see this list working at a lower points level like 1850 or 2000? Or would it become too points dense into the battle co?

 

3: and finally did you feel like the BA were a tax and it would have been more effective just to go full DA? It seemed like the BA pulled their weight the first battle, interested to hear about the other games.

1.  There were two reasons for this.  The first is that the DA are comparatively cheaper than the SM Gladius.  Their minimum Aux cost is 165 points, while DA are 55.  They can, admittedly shave this difference down to 105 vs 55 by choosing two single attack bikes over regular ASM, but then you're paying 105 points for whatever scout, or reroll etc.  I think scout may have helped in a lot of games, but I think the Full BS OW is really money and works so, so well.  The second reason is that I have an affinity for the DA in general - ever since 2nd ed when we shared a codex with them.  To me, it seemed more "Angels of Deathy".  Id give it about a 65/35 weighting for each reason. 

 

2.  At 2k, ya, i think it could work with some tweaks.  At 1850, i think you have far too many points in the double-company.  

 

3. BA were without a doubt the stars of the show.  DA did the groundwork and provided a solid support for the BA - the unsung heroes -  but it was the BA that were winning me games, kickin ass and chewing bubblegum.  

 

You'll read about it soon, soon ! ^_^

[Morticon]

Game 2  vs Tau.

 

Ben was a relatively new player.  Or returning player from 4th ed, i think.  

He was rocking a very old-school Tau list.  

 

From memory it looked like:  

 

Firewarrior leader duder

Battlesuit commander with bling. 

5 Crisis Battlesuits

3 Crisis suits (dual burstcannons - i think this unit puts out 24 S5 shots.)

2 Crisis Suits 

1 Crisis suit  
12 Kroot

12 Kroot

12 Kroot

12 Firewarriors

12 Firewarriors

3x4 Drones (drone formation)

3x Railsides with missile pods

3x Stealth Suits with pods

1x Piranha

1x Riptide

 

 

The mission primary was modified KP, where we had to choose 3 units of ours, and 3 enemy units to be the marked for death units. Only those 6 units counted for KP. 
 

I choose my Sicaran and 2 scout squads (weaker, but able to go into reserve and walk on in safety behind my lines). 

 

Secondary was Maelstrom and Tertiary was the Relic. 

 

Board Set up was old style "cleanse" i think its called? The board quarter one.  I got bottom right, he got top left, with some nice ruins.  Because of nightfight, i was forced to take the #2 on the strategic table with one of my rolls.  I cant remember the other roll. 

 

I deployed my scouts off board, the rhinos in positions in my mid right flank covering the top, and the other rhino covering the mid bottom of the battlefield.  The dual-grav pillboxes are quite something - and a fantastic deterrent.  The commander I put forward, ahead of the other jumpers ready to tank the incoming small arms fire from the Tau. The Vanvets were top middle of my zone, while the DC and ASM where on the line ready to rush into battle.  
 

 

 

tbc....

[CaptainHelion]

3. BA were without a doubt the stars of the show.  DA did the groundwork and provided a solid support for the BA - the unsung heroes -  but it was the BA that were winning me games, kickin ass and chewing bubblegum.  

 

As it should be!

 

Glad to hear the Double Grav Devs were good. It's an idea I've had in the past, but I've not left the BA cordon just yet.

[Charlo]

With the double Grav Devs can you move the Rhino and get your full Salvo shots... Or are you still using the shorter range/ less shots?

[CaptainHelion]

It'll work like anything else. If the rhino moves, the passengers count as moving. So, the lower option, and half range. But that's 24" on the turn you get into position, and you don't have to move much after that.

[Charlo]

Thought as much, but was never sure :D

[Morticon]

It'll work like anything else. If the rhino moves, the passengers count as moving. So, the lower option, and half range. But that's 24" on the turn you get into position, and you don't have to move much after that.

 

This!

 

If ever the rhino did move, it usually used its "flat out" move too, after which it bunkered down and let loose hell.  Best thing about it is, even if the Rhino is charged thats 10 full BS grav shots. 

[CaptainHelion]

Disgusting. Just disgusting. I love it.

[Morticon]

So continuing with the Tau battle. 

 

 

I quite enjoyed this game. 

 

I cant remember who got first turn, but I cant remember it being a big of a deal.  The DC and the ASM surged forward as did the Vanvets. 

The left rhino stood ground, where the top right rhino moved a little more to the central point.  All the while the Sicaran was laying down some fire against the drones of the broadsides.  

 

The game played as expected, to be honest.  The jumpers surged forward, using cover to protect themselves, whilst being shot down as they advanced.  Thankfully the dropping pods provided enough of a distraction and also did a good job of providing some solid dakka en route in. 

 

Even Cassor dropped down behind the lines, only to clamber up the ruins eventually and finish off the broadsides - this was after he nommed a riptide!!   The gattling squad of the Tau put some serious damage on the vanvets -something like 12 or so wounds, but, i got silly lucky with saves and then FNP and only lost 1or 2 guys.  They then got seriously nailed by the devs.

 

When the DC, and vanvets and jumpers hit the line it was over.  He wanted to try take out the jumpers, but as a result, let the rhino dev squads clean up the big 5man crisis squad.  

The scouts came in later, and secured themselves in the backline, protected from damage.  We called it in the 4th, as id secured all the objectives, and there were precious little fishies left. 

 

Solid victory with 34out of 36 battle points to me. 

[CaptainHelion]

Sounds like a great game. One of those ones where enough went right for you in terms of luck that a bit of cunning and a touch of knowing what the feth you're doing could carry you to victory!

[Morticon]

Forgot to mention that the DC, Vanvets and remaining assaulters all managed to get a charge in on about 3 squads spaced out at various places across the board.  Took out a squad of kroot, fire warriors and drones as a result of the sweep.  Nice clean up.

[Nicodemus Doloroso]

So continuing with the Tau battle. 

 

<snip>

 

Even Cassor dropped down behind the lines, only to clamber up the ruins eventually and finish off the broadsides - this was after he nommed a riptide!!   The gattling squad of the Tau put some serious damage on the vanvets -something like 12 or so wounds, but, i got silly lucky with saves and then FNP and only lost 1or 2 guys.  They then got seriously nailed by the devs.

 

<snip>

 

You said in your general army overview that Cassor was a letdown in general, but I don't think you could have asked for more out of him in this battle and I'd venture to say that he pretty much earned his keep for the tournament here taking out a Riptide and several Broadsides. That said, I'm interested to see how a Stormraven can improve his efficiency (and that's exactly how I intend to deploy him in my own upcoming tournament -- the one you helped me with my list for).

[Morticon]

 

So continuing with the Tau battle. 

 

<snip>

 

Even Cassor dropped down behind the lines, only to clamber up the ruins eventually and finish off the broadsides - this was after he nommed a riptide!!   The gattling squad of the Tau put some serious damage on the vanvets -something like 12 or so wounds, but, i got silly lucky with saves and then FNP and only lost 1or 2 guys.  They then got seriously nailed by the devs.

 

<snip>

 

You said in your general army overview that Cassor was a letdown in general, but I don't think you could have asked for more out of him in this battle and I'd venture to say that he pretty much earned his keep for the tournament here taking out a Riptide and several Broadsides. That said, I'm interested to see how a Stormraven can improve his efficiency (and that's exactly how I intend to deploy him in my own upcoming tournament -- the one you helped me with my list for).

 

 

Got super lucky here on account of the limited anti-tank!!