Agents of The Sigillite - colourschemes and ideas

[Ryltar Thamior]

I'm presently working up an Inq28 warband for the Horus Heresy series of games we're running [you can find the associated WIP thread here] ... specifically representing some Agents of the Sigillite. 

Now, we already have rough colour schemes for the Knights Errant, and I'm presuming that Assassins and the like will be largely the same in 30k as they are for 40k - but for the human emissary I'm working on based on the older Titan Princeps miniature, I find myself wondering what colours to go with. 

So are there any specific colours or other items of heraldry etc. which are associated with Malcador's agents? 

And, for that matter, do people have nifty ideas for what to include in such a warband? 
(atm, it's built around the aforementioned emissary, with two Vlka Fenryka Huscarla 'minders', and I'm potentially considering adding an Assassin as well due to Malcador's role as Grandmaster of Assassins; perhaps also a diplomat/iterator - here's a photo of where we're at currently)

[Sandlemad]

Those wolves look great! Excellent extension of the watch-pack concept. The weapons look well-scaled and the IW helms a good call.

 

Heraldry-wise, I think it was just Malcador's =I= symbol with an eye in front but maybe you could incorporate a flaming eagle icon somehow? That flaming eagle-staff was the Sigilite's symbol of office. Not very stealthy but maybe it would work as a small badge or token? The bare ceramite thing seems only to apply to the knights-errant but you probably wouldn't go wrong with black.

 

Have you considered the Sisters of Silence? Amendera Kendel left them to work for Malcador. Her sisters practically spat on her for doing so but that might have been for breaking her oath rather than because of a distaste for the Sigilite. They're definitely throneworld forces and there'll be plastic models soon.

 

The Sigilite had one Khalid Hassan, a captain of an elite spec-ops imperial army unit, working for Malcador. Maybe you could build on that and have some stormtrooper-esque dudes? Scions look a little too 40k but I'm sure the trim could be reduced.

 

There was also the Seventy, the loyal Death Guard who came to Terra with Garro. They sort of just hung about in semi-captivity, and seemed more than a touch bitter about it, particularly as they'd seen their captain made a knight-errant. Some of them ended up being used for Malcador's dirty jobs alongside Kendel. It might clash a little with your Dusk Raiders but a handful of cynical Death Guard could be fun.

 

Alternatively maybe an Imperial Fist? They didn't do well with espionage and Retribution mentions Dorn and Malcador's agents probably coming to blows occasioanlly but they surely worked together sometimes. Even if not marines, perhaps some IF neophytes in recon armour or legion serfs from Inwit?

[RandomMarine]

What happened to the RG member of the host did he rejoin the legion when corax came to terrra or did he become a errant.

[Black Cohort]

Those models look good. I could see humans working for Malcador having a similar colour scheme to knight's errant, a black and silver one of some kind, or just using their old gear.

 

Where is the torso on the right marine from?

[Ryltar Thamior]

Thanks for the ideas, everyone :D Great start. Please keep 'em coming. I also can't believe I overlooked reading the actual Sigillite story for inspiration. 
 

 

What happened to the RG member of the host did he rejoin the legion when corax came to terrra or did he become a errant.

Huh, I'd completely overlooked the Crusader Host themselves. Always seemed like a really fun concept - and have been interested in tracking down more mentions of them after reading (and loving) The Outcast Dead. A quick google suggests that the Raven Guard you speak of are mentioned in 'The Purge'?

 

Those models look good. I could see humans working for Malcador having a similar colour scheme to knight's errant, a black and silver one of some kind, or just using their old gear.

Where is the torso on the right marine from?

I should probably have included more in-depth parts-recipes on the WIP thread :P It's always somewhat infuriating to me when I see a decent conversion I wish to replicate ... and the person behind it hasn't handily labelled whatever part it is of theirs I wish to use. 

Both torsos are Legion Tartaroi with the tops cut off - I particularly liked the studded effect on the hammer-bearer for suggesting a more heavily armoured physique. 

Good call with the black (dark grey) and silver - that's probably what I'm leaning towards at the moment ( i'm wondering how to make these colours 'pop'); and i agree about holdover gear - although this must be balanced somewhat with a certain visual coterminity between the miniatures of the warband (like, giving the impression they're all drawn from different backgrounds and areas; but not in such a way that it just looks like I've grabbed six random miniatures out of my collection and chucked them together on the tabletop). 

I'm wondering whether the way around this is via a common insignia/unit heraldry painted on to almost every miniature (the great big "=][=" mentioned below, for instance); and/or other elements of visual unity like the mini-shields from the Grey Knights (iirc) kits.

 

Those wolves look great! Excellent extension of the watch-pack concept. The weapons look well-scaled and the IW helms a good call.

 

Heraldry-wise, I think it was just Malcador's =I= symbol with an eye in front but maybe you could incorporate a flaming eagle icon somehow? That flaming eagle-staff was the Sigilite's symbol of office. Not very stealthy but maybe it would work as a small badge or token? The bare ceramite thing seems only to apply to the knights-errant but you probably wouldn't go wrong with black.

 

Have you considered the Sisters of Silence? Amendera Kendel left them to work for Malcador. Her sisters practically spat on her for doing so but that might have been for breaking her oath rather than because of a distaste for the Sigilite. They're definitely throneworld forces and there'll be plastic models soon.

 

The Sigilite had one Khalid Hassan, a captain of an elite spec-ops imperial army unit, working for Malcador. Maybe you could build on that and have some stormtrooper-esque dudes? Scions look a little too 40k but I'm sure the trim could be reduced.

 

There was also the Seventy, the loyal Death Guard who came to Terra with Garro. They sort of just hung about in semi-captivity, and seemed more than a touch bitter about it, particularly as they'd seen their captain made a knight-errant. Some of them ended up being used for Malcador's dirty jobs alongside Kendel. It might clash a little with your Dusk Raiders but a handful of cynical Death Guard could be fun.

 

Alternatively maybe an Imperial Fist? They didn't do well with espionage and Retribution mentions Dorn and Malcador's agents probably coming to blows occasioanlly but they surely worked together sometimes. Even if not marines, perhaps some IF neophytes in recon armour or legion serfs from Inwit?

Thanks for the kind words! :D I'm particularly pleased with the Anglo-Saxon warrior feel which the IVth legion upgrade helms lend to them - and you're right, the standard Marine upgrade weapons which have often struck me as looking almost comically oversized for the ways they're supposed to be employed ... well ... on true-scales, they look a lot more 'in proportion' :P 

Good point about Malcador's personal iconography. The flaming eagle might be an order of magnitude beyond my (nonexistant) freehand skills to execute - although I wonder if High Elf kits with their phoenixes etc. might form an acceptable substitute. The other option is the small heraldic shield bitz from the Grey Knights kits affixed at the shoulder on the human-sized kits, bearing that rather large "=][=" you mention. (although these have often seemed rather large on ordinary, unaugmented humans (being perhaps the size of a head or bigger). Either way, prominent "=][="s seem like the way to go! Thanks!

Excellent suggestion about the Sister of Silence! If I put enough effort into it, I could probably convert one up from some of the Dark Eldar bits I have sitting around at the moment - although the upcoming Prospero plastics look pretty superlative :D (is that box out next month or december). I'm presuming the fluff citation to get an insight about the ccharacter you mention etc. is Flight of the Eisenstein? 

Great call with the spec-ops soldiery. Although I see what you mean about the extant plastic Storm Troopers being too um ... modern-40k. This leaves a number of options:

- I have most of a box of Greatswords sitting around (a good number of which are earmarked for use as Remembrancers to go with my reject/loyalist IVth Legion warband), which could form a viable source of more appropriate (read: "restrained" design-wise) torsos. These could be combined with Cadian or Genestealer Cultist weapons, arms and shoulderpads to 'modernize' them (although I wonder how much that would get across 'special forces' vibe - I do have some interesting ideas for night-vision goggle conversions though; and perhaps 'kneeling' legs etc. might help convey the right 'feel') [another alternate to this approach would be to sprig for some of the Forge World Fantasy Empire swordsmen/command etc. to use as the base miniatures, although I remain wary of 'over-ornamentation' for Heresy-era, which has always seemed rather more spartan and pragmatic/utilitarian in its approach to technical design]

- There's also the potential to use old Kasrkin figures (particularly since they're back up on 'Made to Order' :D - annoyed I missed out on the Tallarn Lieutenant I was uber-keen to scrape up for this project); although while I can definitely see how they'd work as up-armoured special forces types, there would be an issue with how to integrate them into the Heresy-era rather than just having them look like 40k imports (i.e. visually distinguish them from their Cadian origins) - particularly since the more obvious 40k-era solution of adding skulls and what not is a bit much for 30k. Alternately, there's other stock Imperial guard figures from the older ranges - Tallarns, perhaps, or Mordians for an Honour Guard, or even the more recent Vostroyans. 

- A third idea would be to use some of the rather beautiful Solar Auxilia miniatures. These would have the obvious advantage of already being identifiably both 30k and 'elite'; although I'm loathe to use stock figures as-is and unconverted :P 

Interesting call with the Garro-ites; might jive in well with the potential for former-Crusader Host marines floating around the place. Although it behooves me to point out that the Dusk Raiders are my associate's rather than my own, being used for the same game. 

Now that you mention the Fists and a ... fractious relationship betwixt Dorn and Malcador (What do they often squabble over?) ...... I think that's given me yet another idea for a Heresy-era warband! I've got Sigillite agents running about the place - but what if, motivated by a not-entirely trust-worthy relationshp with Malcador, *Dorn* also had his own groups of agents & operatives sent to some of the same areas (in this case, Imperium Secundus). 

 

 

[Black Cohort]

Thanks for the ideas, everyone Great start. Please keep 'em coming. I also can't believe I overlooked reading the actual Sigillite story for inspiration.

Removed stuff to shorten quote

Those models look good. I could see humans working for Malcador having a similar colour scheme to knight's errant, a black and silver one of some kind, or just using their old gear.

Where is the torso on the right marine from?

I should probably have included more in-depth parts-recipes on the WIP thread It's always somewhat infuriating to me when I see a decent conversion I wish to replicate ... and the person behind it hasn't handily labelled whatever part it is of theirs I wish to use.

Both torsos are Legion Tartaroi with the tops cut off - I particularly liked the studded effect on the hammer-bearer for suggesting a more heavily armoured physique.

Good call with the black (dark grey) and silver - that's probably what I'm leaning towards at the moment ( i'm wondering how to make these colours 'pop'); and i agree about holdover gear - although this must be balanced somewhat with a certain visual coterminity between the miniatures of the warband (like, giving the impression they're all drawn from different backgrounds and areas; but not in such a way that it just looks like I've grabbed six random miniatures out of my collection and chucked them together on the tabletop).

Removed stuff to shorten quote

I'm wondering whether the way around this is via a common insignia/unit heraldry painted on to almost every miniature (the great big "=][=" mentioned below, for instance); and/or other elements of visual unity like the mini-shields from the Grey Knights (iirc) kits.

Excellent suggestion about the Sister of Silence! If I put enough effort into it, I could probably convert one up from some of the Dark Eldar bits I have sitting around at the moment - although the upcoming Prospero plastics look pretty superlative :D (is that box out next month or december). I'm presuming the fluff citation to get an insight about the ccharacter you mention etc. is Flight of the Eisenstein?

Remove stuff to shorten post

Now that you mention the Fists and a ... fractious relationship betwixt Dorn and Malcador (What do they often squabble over?) ...... I think that's given me yet another idea for a Heresy-era warband! I've got Sigillite agents running about the place - but what if, motivated by a not-entirely trust-worthy relationshp with Malcador, *Dorn* also had his own groups of agents & operatives sent to some of the same areas (in this case, Imperium Secundus).

Interesting on the torsos, they look a lot like anvil torsos. The studded effect is really good.

A common symbol is good for tying models together, you could also do something like having them all have cloaks in the same colours. For a dark grey and silver colour scheme try looking at some new deathwatch logs, black and silver is their bread and butter.

Burning of Prospero goes up for pre-order this weekend. The sisters of silence models would look very different with simple things like head or weapon swaps and should be reasonably priced separate from the box if you don't want the full thing.

Fists could be marines that were exiled or perhaps left because they were unhappy with choices that were made. Alternatively Dorn seems too loyal to let his personal disagreements with other loyalists from doing his duty.

[Sandlemad]

Ah, apologies about misidentifying the Dusk Raiders! In that case there is definitely potential for some interesting narrative hooks via the crusader host. The list of members on lexicanum comes directly from The Purge. A lot either died or joined the knights-errant (and then died) but it looks like there's a good few 'unclaimed' names.

The greatswords and kasrkin ideas both sound great, btw. Different heads perhaps? Aren't there a few greatsword helms that look a bit like the skitarii vanguard ones? It's not guaranteed to make them look less 40k but it would make the kaskin less obviously cadian. There's already some decent conversions out in the wilds with skitarii parts and the genestealer cultist bits you mention.

The idea of a band of Dorn's agents is a good one. I get the impression they squabble over methods (e.g. the use of assassins in Nemesis) but Dorn's been increasingly getting his hands dirty and making hard choices as the BL series has marched on. Retribution simply says their interest often conflicted, which is pretty vague...

In Praetorian of Dorn he assigns Archamus to the task of hunting down the Alpha Legion and is clear that this is very un-fisty work, so BlackCohort's ideas of disaffected fists (or fists grimly doing distasteful work) is a good one. To return to the crusader host, Dorn did send the IH member, Crius, along with an IF minder to attempt to find any surviving Iron Hands (in Riven), so non-IF astartes are an option for Dorn as well as Malcador.

One more character that might be of interest - at the risk of leaning into that 'six random miniatures' issue () - was this... free agent, I guess, from Templar. She was a former Terran warlord who joined up with the Emperor early on in the unification wars and now acted as a sort of roving troubleshooter for the Council of Terra. She was elderly but got around with a bionic frame which made her agile enough to wield twin volkite guns and take down multiple Word Bearers alongside Sigismund while being ferocious old lady snarky in the extreme. She was also accompanied by some sort of gene-bred body guards. I cannot remember her name but the point is that there could be room for some pre-unifcation Terran elements. That might fit the more utilitarian sci-fi look you're after. Or could go full Blanche, of course.

The SoS, Kendel, who went working for Malcador was in Flight of the Eisenstein but she's also the main character (having left the sisterhood) in Ghosts Speak Not, a short story in The Silent War. If you've not read the stories in it, that's probably worth seeking out, it's got Templar, The Purge and a host of other good sources of small-scale war inspiration.

[Skalpynock]

I may be utterly wrong as I don't have the book at hand, but I seem to remember a picture in Visions showing "Malcador's Chosen", soldiers in what looked like brown Cadian armour with golden ornaments.

[Ryltar Thamior]

I may be utterly wrong as I don't have the book at hand, but I seem to remember a picture in Visions showing "Malcador's Chosen", soldiers in what looked like brown Cadian armour with golden ornaments.

Bingo, bango - you're on the money with that one!

 

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Malcador's_Chosen

 

Looks like a general colour-scheme of darkish greys and bling. 

 

In terms of stylistic pointers - this would appear to suggest that a more ornate visual appearance isn't entirely out of keeping with the Heresy-era - but perhaps less 'Gothic Weirdness' and more 'Renaissance' styling, so to speak. 

 

 

 

Interesting on the torsos, they look a lot like anvil torsos.  The studded effect is really good.

 

A common symbol is good for tying models together, you could also do something like having them all have cloaks in the same colours.  For a dark grey and silver colour scheme try looking at some new deathwatch logs, black and silver is their bread and butter.

 

Burning of Prospero goes up for pre-order this weekend.  The sisters of silence models would look very different with simple things like head or weapon swaps and should be reasonably priced separate from the box if you don't want the full thing.

 

Fists could be marines that were exiled or perhaps left because they were unhappy with choices that were made.  Alternatively Dorn seems too loyal to let his personal disagreements with other loyalists from doing his duty.

 

Thanks with regard to the studs - there's another Vlka Fenryka in my WIP thread (this one's accompanying the loyalist Iron Warriors as a safeguard), but using a Tartaros shoulderpad in order to give a bit of a brutal effect writ large. 

 

Good call with looking to the Deathwatch logs etc. for colour-scheme inspiration (and your other ideas, of course!)

 

Speaking of Deathwatch ... I also have this image saved to my inspiration folder - a Watch Master given Emperor's Children terminator pads. Not my work, but I'm very taken with the overall effect. Looking at it, there's a number of design-cues on the base miniature which bear some resemblance to the way the Garro Knight-Errant miniature's been done (for example, the Eagle behind the head). Something for me to keep in mind, at any rate. And while the Watch Master itself might be a bit large for a properly 'human' silhouette next to my Truescales - it's nevertheless reminded me that all the new Deathwatch kit is an ample supply of weapons, armour and other accessories stamped with a great "=][=" insignia (I'm eyeing up the shotguns particularly with this in mind). 

 

 

 

[Ryltar Thamior]

Ah, apologies about misidentifying the Dusk Raiders! In that case there is definitely potential for some interesting narrative hooks via the crusader host. The list of members on lexicanum comes directly from The Purge. A lot either died or joined the knights-errant (and then died) but it looks like there's a good few 'unclaimed' names.

The greatswords and kasrkin ideas both sound great, btw. Different heads perhaps? Aren't there a few greatsword helms that look a bit like the skitarii vanguard ones? It's not guaranteed to make them look less 40k but it would make the kaskin less obviously cadian. There's already some decent conversions out in the wilds with skitarii parts and the genestealer cultist bits you mention.

The idea of a band of Dorn's agents is a good one. I get the impression they squabble over methods (e.g. the use of assassins in Nemesis) but Dorn's been increasingly getting his hands dirty and making hard choices as the BL series has marched on. Retribution simply says their interest often conflicted, which is pretty vague...

In Praetorian of Dorn he assigns Archamus to the task of hunting down the Alpha Legion and is clear that this is very un-fisty work, so BlackCohort's ideas of disaffected fists (or fists grimly doing distasteful work) is a good one. To return to the crusader host, Dorn did send the IH member, Crius, along with an IF minder to attempt to find any surviving Iron Hands (in Riven), so non-IF astartes are an option for Dorn as well as Malcador.

One more character that might be of interest - at the risk of leaning into that 'six random miniatures' issue () - was this... free agent, I guess, from Templar. She was a former Terran warlord who joined up with the Emperor early on in the unification wars and now acted as a sort of roving troubleshooter for the Council of Terra. She was elderly but got around with a bionic frame which made her agile enough to wield twin volkite guns and take down multiple Word Bearers alongside Sigismund while being ferocious old lady snarky in the extreme. She was also accompanied by some sort of gene-bred body guards. I cannot remember her name but the point is that there could be room for some pre-unifcation Terran elements. That might fit the more utilitarian sci-fi look you're after. Or could go full Blanche, of course.

The SoS, Kendel, who went working for Malcador was in Flight of the Eisenstein but she's also the main character (having left the sisterhood) in Ghosts Speak Not, a short story in The Silent War. If you've not read the stories in it, that's probably worth seeking out, it's got Templar, The Purge and a host of other good sources of small-scale war inspiration.

Oh man, so much of use here :D

Knight-Errants (or, at least, ex-Crusader Host types) give me a good excuse to do nice one-off Truescales that really distill the 'essence' of a legion without having to necessarily worry about working up another four or so 'interesting' looking miniatures to bulk out a full warband; so I'm glad to see that there's some good precedence in this area. And also very interested to note that there's some Marines you fairly totally wouldn't expect amidst their number - the Loyalist Word Bearer, for instance!

I see what you mean about the Greatsword helms - they're a fairly solid way of 'distorting' the visual patterning of stock 40k miniatures. I think the helms in question are called 'Sallet' helms? Haven't done headswaps on single-piece miniatures before, so this could be interesting :D Another option could be Space Marine Scouts (well, the torsos of perhaps) with the aforementioned heads and other associated bits. I can recall some pieces of previous art generated for the old Inquisitor 54mm skirmish game which have effects similar to this:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-5JjMB0vwIhk/UTIng4ynwjI/AAAAAAAAB6Y/0QqXwAKijHM/s1600/daemonhunters+stormtrooper.jpg

And thanks hugely for the additional detail of Dorn's activities - I discussed the Agents of Dorn idea with my associate who forms the other half of our modelling/storytelling duo earlier, and he cited incidences such as the conflict over 'underhanded' means you mention in Nemesis (which I also have to read - although I've been put off by a number of people saying it's not one of the greater Horus Heresy novels, so to speak) as a potential reason such a notion wouldn't be entirely faithful to the fluff. I'm pretty intrigued to see that Dorn's approach alters somewhat through the course of the Heresy (which is entirely in keeping with the 'moral compromises' which the greatest war in the history of the Imperium have forced on all), and am grateful for specific instances to be able to point to in support of this.

And, you know, it's always good to have more guidance as to what to add to the reading-list :)

Now it's interesting that you mention a character drawn ultimately from the Unification Wars. The next set of warbands we're working on over here are actually specifically *for* the Unification Wars, so I'm heavily interested in fluff drawn from that direction. The backstory for the Remembrancer troop accompanying my Iron Warriors is also built around them being grizzled veterans for same.

One area wherein I like to think The Sigillite shines is not just in having massive troves of ancient artifacts or knowledge - but also in having quite considerable reservoirs of (not-entirely) human talent to draw from & upon. These folk are obviously going to be somewhat 'unique' in the extreme, so as long as there's appropriate & adequate fluff-justification for an inclusion, a slightly more esoteric or obscure backstory (which is nevertheless reflected in hard plastic/resin on the miniature in question) ought not be a problem. Something like the character you cite also gives additional 'springboard' oppportunities for other characters and small forces in the campaign. Replete with interesting and 'one-off' "toys" - in the instance you've cited, including geneforged soldiers (which is definitely another area i'm massively keen to explore!).