Black Library Advent Calendar 2016

[Marshal Loss]

Exocytosis was pretty good, I enjoyed it. Not one of the more memorable shorts but it felt like it was worth the money.

 

I'd much prefer Wraight to do the eventual DG novel - he's single-handedly rehabilitated the Legion with Daemonology, Scars and Path of Heaven, and his depictions of Mortarion are easily the best in the setting - but if this short shows that Swallow is going to write it, I'll try to keep an open mind. I didn't really enjoy FOTE or FTT, and I'm not a Garro fan - but again, the short wasn't bad, even if it wasn't Wraight level.  At the very least, it's nice to see the pieces coming together. I can't wait for Typhon and Mortarion's reunion.

[Plaguecaster]

http://puu.sh/sUIGD/a1cf7abc41.jpg

 

Exocytosis

 

Granted asylum by his old friend Luther of Caliban, First Captain Typhon of the Death Guard takes time away from the war... to find that a new corruption is spreading on Zaramund.

It's another step towards what we all know is coming for the Death Guard and Captain Typhon. Is it time that he embraced his destiny as a pawn of the Plague Lord?

Having long been hounded across the galaxy by the Dark Angels, First Captain Typhon of the Death Guard has limped his fleet to sanctuary in Segmentum Obscurus - as a guest of the separatist Luther of Caliban, no less. On the world of Zaramund, long a symbol of brotherhood amongst the Legions, Typhon begins to suspect that a new form of corruption has followed him out of the wider war. Will he embrace it, or escape into the darkness once more?

Damn this was good :D finally a story which deals with the Death Guard leading to their eventual corruption by Nurgle. The end was quite nice especially with the Death Guard's tradition of the cups used by Typhon to start the corruption. Considering it was James Swallow who first portrayed the death guard heresy style with the Flight of the Eisenstein it feels right letting him return for their corruption, I would easily read the book if he wrote a full novel detailing their fall to Nurgle

[bluntblade]

I'm less fussed about what's "right" and who'd deliver the better book.

[Master Ciaphas]

Thinking of getting this one...how heavily do the Fallen Angels figure into it?

[Marshal Loss]

The focus is mostly on the DG, although there are some nuggets. You get a small conversation between Luther Cypher and pals about what they hope to get from giving sanctuary to Typhon (short answer: they don't know), which I suppose adds a little depth to their status/motivation, and a Dark Angel goes snooping around the DG base before a confrontation with Typhon. If you're an avid DA fan pick it up but it's based around Typhon's destiny

[HeritorA]

 

 

Online synopses don't count. And basing your opinions on a blurb that I spent roughly 30 seconds putting together is hardly a good way to get informed about the author's ACTUAL work.

If the community applied this to the mainstream narrative releases like War Zone Fenris there would be literally no discussion on the internet. I thought the web was meant to help with communication, not create a mad tangle of total misinformation...

The internet has started actual revolutions and wars now. 40k gets off pretty easily.

 

Indeed. lol

 

 

Online synopses don't count. And basing your opinions on a blurb that I spent roughly 30 seconds putting together is hardly a good way to get informed about the author's ACTUAL work.

If the community applied this to the mainstream narrative releases like War Zone Fenris there would be literally no discussion on the internet. I thought the web was meant to help with communication, not create a mad tangle of total misinformation... 

 

It is not helping that the lore stuff given in it is so childish you can't take it seriously. It's not a W40K - it's a World of fething warcraft

[HeritorA]

Exocytosis was pretty good, I enjoyed it. Not one of the more memorable shorts but it felt like it was worth the money.

 

I'd much prefer Wraight to do the eventual DG novel - he's single-handedly rehabilitated the Legion with Daemonology, Scars and Path of Heaven, and his depictions of Mortarion are easily the best in the setting - but if this short shows that Swallow is going to write it, I'll try to keep an open mind. I didn't really enjoy FOTE or FTT, and I'm not a Garro fan - but again, the short wasn't bad, even if it wasn't Wraight level.  At the very least, it's nice to see the pieces coming together. I can't wait for Typhon and Mortarion's reunion.

True - Wraight is the only one so far who has done justice to Death Guard in HH.

 

The focus is mostly on the DG, although there are some nuggets. You get a small conversation between Luther Cypher and pals about what they hope to get from giving sanctuary to Typhon (short answer: they don't know), which I suppose adds a little depth to their status/motivation, and a Dark Angel goes snooping around the DG base before a confrontation with Typhon. If you're an avid DA fan pick it up but it's based around Typhon's destiny

And that's the problem. We get where - we shelter traitors - why we did that? We don't know. Maybe something good will come from that, lol

[Tymell]

I've enjoyed James Swallow's contributions so far, I like Fear to Tread, Eisenstein and his Garro stories, but I still really want Chris Wraight to do the Doom of the Death Guard novel, just because he's done so well with them so far and I think it would be a huge missed opportunity otherwise.

 

But like Marshal Loss I'll try to keep an open mind and I'm looking forward to it, whoever gets to write it.

[LaurieJGoulding]

Andrey - remember, always say "In my humble opinion"...

 

Tymell has the right tone in his post. People don't automatically tune out when you acknowledge that this is subjective.

 

I, for one, really like Chris De Burgh's early music. I don't expect anyone here to come with me on that, and I'm certainly not even going to go as far as to say it's "good". But I could tell you all the things I like about it...

[HeritorA]

Andrey - remember, always say "In my humble opinion"...

Tymell has the right tone in his post. People don't automatically tune out when you acknowledge that this is subjective.

I, for one, really like Chris De Burgh's early music. I don't expect anyone here to come with me on that, and I'm certainly not even going to go as far as to say it's "good". But I could tell you all the things I like about it...

In my humble opinion As Oleander Koh told us - 'manners can definitely help in the Eye of Terror'

[Pariah32]

Well just read Exocytosis and must say it was an interesting way of doing things. There was a good little tale here to be told and James does a great job of telling it. There is a sense of symmetry about the whole thing that just worked for me.

I'm not sure why everyone gives James Swallow a hard time I really enjoy his work. Sure Chris did a great job with the Death Guard, but so did James in Flight of the Eisenstein and Nick in Deathfire?

If where picking favourites then I would choose Rob sanders for his depiction of the Death guard in The Distant Echoes of Old Night, now that was one heck of a story, Rob really demonstrates the sheer unstoppable power of the Death Guard, I would recommend that to anyone who has not yet read that one.

[1ncarnadine]

Well just read Exocytosis and must say it was an interesting way of doing things. There was a good little tale here to be told and James does a great job of telling it. There is a sense of symmetry about the whole thing that just worked for me.

I'm not sure why everyone gives James Swallow a hard time I really enjoy his work. Sure Chris did a great job with the Death Guard, but so did James in Flight of the Eisenstein and Nick in Deathfire?

Yeah, Exocytosis seemed alright. My thoughts on it echo Marshall Loss's pretty heavily. I would prefer Wraight, because he already has my trust. But if this is any indication I'll probably be fine if James Swallow writes the "fateful journey." I have not read Fear to Tread or listened to any of the Garro stuff, so my experience with him is entirely limited to Flight of the Eisenstein, but I do like how he handled Typhon here. I kind of wish FotE had had more of these traitor perspectives, although it's been way too long since reading FotE for me to comment on it accurately. Actually, I remember very little of FotE, period. I hope that's not a bad sign, because I remember the opening trilogy and Fulgrim quite well despite having read them around the same time.

If where picking favourites then I would choose Rob sanders for his depiction of the Death guard in The Distant Echoes of Old Night, now that was one heck of a story, Rob really demonstrates the sheer unstoppable power of the Death Guard, I would recommend that to anyone who has not yet read that one.

The short story where the Death Guard are cackling and hurling insults at their foes? That one felt so jarring to me. All of that was coming from a Legion that's renowned as the embodiment of silent death, famous for their dour demeanor and general lack of a battlecry.

[bluntblade]

FotE is OK, but doesn't really show that much of the Death Guard's character as a Legion barring one of them thinking "we're not that grumpy", other Legions seeing them as obstinate, and Garro feeling some distance from his Barbaran counterparts because of their attitude to the weak. Which isn't that much, for a novel in which they were the lead, compared to the likes of ATS, Scars or Horus Rising.

[mc warhammer]

FoTE really didn't grab me either, though I particularly liked the scenes with Dorn.

[Marshal Loss]

Writing quality aside, Wraight has been the man who has moved the pieces into place for the fall of the Death Guard. He was the one who rehabilitated Mortarion after the events of Vengeful Spirit, making his backflipping on matters of the warp more understandable. His encounters with the Khan in Scars began to show the effects his corruption was having on him and sets up his rivalry with the Khan, and Path of Heaven finishes with the cliffhanger of Eidolon being ordered to help Mortarion find Typhon. In Blackshield, Wraight helps show the effect that Mortarion's personality has on his own Legion - even his own Deathshroud. Little nuggets like the fleet using special phosphex ammunition against the Scars all add depth to a Legion that has received very little attention in the HH series.

 

Most importantly, the Death Guard are believable, threatening antagonists in his books. Mortarion holds his own against the Khan and the Death Guard are pure badassery personified in Path of Heaven. Kyme's Death Guard in Deathfire were a joke. They're respectable enough in Vengeful Spirit, although the aforementioned warp flirting and Mortarion massacring his own Deathshroud felt utterly absurd before Wraight at least put it into perspective. Distant Echoes of Long Night is a cool story that I did enjoy, but it felt like an inappropriate depiction of the XIV as LetsYouDown said.

 

Out of a potential list of authors who have done major portrayals of the DG to date, the list is short: Swallow, Wraight, McNeill perhaps. Out of those, Wraight is the one that got the ball rolling and linked the various stories together with FW's new/updated lore into a coherent body, made Mortarion a believable character and gave them their best moments in the novel series so far.

 

FoTE, Swallow's own solitary DG contribution prior to this, doesn't really compare in terms of its depiction of the DG. They come across more as a vanilla Legion (as Bluntblade said, to steal his point) and the story is centered around Garro, who is the walking sterotype of the goody goody Terran. It's not a novel you're going to enjoy if you don't like Garro, and does it compare to Wraight's contributions to the DG? I don't think so. I'm sure Swallow his his own fans, and that's fine - his work has just generally not been my cup of tea. The short wasn't bad though, and I'll keep an open mind like I said.

 

That being said, complaining/wishlisting won't change a thing - if Swallow is doing the DG fall novel, what's done is done as it seems like the whole series is planned out and set in stone now. It's a true pity, but at the very least I would hope that when Mortarion meets the Khan on Terra, it is Wraight that covers that. I'd assumed that he would be the one to do it because of how much he's covered them in his WS novels and the shorts he's written, he seemed the natural (and best) choice. Either way, I'll inevitably buy the novel and hope for the best, as this is a moment I've been looking forward to for a long time. The DG deserve a full novel.

[1ncarnadine]

That being said, complaining/wishlisting won't change a thing - if Swallow is doing the DG fall novel, what's done is done as it seems like the whole series is planned out and set in stone now. It's a true pity, but at the very least I would hope that when Mortarion meets the Khan on Terra, it is Wraight that covers that. I'd assumed that he would be the one to do it because of how much he's covered them in his WS novels and the shorts he's written, he seemed the natural (and best) choice. Either way, I'll inevitably buy the novel and hope for the best, as this is a moment I've been looking forward to for a long time. The DG deserve a full novel.

*RAMPANT SPECULATION AHEAD*

If things are set in stone, remember that Wraight has also been writing most all of Russ's stuff post-Prospero Burns. So if he's not writing the Death Guard story leading up to Terra and he is also slated for a Siege of Terra book involving the Khan, he's probably writing the Wolf Cull and Russ's ill-fated stab at beheading the Warmaster.

Previously, in my head, James Swallow was doing another Blood Angels book covering their trip to Terra and Wraight would do the Wolf Cull and then a book including the Death Guard's Bestest Day leading in to the Siege and the Khan encounter. But now we know that David Annandale is doing Ruinstorm, and James Swallow did recently finish Garro (Book 42?), so it would add up.

And, if I'm right, there are good odds that we'll see Wraight do some Sons of Horus antagonist POV

[bluntblade]

After his one scene with corrupted Horus, I'd love to see that

[Roomsky]

The one point I think Flight of the Eisenstein's Mortarion had going for him is that it was easily believable that his legionaries would revere him as much as they do. He seemed genuinely concerned about Garro, and disappointed with his betrayal. The scene where he shared a drink was great as well, and hammers home nicely Mortarion's affinity for his sons. They didn't seem tools to him, and while I didn't like his portrayal as much as Wraight's, it made it easy to swallow (kek) that he was one of the more resistant traitors, disapproving of what they had become vs what was advertised.

 

While I echo the sentiment the others have brought forward and that I hope Wraight gets to handle it, I think Swallow could do a perfectly acceptable Doom of the Deathguard novel. 

[Marshal Loss]

That being said, complaining/wishlisting won't change a thing - if Swallow is doing the DG fall novel, what's done is done as it seems like the whole series is planned out and set in stone now. It's a true pity, but at the very least I would hope that when Mortarion meets the Khan on Terra, it is Wraight that covers that. I'd assumed that he would be the one to do it because of how much he's covered them in his WS novels and the shorts he's written, he seemed the natural (and best) choice. Either way, I'll inevitably buy the novel and hope for the best, as this is a moment I've been looking forward to for a long time. The DG deserve a full novel.

*RAMPANT SPECULATION AHEAD*

If things are set in stone, remember that Wraight has also been writing most all of Russ's stuff post-Prospero Burns. So if he's not writing the Death Guard story leading up to Terra and he is also slated for a Siege of Terra book involving the Khan, he's probably writing the Wolf Cull and Russ's ill-fated stab at beheading the Warmaster.

Previously, in my head, James Swallow was doing another Blood Angels book covering their trip to Terra and Wraight would do the Wolf Cull and then a book including the Death Guard's Bestest Day leading in to the Siege and the Khan encounter. But now we know that David Annandale is doing Ruinstorm, and James Swallow did recently finish Garro (Book 42?), so it would add up.

And, if I'm right, there are good odds that we'll see Wraight do some Sons of Horus antagonist POV

I don't know if my heart could take that. My wallet certainly couldn't, because everything he writes about I have a burning desire to purchase and paint. I'd love to see his take on 30k era Abaddon, (as from memory it's Abaddon who leads the SoH elite at Yarant).

If Swallow does the fall of the DG, but Wraight does Wolf Cull and Khan v. Mortarion on Terra, I'd be content. Not perfect by any means, but inevitably some cracking novels for us to enjoy. I'm more than happy to eat my words if he produces something I love, the man is certainly a prolific author so I'm sure he's capable.

@Roomsky - Mortarion in Eisenstein isn't the bitter twisted creature we've come to know and love - that's my problem. It doesn't really sit well with the more modern depictions, so it doesn't show he can work with the character in the way Wraight can. He's not a Perturabo type leader but the similarities should be there, his intense hatred of the Emperor (well, tyranny) and the effects his upbringing had on him really weren't really communicated very well at all in FoTE. He even says sadly that the lodges make people feel appreciated etc, implying that he didn't feel appreciated by the Emperor...which isn't really his thing, he's hated his Emperor since his vengeance was denied to him all those years ago. He comes across as...well, a bit too fatherly and normal for my tastes. He was raised by monsters and worshipped as a saviour by the denizens of Barbarus. He's a damaged nutter and should be portrayed as such.

You're right though, I'm sure he'll do a perfectly acceptable novel. I'll take what I get either way, a DG novel is long overdue. :)

[mc warhammer]

He's a damaged nutter and should be portrayed as such.

 

sure he is. but that shouldn't be all he is.

 

put swallow's exploration of mortarian's vulnerability up there with his work on dorn in FoTE for me. thanks for the reminder

[Marshal Loss]

 

He's a damaged nutter and should be portrayed as such.

sure he is. but that shouldn't be all he is.

 

put swallow's exploration of mortarian's vulnerability up there with his work on dorn in FoTE for me. thanks for the reminder

 

 

I didn't mean it to sound like that's all he should be:

 

 

 

 the effects his upbringing had on him really weren't really communicated very well at all in FoTE.

 

 

 

It's not his vulnerability I dislike, it's the fact that we don't see any of the bitterness of his later and superior depictions. There should be bitterness, because that's part of what makes him such a tragic character. Raised on a planet by monsters, he was a product of the environment he was raised in. Add in his attitude in Path of Heaven in regards to failure/praise and it would have been great. Compare him in FoTE to Mortarion in other texts and he's a different character. It's an earlier book though, so much can be chalked up to that, but until we see Swallow handle him again it's pure conjecture.

 

As for the reminder, you're welcome. This topic has made me go back and re-read it so it's fresh in my head at the moment.

 

Don't mean to be negative, it's not so much that Swallow writes a completely terrible Mortarion, it's that Wraight writes (hehe) a brilliant one. I'm keen for the fall of the DG to be covered anyway

[Roomsky]

I always found Mortarion's dislike of the Emperor based on his kill-stealing a little silly, especially in comparison to 1. Being the same sort of tyrant he fought his entire life until that point to depose, and 2. letting those gosh-darned psykers have so much freedom. I mean, didn't he take a scythe as his weapon to identify with the farmers he saved rather than to look like a heavy metal album cover?

 

To me, Mortartion is compelling because while not especially charismatic, he believed in the Warmaster's espoused cause, and doesn't seem to take much joy in praising daemons, flaying, slaughter for its own sake, hookers and blow, or planet-killing outbursts. He, like, believed in the cause, man! 

 

But I am in agreement that the total lack of crazy in Swallows Mortarion was a problem, and as I've said, Wraight does it much better. But hoo boy, compared to stuff like Mcneill's Mortarion, James did pretty good.

[mc warhammer]

 

 Raised on a planet by monsters, he was a product of the environment he was raised in. Add in his attitude in Path of Heaven in regards to failure/praise and it would have been great. Compare him in FoTE to Mortarion in other texts and he's a different character. It's an earlier book though, so much can be chalked up to that, but until we see Swallow handle him again it's pure conjecture.

 

Don't mean to be negative, it's not so much that Swallow writes a completely terrible Mortarion, it's that Wraight writes (hehe) a brilliant one. I'm keen for the fall of the DG to be covered anyway

 

 

nope, i hear ya. i didn't read what you had to say as negative at all, only a very strong preference. and it's one that makes 100% sense and i'm glad that subsequent authors delivered on that.

 

if i can expand my thoughts a little?  i have a personal (and strong) professional point of view on depicting characters;  if they're written as real and believable human beings, then i believe they will behave differently in different situations with different people. the "you" that interacts with your boss at work (if you have one)... is that the same "you" who interacts with your parents? or the same "you" in a relationship with someone you deeply trust? was it the same "you" who went on the first date with that person? the same you that talks to a policeman? or a homeless person?  or the you in a fight? yes, they are all you...but we tone down or turn up different aspects of ourselves dependent on our personal needs in a circumstance and it's not even entirely voluntary.

 

i'm not the biggest fan of FotE but i can reconcile the mortarion in that with the fact that on the one hand he was still playing the loyal son in public and on the other, he was trying to sway one of the most steadfast terran astartes in his ranks. as roomsky points out- mortarion knew the potency of appearances when he took up the scythe as his weapon on barbarus. i think that when talking to garro, he dialed back some of his more bitter and negative nancy attitudes and brought the more seductive ones to the fore: vulnerability and caring. and it worked. garro was practically swooning.

 

i know real world references are generally frowned upon here, but watch videos of donald trump throughout the last two decades. the man he presents to the media currently is like a totally different person to a decade ago; not only in his opinions but his temperment and mannerisms too. yet it's still the donald.

[bluntblade]

I would like to see the traitor version of the awesome First Captain Abaddon Abnett gave us. Or some different SoH - one of the things I like about Path of Heaven is the new Emperor's Children characters, and with the deaths and/or defections of several leading captains (five by my count) among the SoH, there's plenty of room for new ones to rise.

[1ncarnadine]

 

i'm not the biggest fan of FotE but i can reconcile the mortarion in that with the fact that on the one hand he was still playing the loyal son in public and on the other, he was trying to sway one of the most steadfast terran astartes in his ranks. as roomsky points out- mortarion knew the potency of appearances when he took up the scythe as his weapon on barbarus. i think that when talking to garro, he dialed back some of his more bitter and negative nancy attitudes and brought the more seductive ones to the fore: vulnerability and caring. and it worked. garro was practically swooning.

 

I have to agree. Again, been a long time since reading FotE, but I remember Mortarion acting fatherly to Garro, but also condescending and incredibly distant. It's a story from the lens of Garro, and Garro's lens mostly overlooks the paranoia and bitterness in favor of seeing the idealism. Which seems very Garro?

 

But also, as Marshall Loss brought up, FotE is definitely a victim of being a very early Horus Heresy novel. They were still getting a feel for what they could do.

 

 

 

i know real world references are generally frowned upon here, but watch videos of donald trump throughout the last two decades. the man he presents to the media currently is like a totally different person to a decade ago; not only in his opinions but his temperment and mannerisms too. yet it's still the donald.

 

http://i.imgur.com/ukNuhNy.jpg?1