Fabius Bile: Primogenitor

[Sandlemad]

About half way through, really enjoying it. Anyone else?

Fabius is suitably deranged but the rest of the cast are all fleshed out and well-developed. For the most part they are utterly insane apothecaries. Like, the World Eater, Arrian, isn't just a generic blood mad psychopath, he is an educated warrior-surgeon pushing his self-control so hard that he has actually affected an upper-class accent. He's pretty much the sanest and most reasonable member of the 'main crew'. And he still occasionally talks to the skulls he wears on his chest.

Some genuinely good black humour too, mostly of the blood and guts and unnecessary surgery sort. Delightful bit where Fabius

makes a crack about someone not having the stomach to do what's necessary. While performing surgery on himself. "Then, a moment ago, neither did I."

Or where he scratches his chin, listing off all the people who are trying to have him killed: Abaddon, the Word Bearers' ruling council, Angron, some Alpha Legion bigwigs, most of the Emperor's Children, Fulgrim himself...

It's also charming how Fabius, despite being an utter monster, is still carrying the torch of the great crusade. He's a died in the wool atheist. Gods, pfff.

"It is the height of folly to attribute motive to a random confluence of phenomena, Oleander." He sticks with this to the point of spitting in a greater daemon's face, essentially saying 'why should I listen to you? You're not even real.'

One minor issue is that I am now cursed to imagine Fabius's voice as that used in the wonderful Fabius Bile: Repairer of Ruin (there's a sample on the page, get yourself cursed too). Unfortunately it appears that as that was an audiodrama and this is an audiobook, there's no continuation of voice actors. A shame, the guy they had really was perfect. Oh well.

[DukeLeto69]

When is this book set? Is it M41 or is it after the HH?

[HeritorA]

About half way through, really enjoying it. Anyone else?

Fabius is suitably deranged but the rest of the cast are all fleshed out and well-developed. For the most part they are utterly insane apothecaries. Like, the World Eater, Arrian, isn't just a generic blood mad psychopath, he is an educated warrior-surgeon pushing his self-control so hard that he has actually affected an upper-class accent. He's pretty much the sanest and most reasonable member of the 'main crew'. And he still occasionally talks to the skulls he wears on his chest.

Some genuinely good black humour too, mostly of the blood and guts and unnecessary surgery sort. Delightful bit where Fabius

makes a crack about someone not having the stomach to do what's necessary. While performing surgery on himself. "Then, a moment ago, neither did I."

Or where he scratches his chin, listing off all the people who are trying to have him killed: Abaddon, the Word Bearers' ruling council, Angron, some Alpha Legion bigwigs, most of the Emperor's Children, Fulgrim himself...

It's also charming how Fabius, despite being an utter monster, is still carrying the torch of the great crusade. He's a died in the wool atheist. Gods, pfff.

"It is the height of folly to attribute motive to a random confluence of phenomena, Oleander." He sticks with this to the point of spitting in a greater daemon's face, essentially saying 'why should I listen to you? You're not even real.'

One minor issue is that I am now cursed to imagine Fabius's voice as that used in the wonderful Fabius Bile: Repairer of Ruin (there's a sample on the page, get yourself cursed too). Unfortunately it appears that as that was an audiodrama and this is an audiobook, there's no continuation of voice actors. A shame, the guy they had really was perfect. Oh well.

Amazing book - tis all said in Josh Reynolds 'first word' - awesome description of mazoshystic idealist with a dream - and his torch for the Great Crusade is epic

[DarkChaplain]

Sounds exactly like the kind of book I was expecting from Josh. Lovely.

[Sandlemad]

When is this book set? Is it M41 or is it after the HH?

M34. One of the key plot points is the EC attack on Craftworld Lugganath.

 

Oleander, the main POV character, is great too. A messed-up scheming EC apothecary who hums to himself just a little bit too much. Knows he isn't a great swordsman but can't stop starting fights, wearily admits that we all want to be a Lucius. Literally smokes daemons and bits of xenos, in a specially designed pipe, all for that good good high. Flirts with daemonettes, banters with elder. Probably my favourite character in a BL novel in a long time.

 

Any horror fans with recognise the song he sings in the free extract on the BL site as coming from the Carcosa stories of Ambrose Bierce and Robert Chambers' The King in Yellow.

[DukeLeto69]

 

When is this book set? Is it M41 or is it after the HH?

M34. One of the key plot points is the EC attack on Craftworld Lugganath.

Oleander, the main POV character, is great too. A messed-up scheming EC apothecary who hums to himself just a little bit too much. Knows he isn't a great swordsman but can't stop starting fights, wearily admits that we all want to be a Lucius. Literally smokes daemons and bits of xenos, in a specially designed pipe, all for that good good high. Flirts with daemonettes, banters with elder. Probably my favourite character in a BL novel in a long time.

Any horror fans with recognise the song he sings in the free extract on the BL site as coming from the Carcosa stories of Ambrose Bierce and Robert Chambers' The King in Yellow.

M34 cool more fleshing out of the timeline. I like that.

 

The King in Yellow is a very interesting Easter egg. There are many theories relating to Abnett's Pariah and the references to The Yellow King with some speculation that is could be Ahriman. I wonder if it is just a nod or if there are some linkages?

[Sandlemad]

When is this book set? Is it M41 or is it after the HH?

M34. One of the key plot points is the EC attack on Craftworld Lugganath.

Oleander, the main POV character, is great too. A messed-up scheming EC apothecary who hums to himself just a little bit too much. Knows he isn't a great swordsman but can't stop starting fights, wearily admits that we all want to be a Lucius. Literally smokes daemons and bits of xenos, in a specially designed pipe, all for that good good high. Flirts with daemonettes, banters with elder. Probably my favourite character in a BL novel in a long time.

Any horror fans with recognise the song he sings in the free extract on the BL site as coming from the Carcosa stories of Ambrose Bierce and Robert Chambers' The King in Yellow.

M34 cool more fleshing out of the timeline. I like that.

The King in Yellow is a very interesting Easter egg. There are many theories relating to Abnett's Pariah and the references to The Yellow King with some speculation that is could be Ahriman. I wonder if it is just a nod or if there are some linkages?

Not sure but I think it's it's simply down to Reynolds' background as a weird/horror writer apart from his BL work. The whole book is replete with 'modern day' quotes, usually attributed to 'some old Terran poet or other'. Bile is particularly fond of Yeats' 'the centre cannot hold' bit.

That said

a significant element of the book is the manipulations of the harlequins to kill off a promising EC lord. They explain this to Oleander and Bile at various points using a particular eldar play as an extended allegory for what they want to happen. Or what is fated to happen. It's all about a King in Feathers - a sort of Lear-like character - and a Count Sunflame, who are variously this EC lord, Bile and Oleander.

Oleander is an aesthete and sort of appreciates it, even if the book's climax shows he doesn't quite understand it, whereas Bile just snorts at the whole thing and calls it shoddy melodrama. That has rings to me of Chambers' King in Yellow play. Not so much Abnett's work, which appears to be doing something different with the concept.

Finished yesterday. Really wonderful book. Very well-written, lots of good black humour, nips along at a fair pace. The resolution is perhaps a bit curt. Not a rushed ending or a too-neat one but it's sharp. Very creepy depictions of noise marines and harlequins. Great characters, particularly a good spectrum of EC characters, from utter psychopaths to only mildly depraved sadists who can still conceive of discipline and such.

It hits on a lot of the same broad CSM themes as the Night Lords books, the Ahriman and Abaddon books, that one Khârn book: loss of brotherhood, purpose or direction, as well as the host of new post-heresy motives like conquering the Eye or reaching beyond reality. The difference is that when EC pine for the past, they know that they fell harder than any others, even before the flight from Terra. They aren't really harking back to when they served in the great crusade but to when they were top dogs in the legion wars, before Skalathrax and then Abaddon dropping a ship on Canticle City. Different characters have different opinions on where the rot began and if it's even a bad thing.

Bile actually seems more driven and feverishly motivated than during the heresy (barring an increasing melancholy about his failing body). He looks back on primarch cloning and the surgeries on Eidolon as sort of unfocused early works in service to others. Turns out he actually left Terra before Horus died because he realised how petty the whole rebellion was compared to the more important scientific work he should be doing.

Bile really comes off as the spiritual heir to the Emperor. He has his plans for humanity's evolution, his great work, and if he has to break a few eggs for it to come to pass, eh. I know this has been stated before in the codices but you see it in action here, with multiple iterations/generations of post-human post-astartes (and some specifically astartes-hunting) creatures. He's a wonderful character, fleshed out with lots of little details like a fondness for classical music (it helps him work) or a dry scorn for anything military.

If you liked any of those post-heresy, pre-41st millennium chaos books, this is absolutely worth getting.

[HeritorA]

 

 

When is this book set? Is it M41 or is it after the HH?

M34. One of the key plot points is the EC attack on Craftworld Lugganath.

Oleander, the main POV character, is great too. A messed-up scheming EC apothecary who hums to himself just a little bit too much. Knows he isn't a great swordsman but can't stop starting fights, wearily admits that we all want to be a Lucius. Literally smokes daemons and bits of xenos, in a specially designed pipe, all for that good good high. Flirts with daemonettes, banters with elder. Probably my favourite character in a BL novel in a long time.

Any horror fans with recognise the song he sings in the free extract on the BL site as coming from the Carcosa stories of Ambrose Bierce and Robert Chambers' The King in Yellow.

M34 cool more fleshing out of the timeline. I like that.

 

The King in Yellow is a very interesting Easter egg. There are many theories relating to Abnett's Pariah and the references to The Yellow King with some speculation that is could be Ahriman. I wonder if it is just a nod or if there are some linkages?

 

The Yellow King is Ahriman. We had big discussion on that after Pariah was released.

If Abnett ever will write Penitent, we will see more

 

When is this book set? Is it M41 or is it after the HH?

M34. One of the key plot points is the EC attack on Craftworld Lugganath.

 

Oleander, the main POV character, is great too. A messed-up scheming EC apothecary who hums to himself just a little bit too much. Knows he isn't a great swordsman but can't stop starting fights, wearily admits that we all want to be a Lucius. Literally smokes daemons and bits of xenos, in a specially designed pipe, all for that good good high. Flirts with daemonettes, banters with elder. Probably my favourite character in a BL novel in a long time.

 

Any horror fans with recognise the song he sings in the free extract on the BL site as coming from the Carcosa stories of Ambrose Bierce and Robert Chambers' The King in Yellow.

 

Oleander Koth is amazing. I think that Josh painted him from Edgar Poe, lol

[Karthak]

 

It hits on a lot of the same broad CSM themes as the Night Lords books, the Ahriman and Abaddon books, that one Khârn book: loss of brotherhood, purpose or direction, as well as the host of new post-heresy motives like conquering the Eye or reaching beyond reality. The difference is that when EC pine for the past, they know that they fell harder than any others, even before the flight from Terra. They aren't really harking back to when they served in the great crusade but to when they were top dogs in the legion wars, before Skalathrax and then Abaddon dropping a ship on Canticle City. Different characters have different opinions on where the rot began and if it's even a bad thing.

 

Have there been any Emperor's Children characters who regret rebelling against the Emperor in the first place? The only Legion named His children. The only Legion permitted to wear the Palatine Aquila, reduced to thrill-seekers manipulated by Slaanesh.

[Marshal Loss]

Out of interest, is Eidolon's fate mentioned? Curious if they're going to keep to the tit-bit in Index Astartes: Emperor's Children where it's highly likely he lives past the Siege of Terra, serving different masters.

 

Will pick this up soon I think, was hesitant but everybody seems to be enjoying it.

[Sandlemad]

It hits on a lot of the same broad CSM themes as the Night Lords books, the Ahriman and Abaddon books, that one Khârn book: loss of brotherhood, purpose or direction, as well as the host of new post-heresy motives like conquering the Eye or reaching beyond reality. The difference is that when EC pine for the past, they know that they fell harder than any others, even before the flight from Terra. They aren't really harking back to when they served in the great crusade but to when they were top dogs in the legion wars, before Skalathrax and then Abaddon dropping a ship on Canticle City. Different characters have different opinions on where the rot began and if it's even a bad thing.

Have there been any Emperor's Children characters who regret rebelling against the Emperor in the first place? The only Legion named His children. The only Legion permitted to wear the Palatine Aquila, reduced to thrill-seekers manipulated by Slaanesh.

Afraid not. The most... let's say 'moderate' EC is probably Oleander and he still registers almost every painful sensation as 'nice, gotta remember that one'. He's looking for brotherhood but I don't think anyone in the whole book regrets the heresy, as such. Bile sees it as a bit of a youthful folly and thinks most CSM are fools for immediately leaping into the control of new slave masters but there's no regretful loyalists.

Worth noting that the EC of the former 12th company still grin and use the old battlecry - "Children of the Emperor! Death to his foes!" - and get a kick out of it.

Out of interest, is Eidolon's fate mentioned? Curious if they're going to keep to the tit-bit in Index Astartes: Emperor's Children where it's highly likely he lives past the Siege of Terra, serving different masters.

Will pick this up soon I think, was hesitant but everybody seems to be enjoying it.

He's mentioned as being around and prominent, as are a handful of other EC bigwigs. Fulgrim has disappeared at this point and some of those bigwigs, including Eidolon, have formed a body called the Phoenix Conclave. They're devoted to setting the groundwork for his return but they don't seem very organised, it mostly appears to be a status thing. Bile thinks they're idiots.

[HeritorA]

Out of interest, is Eidolon's fate mentioned? Curious if they're going to keep to the tit-bit in Index Astartes: Emperor's Children where it's highly likely he lives past the Siege of Terra, serving different masters.

Will pick this up soon I think, was hesitant but everybody seems to be enjoying it.

What not to enjoy. It is stellar. Now I know who is the most dangerous on the field - apothecaries squad

Eidolon's fate - he will live a long a happy life.

[DarkChaplain]

A couple of chapters in, and enjoying it quite a bit. This is the Fabius that I wanted Josh to write since Repairer of Ruin got released. It also accounts for a lot of Heresy developments on Fabius since, and even references The Talon of Horus (which is expected, considering Repairer of Ruin was a lead-up to it). Fabius is delightfully despicable, and I love it.

[DarKnight]

I was waiting for a thread like this to emerge, thanks guys for the details.

[The Nephilim]

I've got to read this. From your guys' review Oleander sounds like how I've written my own IT to behave. More inspiration for a rewrite? Yes, please!

[b1soul]

 

 

Not sure but I think it's it's simply down to Reynolds' background as a weird/horror writer apart from his BL work. The whole book is replete with 'modern day' quotes, usually attributed to 'some old Terran poet or other'. Bile is particularly fond of Yeats' 'the centre cannot hold' bit.

 

That said

a significant element of the book is the manipulations of the harlequins to kill off a promising EC lord. They explain this to Oleander and Bile at various points using a particular eldar play as an extended allegory for what they want to happen. Or what is fated to happen. It's all about a King in Feathers - a sort of Lear-like character - and a Count Sunflame, who are variously this EC lord, Bile and Oleander.

 

Oleander is an aesthete and sort of appreciates it, even if the book's climax shows he doesn't quite understand it, whereas Bile just snorts at the whole thing and calls it shoddy melodrama.:P  That has rings to me of Chambers' King in Yellow play. Not so much Abnett's work, which appears to be doing something different with the concept.

 

 

Finished yesterday. Really wonderful book. Very well-written, lots of good black humour, nips along at a fair pace. The resolution is perhaps a bit curt. Not a rushed ending or a too-neat one but it's sharp. Very creepy depictions of noise marines and harlequins. Great characters, particularly a good spectrum of EC characters, from utter psychopaths to only mildly depraved sadists who can still conceive of discipline and such.

 

It hits on a lot of the same broad CSM themes as the Night Lords books, the Ahriman and Abaddon books, that one Khârn book: loss of brotherhood, purpose or direction, as well as the host of new post-heresy motives like conquering the Eye or reaching beyond reality. The difference is that when EC pine for the past, they know that they fell harder than any others, even before the flight from Terra. They aren't really harking back to when they served in the great crusade but to when they were top dogs in the legion wars, before Skalathrax and then Abaddon dropping a ship on Canticle City. Different characters have different opinions on where the rot began and if it's even a bad thing.

 

Bile actually seems more driven and feverishly motivated than during the heresy (barring an increasing melancholy about his failing body). He looks back on primarch cloning and the surgeries on Eidolon as sort of unfocused early works in service to others. Turns out he actually left Terra before Horus died because he realised how petty the whole rebellion was compared to the more important scientific work he should be doing.

Bile really comes off as the spiritual heir to the Emperor. He has his plans for humanity's evolution, his great work, and if he has to break a few eggs for it to come to pass, eh. I know this has been stated before in the codices but you see it in action here, with multiple iterations/generations of post-human post-astartes (and some specifically astartes-hunting) creatures. He's a wonderful character, fleshed out with lots of little details like a fondness for classical music (it helps him work) or a dry scorn for anything military.

 

If you liked any of those post-heresy, pre-41st millennium chaos books, this is absolutely worth getting.

 

If Wraight could make me interested in Eidolon...could Reynolds make me interested in Fabius?

 

Reynold's take sounds fascinating actually

[HeritorA]

Not sure but I think it's it's simply down to Reynolds' background as a weird/horror writer apart from his BL work. The whole book is replete with 'modern day' quotes, usually attributed to 'some old Terran poet or other'. Bile is particularly fond of Yeats' 'the centre cannot hold' bit.

That said

a significant element of the book is the manipulations of the harlequins to kill off a promising EC lord. They explain this to Oleander and Bile at various points using a particular eldar play as an extended allegory for what they want to happen. Or what is fated to happen. It's all about a King in Feathers - a sort of Lear-like character - and a Count Sunflame, who are variously this EC lord, Bile and Oleander.

Oleander is an aesthete and sort of appreciates it, even if the book's climax shows he doesn't quite understand it, whereas Bile just snorts at the whole thing and calls it shoddy melodrama. That has rings to me of Chambers' King in Yellow play. Not so much Abnett's work, which appears to be doing something different with the concept.

Finished yesterday. Really wonderful book. Very well-written, lots of good black humour, nips along at a fair pace. The resolution is perhaps a bit curt. Not a rushed ending or a too-neat one but it's sharp. Very creepy depictions of noise marines and harlequins. Great characters, particularly a good spectrum of EC characters, from utter psychopaths to only mildly depraved sadists who can still conceive of discipline and such.

It hits on a lot of the same broad CSM themes as the Night Lords books, the Ahriman and Abaddon books, that one Khârn book: loss of brotherhood, purpose or direction, as well as the host of new post-heresy motives like conquering the Eye or reaching beyond reality. The difference is that when EC pine for the past, they know that they fell harder than any others, even before the flight from Terra. They aren't really harking back to when they served in the great crusade but to when they were top dogs in the legion wars, before Skalathrax and then Abaddon dropping a ship on Canticle City. Different characters have different opinions on where the rot began and if it's even a bad thing.

Bile actually seems more driven and feverishly motivated than during the heresy (barring an increasing melancholy about his failing body). He looks back on primarch cloning and the surgeries on Eidolon as sort of unfocused early works in service to others. Turns out he actually left Terra before Horus died because he realised how petty the whole rebellion was compared to the more important scientific work he should be doing.

Bile really comes off as the spiritual heir to the Emperor. He has his plans for humanity's evolution, his great work, and if he has to break a few eggs for it to come to pass, eh. I know this has been stated before in the codices but you see it in action here, with multiple iterations/generations of post-human post-astartes (and some specifically astartes-hunting) creatures. He's a wonderful character, fleshed out with lots of little details like a fondness for classical music (it helps him work) or a dry scorn for anything military.

If you liked any of those post-heresy, pre-41st millennium chaos books, this is absolutely worth getting.

If Wraight could make me interested in Eidolon...could Reynolds make me interested in Fabius?

Reynold's take sounds fascinating actually

'Fabius' is an AWESOME book. Wraight's Eidolon could say that he doesn't want to live on a 'whim of overspilled demonic cocoction'. Reynold's Fabius and company send daemons back to «Be off with you, back to whatever child’s nightmare you crawled out of» His believe in Gods and daemons: «Come then... test me, figment....Names are for the sentient...'

Asking permission to send the daemon back to warp from this harsh realm! Edgar Poe quoting Oleander Koh.

And 'He did piss acid, after all....'

And the best of them - 'I know of a warrior of the Third who bartered away his recollections of Fulgrim’s apotheosis for the dream of a hrud migration. Another sold his last dream of the Corpse-Emperor for the price of a nightmare involving the fleshworks of the Dark City.'

I could quote this book for eternity. Josh Reynolds you glories glories bastard - see what have you done

«That was what this was all about – hope....«Prick his flesh, crack his bones, that’s the way the story goes. Urge him up, strike him down, call him out and pass him round.»

After all - whole novel is about the King of Feathers, who must shed his rags, and take his throne

[DarkChaplain]

66% through and at this point I can't see myself giving this a bad review at all once I'm done. This is the kind of book I didn't fully realize I always wanted, and needed. It fleshes out so much and readjusts Fabius to turn him into something that he needs to be. It feels authentic and insanely well-developed.

It does for the Emperor's Children / Fabius what The Talon of Horus did for Abaddon and various small warbands post-scouring. Even better that it references Talon in various places, seeing how Fabius was involved there.

And it is making me chuckle, which is to be expected from Josh.

[Xin Ceithan]

Such high praises! Think I should be getting my claws on this - I am a sucker for snappy dialogue.

On a side note....wasn't t there an old Epic model (or rules at least) for Commander Eidolon? At least I always took it as a nod towards Epic when he first showed up in the HH novels.

[HeritorA]

A couple of chapters in, and enjoying it quite a bit. This is the Fabius that I wanted Josh to write since Repairer of Ruin got released. It also accounts for a lot of Heresy developments on Fabius since, and even references The Talon of Horus (which is expected, considering Repairer of Ruin was a lead-up to it). Fabius is delightfully despicable, and I love it.

And he is amazing in his delightful despicability

66% through and at this point I can't see myself giving this a bad review at all once I'm done. This is the kind of book I didn't fully realize I always wanted, and needed. It fleshes out so much and readjusts Fabius to turn him into something that he needs to be. It feels authentic and insanely well-developed.

It does for the Emperor's Children / Fabius what The Talon of Horus did for Abaddon and various small warbands post-scouring. Even better that it references Talon in various places, seeing how Fabius was involved there.

And it is making me chuckle, which is to be expected from Josh.

Prick his flesh, crack his bones, that’s the way the story goes. Urge him up, strike him down, call him out and pass him round

Bile dialogs wit Greater Daemons are beyond epic - 'Come then... test me, figment....Names are for the sentient...'

I would be dishonest - not to call Fabius Bile: Primogenitor one of the best (if not the best cause I like it more than MoM) novel of 2016!

[Scribe]

Darn, another one I'll have to get then. :]

[DarkChaplain]

I'll have to chalk this one up as one of the best BL books of the year, which says a lot looking at the lineup. It'll probably make my top list for 2016 in general as well, because the whole thing works so well.

[Robster The Lobster]

This sounds really great. I think I will take the advice from the reviews in this thread and make Primogenitor my next read. A question though, is the limited edition with the extra chapter worth it over the hardback?

[DarkChaplain]

That's entirely down to your own judgement and wallet, I'd say. The book looks absolutely gorgeous, and having finished the novel, I am still tempted to get the limited edition. I'd really appreciate getting to read the extra short story and judging from the photos of the dressing, it'd look amazing on the shelf. But the pricetag is pretty high, and I'm not sure I could justify it to myself when I look at my backlog.

 

The novel's a high-quality product either way, and if you have the money to spare, you'd probably be happy with the limited edition.

[Prot]

I was going to skip this one.... but a World Eaters Apothecary? That piqued my curiosity. ;)