hopes, dreams, and fears for sisters in 8th

[Beams]

Is she though?

She's 150/200/250 PTs, and if you want a gun line, a cannoness is cheaper (45) and throws a reroll ones buff, and then you throw in two imagifiers (80) and your looking at way better gun line performance, with 1-3 acts of faith a turn, distributed as 25:50:25 at 25 PTs less than Celestine no Gemini. For ten points more than her, you can get 1-4 acts of faith, plus reroll ones within 6" o. Your canonness and set up your fun line accordingly and let rip with multimelta retributors and exorcists.

 

Celestine is great, but she's not meant to buff a gun line. She's meant to be surrounded with seras (reroll able 5++) and smashing into the enemy lines.

[Commander Dawnstar]

I was just in the process of typing something similar. The points gap between Celestine (with Geminae) and a well-equipped Canoness has exploded between editions, so it's not unreasonable to suggest that 200 points and a different build focus could compensate for Celestine's absence.

[Ficinus]

General issues with rules and weapons this addition aside, I'm very irritated by the new force org charts requiring so many HQ units given that Sisters have 2-3 distinct HQ options, 1-2 of whom are special characters (the variance depends on if you consider Uriah a Sisters HQ). I feel like I'm going to need two or three more Canonesses just to list build.

[Sister Alessia]

I know what you mean Ficinus. I don't like taking special characters and there are no men in my Sisters army. So that leaves one hq choice. Im just going to count some as Palentines and some as Vet Sister Superiors. Im still all beamish for 8th!

[micahwc]

Battle sisters have keyword "imperium", so they can ride in valkyries and make use of grav chute insertion.

[micahwc]

So Valkyrie and battle sister squad with two melted and a combi-melta on the superior, grav chute anywhere 9" away from an enemy, cheap anti-tank. Swap plasma/flamer as needed.

[Commander Dawnstar]

Battle sisters have keyword "imperium", so they can ride in valkyries and make use of grav chute insertion.

 

Unfortunately that's not how it works. Transports are faction-locked in 8th and specifically state on their profile who can use them, the Valykrie being limited to Astra Militarum Infantry. It gets so specific at times that a Sororitas Rhino can't even be boarded by Sisters from an Order other than the one it belongs to.

 

Inquisitors and their Acolytes have a special rule specifically for the purpose of getting around this limitation, allowing them to embark on any transport with the Imperium keyword regardless of any other faction keyword restrictions.

[micahwc]

I thought that was if you took them as a dedicated transport as opposed to a fast attack slot. Darn. Oh well.

[micahwc]

So I can't put sororitas into a Valkyrie but I can take exorcists in an imperium faction list with no other SOB units?

[Commander Dawnstar]

So I can't put sororitas into a Valkyrie but I can take exorcists in an imperium faction list with no other SOB units?

 

I mean ... that was true of the Castellans of the Imperium detachment too.

 

To be honest I'm not 100% sure if this is how that stuff works as I haven't got the specific pages from the rulebook on transports, but the profile for every transport vehicle says that it can transport the relevant number of [Faction] Infantry, where the stated faction is whichever list it comes from and not Imperium - i.e. 12 Astra Militarum Infantry for the Valkyrie. That the Inquisitor has a rule that seems designed to override that restriction all but confirms it.

[Commisarp]

Seems like every imperial transport specifies what can go in it. Inquisitors and Acolytes can hitch a ride in any Imperial transport but otherwise it's very limiting.

Sucks for players who like an Inquisition theme too, because our Death Cultists and Crusaders can only go in Rhinos and Immolators. 


Really though. Transports seem to be a sticking point with 8th ed. They are very restrictive in a ruleset that is otherwise very permissive. They are expensive, they restrict your ability to mix in other imperial units, and for sisters they make using faith points very very difficult. I do wonder if GW is trying to push us away from Full Mechanised Infantry lists.

I suspect when we finally get the Sisters of Battle Faction focus it may be extolling the virtue of 15 strong foot squads.

The problem with this is if you are an existing sisters player, you probably have a large motor pool of plastic tanks and comparatively few metal sisters.

Or like me, you might have invested in 4 Repressor tanks (which might not even get rules!) 

But I suppose forgeworld might right to the rescue with a Repressor which through the magic of forge world still somehow has fire points.


But then, if not Mech... how are we supposed to use flamers. And Frankly, if the optimal setup becomes Stormbolters and Heavy bolters and deploying in a big line using faith to shoot twice...

Is that fun?

[micahwc]

I still think the 5 gal, 3 melta or 3 plasma will be useful. Especially without plasma getting hot.

[micahwc]

they seem like a decent way to get MSU of special weapons. Astra militarum special weapon squads need 6 troops for three weapons with worse ballistic skill and armor, guard Veterans get the same number of special weapons and the same ballistic skill, but come in squads of 10. On the other hand the Veteran squad can take a heavy weapon as well.

[Montford]

Huh. Dominions with Stormbolters might be viable in 8th: Stormbolters are Assault 2 and Rapid Fire, so 4 shots at 12".

[micahwc]

MSU battle sister squads effectively give you three special weapons for under 100 points. Three flamers is only 68 points.

 

They are also a really cheap way to add durable bolters to an imperium army. 45 points gives you 5 bolters at bs3+, with a 3+ save and 6+ invulnerable. They could have some synergy with guard as priests can buff guard infantry as well as SOBs.

[GodwynDi]

General issues with rules and weapons this addition aside, I'm very irritated by the new force org charts requiring so many HQ units given that Sisters have 2-3 distinct HQ options, 1-2 of whom are special characters (the variance depends on if you consider Uriah a Sisters HQ). I feel like I'm going to need two or three more Canonesses just to list build.

 

Which I would have been entirely fine with, if I could include a jump pack canoness once again.  I used to regularly run 3 hq units before 7th edition, canoness with celestians in an immolator, jump pack canoness, and then an inquisitor.

[micahwc]

Celestine's look like fun since you can basically take 5 special weapons and vanguard.

 

I think heavy bolters are the better choice for immolators over the immolation flamer. Same strength and AP, much better range, and costs 15 points less. 6 shots a turn instead of 2-12 shots a turn.

[Servant of Dante]

I like a balance between hoard and msu. If I go all msu I get bored :P

 

The way I like to field Sisters wasn't optimal in 7th, we'll see how it works in 8th

[Servant of Dante]

You know, I can honestly say I'm excited about sticking Raedia in a Rhino with a Celestians squad and probably an Imagifier (and the Celestians "superior" I'll probably include as a Canoness so my army has 2 HQs), placing a Simulacrum outside the rhino during deployment, and using that simulacrum's AoF to let the rhino move 12" before the people inside disembark, then move 6" (hopefully putting them about 6" away from the enemy, the rhino moves forward and locks the opponent downs soaking up the overwatch, then the unit charges in, first turn :D sounds like something Raedia would do.

 

Edit: and if that Simulacrum fails it's 4+, I'll try using a command re-roll

 

Edit2: then the enemy will back of, shoot me to pieces, and countercharge the crap out of me, but it will have been worth it, at least the first couple times :P

[micahwc]

I'm combining imperium forces. I have (or have on the way) enough for a brigade detachment.

 

(Combined astra militarum, blood angels death company, sisters of battle, sisters of silence, and inquisition forces)

 

I'm going to run celestions as my required 3 FA choices, 2 exorcists for part of my required HS choices, and my death cultists for an elite slot.

 

They will be joined by six squads of astra militarum, 3 squads of sisters of silence, 5 death company with Tycho the lost, and a mixture of commisars/ company officers.

[sedibear]

do note that you can put 2x dominion squads in a single rhino :)

[Gothical]

Celestine's look like fun since you can basically take 5 special weapons and vanguard.

 

I think heavy bolters are the better choice for immolators over the immolation flamer. Same strength and AP, much better range, and costs 15 points less. 6 shots a turn instead of 2-12 shots a turn.

 

The Immolation Flamer automatically hits and also is an Assault weapon meaning that the Immolator can move 12", advance D6" and shoot 12" of burny death (average roll = 7 hits, beating out the Heavy Bolters).

 

What I am likely to do is Flamers on my Dominion Immolators (some set-ups may have MM instead) and then perhaps have some MSU backline BSS with Heavy Bolter Immolators for firepower & late-game objective claiming if I'm not using 10-woman Rhino squads.

 

I do like that Storm Bolters are much more viable now. A Dominion Squad sounds fun, and compares reasonably favourably to the Flamer Dominions. Where I hope they will shine is a BSS squad, 2 Storm Bolters and a Heavy Bolter is quite a lot of firepower now for a 63 point squad - especially one in cover for a 2+ Save. Stack that with an 85 point 6-shot Immolator.

[A.T.]

Celestine's look like fun since you can basically take 5 special weapons and vanguard.

 

I'm guessing you mean dominions as the celestians are the elite-slot meatshields

 

 

 

Edit - also, having looking through the rules a little more it appears that meltabombs have not been removed from the game. Space Marines still have them, they've just been taken away from everyone else.

[Atrus]

At a charity game-a-thon right now and one of the guys enough in all the leaked rules so he and I just sat down and had a quick game. He only had a handful of models so we did a 280 pt game of us and 2 troop (Though I took an imagifiers cuz).

He had space marines.

Captain with combi grav and relic blade; 2x 5 man tac squads 1 with missile launcher 1 with plasma gun.

I had coanoness with inferno pistol and eviscerator; 2x 7 girl sister squads 1 with heavy flamer 1 with meltagun; and imagifier.

 

We played on a crazy infinity table so lots of terrain.

 

Just did a plain kill each other game just to learn. It was fun. Once the rules are memorized, this game is going to go really smooth.

The heavy flamer is amazing, lowering that marine save makes a big difference. Command Points are handy, he used one to refill an inbo save that saved his captain from melta death.

He locked me in close combat most the time so it was an uphill struggle. It was nifty to use faith to get extra pistol shots in, but good armour makes things rough for them.

 

Faith. Holy crap. Amazeballs. The movement one was a big favourite on for me as with all the terrain it let mobility be very tactical. I never got into a position to utilise the double tap as he charged me before I could do it. But that movement, dang, end of movement phase first turn I was pretty much in his deployment zone (rolled crazy good for advance).

 

Imagifier...yeah....5 turns.....2 activations....wasn't happy with that. That said, seeing these AoF in action. They're bloody good. As much as I'd like to see a better than 50% chance of them going off. When they do, they are a big advantage.

 

Overall I'm happy. Looking forward to doing more optimised lists in larger games.

 

And to finish off. Canonness took down the captain in combat. Go girl.

[Noeh]

My new army is basically a combination of sisters and imperial guard. Greyfax is thrown in there becauseI have fluff of her being an entirely different person with her own detachment of soldiers. Basically I almost always just throw her in the middle of an infantry platoon and watch people cry.
However a weird one for me is going to be a pair of dunecrawlers. They won't move as fast an an exorcist, but I actually think they'll have more reliable damage than taking two of them. Cheaper too. About 120ish points rather than 160+ on the exorcist. Plus with two it's a 5++ for free.

Safe to say my army would look super weird on a board if I wasn't all about conversions and making everything look like it belongs.