Shadow Wars Armageddon Army List and Tactics Discussion

[Brother Dallo]

Hey all.

 

I thought it would be a good idea to have a thread discussing the lists and tactics people are using in SW:A with their Guard. Feel free to post up any army lists you're working on and discuss any tactics that have or haven't been working for you. To be honest, any Imperial Guard SW:A chat is welcome here.

 

At the minute, I'm working on converting up a Veteran Kill Team based on one of the Black Library Novels. You can check out their progress in my thread.

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/321424-stuff-thangs/

 

Here is my provisional starting list. 

 

1. Veteran Sergeant with lasgun, camo gear 150

2. Veteran with lasgun, camo gear 90

3. Veteran with lasgun, camo gear 90

 

4. Veteran with lasgun, camo gear 90

 

5. Veteran with shotgun, lasgun, camo gear 110

6. Special Weapons Operative with plasma gun, camo gear 155

7. Special Weapons Operative with sniper rifle, telescopic sight, toxic rounds, camo gear 155

 

8. Special Weapons Operative with grenade launcher (frag), camo gear 160

 

1000/1000

 

The plan with this list is to buy two recruits without any other gear after my first game, to bring me up to maximum  team size. They'll try not to die in the second game (as I don't believe you can give traded gear to a recruit before their first game). I will then give one the shotgunner's spare lasgun and use my 100 points to get a lasgun and camo gear for the new recruits,  and a smattering of new gear for the vets. Sound like a decent plan? 

 

In my opinion, it looks like lasguns are a better plan than shotguns, but I have the model and it's more of a rule of cool thing. That said, if anyone has had success using shotguns, let us know. I don't know if the special weapons I've chosen are the most optimal, but I thought it would be more interesting to try different weapons than to spam the "best" gun.

 

One option for my list is to drop the spare lasgun and give the sgt. a bolter and grab a clip harness for the sniper? Do people think this is a better option?

 

Dallo

[Hasuro]

You can have only 2 specialists, or am I missing something?

Edit: Ah, nevermind, found the rule for AM about specialists :)

Edited May 12, 2017 by Hasuro

[Brother Dallo]

Yup. Guardsmen are special snowflakes who get three specialists. Still have a max squad size of 10 AFAIK, which strikes me as strange when you can have 10 Chaos Marines at max size, who will likely chew through 10 Guardsmen. In contrast, orks can get 20 dudes max.

 

Dallo

 

Edit:

 

BTW Welcome to the Bolter and Chainsword Hasuro. Hope you enjoy your stay here. If you haven't yet, be sure to take a quick look over the Forum Rules. If you have any questions about anything, ask away and someone will give you an answer.

Edited May 12, 2017 by Brother Dallo

[WarriorFish]

Welcome aboard Hasuro :)

 

Looks like a good start from what I know, and a good plan to add numbers later. Numbers forward to suppress the enemy and let your heavier hitters finish the job in relative safety :)

[Akrim]

Good list, i agree definitely escalate your numbers as you get a few games in.

 

One thing to consider is some missions require you to advance to take objectives, dont overlook a sturdy shotgun and a few good grenades.

 

Also consider a splurge on hotshot power packs at some point, youll find that the lasgun will struggle to do much against many opponents.

 

You may even want to consider going more aggressive with the Sarge at some point, bolt pistol and frags prehaps.

[Brother Dallo]

Thanks for the comments Gents.

 

Hotshots are a potential addition once I'm up to 10 men. However, they compare pretty unfavourably to bolters, which is sad. I'd rather take a bolter on the Sgt for rules purposes, but a las gun feels more fluffy. Decisions.

 

I was hoping that the sniper and plasma gun will do most of the heavy lifting in the mean time. That's an interesting point about shotguns. I might add a few later on, but for not I'm going to put my trust in massed las fire, like a good servant of the Emperor.

 

Dallo

[Akrim]

Dont get me wrong pinning by hits is good, but stuff like Nid Warriors are impervious and tough. Its too bad they dont have a sustained fire gun, ive been using twin stubbers in my GSC, theyre gold.

[Brother Dallo]

Yeah, it's a shame guard don't have access to some fluffy gear like heavy stubbers and autoguns.

 

I guess you can house rule it if you have a decent gaming group.

 

Dallo

[The Pounder]

Welcome Hasuro,

I'm playing my first game tonight!

I'll be playing vs Tyranids and Chaos.

Here's the list I went with:

 

Vet Sergeant with Camo gear, bolt pistol, carapace armour and power sword,

 

2 vets with shotguns, camo gear, carapace armour and swords,

 

2 special weapons operatives with camo gear, sniper rifles and toxic rounds,

 

3 vets with lasguns and camo gear.

 

That gives me 8 troops to start.

 

My plan is simple, sit at range with snipers and lasgunners while the guys with shotguns and Serg go raiding!

 

I'm a firm believer in redundancy I like to double up my options.

 

The list was made with my Death Korps of Krieg in mind, I'm thinking of using Steel Legion rules.

[Brother Dallo]

Sounds like an interesting list Jud. Are you worried by only having 2 specialists? I can buy carapace incrementally if I feel like it, but you'll take two turns (or a promethium) to get a specialist with a special weapon. Let us know how the games went.

 

Do you feel the swords were worth it on the shotgunners as they won't get the benefit of the extra attack from two hand weapons?

 

Nids are probably hard to put down with lasguns, so I'd be interested to hear how things went for you.

 

Dallo

[The Pounder]

Played 2 games, was great fun!

First was a game vs Chaos, took about 4 turns before they bottled it!

My vet serg actually killed their champion! I learnt that snipers can be deadly.

 

Second game vs nids I got completely owned!

I couldn't get a shot off until they were about 8" away, which either missed or bounced off their extended carapace.

 

Over both games I found that I need something with a bit more punch. I'm thinking of dropping the swords for the shotgunners and maybe the carapace armour to get a plasmagun.

 

Anyone else got some games coming up?

[Chaplain Raeven]

I got my list together as well. The special weapons are some nasty pointsinks. The carapace might be too expensive to start with, but I don't want to risk losing those expensive guys because of a lousy 6+ save. Not to mention that I can just use the Scion-models instead of building some additional units, the extra 4 lasgun guys are painted easily enough.

 

1/ Veteran sergeant w/ lasgun,  carapace armour 165

2/ Veteran guardsman w/ lasgun 85

3/ Veteran guardsman w/ lasgun 85

4/ Veteran guardsman w/ lasgun 85

5/ Guardsman w/ lasgun 75

6/ Special Weapons Operative w/ Sniper rifle, carapace armour, clip harness & toxic rounds 160

7/ Special Weapons Operative w/ Frag grenade launcher, carapace armour 175

8/ Special Weapons Operative w/ Plasma gun, carapace armour 170

[Cap'm Heckus]

Yay. I was hoping this discussion would pop up but I want pics of peoples kill teams. Chop chop.

 

/grabs popcorn and gets comfortable.

[wulfgar hammerfist]

I haven't played a game yet but I'm looking at something like this:

 

Vet Sergeant, bolt pistol, chain sword, carapace

 

Special Weapons, sniper, hot shot, red dot, clip harness, carapace

 

Special Weapons, sniper, hot shot, red dot, clip harness, carapace

 

Special Weapons, flamer, carapace

 

3 vet guardsmen, lasguns, hot shot, carapace

[Lord_Ikka]

Just remember when purchasing carapace armor that it does incur a -1 Initiative penalty, so it is much easier to fall off a ledge with it on.

[Chaplain Raeven]

Just remember when purchasing carapace armor that it does incur a -1 Initiative penalty, so it is much easier to fall off a ledge with it on.

 

But you get an improved save if you do fall off.

[Dr_Ruminahui]

Here is a pic of my killteam.  For those who saw this on my own thread, sorry about the repeat.

 

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a396/Dr_Ruminahui/Imperial%20Guard/IMG_1301_zpsgsk4lsqo.jpg

 

Sergeant with bolter (the Lt.)

Specialist with plasmagun

Specialist with flamer & carapace (arbite)

Veteran with shotgun & carapace (arbite)

Veteran with shotgun & camo cloak (the ratskin)

Veteran with lasgun & frag grenades (the guy throwing a grenade)

Veteran with lasgun

Veteran with laspistol and chainsword (convict)

Newbie with lasgun (convict vehicle crew)

 

I have fought two skirmishes against my friends orks.

 

 

First one was ambush, with me being the ambushee.  Luckily, I was able to counter ambush with my flamer, melee guard and newbie, but while the flamer took out a couple of orks, their nob with power claw was able to get into melee with my sergeant.  Fortunately I bottled the next turn.

 

My sergeant and my shotgun arbite were injured, with the sargeant getting hatred for the nob, and the arbite getting frenzy.    Both were out the next battle.  My flamer arbite got my advancement and got + 1 W.  I spent my points to get another specialist with a lasugn and camo.

 

Second battle was just a kill team fight, but we rolled that the winner got an extra 100 points.  My friend split his force, and mine was pinned against one edge as there was no safe way to advance.  Both factors played in my favour, as even though my flamer arbite took a rockit to the head in the first turn of shooting, my friend didn`t coordinate his forces well and I was able to concentrate on them one group at a time.

 

My flamer arbite got hatred for his rokkit ork, and my plasmagunner got ammo hound for the group advancement roll.  I had been planning on cashing in a promethium for more points, but as I won, I didn`t have to.  So, I bought a grenade launcher (with both types) and laspistol for my new specialist, gave his camo and carapace to my plasmagunner, gave a laspistol to my flamer arbite, and frag grenades (and the specialist`s old lasgun) to my scout shotgunner.

 

I played LOTS of necromunda back in the day, and this seemed like a natural improvement over that.  In particular I like the more forgiving wound table, and the more varied "gangs".  What I didn't like (and also didn't like when I played necromunda) was having to bend down to figure out true LOS, and how static some battles can be.  I like that team advancement is more even between killteams, but dislike not having a "stash" in which to save points and unused gear.

 

Inquisitor Psychologis Ruminahui

[Brother Dallo]

Thank you for posting Dr Ruminahui. That was exactly the kind of thing I was hoping people would share here. Inspirational pictures of lovingly converted killteams, how their gang was getting on so far and their general experiences of the game.

 

Thanks also to everyone else who has commented. I'd like to see this becoming a really useful resource for SW:A Guard players everywhere.

 

 

Keep up the good work, all.

 

Dallo

[Dr_Ruminahui]

Thanks Dalo - I'm glad to share.  Though, to be honest, I haven't done any converting or painting specifically for kill team - all my models are simply ones from my existing collection.  Next time I play I'll try to remember to take some photos, though. :)

 

One small annoyance I have with the kill team rules is that IG/AM can't go "wide" like orks can, in that orks are the only faction that can get 20 models.  So, already on game 2 I've hit my model cap, with the only option now being to "gear up" my existing guys.  Which is fine, but not really within how I see my kill team - which I see more as a dirty dozen type group, rather than an elite group all decked out in carapace, scopes and hotshot lasguns.  Still, I can understand why it may be necessary for game balance - in necromunda there were balance mechanisms where the more guys you had, the harder it was to get money for gear, and the better your gang was compared to your opponent, the faster your opponent advanced.

 

Anyway, I'll have to see what it feels like further into the campaign - maybe I'll like it more then, or better understand the balances required to keep games fun later on.

 

Inquisitor Psychologis Ruminahui

[Brother Dallo]

That's something I've touched on. One option is to ask if you can house rule a 15 man limit, like GSC. It doesn't step on the orks' toes, but it makes sense in terms of fluff.

 

As a slight aside, I believe you'll find there are two "L"s in Dallo. :p

 

Whether you made them before or after the rules came out, they are some pretty models, so well done.

 

Dallo

[Lord_Ikka]

 

Just remember when purchasing carapace armor that it does incur a -1 Initiative penalty, so it is much easier to fall off a ledge with it on.

But you get an improved save if you do fall off.

Depends in the height if the fall. Anything 6 inches or higher takes away carapace armor saves. I think carapace is ok, but would restrict it to my members who are sniping with clip harnesses.

 

Carapace is useful, but I view it as kind of a later addition to the team rather than something to buy right away. I think having more guys with better guns is a better use of points than carapace, but that is an opinion call.

 

My starting team is set up like this-

 

Leader- No upgrades/weapons

2x Specialist- Plasma gun, red dot, telescopic sight

Specialist- Laspistol, clip harness

3x Vet Guardsmen- Lasgun

2x Guardsmen- Lasgun

 

After the first game I'll burn a cache, upgrade my third specialist to another plasmagun with sights or a 'nade launcher, give the leader his laspistol, and give the other specialists clip harnesses/camo gear. After that, red dots and hot-shot packs for the foot sloggers and a final guardsmen.

 

My take on the guard is for them to be a mid-field shooting team. They are not suited for close combat, even the sergeant, and with red dots/hot-shot packs even the humble lasgun has a decent chance of pinning.

 

Ugh, can't wait for my Anvil Industries order to come in so I can build these guys!

Edited May 16, 2017 by Ikka

[Brother Dallo]

Interesting list Ikka. Guessing the leader hangs out with the plasma dudes and assists them with rerolling 1's? Let us know how that works.

 

Be sure to throw up WIPS when your bits arrive.

 

Dallo

[Lord_Ikka]

That was the general idea, Brother Dallo. Very much a lead from the rear, inspirational leader. More, play-to-win than my normal style, but I can't help but liking the idea of hitting on 2+, rerolling 1's plasma shots. Given that my primary foes will be Orks, Scouts, and Tau it is probably overkill with three plasmaguns, so the third specialist is looking like a grenadier right now.

 

I'll definitely post up some team shots when I get the bits.  

[Brother Dallo]

Do you plan on arming him better as you get more points, eg a tricked out bolter, or will he always stay with the las pistol?

 

Dallo

[Lord_Ikka]

If I have the extra points to do so, sure. Its not a huge priority for me though- he is the Voice of Command after all. Any weapons he has are strictly for backup in case someone manages to get close enough to him to be bothersome.