8th Ed Codex on the way

[Withershadow]

So you are echoing and elaborating on my comments then?  We are in complete agreement, infiltrate is extremely flexible and a very useful tool.  I was responding indirectly to a previous poster who seemed boggled by why people are excited for this ability, "oh noes, I can't get my -1 to hit just because I chose to infiltrate, because apparently that means parking within 12" of the enemy...".

[Magos_Adephus]

Another thing, people seem to be assuming you gotta be within 12" when you Deepstrike your bots? Screw that, just drop some Plasma Kataphrons more than away 12" From an MC, Russ, Termies, whatever and pop 'em. Bonus points if you use in tandem with Infiltrators to get rid of a Character's cheap meat shields then target the character with the Kataphrons. Stygies is a serious powerhouse and pretty flexible too.

[elbianc]

I was assembling my skitarii since 7th, already have 3 codexes and still havent played with them...

 

I've got the new codex in front of me, and im glad that a havent painted them yet, well... painted one robot and Dominus in Rysa orange...

 

The Codex has the 7 Forgeworlds and their rules, but has another 4 forgeworlds without any rules, just description and colour schemes (Triplex Phall, Deimos, Voss Prime and Gryphone IV), im gonna paint them has Triplex Phall or Gryphone IV, i like the fluf and colour schemes, then i will play test all the rules from the other forge worlds and aply one of them to my Army, problem solved.

[Feral_80]

Never said that Stygies is not good. Actually it is probably the best FW, or one of the best, overall. 

 

I was simply noting that their specific stratagem basically goes against their specific dogma - as happens, besides, for Raven Guard marines and Alpha Legion CSM. They just copied and copied the same (not entirely coherent) idea, which we find for the 3rd time and now for non-Marines too...quite unimaginative overall.

 

Add to that that another FW has a very similar (but better) stratagem, and you get why I am slightly pissed off by this lack of balance among FWs plus copy/paste attitude.

[Prot]

So you are echoing and elaborating on my comments then?  We are in complete agreement, infiltrate is extremely flexible and a very useful tool.  I was responding indirectly to a previous poster who seemed boggled by why people are excited for this ability, "oh noes, I can't get my -1 to hit just because I chose to infiltrate, because apparently that means parking within 12" of the enemy...".

It's not the message you have... it's the delivery.

[Yoda79]

Well thats why we got wrath of mars a great buff. It gives an alpha strike feared from all armies. Thats why inflitrators are the best suited with mars especially when we play vs heavy assault armies. You can wrath a unit of 5-10 in any round you decide. Thats why we got insta protocol change but cant move. And generrally Mars can deal a great alpha strike ofshooting with elimination combo can do also overcharge plasma effective and threat even bigger tougness witj plasma maybe heavy enemy high toughness chars. Do not forget in this combo you can take less icarus so might work with 3 neutron or 4 depending on you detachments and if you need anti air plasma can do it or a simple gem protective doctrina +2 with broad on neutrons. Same goes for all targets like high vallue Tau with lots of -1 to hit them or even the mission with -1. All those can be dealts with elimination volley 4 robots 3-6 destroyers and 3-4 neutronagers Cawl is a great must. Now thats a dakka line and i strongly suggest 5-10 inf. That can benefit from wrath in later rounds and two melee canticles as well as 2 doctrinas. Wanna calc what 10 inflitrators with wrath and a tpd with omnicient mask can do if you play +1 to hit and reroll ones to hit with wrath on wounds charge with +1 to hit reroll 5+ tazer. +1 str shroid or reroll ones or whatev cantice even electromancy .

? In any big or small unit? Thats focus fire and focus planning. Onagers got 145 points with 2* stubber not bad to forget 5 will deliver 30 shots better than 5 priests for me 36 range.

 

The robots 6 -2 1 -COVER clear obj holders like a free cake. Plasma fill the gap you can even make a deep strike small detach to send 5-10 vang with plasma the volume of fire the buffs or non spend cp if things go wrong s extreme. 10 vanguard will shoot 21 rifle shots and 6 plasma . We dont have issues with bloops. Even if you play priest. But thats another tactic...

 

 

Automatically Appended Next Post:

If you really want priests.

 

Units of 20 will do. Lucius for range ones stygia for melee ones. Make sure you got them both buffed with tpd for range with full range weapons. And omnis. Mask for melee. You require 4 cp s only for the deploy and deep strike. And you ll need to decide the rest of your army with heavy defence. So 2* vanguard and 1* battal. Seems valid. Most likely stygia can be battalion for options. Depending on enemy inflotrate breachers or priests accordingly. Flexible units like onagers are preffered. Neutronagers and icarus in teams of two. Mobility and toughness we seek. Graia battalion super good for camping troops and dragoons for flank defence . When dragoons die explode so dont forget to ge them in place. Onagers with broadsp are enough with graia to defend and always get a vanguard group for that -1 tough. Rapid rangers in meele shooting a unit with -1 is great defence. While stygia breachers great campers. If they get 7 str arc then they ll be #1 for surviving supplements.

 

Both priests cause either in same detachment or different you ll get to decide varying the enemy what you need to spend cp s upon. Need anti bloop then range one. Need mortals then elite. Vanguards can close the detach ment can prpvide cheap third option as counter in your army or move 8 etc. Theycan be an option with skitarii buffs if things go wrong. Or you facing elite armie. If you believe a more priests 1*5 and 1*5 can defend or even inf. Again id suggest one detach. Licius or stygia to get a plan and use it. Mybe 2*20 same priests id take melee ones as they team up with dragoons and a batt graia to defene and deal with blops. Snipes in stygia or any detachment can help a lot here since a lat wound if you plit fire a char kill is vital to win this. A unit if breachers withnapl buffs can hold the relic for 2 rounds easy. High alpha strike elite mobile armoes can hurt you a lot plan accordingly. If they come for you dont forget you can always screen with graia deep - inf breacherd and all priests and vanguard initially where the best counter units.

If you finally decide one type of priests and use one hq to buff them can lower the cp cost. Drop 20 with hq buff them then nother 20 as long as hq i 6" from both. If you decide what type you ll favor there i always cheap s!itarii to fill the detachm 2*10 melee priest one rust same for rnge and inf or mess around. Your playtyke determines a lot here but dont forget onagers to cover what you will be missing. Usually antitnk. Unless you plan to deep strike plasma vanguards and or destroyers. If you go stygia dragoons prefer 1*2-3 dragoons and solo las balistari. Same goe for them either they remain t back or inlflitrate can get buffed from hq on both types of priest. And usually you wanna run same canticles according to your plan.

 

Troops troops troops. As many as possible with stars can be done with 2* batt and 2* vang detachments. And mass. Use gems where you need form expoding till mass inf. Units all over the table. Your army can move and shoot all of them and usually advance and shoot. You can kite of need for last rounds. As said reloc type games 6 spread obj etc is your thing!! Of you decide to go for less detachments dragoons melee priest etc melee in general favored for stygia detachment. Remember if you going second plqce your units at least 12" away for the enemy.

 

Deciding what units will be put in deep strike or inflitrate is the most important part of the game . So care the lucius amd stygia units simce they provide the options. While a Graia detach best use units bare bones and troops or onagers.

 

 

Generall.

 

Mars better split in 2* spearhead. Dont forget to ppqce units in range and give buffs before warth of mars. Cawl in not debatable if got 6+ hevies robots or destroyers.

 

Stygia best all around can be a battalion depending on plan. Usually vanguards - outriders. Most likely can be seen as brigade in lowe point games.

Units in stygia gppd defence and good offence. So all options will help dewl with various enemies.

 

Graia. Dont forgef warlord here will make you troops shoot in melee like pistols also in other melee fights. Take an extra engiseer with relic +1 cp. Graia specific gem provides negation on pshycher abilities if within 24 of a graia unit roll 4+.

 

Synergy

 

You dont have to buy all units day one vanguard and rangers now in graia work superb together need both.

Priests melee dragoons rustallkers can do the same. Range priests and inflt balistari can do same.you can use the army you got just remember if you eventually decide a plan you d be better to form detachments with bigger same units to execute and fill the rest. So eventually you d buy one larger group. Especially if you decide troops priests etc.

 

Make your list abjust relics compare the list with any other you believe is competitive and abjust details. Hf thanks for reading. As awlays this is my opinion and contribution not trying to cnvince none or know it all. As i see the codex thus far.

[Withershadow]

Never said that Stygies is not good. Actually it is probably the best FW, or one of the best, overall. 

 

I was simply noting that their specific stratagem basically goes against their specific dogma - as happens, besides, for Raven Guard marines and Alpha Legion CSM. They just copied and copied the same (not entirely coherent) idea, which we find for the 3rd time and now for non-Marines too...quite unimaginative overall.

 

Add to that that another FW has a very similar (but better) stratagem, and you get why I am slightly pissed off by this lack of balance among FWs plus copy/paste attitude.

But it really doesn't, it doesn't go against their dogma... the point of the infiltrate power is to reduce the number of your deployment drops, still get a full turn of movement, and open up the entire table to your deployment.  Say there is a big LOS-blocking piece of terrain in the middle of the board.  Park your melee dudes behind it, and now they have an ideal spot from which to launch a charge in subsequent turns without having to rely on getting a 9 out of deep strike.  Is there a particular objective that would take you a while to reach?  Infiltrate a unit nearby.  Does your side of the deployment not provide adequate LOS angles for your best shooting options, infiltrate somewhere where you have better ones.  In either case, unlike a deep strike, you can place them defensively and limit the opponent's LOS, and thus prevent first turn fire against them and then simply move them onto the objective on your turn.  Did your opponent hold back a bunch of stuff in reserve?  Well now your infiltrators can be used to plug in that hole in your backlines even if your opponent went first.  Did he deploy everything on his side?  Well then you don't have to worry about your backfield and can deploy that unit more aggressively.

 

There are so many uses for the stratagem, placing your models within 12" of the enemy just so you can try for a first turn charge is literally the simplest and most obvious and least tactical use possible.

[Prot]

I actually picked up a ton of priests for Mars. I anticipate getting rushed a lot with Mars because of the solid firebase now with more Mortal Wound capabilities.

 

I've been playtesting both versions of Priests and they're both really fun. I went a little out of my budget and picked up 20! Not sure if I should do 10 and 10. Or build 15 + 5.

[Odds.043]

 

 

Never said that Stygies is not good. Actually it is probably the best FW, or one of the best, overall.

 

I was simply noting that their specific stratagem basically goes against their specific dogma - as happens, besides, for Raven Guard marines and Alpha Legion CSM. They just copied and copied the same (not entirely coherent) idea, which we find for the 3rd time and now for non-Marines too...quite unimaginative overall.

 

Add to that that another FW has a very similar (but better) stratagem, and you get why I am slightly pissed off by this lack of balance among FWs plus copy/paste attitude.

But it really doesn't, it doesn't go against their dogma... the point of the infiltrate power is to reduce the number of your deployment drops, still get a full turn of movement, and open up the entire table to your deployment. Say there is a big LOS-blocking piece of terrain in the middle of the board. Park your melee dudes behind it, and now they have an ideal spot from which to launch a charge in subsequent turns without having to rely on getting a 9 out of deep strike. Is there a particular objective that would take you a while to reach? Infiltrate a unit nearby. Does your side of the deployment not provide adequate LOS angles for your best shooting options, infiltrate somewhere where you have better ones. In either case, unlike a deep strike, you can place them defensively and limit the opponent's LOS, and thus prevent first turn fire against them and then simply move them onto the objective on your turn. Did your opponent hold back a bunch of stuff in reserve? Well now your infiltrators can be used to plug in that hole in your backlines even if your opponent went first. Did he deploy everything on his side? Well then you don't have to worry about your backfield and can deploy that unit more aggressively.

 

There are so many uses for the stratagem, placing your models within 12" of the enemy just so you can try for a first turn charge is literally the simplest and most obvious and least tactical use possible.

Now, I get why you may or may not see this, as I assumed the same, but apparently you can still move after using the stygies deployment, so actually you won't be hoping for a 9 out of deep strike, you can practically guarantee a charge, especially if you use some of our faster melee units. So while I agree on the deploying up the field in cover, it's also tactically advantageous to just have your melee units charge turn one. Admittedly this relies on getting the first turn, but that's a much better chance than getting a 9 on the charge.

[yellabelly]

I believe Withershadow was referring to the Lucius deep strike stratagem needing a 9 on the charge, whilst the Stygies one doesn't.

[Withershadow]

Yeah, you can move after infiltrating, that's what makes it so flexible. That is why I specifically compared it to deep striking, which limits you to needing to roll a 9 to succeed a charge. And yes, getting a first turn charge is nice, but even if you have the +1 to the roll-off, they still have like a 28% chance to beat your score on the initial roll, and a 33% chance to seize initiative if they use a stratagem point (and that's without any potential go first bonuses that armies get down the road). Like I said, this tactic can work, but it is the most simple, the most obvious, and the most prone to failure, out of all the possible things you can do with infiltration. That is why I so vehemently disagree that infiltration is in any way antithetical to the dogma.

 

I guess no one has faced an Alpha Legion Noise Marine squad take the best high-ground piece of cover in the middle of the board, where they are -1 to hit, 2+ save in cover, shooting twice, and shooting again before dying, while reaching every corner of the board. :P

[lancerusso]

I reckon Ryza is doing pretty great now. The plasma stratagem makes a squad with three radtrooper plans calivers on average deal 16w or so to something T8 when you overcharge and activate the stratagem. Adding a tech priest or rerolls canticle with protector doctrina imperatives and you've got a hit rate of 0.972, with no gets hot since you've got modifiers. Without overcharging, rerolls or stratagems they'll do a measly 1.333 wounds or so.

 

Plasma destroyers have the same kind of power as well. They've got a bonus attack too which works well for Ryza- they're still pants in c.c.

 

Full overwatch ironstriders will be great, as will ap-1 dragoons with +2 to hit in c.c.

 

The objective holding stratagem is looking important for Ryza too- increasing our durability AND doubling the number of attacks on vanguards, adding an extra thirty or twenty-five percent more attacks to infils and ruststalkers respectively. Really :cussing good with those rr 1s to wounds.

[yellabelly]

I think as the dust settles, and people process the new codex most forge worlds will actually be viable.

I've been leaning towards Stygies but tried it the other night vs a tyranid list. Not an army for Stygies to shine. It was nice turn 1 but by turn 2 the nids were across the board and well inside 12".

Although Stygies outperforms the Graia 6+ resurrection trait shot for shot, you always get the graia trait so it may break even over the course of a game, especially if you use infantry. I also like the stratagem for a 50% chance of denying a key psychic power. Not sure how easy the warlord trait will be to use, but I'd probably go for the command point on a 6 trait anyway.

[anarchistscourge]

Quick question around mixing Forgeworlds in an army, specifically with Mars. If the main force of my army is Mars and i have a small detachment of Stygies and i roll for my canticles, do i roll the 2 for mars and a seperate 1 for stygies or do i pick which out of the 2 i apply to stygies detachment?

[Charlo]

I actually picked up a ton of priests for Mars. I anticipate getting rushed a lot with Mars because of the solid firebase now with more Mortal Wound capabilities.

 

I've been playtesting both versions of Priests and they're both really fun. I went a little out of my budget and picked up 20! Not sure if I should do 10 and 10. Or build 15 + 5.

 

I'd say go full Disco-stick.

 

They offer some nice strength (magic 5), -2AP and a real nice chunk of Mortal wounds.

 

Not to mention you just need to murderise one unit and you're looking at 3++/ 5+++

 

The Massed hit potential of Zappy Fingers is staggering (and combining with the Strategem for Mortal wounds, ooo boy) but I feel like you can get massed shooting from Vanguard cheaper & easier?

[Prot]

 

I actually picked up a ton of priests for Mars. I anticipate getting rushed a lot with Mars because of the solid firebase now with more Mortal Wound capabilities.

 

I've been playtesting both versions of Priests and they're both really fun. I went a little out of my budget and picked up 20! Not sure if I should do 10 and 10. Or build 15 + 5.

 

I'd say go full Disco-stick.

 

They offer some nice strength (magic 5), -2AP and a real nice chunk of Mortal wounds.

 

Not to mention you just need to murderise one unit and you're looking at 3++/ 5+++

 

The Massed hit potential of Zappy Fingers is staggering (and combining with the Strategem for Mortal wounds, ooo boy) but I feel like you can get massed shooting from Vanguard cheaper & easier?

 

 

That is a good point. There might be some overlap in function between JazzHands and Vanguard, however the S3 of the overall Vanguard is just...bleh. Now the volume of shots is impressive with the Mars Strat (Mortal wounds on 6's) but day to day shooting seems to be relying a lot on special weapons.

 

Jazzhands might be worth it for not that much more! (I forget the point drop changes though).

 

On the other hand, playing Mars I think the Disco sticks are probably going to have a place as I anticipate getting charged a lot.

 

Ah... I dunno, I might just go 10 and 10.

Edited September 20, 2017 by Prot

[yellabelly]

Quick question around mixing Forgeworlds in an army, specifically with Mars. If the main force of my army is Mars and i have a small detachment of Stygies and i roll for my canticles, do i roll the 2 for mars and a seperate 1 for stygies or do i pick which out of the 2 i apply to stygies detachment?

I'd have thought you need to roll the 2 dice separately. First roll applies army wide. Second applies Mars only.

[Vel'Cona]

I like the idea of going 1:1 on the E-priests, myself.  If it turns out your favor one over the other, you can always bulk out the squad later.  FWIW I think both units have reasonable viability now, especially with smart Dogma selection and/or Character support.  They seem like the kind of unit(s) that need a definitive game plan early on, given their short range/scope of effectiveness, and the seeming fragility only emphasizes this conclusion.

[Withershadow]

Discosticks have the mortal wound shenanigans, but only really only if you successfully get the charge, and they will not be a secret for long.  The shockers put out enormous amounts of firepower and attacks in general, at a respectable S5.  With normal rounding, I get the following results:

 

13 Corpuscari and 20 Vanguard are within 2 points of each other.

 

The Vanguard will deal 13 wounds on a T4-5 target, half of those rolls being for 2 damage.  T6+ cuts that to about 7 wounds, all being for 2 wounds.  If you burn a Protocol, that goes up to 16 vs. T4-5, and 8-9 vs T6+.

 

The Corpuscari will deal 26 wounds on a T4 target, 20 vs T5, and 13 vs T6-9.  That's without considering their melee potential at all.

 

We do have to give some consideration to the double-wounding.  Let's assume the target is T5 and has a 3+ save with 2 wounds.  The Vanguard will kill 4 and maybe wound a 5th.  The Corpuscari will kill 3 and wound a 4th.  If the target is a TEQ with T4, W2, and 2+, Vanguard kill 1 and wound another. Corpuscari kill 2 and wound another.  Against T8 3+, Vanguard deal 6 unsaved wounds, Corpuscari deal 4.  

 

So interestingly enough, the double damage quirk does make Vanguard more interesting against higher T multi-wound models regardless of save (when you invest a protocol) but the total amount of damage we're talking about for 180 points of concentrated fire is not particularly impressive.  When it comes to blowing away chaff units, no one does it better than Corpuscari (again recall the numbers above don't even consider melee).  Big speedbump units are a common part of the game right now, and Mechanicus doesn't really have any other tools for dealing with them unless you want to waste Kastelan fire against 3-4 point trash models.

 

This does, however, provide for a use for Vanguard, load them up with plasma and shoot everything at multi-wound targets.  Otherwise, you're just shooting lasguns without the numbers or orders of IG.

Edited September 20, 2017 by Withershadow

[oOskyOo]

I pick up my Codex today and get ready to fight Space Marines on Sunday. Sadly I don’t like to mix Forgeworlds. And so I have to stay with Mars, because I this is my color scheme.
The list will be:

Battalion – Mars
Belisarius Cawl
Tech-Priest Enginseer
4x 5 Ranger
10 Fulgurite Electro-Priest
10 Sicarian Inflitrator w/ Fetch blaster
5 Sydonian Dragoon

Spearhead – Mars
Tech-Priest Enginseer
4 Kastelan Daka Robots
2x Onager Dunecrawler w/ Neutron laser

The plan is Simple. Castle up, push with Dragoons, Inflitrator and counter-attack with the Priest
I hope, to get a lot out of “Wrath of Mars” with the Daka Robots and Inflitrator. And buff the Dragoon with 15 Attacks, explode on 4+.
 

[Silentz]

I pick up my Codex today and get ready to fight Space Marines on Sunday. Sadly I don’t like to mix Forgeworlds. And so I have to stay with Mars, because I this is my color scheme.

The list will be:

Battalion – Mars

Belisarius Cawl

Tech-Priest Enginseer

4x 5 Ranger

10 Fulgurite Electro-Priest

10 Sicarian Inflitrator w/ Fetch blaster

5 Sydonian Dragoon

 

Spearhead – Mars

Tech-Priest Enginseer

4 Kastelan Daka Robots

2x Onager Dunecrawler w/ Neutron laser

 

The plan is Simple. Castle up, push with Dragoons, Inflitrator and counter-attack with the Priest

I hope, to get a lot out of “Wrath of Mars” with the Daka Robots and Inflitrator. And buff the Dragoon with 15 Attacks, explode on 4+.

 

 

No daatsmith?  Then you are relying on the stratagem to put your 4 Dakkastelans into protector mode, and accepting that they will never move?  I expect this is a conscious decision and would be interested to know whether you're annoyed with it and have turns where they have nothing to target, or whether it save a valuable 52 points.

 

Otherwise, looks a lot like my list!  I take some sniper rangers as well because they've done amazingly well for me in the past. (Confirmation bias from a small dataset!)

[Charlo]

Discosticks have the mortal wound shenanigans, but only really only if you successfully get the charge, and they will not be a secret for long.  The shockers put out enormous amounts of firepower and attacks in general, at a respectable S5.  With normal rounding, I get the following results:

 

13 Corpuscari and 20 Vanguard are within 2 points of each other.

Hidden Content

The Vanguard will deal 13 wounds on a T4-5 target, half of those rolls being for 2 damage.  T6+ cuts that to about 7 wounds, all being for 2 wounds.  If you burn a Protocol, that goes up to 16 vs. T4-5, and 8-9 vs T6+.

 

The Corpuscari will deal 26 wounds on a T4 target, 20 vs T5, and 13 vs T6-9.  That's without considering their melee potential at all.

 

We do have to give some consideration to the double-wounding.  Let's assume the target is T5 and has a 3+ save with 2 wounds.  The Vanguard will kill 4 and maybe wound a 5th.  The Corpuscari will kill 3 and wound a 4th.  If the target is a TEQ with T4, W2, and 2+, Vanguard kill 1 and wound another. Corpuscari kill 2 and wound another.  Against T8 3+, Vanguard deal 6 unsaved wounds, Corpuscari deal 4.  

 

So interestingly enough, the double damage quirk does make Vanguard more interesting against higher T multi-wound models regardless of save (when you invest a protocol) but the total amount of damage we're talking about for 180 points of concentrated fire is not particularly impressive.  When it comes to blowing away chaff units, no one does it better than Corpuscari (again recall the numbers above don't even consider melee).  Big speedbump units are a common part of the game right now, and Mechanicus doesn't really have any other tools for dealing with them unless you want to waste Kastelan fire against 3-4 point trash models.

 

This does, however, provide for a use for Vanguard, load them up with plasma and shoot everything at multi-wound targets.  Otherwise, you're just shooting lasguns without the numbers or orders of IG.

 

That is some nice analysis... And a good solid conclusion!

 

I do always forget that Vanguard are only S3 and that really hampers them sometimes. They certainly have a use though, they can shoot lots and get good buff access and PLASMA.

[momerathe]

So In the Enhanced/ibooks codex, I noticed that all the stratagems are "Adeptus Mechanicus Stratagem", even the Forgeworld specific ones, contrary to the images from that youtube video. This has got to be a mistake, right? Can someone with a dead-tree copy confirm?

 

I've noticed a few bits of dodgy layout in the book - misaligned text, images overlapping etc. I get the impression that the creators were under some serious time pressure, so a mistake or two would not be surprising.

[OnboardG1]

So In the Enhanced/ibooks codex, I noticed that all the stratagems are "Adeptus Mechanicus Stratagem", even the Forgeworld specific ones, contrary to the images from that youtube video. This has got to be a mistake, right? Can someone with a dead-tree copy confirm?

 

I've noticed a few bits of dodgy layout in the book - misaligned text, images overlapping etc. I get the impression that the creators were under some serious time pressure, so a mistake or two would not be surprising.

 

I noticed this too and thought it was kind of odd. It's a pretty bad mistake given how important the fw specific strategems are. I'll ask for a refund and buy the paper copy if it's not corrected.

[Tiger9gamer]

Sooo... i had to eat crow today... it's a really tasty crow though. I was complaining that the book "Wasn't as good as I thought" before i played a game, and when I actually played lucius against a chaos heavy army, I was purely surpised at how good my guys did. I think I rolled a little high through the game, but the ways I could deep strike and ignore -1ap really made the army work.

 

some highlights... 

 

My knight took 12 lascannons and a brass scorpion cannon before the game even started, and knocked me down to 6 wounds from 24. My turn I used the strategum to allow my knight to function at full capacity, and because of this he was able to finish off the brass scorpion with a bunch of shooting combined with 2 neutron onagers, killing it before he got blown up. that was game changing, since if I didn't use that he would have done next to nothing. 

 

Having the lucius deepstrike allowed my vanguard to work like they were intended to: get up close and shoot. Combine this and the boost to Ballistic skill and I pretty much finished off one predator by turn one, making him lose his favorite killshot stratagem. and, I gotta say, arc rifles in this range is really nasty, and the guns are super fun to shoot up close. I was also suprised at how good breachers were (when I rolled good) at plinking off vehicles. it really helped to free up my neutron lasers so they shot at bigger targets (like the aformentioned brass scorpion and a sicaran!)

 

overall, I am growing more fond of this book as I play. having actual uses for command points really brings the game around, doesnt it?