Crazy ideas for our codex (whishlistin´& conspiracies)

[Are Verlo]

I think that is no Faq, it's a change of pointvalue in codex space marines.

We use datasheets and pointvalues from index imperium 1 until gw release codex BA

[SM1981]

Ahh... Thanks for the correction.

[Xerxus]

On a semi related note (well related to rules updates / changes). Can someone point me towards the FAQ where space marine power fists get reduced to 12 points, and also where it says this applies to all non codex chapters also?

 

I'm sure I saw this somewhere (specifically the 2nd point) but now can'take re-find it.

 

Any ideas anyone?

 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/22/the-other-angels-of-death-and-codex-space-marines/

 

"Blood Angels, Dark Angels and Space Wolves army lists in Index: Imperium 1 all let you use units from the Space Marines section of that book. If you own the new codex, you should feel free to use those same units’ Datasheets from that book instead, until your own codex comes out."

 

As far as I am concerned, this means using the pts costs from the SM codex for everything that BA share with SM. It was even ruled that way at a recent tournament I went to based on this FAQ.

[Pendent]

 

On a semi related note (well related to rules updates / changes). Can someone point me towards the FAQ where space marine power fists get reduced to 12 points, and also where it says this applies to all non codex chapters also?

 

I'm sure I saw this somewhere (specifically the 2nd point) but now can'take re-find it.

 

Any ideas anyone?

 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/22/the-other-angels-of-death-and-codex-space-marines/

 

"Blood Angels, Dark Angels and Space Wolves army lists in Index: Imperium 1 all let you use units from the Space Marines section of that book. If you own the new codex, you should feel free to use those same units’ Datasheets from that book instead, until your own codex comes out."

 

As far as I am concerned, this means using the pts costs from the SM codex for everything that BA share with SM. It was even ruled that way at a recent tournament I went to based on this FAQ.

 

 

It would obviously make sense for us to have the cheaper power fists etc, but whoever does the Blood Angels datafile for battlescribe does not agree and I am cripplingly depending on that app for list writing.

[Jolemai]

It says datasheet and there are no points listed on a datasheet. If you're depending on that community post to the letter then you can't use the associated points in C:SM.

 

Feel free to take this to the OR.

[Are Verlo]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/05/codexes-your-questions-answered-july-5gw-homepage-post-2/

 

This clearly says to use index 1, both datasheets and point values.

[SM1981]

Cheers guys. For me that lost post is the nailminnthe coffin. Still good to have the right info even if it's not the answer I hoped for. Index books rules and points values stand for BA. Looks like I'm stuck paying for expensive power fists for the time being... Or maybe remodelling those models that have the option to have thunder hammers. Edited October 15, 2017 by SM1981

[Father Mapple]

What if the chapter tactic was a -1 to hit them when they are moved in a previous turn/phase. Something to be different from Raven guard, but gives them the defense needed to close in combat or be resilient, and still be the blitz type of army they are expected to be. It would work for shooting and closer combat, but overwatch still hurts on 6s.

 

Maybe to make sure fight phase pile in didn't count, say it triggers with movement in any previous phase than fight phase. Or only if unit attempted to charge it advanced.

 

It would allow vehicles that have Lucifer engine keyword get it too if they don't get an increased base movement statistic.

Edited October 16, 2017 by Father Mapple

[Sete]

BA could share a CT with WE.

 

Both ragey and choppy. Considering both Loyal and Traitor CT are similar.

[Panzer]

BA could share a CT with WE.

 

Both ragey and choppy. Considering both Loyal and Traitor CT are similar.

Yeah or with EC.

 

Both skillfull and choppy. BA kinda always had traits from EC, WE and considering the love for Jump Packs and shock&awe tactics (just without the awe) Night Lords as well. :P

[Damon Nightman]

Maybe we will get BA and FT tactics with BA mimicking EC and FT mimicking WE?

 

I'd be okay with that. Also, I wouldn't count on it at all, but I think FT might get their own specific tactic.

Edited October 16, 2017 by Brother Lemartes

[Dont-Be-Haten]

God I hope we don't go that route. It's looking that way though. /:

 

My proverbial bubble is getting ever closer to the needle.

[Sete]

Or you can share the awesome CT of Black Templars!!!

 

Since BA were kinda almost destroyed, I wonder how the next codex is gonna be.

Edited October 16, 2017 by Sete

[Grazcruzk]

How about a stratagem that you could play when an enemy unit completes a fall back move from combat. The BA unit may immediately move as if it were the movement phase as long as at least one model ends within 1" of the fleeing unit.

[Damon Nightman]

God I hope we don't go that route. It's looking that way though. /:

 

My proverbial bubble is getting ever closer to the needle.

Do you not like those tactics or do you just not like the copy & pasting that's going on?

[BaldrickRSA]

My thoughts.....

 

1. New models for Dante and Mephiston.

2. Feel no pain 4+ for DC. Hey,.....it’s DC, give them something

3. +1 Str for charging, I like this from 4/5th Ed

4. Charge: 3D6, discard the lowest. We are BAs after all....

5. Chapter Tactics: BA units that charge can charge multiple units with no disadvantages

[Dont-Be-Haten]

 

God I hope we don't go that route. It's looking that way though. /:

 

My proverbial bubble is getting ever closer to the needle.

Do you not like those tactics or do you just not like the copy & pasting that's going on?

Both. 1) Mainly because you have roughly 1 turn to do damage, and then you're done. Until they fix the major problems with assault those aren't great tactics. Death Guard is hands down better in every regard to World Eaters, and right now, there isn't enough damage output to make swinging first overly viable.

 

2) the reflection of armies kinda bugs me in you're really only unique by faction, except in a couple cases.

 

I don't understand why they wing just give us +1 to wound against infantry, and bikes, dreadnoughts wouldn't be terrible, to add to that.

Edited October 16, 2017 by Dont-Be-Haten

[Jorre]

3 dice for chargeing pick the 2 highest is workable i like it! Might not be enough by itself though!

[BaldrickRSA]

I really feel the BAs need something to make them more effective and threatening in HtH combat. Its what BAs are know for, yet several other chapters are better at it than BAs currently. Pity. Living in hope for a good codex. I do like the new 8th Ed Rules. Yes, there are a few gaps, as per every ruleset, but 8th ED is FAR FAR better than  6th or 7th ED (which killed 40K for me).

 

I play two 2000pnt lists, a very heavy HtH focused list, and I feel it needs a bit more of a 'punch' to make it more threatening/effective. For example, 3D6 (exclude the lowest result) to increase chances for a successful charge). BAs should be feared in HtH. I just do not feel we are there yet. The second list is a shooty list (3 x Baal Preds with TL ASS Cannons) with HtH back up (Lemartes and 2 x 15man DC, etc, etc with JPs), and troops, priest etc, etc. Both work well. Are these lists hyper competitive?, probably not, but then I am playing for enjoyment. My competitive tournament days are over, 6th and 7th Ed killed it for me, so now I just play for fun. HOWEVER, I still do feel BAs need a good codex, that's makes them more threatening/feared.........

 

1. Increase their chances for successfully getting into HtH with a charge greater, however that may be....

2. Make DC feared.....e.g. 4+ Feel no Pain, maybe 2 wounds per mini..........both

3. Make BAs feared in HtH: Take away disadvantages for charging, e.g. only being able to charge a single unit, etc, etc....

 

Just my thoughts......

Edited October 17, 2017 by BaldrickRSA

[evildrcheese]

Whatever we get i hope it's not something that can be turned off by yiur opponent..

 

Specifically thing like +1S and +1I on the charge in the last edition, they could effectively be 'turned off' by your opponent charging you.

 

I'd much rather see +1S in the first round of combat (or just a flat +1S when in combat). Or something like the FW HH rules where we get +1to hit in combat.

 

Make Baal Predators good again and put them back in the fast slot. Hopefully we'll see Lucifier Pattern engines return as an upgrade rather a Strategem or something.

 

Most of all i want the Codex to cater to BA armies of all styles. Yeah our Chapter Tactics should be specialised and focus towards CC, but give us a strategem to make Devs useful, give us the ability to run a fast armoured column etc etc.

 

EDC

[Dont-Be-Haten]

I'm so lost on what they are actually going to do to give us something we will find acceptable.

 

I don't have high hopes, and my ceiling isn't very high for this codex. I'm curious what all they read on these boards and what they actually take into account for the players.

 

We could have another crap book, or we could get something really enjoyable. The problem we face is the loud minority of BA players that don't truly represent the majority of us.

 

Maybe, just maybe it will be as good as we can hope for. I don't want a savage dex, but something I can enjoy and be competitive in every game with, while having something other than red marines.

Edited October 17, 2017 by Dont-Be-Haten

[swordofmandulis]

Blood Angels need to be able to hit hard in CC, at the moment as has been stated previously 1 base attack at S4 + 1 for the chainsword just doesn't do anything. so something to help there, either more attacks, more strength, +1 strength would make a decent difference, I can see that happening.

 

something I would really like to see is a way to combat the now common almost penalty free falling back from combat. If its not a chapter trait then maybe a stratagem that if an enemy unit falls back from combat, before they move, your unit they are engaged with may immediately pile in and fight.

 

Wings of sanguinius needs to come back, and needs to work a bit like warp time, guaranteed deepstrike and charge would be very nice. big threat range for mephy, yes please.

 

As above SG weapons are a bit lacking for the points they cost.

 

Dante needs to be cheaper, especially when compared to MAC as he is now joke price considering he's easily as good as Draigo and 40pts cheaper now.

 

DC need 5+ FNP and need to be as terrifying as Khorne Berzerkers, they also needs to be immune to morale.

[Dont-Be-Haten]

A lot of what you guys are saying is already there with a simple priest. So take that into consideration.

 

+1 to wound is better than having to take priests as a piggy-back. But I get what we are all saying.

 

I still think move + assault is a great option. Something else I think was mentioned is being able to use pistols in the assault phase. I think that would be a better overall option across the board, but it is a neat idea I would love to see implemented.

 

DC don't have to be OP. Just make them more viable, a 5+ or Rage unto Death would be a great option they should have had from the outset.

[Bremon]

I’m not yet convinced that the chapter tactic will be strong enough to make CC more viable without being called cheese. CC as a whole this edition seems second rate compared to shooting. When an assault marine only hits as hard as a tac marine with a range of 1” instead of 12” there’s very little incentive to play them. +1 to wound is certainly superior to +1 S, and that, combined with attack twice stratagems, etc. might make enough of a difference to crush a key enemy unit or two and turn the tide.

 

I really want to see Baal Preds made viable though, such an iconic tank and what made me interested in BA in the first place.

 

Embarrassingly, I’m plan to play red Salamanders at the moment because the flame theme and artisan type chapter tactic feels close enough to BA for me in the meantime and gives access to some cool stratagems.

[swordofmandulis]

Yeah I get that the priest already does +1 strength, but you have to pay for it, and its difficult to keep him in range (both have to make the charge).

 

totally agree that +1 to wound rolls is superior to +1 strength but I'd argue its too strong. Hammerhand on everything all the time, I doubt that will happen.

 

its really difficult as previously mentioned GW don't know who BA are. I don't see them being made versatile enough to be CC viable and fast vehicle viable and shooty viable.

 

Agree that shooting is more powerful, but CC has been made pretty lethal in this edition too once you can get there and get stuck in with some decent units. a couple of tweaks and blood angels could be CC viable. some way to make falling back a really tough decision, more reliable charges or advance and charge ability, and +1 strength would go some way to making it work, at least in a regular gaming environment.