HH Wolfsbane: Artwork

[bluntblade]

Emo funk. That conjures weird images.

[Ascanius]

I only listened to it recently, so it's fresh. Here's the relevant quote:

 

From the height of the mountain flew a banner that he knew well - the standard of the Warmaster's reviled First Captain, Abaddon. Though Horus himself had not come to Yarant, he had despatched his right hand to oversee the final destruction of the VI.

 

Earlier, it's noted in passing that Corax and his Legion aren't sure if the Warmaster himself is at Beta-Garmon or not.

[Roomsky]

 

Here's the high-res version.

 

I've considered the goofy poses, and I think I've figured it out. Russ charged Horus, presumably in a proper stance, but Horus tripped him with Worldbreaker. What we see here is Russ` initial moment of panic as he tumbles into his foe.

[Izlude]

That is a nice picture, up close looks pretty good actually. 

[Sete]

Eh Horus has a go pro on his armour.

[Marshal Loss]

Paging FW to make some Luperci models!

[bluntblade]

Eh Horus has a go pro on his armour.

Nah, Contour.

 

Pity the artist doesn't seem to have read Path of Heaven. Was hoping for the massive and twisted Horus from that book.

[ChildofFang]

‘The artist’ has everything he does checked and cleared before it’s finalised after creating an image that is detailed to him by editorial (maybe a little bit of author as well).

[bluntblade]

That was just a turn of phrase. I just mean this take on Horus is a bit underwhelming.

[Baluc]

The SoH in the background are interesting. 

[Marshal Rohr]

Horus should look no different than the famous Adrian Smith artwork by the time he fights the Emperor.

[Izlude]

Horus should look no different than the famous Adrian Smith artwork by the time he fights the Emperor.

I think that scene (is that the one with Sanguinius at their feet with Horus and the Emperor looking at each other?) is the best depiction of Horus..just seething with a can of whop ass. In other pictures he sort of looks meh...

[Marshal Rohr]

That picture is Darth Vader/Sauron level iconic villain. Even thought it’s not meant as a perfect depiction of events.

[rendingon1+]

That wolf on the spear. No doubt Russ hated it.

Emperor: "What to give my boy Russ for his birthday... I know! He already has a sword and an axe.So... I'll give him a spear! Yes! It will be made of gold because it's the best metal ever  and will have giant wolf because Leman loves wolves so much! A perfect gift from the perfect father!"

Later

Emperor: "Happy birthday son, I have a gift for you!"

Russ: "Please, just not another weapon"

Emperor: "Actually..."

Russ: "Eh... I hope at least it's not gold"

Emperor: "Well..."

Russ: "And don't tell me it has a wolf on it! I'm so tired of wolf motive everywhere!"

Emperor: ....

[b1soul]

That wolf on the spear doesn't look very comfortable

[Guest Anakwanar]

Timeline for the SW goes

Prospero > Alaxxes (sp?) > Presumably Wolfbane > Yarant > Post-Terra?

 

When did Russ have time to play chess on Terra as seen in Vengeful Spirit?

 

After 'Wolf King' and his survival at Alaxxes thanks to DA 'Chimera' intervention.

When goes 'Wolfsbane' and after that Corax 'Weregeld' SW being saved by Corax and Russ dreaming of his total failure to stop Horus. Everyone told him - not to go to attack Horus. To stay with Rogal Dorn.

 

But then does he listen to anyone except himself? In total - it is partly his fault the Emperor is in the state we find in W40K. Because if he would have stayed, it would have been 4 Legions vs traitors during Siege of Terra. Instead of 3.

[Daddywarcrimes]

Paging FW to make some Luperci models!

 

From what we've seen of the Varagyr, are you sure?

[Calas Typhon]

 

Timeline for the SW goes

Prospero > Alaxxes (sp?) > Presumably Wolfbane > Yarant > Post-Terra?

 

When did Russ have time to play chess on Terra as seen in Vengeful Spirit?

 

After 'Wolf King' and his survival at Alaxxes thanks to DA 'Chimera' intervention.

When goes 'Wolfsbane' and after that Corax 'Weregeld' SW being saved by Corax and Russ dreaming of his total failure to stop Horus. Everyone told him - not to go to attack Horus. To stay with Rogal Dorn.

 

But then does he listen to anyone except himself? In total - it is partly his fault the Emperor is in the state we find in W40K. Because if he would have stayed, it would have been 4 Legions vs traitors during Siege of Terra. Instead of 3.

 

 

Kind of hoping that Russ really gets it pushed in for rocking up to Horus thinking he can kill him. And I really hope its not a generic equal footing Primarch slugfest with Horus on meth.

 

Horus battering Russ whilst humiliating and planting seeds of dismay about leaving Terra would be absolutely fantastic for me. I like Russ, I like the Space Wolves, but leaving Terra always sounded really damn stupid to me. Especially recently after reading the new advent shorts. I will be very very interested to see what exactly Russ said to Dorn and the other Primarchs before going away, because I can't think of any real reason to leave other than a last ditch suicidal attempt to kill Horus before he reaches Terra. I hope its a good enough reason, otherwise I wont really be liking the book too much, because as it stands 4 Legions would have been enough to hold out until the Ultramarines, Dark Angels and other forces arrived.

 

Its been said before that this book just sounds like a void filler as to why the VI were not on Terra at the siege. 

[Splog]

Russ heading off to kill Horus isn’t crazy. He doesn’t need to line up his forces against Horus’ and smash them together in the hope that he’ll win. He’s trying to kill Horus. And (Molech powerboost aside) that’s a plausible objective, particularly when you’re a primarch. Russ ‘just’ needs to get the right angle in a void battle, or sneaky insertion, or a surprise raid etc etc.

 

Horus isn’t just one man. He’s a massive force enabler/multiplier just like other primarchs. Killing him does way more for the war effort than just killing off some mortal leader or general. Plus quite reasonably the view from Terra is probably that if Horus dies the traitor forces will break up. In a war with such high quality ‘units’ in play, it isn’t just a war of numbers and logistics. (Some) individuals matter hugely.

 

Russ has reason to be confident that he / he and his legion can take out Horus under the right conditions. Any executioner / missing legion shannighans aside, from Russ’ point of view he and his legion of heroes have a) shown they could have killed Angron if they wanted b) have smashed the Thousand Sons to bits and Russ personally gave Magnus a bit of a kicking c) (if I recall correctly from Wolf King) Russ might think that Alpharius has backed out of a fight with him.

 

Russ and the Wolves just need the right opportunity to exploit and they’ve got a good chance (or at least reasonably think they have) off killing Horus and turning the tide of a galaxy-wide war that is not going in their favour. Is it a bit of a gamble? Yes. But he’s not the primarch and they’re not the legion to do the sure thing, the conservative and cautious thing. They could all die but a) they probably don’t believe that, b) (as with no doubt many/most other marines) while they don’t want to die that isn’t going to stop them taking a worthwhile risk / doing their duty (see all those watchpacks) and c) the potential payoff is huge.

 

Risky? Yes. A little foolhardy? Yeah. Motivated in part by anger/frustration/etc? Yep. Stupid/crazy? No.

[TheRealMcCagh]

Does anyone else get the feeling the 'Emperor's Executioner' title is meant to be tongue-in-cheek, but Leman Russ just doesn't get the joke? It would be like calling an overzealous, but ultimately inept, commander 'Captain America.'

[Runefyre]

Does anyone else get the feeling the 'Emperor's Executioner' title is meant to be tongue-in-cheek, but Leman Russ just doesn't get the joke? It would be like calling an overzealous, but ultimately inept, commander 'Captain America.'

I think because of unreliable narrator we'll never actually know, there's evidence for both sides. "Executioner" or not, Russ was still the most loyal primarch (alongside Dorn) and as such probably was more readily considered by the Emperor to do more tasteless or secretive tasks (like the IF's staying back and defending Terra, but opposite with a focus on offensive operations).

 

[Calas Typhon]

Russ heading off to kill Horus isn’t crazy. He doesn’t need to line up his forces against Horus’ and smash them together in the hope that he’ll win. He’s trying to kill Horus. And (Molech powerboost aside) that’s a plausible objective, particularly when you’re a primarch. Russ ‘just’ needs to get the right angle in a void battle, or sneaky insertion, or a surprise raid etc etc.

 

Horus isn’t just one man. He’s a massive force enabler/multiplier just like other primarchs. Killing him does way more for the war effort than just killing off some mortal leader or general. Plus quite reasonably the view from Terra is probably that if Horus dies the traitor forces will break up. In a war with such high quality ‘units’ in play, it isn’t just a war of numbers and logistics. (Some) individuals matter hugely.

 

Russ has reason to be confident that he / he and his legion can take out Horus under the right conditions. Any executioner / missing legion shannighans aside, from Russ’ point of view he and his legion of heroes have a) shown they could have killed Angron if they wanted  have smashed the Thousand Sons to bits and Russ personally gave Magnus a bit of a kicking c) (if I recall correctly from Wolf King) Russ might think that Alpharius has backed out of a fight with him.

 

Russ and the Wolves just need the right opportunity to exploit and they’ve got a good chance (or at least reasonably think they have) off killing Horus and turning the tide of a galaxy-wide war that is not going in their favour. Is it a bit of a gamble? Yes. But he’s not the primarch and they’re not the legion to do the sure thing, the conservative and cautious thing. They could all die but a) they probably don’t believe that,  (as with no doubt many/most other marines) while they don’t want to die that isn’t going to stop them taking a worthwhile risk / doing their duty (see all those watchpacks) and c) the potential payoff is huge.

 

Risky? Yes. A little foolhardy? Yeah. Motivated in part by anger/frustration/etc? Yep. Stupid/crazy? No.

 

 

Here are the problems I have

 

I never said the plan was crazy, however Yes, I certainly do think it is stupid to leave Terra once two Legions have arrived or before the Angels and Scars turn up, either way it is pretty late into the timeline to be going off to try and kill Horus. Everyone, from Horus to Malcador knew that the final fight would be at the gates of Terra and from where I stand, throwing a small force at Horus, whilst noble and with pretty high payoff for such a low chance of being achieved is pointless when you could easily have another 'x thousand' men on the walls to help until the Ultramarines, Dark Angels and the rest arrive which would certainly improve chances of winning at the siege.

 

And we know its stupid from where we stand, because we know what happens during the fight and why Horus was so eager to finish everything off before reinforcements arrived. I wont go into the previous Executioner stuff, because it is poor bait which has been fought over pointlessly for ages.

 

Recently we have been clued in that Russ decided to go and leave Terra mad with Dorn and refuse to join the muster. So its highly likely Russ is just off doing his thing stupidly thinking he can end things on his own.

 

Edited December 13, 2017 by Warsmith Kroeger

[Marshal Loss]

 

Paging FW to make some Luperci models!

 

From what we've seen of the Varagyr, are you sure?

 

 

Yes, I do, FW do daemonic models brilliantly.

 

Russ heading off to kill Horus isn’t crazy. He doesn’t need to line up his forces against Horus’ and smash them together in the hope that he’ll win. He’s trying to kill Horus. And (Molech powerboost aside) that’s a plausible objective, particularly when you’re a primarch.

 

(...)

 

Risky? Yes. A little foolhardy? Yeah. Motivated in part by anger/frustration/etc? Yep. Stupid/crazy? No.

 

We aren't in a position to comment on whether it is stupid or crazy yet, in my opinion, and we have been told that Russ is aware of the Molech powerboost going into this fight; he goes to Fenris first, in order to make preparations accordingly. Whether or not he will look like an idiot is entirely dependent on how Guy Haley justifies it. Even pre-Molech Horus was an unknown quantity for Russ, as the Wolf King himself admits. The guy who calls himself the Executioner decides going after the one brother he doesn't know if he can kill, who has recently received some kind of mega-warp boost and is the one with the strategic initiative in a galaxy-spanning war, is a good idea. That requires explanation and justification - hopefully more than 'it's my wyrd to kill crazy bald daemon jesus, and here is the shiniest golden spear in the universe, let's do this'.

 

I get the impression he might not be thinking clearly. His Legion took deep wounds on Prospero and was then nearly destroyed by the Alpha Legion, with Russ speaking a lot to Bjorn about taking on Horus in the wake of Alaxxes:

 

 

Since returning from Chimaera, Russ had often mentioned taking on Horus. It had become a mantra for him, an article of faith. There was no one else, in his mind, capable of landing the killing blow, no one with the sheer battle-fury needed to take the Warmaster down.

-Wolf King

 

The Wolf King shook his head. ‘I’m not built for waiting, Sigillite. I don’t fight well from behind stone, waiting for the enemy to try and dig me out. I’m the executioner, and the executioner lands the first blow, a killing strike that ends dispute before it begins.’

-Vengeful Spirit

 

It's a bit late to end the dispute before it begins...

 

Russ is searching for his place in the universe post-Prospero, and attempting to find a way to prove his worth. But even after the disaster at Alaxxes, he's still waffling on about the whole Executioner thing, still trying to fill the same role he believed he filled pre-Heresy. Malcador had even offered him the chance to kill Cthonia, reasoning that it might turn Horus from his course, and Russ refuses to even consider it because he views himself and his Legion in a specific light. The plan is poetic, and I look forward to the confrontation, but much of the worth of Wolfsbane is going to be derived from whether Russ has a plausible reason to believe that he can kill crazy bald daemon jesus.

 

Haley is a solid writer though, and I'm looking forward to this a lot. But we should avoid leaping to conclusions as to the validity of his motivations until we get more information.

Edited December 13, 2017 by Marshal Loss

[Runefyre]

 

Russ heading off to kill Horus isn’t crazy. He doesn’t need to line up his forces against Horus’ and smash them together in the hope that he’ll win. He’s trying to kill Horus. And (Molech powerboost aside) that’s a plausible objective, particularly when you’re a primarch. Russ ‘just’ needs to get the right angle in a void battle, or sneaky insertion, or a surprise raid etc etc.

 

Horus isn’t just one man. He’s a massive force enabler/multiplier just like other primarchs. Killing him does way more for the war effort than just killing off some mortal leader or general. Plus quite reasonably the view from Terra is probably that if Horus dies the traitor forces will break up. In a war with such high quality ‘units’ in play, it isn’t just a war of numbers and logistics. (Some) individuals matter hugely.

 

Russ has reason to be confident that he / he and his legion can take out Horus under the right conditions. Any executioner / missing legion shannighans aside, from Russ’ point of view he and his legion of heroes have a) shown they could have killed Angron if they wanted  have smashed the Thousand Sons to bits and Russ personally gave Magnus a bit of a kicking c) (if I recall correctly from Wolf King) Russ might think that Alpharius has backed out of a fight with him.

 

Russ and the Wolves just need the right opportunity to exploit and they’ve got a good chance (or at least reasonably think they have) off killing Horus and turning the tide of a galaxy-wide war that is not going in their favour. Is it a bit of a gamble? Yes. But he’s not the primarch and they’re not the legion to do the sure thing, the conservative and cautious thing. They could all die but a) they probably don’t believe that,  (as with no doubt many/most other marines) while they don’t want to die that isn’t going to stop them taking a worthwhile risk / doing their duty (see all those watchpacks) and c) the potential payoff is huge.

 

Risky? Yes. A little foolhardy? Yeah. Motivated in part by anger/frustration/etc? Yep. Stupid/crazy? No.

 

 

Here are the problems I have

 

I never said the plan was crazy, however Yes, I certainly do think it is stupid to leave Terra once two Legions have arrived or before the Angels and Scars turn up, either way it is pretty late into the timeline to be going off to try and kill Horus. Everyone, from Horus to Malcador knew that the final fight would be at the gates of Terra and from where I stand, throwing a small force at Horus, whilst noble and with pretty high payoff for such a low chance of being achieved is pointless when you could easily have another 'x thousand' men on the walls to help until the Ultramarines, Dark Angels and the rest arrive which would certainly improve chances of winning at the siege.

 

And we know its stupid from where we stand, because we know what happens during the fight and why Horus was so eager to finish everything off before reinforcements arrived. I wont go into the previous Executioner stuff, because it is poor bait which has been fought over pointlessly for ages.

 

Recently we have been clued in that Russ decided to go and leave Terra mad with Dorn and refuse to join the muster. So its highly likely Russ is just off doing his thing stupidly thinking he can end things on his own.

 

Guy Haley mentioned at the BL weekender that Russ is no idiot...that he is a Primarch and everything he does is with good reason...that he's hunting Horus with good reason.

 

That precludes (imo) the possibility that victory against Horus is an impossibility.

 

But who am I to talk, I'm a Wolves fan

[Calas Typhon]

 

Guy Haley mentioned at the BL weekender that Russ is no idiot...that he is a Primarch and everything he does is with good reason...that he's hunting Horus with good reason.

 

 

That precludes (imo) the possibility that victory against Horus is an impossibility.

 

But who am I to talk, I'm a Wolves fan

 

As I said in the first post, I really hope there is a good reason, otherwise the Book will be a massive let down.