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helterskelter

By helterskelter
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Marshal Loss Venerable Brother

Marshal Loss

Posted
Posted

There might be a little confusion over what constitutes a 'good' reason - there's strategically, and then there's a good reason in terms of what suits his character. Both are valid. I definitely think him going after Horus is appropriate in-universe, but given that he didn't know if he could kill Horus pre-Molech anyway, and he knows that Horus has transformed into super bald angry daemon jesus, he needs a valid reason to believe he can do it, otherwise he looks like an idiot. That's what Warsmith Kroeger is referring to by 'good' reason. I'm sure Haley will deliver.

b1soul Venerable Brother

b1soul

Posted
Posted

To me, Russ' plan is stupid (but perhaps a good example of character-induced stupidity) in light of all the info currently available.

 

Wolfbane might provide some additional info rendering his plan less stupid.

 

I originally thought that Russ was ignorant of Molech...but that doesn't seem the case.

Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Venerable Brother

Jarl Kjaran Coldheart

Posted
Posted

I wonder if even killing Horus is the goal...

 

Maybe just weakening Horus would be enough for Russ. 

 

Horus has a rebellion of monsters and madmen, held together by his charisma and strength. If Horus were to suffer a big enough loss than maybe the already present cracks could crumble...and halting the advance to Terra may be enough for Russ.

Taliesin Veteran

Taliesin

Posted
Posted (edited)

There's so many reasons to look forward to this novel.

One of them is seeing Horus Heresy Space Wolves at work in a pivotal battle.

There is so much that could happen in this book, that makes it so exciting.

 

I think Haley will certainly provide solid motivation for why Leman Russ does what he does, and at the same time you can already imagine that it will be a divisive topic for fans who've read the book. One of the questions will be whether it would have been better strategically for the current HH era army ( forces level at the time just before the Siege of Terra, don't know the numbers) to have remained on Terra and aid the defense as orchestrated by Rogal Dorn. Or, is this an attempt that could actually have succeeded and thus decapitate chaos forces?

 

I am sure that there is no motivation that Haley can think of that will not have a significant amount of people still maintain that it would have been best for Russ to remain on Terra.

Edited by Taliesin
Cerbero666 Battle-Brother

Cerbero666

Posted
Posted

Maybe Russ set something aboard the Vengeful Spirit that disrupts the void shields and allows the Emperor, Sanguinius and Dorn to board the ship during the Siege of Terra. Right now is the logical approach without taking the "opening in Horus armor" from Sanguinius and without making Russ look stupid.  

RikuEru Venerable Brother

RikuEru

Posted
Posted

If he did that, that just cheapens Sanguinius plot.

Russ took a gamble and it failed. Maybe he could take out a non roided up Horus. Maybe that was his gamble. Suddenly the trap turns on the Hunter.

I think that's part of it.

Russ and Horus - normally - probably could sparr or duell for hours or even days - probably even did so in the early years, to test their skills among equals.

So he knows in a duell, under the right circumstances, with the right strategy, distraction efforts and surprise effect he could take him down.

 

By now he knows Horus is far beyond his power-level.

He probably knows/assumes that a simple duel won't cut it.

There needs to be a reason for why he has to leave Terra for Fenris.

The Cover shows him with the Spear of Russ.

The Emperor specifically made it for him.

It IS frickin' gold all over from tip to bottom end.

Russ doesn't like it, due to his dream.

But he also knows that if ANY weapon in his arsenal can hurt Horus, it's the spear.

So he has to go grab that, before he can go on a hunt.

 

And yes, I agree, maybe his whole goal is to play 'his part', as he perceives it to be.

Maybe it's just meant to buy just a bit more time - and sow discomfort and unrest among the Traitors, if he can show that Horus is NOT perfect.

(...maybe that's why the Siege of Terra is just a loosely combined effort of Traitor Forces en masse, with the Legions just doing their thing thwy like best and the Primarchs going for their personal nemesises!?)

 

The novel will be quite interesting to read.

But it was probably a difficult task to write.

Russ needs a good reason to leave Terra - so he needs to look competent in his task. There needs to be the actual chance for him to win/finish his task (whatever it'll be).

 

But Horus needs to be portrayed competent and incredibly mighty aswell - else it wouldn't make sense for hin to best Sanguinius and the Emperor.

 

AND Russ needs to survive/retreat/be saved without a deus-ex-machina cop-out or a moment in which Horus becomes a mustache twirling villain and goes "Iqill let you live... for now! So you can suffer under the consequences of your own decision, as you watch everything fall to pieces! Bwahahaha!"

 

Probably one of the hardest story parts in the HH to get 'right' - only topped by whatever will happen on the Vengeful Spirit at "the end"

Calas Typhon Veteran

Calas Typhon

Posted
Posted (edited)

So this is where things are going as of this moment.

  • Russ and Rogal Dorn start getting salty with eachother, Russ sends Loken off to play about on the Vengeful Spirit.
  • Russ leaves Terra with a desire to take the fight to Horus, going over how he comes across in Vengeful Spirit. 
  • He takes with him the spear, which was in his possession from before his time on Terra if the background of the spear is correct and has not been changed around. The spear being a weapon given to him by the emperor but used as a tool that Wolf Lords would swear loyalty on as addressed by the 13th company.
  • Russ hunts down Horus, manages to sneak aboard the VS and get into combat with Horus.
  • Russ gets mauled and saved by something leading him to be taken away .
  • Space Wolves get to Yarant III after being hounded by Abaddon and end up either having their ship destroyed and having to land on the surface, or landing there to make a last stand.
  • Corax turns up and saves the day calls for everyone to run away. Leman Russ is in a deep coma.
  • ?????
  • Siege of Terra.
Edited by Warsmith Kroeger
Jorin Helm-splitter Veteran

Jorin Helm-splitter

Posted
Posted

Yes, I thought it was well-established that the SW view themselves as literally a breed apart from (and superior to) other legions.

 

Alaxxes badly shakes up this view, but I have no doubt they've recovered most of their pride by the time they charge off to confront the SoH

 

I think all of the legions think they're superior to the other ones. Well maybe not the word bearers, and some of the weird terran reinforcements like the captain from the scars books. I think its just part of warrior culture, I don't think any general would try to lead soldiers into battle with a "to be frank they're better than us" pep talk.

 

Does anyone else get the feeling the 'Emperor's Executioner' title is meant to be tongue-in-cheek, but Leman Russ just doesn't get the joke? It would be like calling an overzealous, but ultimately inept, commander 'Captain America.'

 

Pretty sure he came up with it so no. I know Guilliman doesn't know where the title comes from, and he would if it was something even half way official. Heck one of the major themes of the character is that he is pretending to be a barbarian so he probably wants people to view it that way.

 

My bet on the actual book though is that the cover will be a red herring. I don't think we'll see Russ vs. Horus duel at this stage of the HH. My bet is a fight when they're first meeting each other, and then Russ trying to come up with a plan that leads directly into Yarant.

Ascanius Battle-Brother

Ascanius

Posted
Posted

 

The Wolf King shook his head. ‘I’m not built for waiting, Sigillite. I don’t fight well from behind stone, waiting for the enemy to try and dig me out. I’m the executioner, and the executioner lands the first blow, a killing strike that ends dispute before it begins.’

 

 

 

 

I mean, akshuhly the executioner waits for the target to be caught, imprisoned, tried, sentenced, and condemned before carrying out the sentence.

 

Russ's attitude is more Dog the Bounty Hunter than anything . . .

Aenar Deathclaws Battle-Brother

Aenar Deathclaws

Posted
Posted

From a guy who was at the black library weekender, we know that Russ is looking for a way to weaken Horus.

 

We'll just have to wait a bit more than a month to get our hands on this book and only then we'll be able to criticize it. :wink:

 

I'll be at the Horus heresy weekender to buy this book and I'll be able to give you my opinion even if I'm certainly biased as a SW fan. :rolleyes: 

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