BitsHammer Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Google tells me that they appear in Fabius Bile: Progenitor Primogenitor. I've yet to read the novel myself (too busy learning how to talk to the warp the last couple days honestly) but considering Bile has previously said he feels the Emperor made a mistake not making female Space Marines (perhaps due to wanting to make Marines that can breed true and pursue his goal of uplifting humanity through mad science) it doesn't surprise me that this would be a thing. EDIT: Typo Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5003108 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leif Bearclaw Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 So something I learned recently (thanks Adeptus Podcastus) is that Fabius Bile created the Glandhounds, who are basically Marines 1.5 (assuming Primaris are Marines 2.0) which included both men and women. So yeah, female Marines are basically canon, though they only wear spikes. What? There has to be more nuance than that. Fabius's projects traditionally produce twisted madmen, or Thunder Warrior esque short lived abominations. Not 'straight up better Marines, and we can have female Marines too'. That's actually one of the worst things I've ever heard being added to 40k. Now, the goal of Fabius would logically include both genders, otherwise the entire 'New Men' concept is stillborn, but they wouldn't be Marines, any more than the Custodes are Marines. Also, he's Space Mengele, should he really succeed? That's a bit like if Yvraine just gave Ahriman the Rubric cure (another terrible idea, but that's another story), what does that do to the character? You've just resolved his central arc/motivation. I really want to like Fabius, but it seems they keep sticking the worst excesses of asinine new fluff onto him. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5003405 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsHammer Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 I haven't had a chance to read Primogenitor yet (I'm going to order it and Clonelord when I get paid again), but from what I've heard they're only like Marines 1.5. I think Bile's efforts have been more focused on making the upgrade work for everyone than trying to outright improve it, and now that someone has improved Marines, he wants to take a look at them because he wants to take those upgrades and mix them into his project. I'm sure his ultimate goal will be to do something like release a virus that biologically enhances every human it comes into contact with (or kills them) but I can see him mucking about with geneseed as a shortcut to get the upgrades he wants into human bodies before sampling their genetic material to try and use that as a basis for a more custodes style upgrade. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5003583 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagoth Ur Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 I've read Primogenitor and the Glandhounds are never referenced as being Space Marines or anything of the sorts. They are vastly improved humans, yes, and they can be dangerous to Space Marines when faced in small groups, yes, but Space Marines they are not. Fabius feels close to them and mentions that it is hard to fabricate them but they might be a viable option to mankind's genetic future, or so he thinks. So no, female space marines are still not a thing, spikes or no spikes. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5003773 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsHammer Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 I've read Primogenitor and the Glandhounds are never referenced as being Space Marines or anything of the sorts. They are vastly improved humans, yes, and they can be dangerous to Space Marines when faced in small groups, yes, but Space Marines they are not. Fabius feels close to them and mentions that it is hard to fabricate them but they might be a viable option to mankind's genetic future, or so he thinks. So no, female space marines are still not a thing, spikes or no spikes. Huh. Guess I got head-canoned. I wonder how he makes them. I'd assume it'd do with geneseed since that's like 90% of what he works on all the time, but then again who knows. And now I want a Glandhounds army, because that sounds cool. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5003795 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagoth Ur Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 I'll try and dig up some more infos about them from the book when I get home :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5003852 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamafore Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Listening to the audiobook of that while modeling, there is mention that he rednecked some "proto-geneseed" for them, but the impression I'm getting is they are better than humans, but not as good as space marines individually. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5003856 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interrogator-Chaplain Ezra Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 For me it would be the story of Nurgle granting the Eldar goddess Isha sanctuary within his garden. It was a pretty good 40k version of Persephone and Hades. I like that the great endless war between Slaanesh and Nurgle was started because Nurgle was enraptured. I seem to recall him keeping her in a cage? Hardly sanctuary. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5004046 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Caerolion Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Locked up and constantly force-fed super-plague mixtures as a means of testing their effectiveness. Sanctuary/torture, potayto/potahto. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5004065 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nemisor Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 All the old necron fluff. Back when the C'tan were actually in charge and not just star pokemons Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5004161 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsHammer Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 All the old necron fluff. Back when the C'tan were actually in charge and not just star pokemons Honestly I rather like the C'Tan being broken because it makes them less stupidly underpowered on the table. They were no where near "god" levels of power on the table so having them be complete was rather silly. So that's one change I don't hate because it makes their weaker states versus how awesome they used to be make more sense (I mean the Nightbringer was supposed to have created a spectre of death so powerful that it lives on in the genetic memory of various races, but on the table he was nowhere near strong enough to justify that lore, now it makes sense why). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5004665 Share on other sites More sharing options...
gideon stargreave Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 in my headcannon, the C'tan are fractured, but the Necrons just think they are in charge Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5004679 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsHammer Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 in my headcannon, the C'tan are fractured, but the Necrons just think they are in charge With how fractured the Necron dynasties are, there are plenty of tomb worlds that follow the C'tan shards thinking that they're still gods, while others use them in a Trazyn sort of method: "Deciever, GOOOOOOOOOO!" Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5004682 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raulmichile Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 That Marines were basically the scum of society who were found a better use by the Imperium, druging and mind wiping them to become psycho killers with death rates similar to any other imperial martial body, just equipped and trained to fulfill those missions other soldiers were not insane enough or trained enough to complete. Marines were not immortal or as valuable as current lore states. Their lifes measured in decades, not centuries. They were expendable with “production” rates fast enough to cover such high loses. They were trained to become so crazy and were so on steroids to be expected from them to be suicidal in their zeal to complete the mission, often disregarding their own survival. When the objective was so crucial and difficult to achieve you sent the marines, expecting them to die in droves, it didn’t matter. In fact marines were so nuts that they were “confined” in Chapters in part because of this. They were incapable of relating socially with normal humans. Besides, they were chemically unstable, requiring regular stabilization to keep them at peak efficiency. Marines in RT era were not the pinnacle of humanity, perfect warrior monks they are today by any means. And I liked it as well!!! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5004691 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Caerolion Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Sounds like they've turned that portrayal into what the Thunder Warriors are now. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5004853 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsHammer Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Someone had "corrected" me about the Exorcists sending recruits to the Grey Knights earlier in the thread. Just wanted to point out that the current Grey Knights codex says that the Exorcists and the Silver Skulls both do this. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5011951 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Caerolion Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 The Silver Skulls do? Page reference, out of curiosity? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5011961 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Page 8. The Chamber of Trials. The Exos and SS send the best pskyer pre marine recruits they have to the GK. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5012191 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsHammer Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Page 8. The Chamber of Trials. The Exos and SS send the best pskyer pre marine recruits they have to the GK. Beat me too it, but here's a cap of the section in question to collaborate further: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5012296 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sword Brother Adelard Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 That kind of puts pay to the old notion that Space Marines who met the Grey Knights are memory wiped. Kinda hard to save recruits for a chapter you can't remember existed... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5012488 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsHammer Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 That kind of puts pay to the old notion that Space Marines who met the Grey Knights are memory wiped. Kinda hard to save recruits for a chapter you can't remember existed... Not once do they mention the Grey Knights mind wiping Marines. The Inquisition killing/castrating the survivors of the first Armageddon war, sure, but not the Grey Knights themselves. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5012489 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Res Ipsa Loquitur Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Imperial Guard, as they were then known, are having a hard time taking a bunker stuffed full of Heretics. A Blood Angels Assault Squad arrives on the scene. I.G. C.O. expresses some doubt that the Blood Angels, with so few troops, have the minerals for the job. Blood Angels Sergeant is not happy and says so. Assault Squad zips off and charges the bunker, I.G. charges in to support but stop, shocked, when they reach the bunker and see what the BA have done. IIRC, the phrase 'charnel house' is used. BA Sergeant says "atodaso" and they fly away. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5012533 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Well the secret war is still in the codex. Which is utter rubbish considering the GK travelked the Galaxy alongside Bobby G. Grand Master Voldus was one of his closest companions... Edit. Actually the only mention of the secret war i can find is in the techmarine entry. Perhaps GW have finally dropped that sillyness! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5012560 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsHammer Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 It does seem like they're now more of an open secret. Like the Imperial citizens likely don't know (and low ranking Guard) but anyone with clout has knowledge of them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5012574 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Who the heck are the sulver skulls anyway? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/342725-whats-your-favorite-piece-of-lore-thats-often-forgotten/page/10/#findComment-5012579 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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