Ishagu Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Deepstriking two squads of Rubrics into cover sounds like it could be an early annoyance for an opponent. I think hey are ideal for the stratagem whilst the rest of the force moves up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skerr Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Great distraction for gun lines to do their thing, vortex beast to advance with cc support. Might even throw in an infernal gateway for fun to disrupt more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hhhdan Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Deepstriking two squads of Rubrics into cover sounds like it could be an early annoyance for an opponent. I think hey are ideal for the stratagem whilst the rest of the force moves up. IMO best use for the strat is to throw a blob of 30 tzaangors into combat very quickly, using stratagem and warptime, it will allow the rest of the force some breathing room, while the enemy is dealing with them (especially if tzaangors were also buffed with glamour and weaver, making them decently tough). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C@BA Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Hm, I was thinking... If I'll convert Mutalith Vortex Beast using Khemrian Warsphinx, will it be valid? I love the rules, but I can't stand the model, since my army is all Rubric-styled. I'm thinking about something looking like magical construct of some sort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skerr Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Eddie part 2 is up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prot Posted February 1, 2018 Author Share Posted February 1, 2018 Eddie, Agent of Change – Part 2: Tzaangor Gamer, painter and member of the Warhammer Community team, Eddie Eccles sold his soul to Tzeentch years ago in exchange for a big pile of Thousand Sons models. With the Legion’s very first Warhammer 40,000 codex on the way, he is writing a series of articles about making the most of the new rules. Previously, he covered Rubric Marines. Now it’s the turn of their bestial allies, the Tzaangors: Greetings, fellow seekers of knowledge. Today, we’re going to be taking a look at some of Tzeentch’s most feral and humble servants – the bestial Tzaangors. I’m a big fan of Tzaangors. Plentiful, savage and durable, they fill several battlefield roles that the Thousand Sons would otherwise struggle with. Let’s start with your basic Tzaangor. The stat line is nothing to sniff at – aside from an average Ballistic Skill (which you were never really going to use much anyway, so don’t worry) and a lack of power armour, in combat terms you have a Space Marine. That lack of durability is immediately addressed with a 5+ invulnerable save combined with the fact that you will usually outnumber any power-armoured foes two or three times over. Your out-of-the-box Tzaangors come in two flavours of weapon option – chainsword and autopistol OR Tzaangor blades. Both are fine, though I personally prefer the increased AP of the blade over the extra shooting attack of the pistol against most foes. Equipped thus, and with bonuses to their charge available on their datasheet, a flerd* of Tzaangors is a capable combat horde unit that already matches some of the best in Warhammer 40,000. Where they truly get deadly is with other Tzaangor-related synergies (more of which we’ll get to later). Tzaangor Enlightened are another thing entirely. These disc-mounted warriors can either fill the role of light assault troops or fire support, depending on how you equip them. Enlightened wielding fatecaster greatbows are a really interesting unit – high manoeuvrability and decent range gives them a 36″ threat radius, which turns out to be surprisingly useful against a range of foes. With a lot of shots and the ability to effectively bypass Toughness, they can strip wounds off pretty much any type of enemy – from light infantry to the toughest vehicles. Deploy these at the back of your battle lines, and then move forward once the enemy has committed – staying just within 24″ of the foe – and these guys will serve you well. And if they do get caught in combat by some sort of “shenanigans” charge, the ever helpful Fly keyword means that (provided they survive) they can leave combat and still fire into their attackers! Close combat Enlightened are a very different unit – fast and very killy, but also potentially fragile. I think there are two ways to use this unit that work particularly well. Option one is to hold them back as a counter-charge unit. This works well if you’re building a force around a core of Rubric Marines, who might need help if they get caught up in a protracted combat. Option two is to use them more aggressively to put pressure on your foe. This one is risky, but rewarding, and will work best if the rest of your army is built aggressively also, such as multiple teleport-striking Scarab Occult Terminators, a charging Mutalith Vortex Beast, or Magnus himself. However you equip your Enlightened, deploy them with a Tzaangor Shaman. Not only is it a Character, a Psyker and a capable (if fragile) fighter, but it has an ability which stacks perfectly with your Enlightened, and has the manoeuvrability to utilise it. Top Combos! One of the really powerful things about Tzaangors in the new codex is the sheer number of bonuses potently available to them from the army. Here are some of my favourites. 1) Tzaangor and the Beast For this combo, you’ll need 1 Command Point, a Mutalith Vortex Beast, and the biggest unit of Tzaangors you have. To my mind, a Mutalith Vortex Beast is the perfect companion to a Tzaangor horde – they’re big and scary, have some great force multiplying abilities, and most importantly, they have tentacles for a face – what’s not to love? This combo is about tying up your opponent’s army while your battlefield schemes can come to fruition elsewhere… Deploy your Tzaangor off the board using the Webway Infiltration Stratagem, and deploy your Vortex Beast as far forward in your deployment zone as possible. On your first turn, drop your Tzaangors down in a line in front of the enemy army, just over 9″ away, and advance the Vortex Beast forward at full speed (he doesn’t have a gun anyway, so why not?). In your Shooting phase, use the Vortex Beast’s Temporal Flux ability to gift your Tzaangors the ability to re-roll charges. With +1 to charge already native to their datasheet, and a re-roll, there are good odds that your Tzaangors will make it to the front lines of the foe on the first turn. Charge against a single unit if necessary, to minimise your opponent’s Overwatch attacks, but spread out to pile into others and tie up as much of the enemy battleline as you can. Most foes will then have to spend a valuable early turn clearing out your Tzaangors, while the rest of your army closes in for the kill. Even better, if any are still alive come the second turn, they’ll be joined by a charging Vortex Beast! 2) Right on Tzaarget For this combo, you’ll need 0 Command Points, a unit of Tzaangor Enlightened with fatecaster greatbows, a Tzaangor Shaman, and an Exalted Sorcerer on a Disc of Tzeentch. This combo is about optimising your Enlightened shooting. A big unit of 9 Enlightened works best. Fly this unit around as you usually would and have your Characters stay close, using their own Disc’s speed to keep pace. The Shaman provides a natural +1 to hit, and the Exalted Sorcerer not only lets you re-roll 1s to hit, he can also provide Prescience to give a further +1 to hit, meaning that, on the odds, each time this unit fires, you can reasonably expect at least 9 shots to punch past Toughness and straight to saves at AP -1. Simple, but effective. 3) The Charge of Change For this combo, you’ll want 2 Command Points, a Daemon Prince of Tzeentch with Wings, a unit of Tzaangor Enlightened with divining spears, and a Tzaangor Shaman. This combo is about hitting hard with your fast-moving Enlightened and optimising the impact. Move your Enlightened, Shaman and Daemon Prince up together in a group. The Shaman again is providing his native +1 to hit, and the Daemon Prince this time is bringing the Prescience (you can use an Exalted Sorcerer, but we’re about to hit combat, and things are going to get messy, so I prefer something a little tougher). The unit is very mobile, with a 12″ move, but you can, if you like, take the Warptime psychic power on the Daemon Prince to further guarantee making an early-game charge. The Shaman can also take Glamour of Tzeentch for the Enlightened – which means enemies will have a harder time hitting them, both on the approach and in combat. When the Enlightened make a charge, they are going to rip through almost anything – 2 attacks each, hitting on a 2+, re-rolling 1s, and with any hits of a 4+ jumping straight to an AP -1, 2 Damage wound. Then, if the enemy still isn’t dead, use the Cycle of Slaughter Stratagem, to do it all again! With nine of these guys charging, you’ll deliver dozens of wounds, and they’re especially effective against either 2 Wound Troops (looking at you, Primaris Space Marines) or Vehicles and Monsters with multiple Wounds. Closing Thought: Just as a last thought: while most of these tactics are presented with the idea that you’d be using Tzaangors to support a wider Thousand Sons army, it is quite possible to create an army only of beasts of Tzeentch – hordes of Tzaangors, backed up by fast-moving Enlightened, lumbering Chaos Spawn and Mutalith Vortex Beasts, and led by covens of Shamans and Daemon Princes. I actually think this would both look pretty awesome and be surprisingly competitive… something to think about. Thanks, Eddie, for these beastly ideas on how to use Tzaangors. You can pick up your own Tzaangors – and pre-order the new Codex: Thousand Sons – from Games Workshop now. If you’d prefer a digital edition of the codex, check out Warhammer Digital or pick up the enhanced iBooks edition. And join Eddie again next week, as he looks at the Thousand Sons’ Primarch, Magnus the Red, and what he brings to the army. * I couldn’t decide on “flock” or “herd”, so I went with “flerd”. Such is the will of Tzeentch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skerr Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 I asked about the legion trait on denials. i don't think we will get it though as mentioned worth an ask. Good article and a lot of the tactics discussed here, Eddie are you lurking? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Yncarne Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Anybody know roughly how many points scenario 2 (right on tzaarget) would be for a potential 9 wounds at -1 ap? It seems like a lot for that outcome but I’m pretty dumb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C@BA Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Anybody know roughly how many points scenario 2 (right on tzaarget) would be for a potential 9 wounds at -1 ap? It seems like a lot for that outcome but I’m pretty dumb. Nine Enlightened with bows - 152pts, shaman - 90, if I remember correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin777 Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 388 including the sorcerer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hhhdan Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Anybody know roughly how many points scenario 2 (right on tzaarget) would be for a potential 9 wounds at -1 ap? It seems like a lot for that outcome but I’m pretty dumb. You’ll get more if you also cast flickering flames on them. About 13-14 wounds on anything T6 and higher. For the points it’s decent. And I’d use it if they could deep strike, like this though, I think MSU of bowlightened with a shaman will work better as they will be much less of a target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Yncarne Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Thanks c@ba and Hhhdan. The sorcerer buffs could be used on anything, it’s the Gors damage output alone that made me ask. -1 ap doesn’t do much for me, it’s the d2 that intrigued me. 388 points better do some damage! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven1 Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 388 including the sorcerer I like it, not too expensive but definitely a threat. With weaver of fates and or glamour of Tzeentch it would make the unit a bit more survivable too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoA Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Hm, I was thinking... If I'll convert Mutalith Vortex Beast using Khemrian Warsphinx, will it be valid? I love the rules, but I can't stand the model, since my army is all Rubric-styled. I'm thinking about something looking like magical construct of some sort. I know it's not an "easy conversion" but a (small) Silver Tower would be super fluffy; the reality breaking around it giving your boys buffs. Thought about doing it myself but sadly I have no idea where to start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C@BA Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Hm, I was thinking... If I'll convert Mutalith Vortex Beast using Khemrian Warsphinx, will it be valid? I love the rules, but I can't stand the model, since my army is all Rubric-styled. I'm thinking about something looking like magical construct of some sort. I know it's not an "easy conversion" but a (small) Silver Tower would be super fluffy; the reality breaking around it giving your boys buffs. Thought about doing it myself but sadly I have no idea where to start. Oh. My. God. Thank you, it surely would look awesome, and, now, I'm seriously considering it, if I'll find a suitable base model to make the converions upon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoA Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Hm, I was thinking... If I'll convert Mutalith Vortex Beast using Khemrian Warsphinx, will it be valid? I love the rules, but I can't stand the model, since my army is all Rubric-styled. I'm thinking about something looking like magical construct of some sort. I know it's not an "easy conversion" but a (small) Silver Tower would be super fluffy; the reality breaking around it giving your boys buffs. Thought about doing it myself but sadly I have no idea where to start. Oh. My. God. Thank you, it surely would look awesome, and, now, I'm seriously considering it, if I'll find a suitable base model to make the converions upon. http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t69/joepad/torres001.jpg too big but it was the first thing I found. The big (blob) splinters that you can see in some of the "Wrath of Magnus" artwork would be a good base as well. Link to pic.: http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?196102-Two-Tzeentch-(silver)-Towers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skerr Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Wow! Thanks for the link, very cool idea on both the tower and sphinx (if the size was close id be cool). One might consider converting the slaughterbrute option to a slaughtersphinx if the maw and double tails are off putting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonoftherubric21 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Did a good game against ad mech tonight! Got my first win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skerr Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Fantastic man! Looking forward to hearing more Son. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonoftherubric21 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Fantastic man! Looking forward to hearing more Son. Wasnt easy, ill elaborate more on sunday as I am playing a series of games and seeing what we can do between 1500-2000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C@BA Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 too big but it was the first thing I found. The big (blob) splinters that you can see in some of the "Wrath of Magnus" artwork would be a good base as well. Link to pic.: http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?196102-Two-Tzeentch-(silver)-Towers Thank you, these are amazing, but, between these and Wrath of Magnus variants, I'm leaning towards the later ones, they look more unnatural. I'm searching for a good base now, since I'm not good enough to make it myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonoftherubric21 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 For my game against admech; I took Ahriman on disc. Exalted on disc, he was warlord Terminator sorcerer (familiar) 6 enlightened Mutalith beast Defiler 2 units of rubrics at 10 strong in rhinos (reaper in each) 10 man cultist unit I only had 6 CP, but I found I really didnt even need it. The helm of the third eye paid for itself. I got first turn, defiler and enlightened plugged one of his walkers (auto wounds are pretty great even though they only got one round of shots) The Cuelexus zoned out my casters, caused me to fail a couple times. I did get some lucky rolls, I also got one incredibly well timed Perils that caused an explosion, My exalted died...but it killed Cawl in the process. The Mutalith was still above half health at the end of the game, I made quite a few 5++ saves this game for the record. His Kastellans and Tazer-Chickens were definitely dangerous and I had to focus them down, I had a squad of rubrics hit 2 of the chicken tazers to death after pelting the unit with Inferno shells. (Aspiring Sorcerer FTW!!! dealt 6 wounds in one turn with his stave) Ahriman death-hexes the kastellans, one 10 man unit of rubrics double taps, Vets of the Long War, Prescience is active.....kills one and a half kastellans. Not to shabby, the remaining 2 then activate and obliterate the rubric unit..... I dark-matter crystal the other unit across the table and pull this same trick again and destroy another kastellan. The helm of the third eye is a "take this. period" item. It paid for itself 3 times over. I think I made 4 rolls, the guy had 9 command points start of the game, I got more then 3 back. Overall- I was actually able to beat a competent ad-mech army....with my Thousand Sons....Thats a first I am quite proud of! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prot Posted February 2, 2018 Author Share Posted February 2, 2018 Without knowing how it went down, it's at least fair to say that's a difficult match up for Thousand Sons. Did you use extra CP's for a bonus relic? Did you deepstrike anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonoftherubric21 Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Without knowing how it went down, it's at least fair to say that's a difficult match up for Thousand Sons. Did you use extra CP's for a bonus relic? Did you deepstrike anything? It was a tough matchup but I won fairly soundly. Ill gladly take tough games as long as its not a wash ya know? The termie sorcerer deepstruck. Everything else was on table. The fact that he took a Cuelexsus is because he knows I play thousand sons so that was just a little bit....Mean? for the lack of a classier term. The list worked out fairly well, the defiler and the Mutalith combined with rhinos makes for a solid core. if he hadnt had the culexus it would be a far easier match up. I did get lucky on a couple things. but I am glad to say overall we perform at a capable level in a semi-competitive meta, and this is WITHOUT using any horded up tzaangors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prot Posted February 2, 2018 Author Share Posted February 2, 2018 Well that sounds pretty good. So in hindsight do you think the extra 6" could have helped you with the Celuxes' debuff? Or was he able to be fairly aggressive with him? As a side note, I will just say a lot of the competitive games I play in feature Culexus', sometimes multiples, AND Greyfax (she's strong denial/prevents overwatch). My Tzaangors are there to push them back... As you know Tzaangors LOVE shiny things... like Celuxes heads. They re-roll on his melon, and even 10 of them always beat him down. And at the very least it forces opponents to turtle him a bit, giving me a little more room (my hope now is to get the extra 6" working in conjunction with my old goat techniques.) I hate washes as well. The best games are always nail biters! So your only relic was the crystal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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