Intercessors - is quantity its own quality?

[Race Bannon]

Side note: I'd love cheaper Terminators :wub:

[Macabre Slanneshi Prince]

Makes me wonder why Terminators arent like 130 points for 5 man?

Mandatory Power Fists probably have a lot to do with it.

[Dracos]

Side note: I'd love cheaper Terminators :wub:

... with a las-cannon option :) Pretty sure we’re not getting either :(

 

ObSec really seems to be the Intercessor primary role though and I’m sure we’ll see them supplementing many a old school tournament list. The saturation point for Intercessors seems to be about 20 from what I’m seeing. Any more than 30 even in an all Primaris list and your wasting points you need for the “Kill” teams of Hellblasters, Aggressors, and Interceptors. (imo)

[Ishagu]

Termies would be fine if they could all take Combi weapons like Chaos ones can. They pay a premium for deepstriking yet are ineffective when doing so and charges are unlikely.

[Ahistorian]

BA Intercessors punched heavy in my game last week. Enough bodies and wounds to frustrate lascannons and heavy bolters alike, wounding enemy marines on a 3+, or a 2+ within 6" of the Sanguinary Priest. Delicious fun, and pt/pt more efficient than the Assault Terminators who killed about 1/3rd their points before succumbing to enemy fire. Or indeed the Land Raider that spent all game stuck in melee/falling back from a tiny wee tactical squad.

[Aothaine]

BA Intercessors punched heavy in my game last week. Enough bodies and wounds to frustrate lascannons and heavy bolters alike, wounding enemy marines on a 3+, or a 2+ within 6" of the Sanguinary Priest. Delicious fun, and pt/pt more efficient than the Assault Terminators who killed about 1/3rd their points before succumbing to enemy fire. Or indeed the Land Raider that spent all game stuck in melee/falling back from a tiny wee tactical squad.

 

Yeah I think Intecessors shine with Blood Angels. I like Aggressors with Dark Angels personally but they work pretty good with Raven Guard Strike from the Shadows as well.

 

I've contemplated full Intecessor lists with the Cpt. Smashypants and the Librarian beat sticks. Is it a pretty scare list. Lots of obs-sec, bodies and wounds. Run a double Battalion with 85 Intecessors on the board and 2 Captains and 2 Librarians. Blood Angels make them do work.

[Ahistorian]

 

I've contemplated full Intecessor lists with the Cpt. Smashypants and the Librarian beat sticks. Is it a pretty scare list. Lots of obs-sec, bodies and wounds. Run a double Battalion with 85 Intecessors on the board and 2 Captains and 2 Librarians. Blood Angels make them do work.

 

 

I'd swap at least a few of those many many Intercessors for Hellblasters for AT, and maybe a squad of Reivers for backfield nuisance-making.

 

While the Librarian is good for mortal wounds, a Sanguinary Priest is ace for caning even vehicles in CQB, as is the Chaplain with the flat re-roll to misses

[Kallas]

Makes me wonder why Terminators arent like 130 points for 5 man?

They are, actually

[Guiltysparc]

I feel like grenade launcher get overlooked when people talk about intercessors. For 1pt they get access to a pretty decent special weapon (d6 30" s3 shots or 1 30" s6 ap-1 d3 dmg shot). That's a super cheap special weapon option.

[Blindhamster]

every squad of mine has one!

[Nalim]

I feel like grenade launcher get overlooked when people talk about intercessors. For 1pt they get access to a pretty decent special weapon (d6 30" s3 shots or 1 30" s6 ap-1 d3 dmg shot). That's a super cheap special weapon option.

 

I tried the thing a lot and I'm not impressed. Against most targets that aren't harlequin vehicles, the grenade launcher is only worth considering outside of 15 inch rapid fire range. Inside rapid fire range, using the bolt rifle is better most of the time.

[Ishagu]

 

 

I feel like grenade launcher get overlooked when people talk about intercessors. For 1pt they get access to a pretty decent special weapon (d6 30" s3 shots or 1 30" s6 ap-1 d3 dmg shot). That's a super cheap special weapon option.

I tried the thing a lot and I'm not impressed. Against most targets that aren't harlequin vehicles, the grenade launcher is only worth considering outside of 15 inch rapid fire range. Inside rapid fire range, using the bolt rifle is better most of the time.

That's exactly how you should use it. It's only 1 point after all.

[Blindhamster]

a single point for the ability to exchange your strength 4 AP -1 Damage 1 shot for a strength 6 AP -1 Damage 1d3 shot is well worth it.

the ability to exchange your single shot for d6 Strength 3 shots vs hordes is quite cool too, although more situational.

[Prot]

I feel like grenade launcher get overlooked when people talk about intercessors. For 1pt they get access to a pretty decent special weapon (d6 30" s3 shots or 1 30" s6 ap-1 d3 dmg shot). That's a super cheap special weapon option.

 

I gotta say this is something I assumed was automatic. In fact I think they sell boxes of Intercessors based purely on that model. It's the krak missile variant for me. It takes a bit of sting out of the lack of variety that Primaris have. But the odd time you get a full 3 wounds on a vehicle (don't forget split fire) can make that point seem super efficient. 

[Captain Idaho]

Wounding on a 3+ against most infantry targets is nice so as mentioned, firing it at ranges over 15" it's very worth it.

[Joukernaut]

An added bonus for me is the fact that chucking grenades with the launcher doesn't suffer any penalty from movement.

[Reyner]

You can also make thump noises when they shoot. The krak grenade sounds pretty decent.

[Race Bannon]

Haha - so I'm not the only one that makes sound effects when playing!

 

^_^

[Ishagu]

The grenade launcher can potentially one shot a Custode lol (not actually THAT unlikely)

 

What a 1 point investment it would be if that happened!

[Firepower]

Haha - so I'm not the only one that makes sound effects when playing!

 

 

Of course you aren't.  There are lots of wierdos out there... :teehee:

[Race Bannon]

 

Haha - so I'm not the only one that makes sound effects when playing!

 

^_^

 

 

Of course you aren't.  There are lots of wierdos out there... :teehee:

Accusing fellow Brothers is tickling heresy yo. We know you do it too, it's okay ^_^

[d36williams]

I think Intercessors are more point efficient in some avenues versus tactical marines. When killing t4 3+ models, it takes 9 Str4 Ap0 shots, or 6 Str4 Ap-1 shots. That amounts to 3 Intercessors have the killing power of 5 Tacticals. 54 points VS 65 points for killing MEQ, and 6 wounds vs 5 wounds.

 

4 Guard require 18 Str 4 Ap0 shots, while 4 guard require 9 Str 4 Ap-1 shots. That amounts to nine tacticals vs five Intercessors - 9 wounds vs 10 wounds, and 117 points vs 90 points to kill 4 guardsmen. 

 

The only place where tacticals outshine Intercessors is for Points VS area denial (deep strike denial bubble, screening), where cost per model is the flat value. 

 

In general, I think tactical marines when directly compared to Intercessors, should cost at least 12 points vs the Intercessors 18.  Tacticals are generally about 3/5s to 5/9s as effective as Intercessors, a little less than 2/3s  the value. Tacticals do benefit from Rhinos and Razorbacks and better vehicle support, and that seems baked into the cost.

 

I like the Space Wolf flanking stratagem for Intercessors, allowing you to deploy Intercessors after the start of the game (in contrast to Ravenguard). Players can use these Intercessors to block for the many Space Wolf characters riding wolves. No one wants to spend their shooting on the Intercessors but they are there, allowing the Spacewolf characters to get into charge range. Also, the Spacewolf stratagem that allows models to use rapid fire weapons as pistols is a nice boost in CC, basically like having an extra 1/2 an attack this time with AP -1

 

Last note: with Terminators being so bad, they are so very cheap on eBay. I've now got 20 plus some characters. If there ever is a price drop on Terminators... I will be well positioned!
 

[Ishagu]

I think both tacticals AND intercessors need a point drop. Remember that even though Intercessors are more point efficient, they are vulnerable to multi damage weapons and can still be removed from the table as easily s Tacticals if taking fire from the right weapon.

[Captain Idaho]

Intercessors are only more points efficient than tacticals if you don't take extra weapons in the unit.

 

Add Plasma Guns and Combis and a Heavy Bolter and use equal points of Intercessors and you have a clearer idea of what is more points efficient.

 

Casualties in an Intercessor squads suffer more from losses - each death reducing the killing power of the unit steadily. A Tactical squad is still dangerous with its specials, combis and heavies right up to 7 wounds.

 

The 2 units shouldn't really be compared since they have such different strengths. The extra weapons of the Tacticals makes them extremely offensive in comparison to Intercessors.

 

The Intercessors on the other hand work well marching up the table and laying down steady fire. Their Bolters are still only S4 but least they get AP-1.

 

If I took Intercessors I'd go large. 10 man units (20 wounds) and get them up front taking the hits. I'd probably take 2 such units and march them up the table, maybe even 3.

 

The problem is they are just S4 at the end of the day. Good at killing infantry but struggle somewhat against other targets. If you have Tau or Eldar prepare for pain too as the multi wounds their weapons cause will make the extra staying power of Intercessors seem overpriced.

[momerathe]

I wonder if Iron Hands' chapter tactics might not shine with primaris in general and intercessors in particular. You get a ~30% chance of surviving a 2 damage hit.