Unit of the Week: Sanguinary Guard

[Xenith]

Great charts thoridon, thanks! I was in the verge of a 5 powerfist SG squad also, but now I guess it'll have to be magnets!

[Jolemai]

i still plan on running a mixed loadout, just not at 6+ members!

[Indefragable]

@Thoridon “hey maestro, do you take requests?” <tosses coin into guitar case>

 

Feel like doing defense/resiliency of SG vs VV?

[Charlo]

@Thoridon “hey maestro, do you take requests?” <tosses coin into guitar case>

 

Feel like doing defense/resiliency of SG vs VV?

It's a fairly simple one that.

 

If they have SS then VV are just better against anything ap3 or more, otherwise it's the same.

[Indefragable]

 

@Thoridon “hey maestro, do you take requests?” <tosses coin into guitar case>

 

Feel like doing defense/resiliency of SG vs VV?

It's a fairly simple one that.

 

If they have SS then VV are just better against anything ap3 or more, otherwise it's the same.

 

 

I'm curious about the array of targets, what becomes the ideal matchups for each, esp with the -1 To Hit now. 

[Thoridon]

The -1 to hit will make it a bad day for anyone wielding a fist / hammer. Opposing Marines would go to 5+ to hit against SG, which will stop a good amount of attacks before saves get to kick in.

[Brother Cruoris]

Aren't hit modifiers caped at +1/-1?

Meaning fists or TH will still stay at -1.

[Thoridon]

Ah, true, I forgot about that.

[SnorriSnorrison]

You’ll hit on 2’s with fists on SG though, because the modifiers are capped at -1/+1 after all modifiers have been applied. -1 from hammer, +1 from Heirs, +1 from Warlord means SG hit on 2’s and re-roll 1’s if around a Captain/CM, no?

[Thoridon]

You’ll hit on 2’s with fists on SG though, because the modifiers are capped at -1/+1 after all modifiers have been applied. -1 from hammer, +1 from Heirs, +1 from Warlord means SG hit on 2’s and re-roll 1’s if around a Captain/CM, no?

Surely the fist would hit on a 3, as the +1 from Heirs being near the warlord cancels out the -1 for the fist. There is no second +1 unless I'm missing something?

[SnorriSnorrison]

 

You’ll hit on 2’s with fists on SG though, because the modifiers are capped at -1/+1 after all modifiers have been applied. -1 from hammer, +1 from Heirs, +1 from Warlord means SG hit on 2’s and re-roll 1’s if around a Captain/CM, no?

 

Surely the fist would hit on a 3, as the +1 from Heirs being near the warlord cancels out the -1 for the fist. There is no second +1 unless I'm missing something?

The two cancel each other, but around the Ancient (missing in my post!) with the chapter banner you’ll get +1 to hit in close combat! So it’s just around the sanguinary ancient which must be warlord that SG hit on 2’s. With a captain nearby, they’ll re-roll 1’s on top.

So yeah I was missing that in my post. :)

[Thoridon]

Then yeah, the Ancient as warlord would be fantastic to pair with fist SG and would get them that net +1 :) If the SG have swords/axes take something else as the warlord.

[aquamarine]

My squad has 3 Fists and 5 Swords, oh the dilemma 

 

He'll also give himself the +1 through Heirs of Azkaellon?

 

Always like that he's an Elite character choice too, HQ in BAs still have so many nice options.

Edited October 22, 2020 by aquamarine

[Xenith]

I started building some additional Sanguard last night, initially to be an Ancient ad 3 with fists, then I remembered this thread. Ancient is magged between sword and fist, I've built 2 fists for general purpose, and then one model magged between sword and fist. 

 

Swords still seem the way to go. With plague marines Axes might be an option to stay wounding on a 2+ v T5, but I think it's still pretty close. 

Edited January 18, 2021 by Xenith

[Karhedron]

Axes wound plague marines more easily than swords but swords reduce their save more since they don't have an invuln.

Actually DC might be better again DG as drowning them in a hail of 1D attacks is likely to be more efficient than wasting the 2D weapons on the SG. DC can also take Thunder Hammers which can one-shot (one-splat?) DG. VanVets with SS/LC might also be better in this specific case as wounding on a 4+ with a reroll is pretty handy.
 

The two cancel each other, but around the Ancient (missing in my post!) with the chapter banner you’ll get +1 to hit in close combat! So it’s just around the sanguinary ancient which must be warlord that SG hit on 2’s.

The problem is that the Chapter Banner can only buff 1 unit per turn. The Ancient only has 3 attacks and you will generally want the banner buffing something with a higher damage output.

Generally speaking, I think I actually prefer the Sword for the Sanguinary Ancient. Normally you will want to the Banner's +1 to Hit Bonus on another unit. Although if he is your WL, I guess he will give himself +1 to-Hit from HoA. If he were WS2+, I would definitely go for a Fist, but at a 3+, I would probably stick to the Sword.

Edited January 19, 2021 by Karhedron

[Shaezus]

If you're running the ancient as warlord then you might as well go fists. If you're set on swords then the ancient is a waste of points. My SG are at 5 fists and 3 swords for now, with the swords effectively being ablative wounds tbh.

 

Had fun trying them alongside ancient with wrath of Baal, but in hindsight I think a turn 1 advance should be enough to get cover and line uo a turn 2 charge.

 

WIth the chaplain on bike as WL nearby, the +1 to hit and rerolls gives better odds for the fists than 2 x +1 to hit. Besides the charge bonus.

 

A buffed sanguard in assault doctrine on turn 2 hits much harder than people expect

[Karhedron]

Time to bump this thread a little as we have received a couple of changes that really help Sanguinary Guard. Firstly is Armour of Contempt. Now of course this helps everyone but units with a 2+ save that can make easy use of terrain can leverage AoC better than anyone else. Sanguinary Guard have been likened to flying Terminators, quite frankly the lack of Invulnerable save is almost academic now. I think this boost has put them ahead of other options like Vanguard Veterans for all except maybe a few edge cases.

Secondly, the latest Munitorum Field Manual has brought their price down to 30ppm before upgrades. Granted this is not a huge saving but they were good before and I really think an extra 2 points off per model is great. They are even tougher for my opponent to remove so I plan to continue running mine with a Jump Sanguinary Priest to keep them patched up and to kick them into the Assault Doctrine at the earliest opportunity.