Drider Posted November 10, 2018 Share Posted November 10, 2018 I'm all in favour of strats you can use in the other persons turn, but that strikes me as a bit much. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5189046 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atrus Posted November 10, 2018 Share Posted November 10, 2018 Not to mention would inevitably lead to outraged screeching for sisters to be nerfed. Already hearing some people refer to faith as the "cheat phase" in some battle reports. Strong faith now isnt bad, theres only like 30 sisters players in the world :p the moment plastic drops, all the flavour of the monthers will jump in and abuse the heck out of it and suddenly sisters declared OP by everyone and then we're nerfed into the ground and the trend chasers move onto the next big thing. All things in moderation. Too much of a good thing isnt good. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5189174 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purifying Tempest Posted November 11, 2018 Share Posted November 11, 2018 Not to mention would inevitably lead to outraged screeching for sisters to be nerfed. Already hearing some people refer to faith as the "cheat phase" in some battle reports. Strong faith now isnt bad, theres only like 30 sisters players in the world the moment plastic drops, all the flavour of the monthers will jump in and abuse the heck out of it and suddenly sisters declared OP by everyone and then we're nerfed into the ground and the trend chasers move onto the next big thing. All things in moderation. Too much of a good thing isnt good. Brace yourselves for 300 point Repressors - the bandwagon will be hard with that thing. Maybe FW will cash in and add the vehicle to their line again to scalp some sales. Seems a very GW/FW thing to do Edit: The thing I'm getting a tiny concerned with is the scale/aesthetic of the new line compared to the old line. I don't want to be playing clashing minis or feel I am needing to replace my entire army immediately to incorporate the new sculpts. That's probably the only thing I am concerned over with the new looks :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5189337 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERJAK Posted November 11, 2018 Share Posted November 11, 2018 I'm all in favour of strats you can use in the other persons turn, but that strikes me as a bit much. Not to mention would inevitably lead to outraged screeching for sisters to be nerfed. Already hearing some people refer to faith as the "cheat phase" in some battle reports. Strong faith now isnt bad, theres only like 30 sisters players in the world the moment plastic drops, all the flavour of the monthers will jump in and abuse the heck out of it and suddenly sisters declared OP by everyone and then we're nerfed into the ground and the trend chasers move onto the next big thing. All things in moderation. Too much of a good thing isnt good. It's really not THAT strong. Think about it: Being able to shoot in your opponents shooting phase would be useful, but ultimately something your opponent could fairly easily work around. The shooting phase happens AFTER the movement phase and just about every SoB gun worth shooting is 12" range or less. For the ones that ARE long range, it's actually almost exactly the same as just getting another normal AoF. The stratagem isn't usually going to net any kills a normal AoF wouldn't against an even halfway decent opponent, it's just going to create little deadzones around footslogging dominion squads. It's more about influencing movement than it is killing models. Every halfway decent shooting army in the game would be able to ignore it outright and most CQC armies aren't really that concerned about 1 unit shooting 1 extra time. As for fighting in the fight phase...who cares? Celestine is the only decent CQC unit in the entire book and you just back out when she charges you. Even if it did end up being a little bit too strong you just add the caveat that the unit that AoFs in your opponent's turn can't AoF in your next turn. Now it's only slightly better than a regular AoF. It's important to consider the realistic scenarios rather than the best case when considering potential stratagems. Sure, 5 melta doms could theoretically kill a Knight and a Smash Captain in that extra shooting attack, but it's much more likely that you either don't have a target at all or are taking potshots at guardsmen or Ork boyz. Sisters players tend to be really conservative when it comes to giving the army additional power and as a result overestimate how much of a difference buffs will make, imho. Side bar: Worrying about Sisters being OP or becoming FOTM or whatever is something that shouldn't even be in the top ten list of concerns for Sisters players. People are going to complain about any army they lose to, so just ignore whiners. People are still outrage screeching about GUILLEMON and he's been nerfed 4 times in an army that's been mediocre AT BEST for more than a year. We also really, really could use a powerful codex because we NEED bandwagoners. We need people picking up SoB armies for ANY reason, because if these models don't sell EXTRAORDINARILY well, we really will never see another model again. We'll also be using this codex until the heat death of the universe. Oh, and the "I told you so!'s" from the anti-female models/anti-sisters crowd will be loud enough and obnoxious enough to blot out the sun. I'm hoping that the codex releases at the upper end of the power curve. Non-Ynnari CWE or Non-Ynnari DE level would be more than fine. Then you get the bandwagoners buying up dozens of boxes of SoB for soup lists, guaranteeing the future of the line. If nerfs need to come in later, whatever. Not the first time SoB have faced significant nerfs this edition(cough*ruleof3*cough). The point is to get the new line off to a strong start. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5189369 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beams Posted November 11, 2018 Share Posted November 11, 2018 I don't want sisters to get much better. They're already really good. They just need a couple decent support strategems, and order traits and they'll be really powerful. I don't want to feel like my army is better than anyone else's, because then my wins are meaningless. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5189389 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqui Posted November 11, 2018 Author Share Posted November 11, 2018 As well as balance, all we ever needed besides new models was additional Troop units and HQ's. Everything else will be a bonus as far as I'm concerned. As for the risk of Sisters being ignored if the Codex fails, well, I honestly don't see it happening. GW has finally seen the sheer amount of support a new range and rules has. And they've stated very, very publically that they want to get this right. We're on the cusp of a new age. We don't need to doubt how things will turn out. We've already been in a dark age for around two decades. Faith is it's own reward. :wink: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5189425 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dracpanzer Posted November 11, 2018 Share Posted November 11, 2018 Is anyone else having trouble with the new OoBR conviction being a melee buff for an Order that has always been closely tied with Dominion units? Purely a fluff thing, but when the seemingly best target for the Conviction are Repentia wouldn't it have been a better fit for OoVH? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5189532 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqui Posted November 11, 2018 Author Share Posted November 11, 2018 I thought that too. Valorous Heart (and by extension, my DIY offshoot Order ^_^ ) would be a far better Order to give it to. Until we see the other Order convictions, we don't know where this is headed. Of course, this is a Beta Codex. We can tell GW they've made a mistake ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5189650 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drider Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 Anyone else crawling up the walls waiting for more previews? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5190331 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slasher956 Posted November 12, 2018 Share Posted November 12, 2018 Yep! That’s why I’m asking silly questions about losing the rhino from the list.... Next silly question - what weapon options do we think the mistress of repentance will get? After all they gave her whips a cost .... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5190359 Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvih Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 What worries me about the beta codex is how representative it'll be of the final one if they limit it to currently available models. I know this has been brought up before, but between the current very limited model range and hopefully a bit more varied plastic range there could be so much changing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5192812 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drider Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 I think they will keep stuff in reserve to release when the codex comes out, but for the preexisting stuff, chapter tactics warlord traits and strats, it'll be an opportunity to faq/errata before sending it to print. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5192840 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aothaine Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 Not sure if anyone else has seen this yet, surely someone has, but just in case... https://saintnora.com/2018/11/03/first-sister-of-battle-rules-preview/ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5193074 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainMarsh Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 Yeah it has been a discussion! :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5193155 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banjulhu Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 A Late 2019 release seems par for the course really. They were not going to stick rules in Chapter Approved and then a month or so later supersede them with a codex.Besides, GW need more time to release new Primaris kits into the under supported space marine market (I remember a time when I was keen for larger scale marines, oh how naive I was). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5193803 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montford Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 A Late 2019 release seems par for the course really. They were not going to stick rules in Chapter Approved and then a month or so later supersede them with a codex. Besides, GW need more time to release new Primaris kits into the under supported space marine market (I remember a time when I was keen for larger scale marines, oh how naive I was). GW will also need time to gather the feedback, assess it, and make any alterations they deem fit for the Codex prior to final editing and sending it to be published. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5193824 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banjulhu Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 A Late 2019 release seems par for the course really. They were not going to stick rules in Chapter Approved and then a month or so later supersede them with a codex. Besides, GW need more time to release new Primaris kits into the under supported space marine market (I remember a time when I was keen for larger scale marines, oh how naive I was). GW will also need time to gather the feedback, assess it, and make any alterations they deem fit for the Codex prior to final editing and sending it to be published. I very much doubt that is a priority to them if a thing at all. They already have a fully formed and functional play-testing cycle which they have no reason to change. Play testing on most of the Sisters will have had to already be well underway and any feedback between chapter approved and the the codex is likely just a confirmation of changes already in the pipeline because that is all that could be done in the given time frame. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5193845 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainMarsh Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 It depends on the feedback and the level of it. If there is loud, consistent, and alarming feedback positive or negative, then this gives them time to change. If there are a bunch of small, minor things, they'll ignore it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5194017 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atrus Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 So lets be sure to send the feedback if they dont address it in CA... "Make Exorcists great again." Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5194106 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montford Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 A Late 2019 release seems par for the course really. They were not going to stick rules in Chapter Approved and then a month or so later supersede them with a codex. Besides, GW need more time to release new Primaris kits into the under supported space marine market (I remember a time when I was keen for larger scale marines, oh how naive I was). GW will also need time to gather the feedback, assess it, and make any alterations they deem fit for the Codex prior to final editing and sending it to be published. I very much doubt that is a priority to them if a thing at all. They already have a fully formed and functional play-testing cycle which they have no reason to change. Play testing on most of the Sisters will have had to already be well underway and any feedback between chapter approved and the the codex is likely just a confirmation of changes already in the pipeline because that is all that could be done in the given time frame. I'm pretty sure GW has mentioned that they will be soliciting feedback on the Beta Codex. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5194112 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqui Posted November 19, 2018 Author Share Posted November 19, 2018 It's been stated clearly on the Warhammer Community site that they wish players to feedback their opinions on the Codex. This is fact. We all have a huge chance to get our voices heard. Let's not waste it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5194118 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montford Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 Thanks Aqui! After work today I was feeling pretty worn out and wasn't certain I was remembering that properly. Glad to know I did. Back to speculation: As I've always envisioned a sarissa to be able to be attached to a bolt gun as a bayonet is, I'm really hoping that Celestians will be able to take them, and that the sarissa will confer a S+1 and -1 AP. I have not fielded Celestians at all in 8th, but that sort of an upgrade would probably get me to take at least one Squad. Opinions? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5194171 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atrus Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 I dont see sarissas happening. No official model or upgrade as i recall. Also, such an upgrade would be too good for Celestians. Itd turn Bloody Rose celestians into beasts, each girls effectively hitting like a heavy bolter in combat with all those bonuses (A3 S5 ap-1 in first round each). Dont get me wrong, itd be cool but i dont see it happening. If it did, expect a lot of feedback from non sisters players for it to be culled... Thats my concern fir the whole feedback thing. That it can be tainted by bias from non sisters players. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5194178 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slasher956 Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 I expect sarissas to be a special rule for celestians that’ll be reroll 1s to wound in combat. I also expect all the feedback to be ignored if it doesn’t have example and reason eg, unit x is overcosted by a points because....... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5194233 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainMarsh Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 I think the Sarissas as postulated above would be fine. Outside of a specific Order in a specific scenario they would still only be Strength 4 AP-1 attacks from a supposedly elite unit. While we should be wary of making Sisters too powerful, we shouldn't shy away from making the powerful enough. Most armies have tons of tricks and weapons and we don't, by design. No reason we can't find, within that fluffy framework, more options for ourselves.Heck, I'd argue it should be an available option for all Sisters who have a Bolter. Make us pay for it, restrict it to what is arguably the most lackluster standard infantry firearm in the game, and have fun. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/347326-sisters-speculation-topic/page/15/#findComment-5194283 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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