Vigilus Fluff/Lore Summary

[Sete]

Obviously it’s impossible to write lore that’s going to please everyone but in the 40k I used to know no one would have battered an eyelid at the Crimson Fists firing on civilians.

There's a bit of a disconnect from the guys that carried civilians on their back, to now shoot unharmed civilians. Just that.

[Marshal Rohr]

The Crimsons Fists tried to save Rynn’s Worlders, no? That makes a certain sense they’d see these people differently.

[Lord_Caerolion]

The difference is that the civilians they carried on their backs were innocents during an Ork invasion, whereas these are aggressive civilians when attempting to quarantine against Genestealer infiltration. These are still Imperial Space Marines, they aren't going to play nice and hand out water bottles to the poor refugees when they're all potentially carrying world-threatening xenos taint. In the eyes of the Imperium, better the innocent die than the Xenos walk free to infect further Imperials.

[Master Commander Ajax]

I remeber reading about Blood Angels who killed a bunch of civilians with less provocation than this with little more than a shrug. I know the lore evolves and, like I said, your never gonna please everyone but it just feels like 40k is less grim dark than it used to be.

[Sete]

The Crimsons Fists tried to save Rynn’s Worlders, no? That makes a certain sense they’d see these people differently.

Eh fair enough.

[Lord_Caerolion]

I mean, I do think that the Crimson Fists would seek any alternative to having to do this, but we're talking about a Xenos race that can look literally identical to baseline humans, with the exception that they carry xenos taint and birth literal monsters. Even one slipping through could have catastrophic consequences. It's not like they can have the civilians form a queue and ask them how many arms the Emperor has.

[Lord Marshal]

It bears repeating that the Crimson Fists and the Cadians were actively engaged in escorting refugee convoys and rescuing civilians for the duration of the campaign up until Calgar's order came down. Given the various chapters are noted as being pretty much acting on their own initiative until Calgar shows up, this is notable. The point is made they're responsible for saving a lot of lives that otherwise would not have been able to escape.

[Man of Iron]

Regarding the Adeptus Mechanicus, after the Pact of Fire & Steel the Stygies VIII tech-priests at Megaborealis and Storvhal began mining the planet’s crust extensively for deposits of the precious substance known as noctilith, or "blackstone". Reference is made to the discoveries of blackstone at Amontep II (ala "Forgebane"). Some details are given describing how the blackstone has been found - almost like huge spears in giant fluidic compasses. An interesting, almost passing comment, refers to a connection with Sangua Terra in the Imperium Sanctus - at the other side of the "gauntlet". Perhaps this will be delved into with the next book in the campaign? If Vigilus falls, Sangua Terra may be the next important point of interest. 

I've obtained the Forgebane box, so I'm leaning towards making my AdMech a part of Stygies VIII - although the lack of a Necron presence on Vigilus makes me hesitate. It would be cool to have both my fledgling armies be involved in the same conflict for a little battle history. Hopefully, the next book will see some more armies land on Vigilus? If not, I may have to consider a space marine faction somewhere along my path.

Another thing I like is how GW has built up this campaign with information from Forgebane, Kill Team, and Tooth & Claw (which I wasn't aware of as my army building doesn't include those other models. The progression story wise is appealing.

[Finkmilkana]

Honestly? With the amount of “infection” going on on the planet (ork, genestealer, chaos, what’s next, necron awaking below the Blackstone because the Admech digged too deep?^^) this is by all logic a loosing battle, both for control of the planet and the civilian lives, It sounds like it would cost the imperium far less resources if they just commit the planet to the emperors mercy through exterminatus. Preferably after a large portion of the BL and possibly Abbadon himself made planetfall...

They can still refortify it later after it was cleansed.

[Closet Skeleton]

It's not like they can have the civilians form a queue and ask them how many arms the Emperor has.

 

Except that they do basically try to do that. The Crimson Fists are shown not as pointlessly grimdark but instead as a group that cares about civilian lives while still ultimately being Space Marines of the Imperium of Mankind.

 

 

I'm actually with Sete on this one. It really seems just like GW was just not paying attention to chapter specific details here.

 

Taking care to call the Iron Hands deployments 'clan companies' but not bothering to be specific about Templar formations may be an oversight but its also an in universe table in a setting where the general low quality of information is an important concern. If you want to be upset you can but its not healthy to spend time looking for ways to be upset.

 

 Some details are given describing how the blackstone has been found - almost like huge spears in giant fluidic compasses. An interesting, almost passing comment, refers to a connection with Sangua Terra in the Imperium Sanctus - at the other side of the "gauntlet". Perhaps this will be delved into with the next book in the campaign? If Vigilus falls, Sangua Terra may be the next important point of interest. 

 

 

It means that the Blackstone on Vigilus is not 'raw' and that the Nachamund Gauntlet is an entirely artificial connection between Vigilus and Sangua Terra which probably has its own 'deposits' that contribute to the stability of the gauntlet. Styges VIII's 'mining' is more like careless vandalism and has potentially already weakened whatever purpose the Blackstone was burried on Vigilus for.

 

It also means that someone forsaw that the Pylons might be vulnerable to destruction and decided to develop other easier to hide mechanisms. Or possibly the other way round and the Pylons could have been cruder rushed versions of the subsurface micro-pylons.

 

 

So if the guys at Vigilus are the Vigilus Crusade at only Fighting Company strength it isn’t indicative of being only those guys though it might be only those guys.

 

Neither Crusades nor their fighting companies have a set size so listing a single company doesn't mean anything other than that the forces there have the simplest available command structure.

[RobWrath]

Is there any more detail about how Calgar has 'become' Primaris?

 

Just pondering how frequently it's going to start happening to oldmarine special characters from this point forwards...

[Robbienw]

Yes, he volunteered to be the first test subject for the procedure after much debate, partly because he felt irrelevant after gullimans arrival and wanted a power up.  He has major surgery and was extensively cut open, died for 20 minutes, and was electric shocked back to life and rose from the operating table in the style of frankensteins monster.

 

Cawl calculated that the procedure has a 61.6% chance of failure, but given time he should be able to perfect it. 

 

Based on that, i'd expect it to be infrequent for now with a few characters being transformed, but possibly to become common in the future.

[NatBrannigan]

In regard to the Crimson Fists, you do need some "good" guys in the Lore to give some contrast to the Darkness. If everyone and everything is dark and hopeless it's all very unimpressive. Oh look, another massacre f innocent civilians.

 

Like the Space Wolves practically going to war with the Inquisition after trying to save the Guard who fought on Armageddon. It makes it more heart breaking later when Grimnar has to sign off on half of Fenris being purged. Still nice and dark which is what the lore is all about, but with a little contrast it all seems that much darker. I can't imagine the size of these rocks that super awesome Space Marines needed to return fire.

 

And speaking of Super Awesome Space Marines, I'd like just once, for other Imperial forces like Guard or Sisters of Battle to be more than something that is just about to be defeated when the space marines swoop in to save the day. Can't we have the Ultramarines being lured into a trap and about to be over run when over the hill come 2000 Leman Russ Battle Tanks? Just once and then I promise I'll go back to dying horribly so the Space Marines can save the day :D

[Mazer Rackham]

In regard to the Crimson Fists, you do need some "good" guys in the Lore to give some contrast to the Darkness. If everyone and everything is dark and hopeless it's all very unimpressive. Oh look, another massacre f innocent civilians.

 

Like the Space Wolves practically going to war with the Inquisition after trying to save the Guard who fought on Armageddon. It makes it more heart breaking later when Grimnar has to sign off on half of Fenris being purged. Still nice and dark which is what the lore is all about, but with a little contrast it all seems that much darker. I can't imagine the size of these rocks that super awesome Space Marines needed to return fire.

 

And speaking of Super Awesome Space Marines, I'd like just once, for other Imperial forces like Guard or Sisters of Battle to be more than something that is just about to be defeated when the space marines swoop in to save the day. Can't we have the Ultramarines being lured into a trap and about to be over run when over the hill come 2000 Leman Russ Battle Tanks? Just once and then I promise I'll go back to dying horribly so the Space Marines can save the day

 

You have this backwards fine Frater, rather think of it thusly: You die gloriously for the Emperor (or die trying if Krieg) not so anyone can steal your glory, but because no-one else can do what the Guard does.  A hard job, a dirty job, but Guardsmen do not care about that, for is not courage to found amongst common men, the knowledge that you are armed only with a laser pointer and girded with cardboard but you are the man that holds the line? Oh the Astartes are fabulous and all that, but who conquers planets?  Who marches in the parades that stretch on for miles, who makes up the backbone and first line of the Imperial Response and Defence?

 

The Guard of course!  Without them to secure what has taken, what ground can be secured?  Without them how can the Imperium be maintained?  Stolen glory?  No!  The Imperium is Glory and GUARD ARE THE IMPERIUM.

 

Now shut up and go and die in a trench so Marneus Calgar can claim that hill over there. 

 

MR.

[Guest Triszin]

Yes, he volunteered to be the first test subject for the procedure after much debate, partly because he felt irrelevant after gullimans arrival and wanted a power up.  He has major surgery and was extensively cut open, died for 20 minutes, and was electric shocked back to life and rose from the operating table in the style of frankensteins monster.

 

Cawl calculated that the procedure has a 61.6% chance of failure, but given time he should be able to perfect it. 

 

Based on that, i'd expect it to be infrequent for now with a few characters being transformed, but possibly to become common in the future.

I thought it was like 61% chance of failure for a marine of his age.

 

but that, younger "old" marines would have higher success rates.

[Panzer]

 

Yes, he volunteered to be the first test subject for the procedure after much debate, partly because he felt irrelevant after gullimans arrival and wanted a power up.  He has major surgery and was extensively cut open, died for 20 minutes, and was electric shocked back to life and rose from the operating table in the style of frankensteins monster.

 

Cawl calculated that the procedure has a 61.6% chance of failure, but given time he should be able to perfect it. 

 

Based on that, i'd expect it to be infrequent for now with a few characters being transformed, but possibly to become common in the future.

I thought it was like 61% chance of failure for a marine of his age.

 

but that, younger "old" marines would have higher success rates.

 

 

Nothing like that. The 61% failure rate got mentioned before Calgar decided to step in and do it himself.

Marines across the galaxy wondered whether an upgrade to Primaris was possible at all, Calgar asked Cawl whether it's possible for such a thing to happen, people fought over it, Cawl said it would be possible but with the current amount of data he possesses it would have a failure rate of 61%, Marines argued even more, Calgar had enough of the debate and decided to do it himself to ease the transition from "centuries of Imperial tradition to a new order".

[Trevak Dal]

The Dark King is Konrad Kurze

They Probably meant the "black king" (abaddon), but hey-maybe Kurze survived his suicide-by-assassin, or is a clone of Fabulous Bill's, or is maybe Decimus leading a whole bunch of the Boo boys to pop out and torture/scare people.

[Robbienw]

 

 

Yes, he volunteered to be the first test subject for the procedure after much debate, partly because he felt irrelevant after gullimans arrival and wanted a power up. He has major surgery and was extensively cut open, died for 20 minutes, and was electric shocked back to life and rose from the operating table in the style of frankensteins monster.

 

Cawl calculated that the procedure has a 61.6% chance of failure, but given time he should be able to perfect it.

 

Based on that, i'd expect it to be infrequent for now with a few characters being transformed, but possibly to become common in the future.

I thought it was like 61% chance of failure for a marine of his age.

 

but that, younger "old" marines would have higher success rates.

No. Cawl worked out from the data he had that there would be a 61.6% chance of failure for any marine undergoing the procedure. Age of a marine being converted didn’t come into it.

 

He may be able to perfect the process in time though, so it becomes less risky.

[Trevak Dal]

Honestly? With the amount of “infection” going on on the planet (ork, genestealer, chaos, what’s next, necron awaking below the Blackstone because the Admech digged too deep?^^) this is by all logic a loosing battle, both for control of the planet and the civilian lives, It sounds like it would cost the imperium far less resources if they just commit the planet to the emperors mercy through exterminatus. Preferably after a large portion of the BL and possibly Abbadon himself made planetfall...

They can still refortify it later after it was cleansed.

Yeah, pull everybody back, hit it with the Life Eater, burn those mutha :cussers, wait until the dust settles and then start fortifying the place properly. Call it Cadia II.

[Marshal Rohr]

I was thinking about that, too. I'm not sure the resource position the Imperials are in, but it would seem to make sense for the Imperials to fortify the system with a Fleet and void fortress network as opposed to committing to defending a world which has proven vulnerable to having big orbiting objects slammed into them.

[Panzer]

Well the chaos fleets arrive after the loyalists started defending the planet against the Orks and the Genestealer it seems. So a retreat might not be particularly practical anymore at this point. They also don't know what Chaos wants with this crucial planet. Could be that they simply want to conquer it ... or they want to destroy it like they did with Cadia and worsen the great rift situation even further in which case it would be impossible to re-conquer it obviously.

[Beams]

Any mention of what the Sisters and the Guard do? For a planet with a heavy population of both, it seems that it's all spacr Marines, all the time.

[Panzer]

Any mention of what the Sisters and the Guard do? For a planet with a heavy population of both, it seems that it's all spacr Marines, all the time.

 

Yeah they're mentioned. These sections are all fluff descriptions of what each of them are doing on Vigilus.

 

[Man of Iron]

Any mention of what the Sisters and the Guard do? For a planet with a heavy population of both, it seems that it's all spacr Marines, all the time.

 

That's how I felt about the established AdMech presence there. Stygies VIII had eight macroclades stationed there and sixteen more macroclades were sent for reinforcement (by Stygies VIII and other forge worlds). I'm still keeping my mechadendrites crossed for Necrons rising. All the AdMech gets are a few Orks and Genestealers to fight? With Iron Hands' assistance no less.

[Sandlemad]

Also speaking as a history nerd I'd like express my enthusiasm for the fact that the Black Legion, my eternal faction of choice, are now practising the Hellenistic policy of doriktetos khora (spear-won land, δορίκτητος χώρα in Attic), makes me incredibly happy

 

That is all

 

This has to be down to ADB's influence, right? With so much of the Black Legion books and associated BL culture drawing from historical fiction, including the likes of The Afghan Campaign, this is surely how this kind of thing finds its way into the general background.