Vigilus Fluff/Lore Summary

[sarabando]

 

Honestly? With the amount of “infection” going on on the planet (ork, genestealer, chaos, what’s next, necron awaking below the Blackstone because the Admech digged too deep?^^) this is by all logic a loosing battle, both for control of the planet and the civilian lives, It sounds like it would cost the imperium far less resources if they just commit the planet to the emperors mercy through exterminatus. Preferably after a large portion of the BL and possibly Abbadon himself made planetfall...

They can still refortify it later after it was cleansed.

Yeah, pull everybody back, hit it with the Life Eater, burn those mutha :cussers, wait until the dust settles and then start fortifying the place properly. Call it Cadia II.

 

Cadia 2: Vigilus boogaloo

[Man of Iron]

Regarding the Adepta Sororitas, the Order of Our Martyred Lady had fought to keep Vigilus unsullied for four thousand years.
AdSororitas has been described as being "urbanized" and "mechanized", fighting almost exclusively in the many hivesprawls. They have a great many midnight-black transports and were well-versed in citizen control. They have been fighting Ork incursions since the shields around many of the hivesprawls have failen.

[Shinespider]

The hyper-focus on Astartes is disappointing, but hardly surprising. They're always going to focus most on the newest models, and the Primaris, Speed Freaks and Genestealers are among the newest things out there. Once the Chaos range drops we'll see more focus on them, and once the Sisters drop they'll come to the forefront.

 

Anyway,

 

Calling Kardan Stronos a chapter master is like calling the President or Prime Minister of your country a King and not understanding that they're different things, just because they're both leadership positions. It's not a trivial mistake. There are fundamental differences in the nature of the position, unlike the Great Wolf, who is literally just the Chapter Master. 

[Canadian_F_H]

Well. The mistake for what it's worth has been made. You can choose how to respond to it.

 

For me personally I find it easier to assume the Adeptus Munitorium cleric responsible for documentating those particular data points was in error perhaps because to him the guidlines for the munitorium was laid out by guilliman 10,000 years ago and the deus-imperator-ex-cell data organization sheets have been row and column locked for 10 millenia. He could only enter under chapter 1-10 companies, and could only put a check in the box next to "chaptermaster" when documenting the deployment and or CO for a given organization.

 

I am OK with this because it suits my "grim dark" view of the massive beurocracy that is the imperium of man.

 

 

*mod note* it's on topic I suppose but the discussion is becoming circular, if it was going anywhere at all to begin with. I'm sure there is plenty else to talk about.

 

We could certainly start another topic in Amucus aedes or elsewhere about errors, typos, fluff contradictions and such across the entire range of sources from GW proper, Forgeworld, the black library and various official websites and sanctioned videogames. I think it would be a terribly fascinating subject as a summary and analysis of the "fog of war" that the 30th thru 41st millennium is permeated with. How we reconcile the errors as in setting confusion and facts eroded by time, distance and unreliable witnesses.

[Sete]

In the end of the day it's a mistake. And I'm not here to excuse their mistakes.

 

You can roleplay this if you want of course, but I'm buying a product, and as a costumer I expect attention to detail ;)

 

Like I'm fond of saying, the devil is on the details.

 

Any more fluff on the Primaris Chapters besides that focus page?

[Panzer]

I mean I completely understand your point, Canadian_F_H. However it also feels like a cheap excuse GW can throw at everything and that it would serve much better from a narrative pov if they'd actually use the correct descriptions for different things.

[Beren]

Honestly, I'm a bit concerned that Blackstone is just going to become the auto-reason for the Ad Mech becoming involved anywhere from now on. I'd rather that there'd be a xenotech convoy heading from one side of the Rift to the other, and Sygies wants to hold Vigilus at least long enough for it to get through.

[Tyriks]

Honestly, I'm a bit concerned that Blackstone is just going to become the auto-reason for the Ad Mech becoming involved anywhere from now on. I'd rather that there'd be a xenotech convoy heading from one side of the Rift to the other, and Sygies wants to hold Vigilus at least long enough for it to get through.

Admech fluff tended towards one-dimensional before. Now I expect "samples of Blackstone" to replace "rumors of STCs" as their only reason for doing anything.

[Tyriks]

Has anyone looked at the missions in Vigilus much? Anything good there?

[Lord Marshal]

The hyper-focus on Astartes is disappointing, but hardly surprising.

I'm still bitter that the Cadians were a secondary focus in Fall of CADIA.

 

I think what irks me with GW lore is that in almost every instance the Guard are taking the roll of the limping defenders getting destroyed on all fronts until the Astartes save them. No, that's the Planetary DEFENCE Force's role. Why the Guard can't get as good of a showing as the Marines when they'd be as much a part of the cavalry is beyond me, unless GW's writers hire from 1d4chan editors.

[Canadian_F_H]

Hidden Content

 

 

The hyper-focus on Astartes is disappointing, but hardly surprising.

I'm still bitter that the Cadians were a secondary focus in Fall of CADIA.

 

I think what irks me with GW lore is that in almost every instance the Guard are taking the roll of the limping defenders getting destroyed on all fronts until the Astartes save them. No, that's the Planetary DEFENCE Force's role. Why the Guard can't get as good of a showing as the Marines when they'd be as much a part of the cavalry is beyond me, unless GW's writers hire from 1d4chan editors.

They used to be a little bit better about it back in the day I suppose.

[Urauloth]

 

The Dark King is Konrad Kurze

They Probably meant the "black king" (abaddon)

 

Abbadon can be the dark king too if he wants. It's not like Kurze is in a position to object.

[Panzer]

Dunno in the Damocles campaign against the T'au the Astra Militarum wasn't just the helpless victim. Overall it wasn't a particularly great campaign and under the line the Imperium lost it even tho they won it but at least the Guard did put the pressure on the T'au as well (noteably Baneblades getting dropped behind the T'au lines and Pask dueling with Longstrike).

[Indefragable]

Good to know that GW continues to only know how to write DA as a meme. Apparently despite the proclaimed rarity of the fallen they're at literally every battle they join, or something.

 

Is it more pathetic that there always just so happens to be Fallen at every allied engagement the Dark Angels are part of, or to depict the DA as always thinking there are Fallen at every engagement?

 

Still it's palatable to use the name the chapter uses.

Or else why bother making the chapters different, if we are to ignore those differences?

 

Lord Gulliman demands you shutup and by shiny new (but ineffective on the battlefield) Primaris models, that's why!

 

You can tell this team does not give a about the lore beyond ultras when they on CF shooting on unharmed civilians, have a meme DA/fallen combo, call IH boss a chapter master, and a crusade a company.

 

The devil is in the details. If they can't get those right they don't deserve my money.

 

See, this is part of the issue with recent fluff in general for me.

 

Crimson Fists = epic saviors of common humanity after a tear-jerking campaign on their homeworld. Imagine the stain on that CF's honor when he was put in a situation where he felt he had no choice but to shoot unarmed civies?

 

...in the right hands, handled appropriately and with the proper care, that sort of full circle narrative could be incredibly compelling (especially if P2 then features that same CF commander jeopardize the Imperial gains by refusing to kill cultists out of an abundance of caution, only to have the cultists blow up the macguffin..and then the finale has the same CF commander going Randy Quaid in Independence Day to make up for all the recent sins/failings and saves the day once and for all)...

 

...but when the rest of the narrative is Dark Angels go chase Fallen, Imperial Fists hold walls, AdMech chase random tech, Guard die barely holding on, Eldar show up to mess with Imperial plans and then disappear, ad nauseum...it makes it quite the eye-rolling moment and the readership err on the side of rightfully lambasting the authors.

 

I suppose the follow-ups could prove us all wrong, of course...

 

So if Abaddon is known as Dark King and Slaanesh is known as Dark Prince, does that make Abaddon Slaaneshs daddy? 

 

They roleplay that sometimes in the Court of Pleasure, just to keep it interesting. #Slaanesh

 

**************

Other random thoughts:

 

-Does this mean Arbites will be a faction now?

 

-I don't expect anything more on the Sisters until their book is out. Just tidbits, but I think we should all expect "yea they were there, but offscreen" treatment for some time

 

-I may buy all the Iron Hands and Grey Knight stuff I can, should they ever actually deign to give them proper attention. Just so that we can have a Sisters of Battle style fandom resuscitation

 

-I hope the Imperial Guard get a major showing in the Campaign in Guilliman's Own Personal Chamber to make up for Fall of Cadia and yet another one like Vigilus where they are forever in the background on their own turf

 

-I prefer BA, GK, DW, SW, Necrons, Tau, etc... and other forces to get their own moment in the sunshine. No need to crowd the stage.

 

-....so long as it's equal treatment..

 

-isn't Vigiuls on the "South" (Terra) side of the rift? It's sort of the Gibraltar compared to the Tangier of Imperium Nihilus?

[Man of Iron]

 

-isn't Vigiuls on the "South" (Terra) side of the rift? It's sort of the Gibraltar compared to the Tangier of Imperium Nihilus?

 

Vigilus is in Imperium Nihilus across the north side of the "gauntlet".

Sangua Terra is on the Terra side of the rift fence.

[Indefragable]

 

 

 

-isn't Vigiuls on the "South" (Terra) side of the rift? It's sort of the Gibraltar compared to the Tangier of Imperium Nihilus?

Vigilus is in Imperium Nihilus across the north side of the "gauntlet".

Sangua Terra is on the Terra side of the rift fence.

Ok, yea, then there better be a good reason why it’s UM taking the lead in this thing.

[Panzer]

Because it's Guillimans narrative and by extension Ultramarines for now. No deep meaning behind it. GW is rather simple minded when it comes to such things.

 

They also already said that Dantes title as regent of Imperium Nihilus has no further meaning. It's just a title. So we should better stop expecting the Blood Angels to have some special position there. As stupid a that is.

[Man of Iron]

-isn't Vigiuls on the "South" (Terra) side of the rift? It's sort of the Gibraltar compared to the Tangier of Imperium Nihilus?

Vigilus is in Imperium Nihilus across the north side of the "gauntlet".

Sangua Terra is on the Terra side of the rift fence.

Ok, yea, then there better be a good reason why it’s UM taking the lead in this thing.

[Arkangilos]

 

I've never been phased by Logan Grimnar being called a Chapter Master instead of Great Wolf or High-King or what not. People getting triggered over it with the Ironhands is super pendantic.

Except that Logan Grimnar fulfills the office of Chapter Master, Great Wolf is just his title.

The Iron Hands do not have the office of Chapter Master. An Iron Father is elected to lead a campaign, and hold dictator-style power over the chapter—yes, including command of the Exterminatus weapons—but he is not, in fact, a Chapter Master. He returns power to the Iron Council on conclusion of the campaign, and though he might be given that power again, it is because the Iron Council saw fit to grant it to him.

 

Space Wolves have a Chapter Master in all but name. Iron Hands have a Warleader who is not a Chapter Master and should not be named as such. The office of Warleader is not always filled, and the clan companies will often operate independently of one another unless at the direction of the Iron Council or their appointed Warleader.

 

Edit: abhor the typo.

So what you are saying is that, for that campaign he was elected to lead the chapter as a single leader, he is, in fact, a chapter master?

 

If one guy is given control over the entire chapter, whether for 1 day or for life, he is acting as chapter master during that duration.

[Man of Iron]

Maybe, just maybe, GW is using the consistent term of "Chapter Master" for its own sake? 

 

If someone isn't aware of the differences between the integral hierarchies of different chapters, why make it more complex than it has to be?
For someone who doesn't know the nuances or the lore or all of the books concerning a chapter, why bog it down? Wait this is a "chapter master" and this is a "great wolf" and this one is an "iron father"? And let us not forget the "supreme grand master"? Okay, they're different names for someone leading their chapter. Does everyone need to know the minutiae? Probably not. SM either follow the C:SM, so structure is almost interchangeable, or they have their own codex.

 

It seems to me there is more concern over who is called what and why rather than delving into the Vigilus fluff as the OP intended. 

[Morovir]

But then they would have used the term 'company' rather than 'clan company' if that were their intent.

[Beams]

Do they go into any detail about where Temperance Blaise was fighting? I have read most of it, but only found real mention of her and her troops on the two forces of the Adepta Sororitas page, and would like to know more about her.

[RandyB]

Do they go into any detail about where Temperance Blaise was fighting? I have read most of it, but only found real mention of her and her troops on the two forces of the Adepta Sororitas page, and would like to know more about her.

Learn something new every day... Modesty Blaise has a "descendant" in the Grimdark Future...

[Man of Iron]

Do they go into any detail about where Temperance Blaise was fighting? I have read most of it, but only found real mention of her and her troops on the two forces of the Adepta Sororitas page, and would like to know more about her.

I've only found reference to her on:

pg. 50 - Hyperia Hivesprawl: The Trinity Hives

pg. 73 - Forces of the Imperium

 

Her battling in the Saint's Haven city-state is the only location given. 

[Man of Iron]

The Stygies VIII Adeptus Mechanicus get three named Magos to play with, although there aren't dtatasheets for them.
The first is Magos Dominus Ipluvius XIV, commanding the Skitarii forces until he is relieved by the second, Archmagos Nesium Caldrike.
The third is Magos Dalathrust, leading Kill Team Gamma-Zhul 881.