The Siege of Terra: Solar War

[Marshal Rohr]

Heaven't read it yet but:

Killing Jubal is really lame. Any idea why French decided to kill him?

The legions that come out of the Heresy were minuscule compared to the ones that went in. We are talking legions of a hundred thousand with two to three thousand survivors. It makes sense that whole generations of characters and legionaries were killed.

[rendingon1+]

Sorry, but killing one of Scar's two remaining astartes main characters, especially Jubal (who's just became Xa's replacement and was one of the greatest warriors in the Legion) is still lame.

Edited April 24, 2019 by rendingon1+

[Marshal Rohr]

I'm just saying, personal tastes aside, 95-97% of characters and npcs dying is just how it is going to go. 

[RikuEru]

I'm just saying, personal tastes aside, 95-97% of characters and npcs dying is just how it is going to go.

If only. Too bad so many Traitor Characters live on into 40k and so many Loyal Characters start of Chapters or survive for other reasons.

[Marshal Rohr]

I'm totally fine with Khârn, Typhus, Ahriman, and Lucius making appearances and surviving, but I'd agree the volume of people who make it and go on to matter afterwards is too high. That is probably more a function of the authors than what the reality of the situations would be. No one wants to write a book where their well loved Heresy commander gets the axe (except ADB, who hates prequels). 

[rendingon1+]

I'm not against killing named characters. On the contrary, if anything Siege is a time and place to cut some threads as an (at the very least) emphasis how terrible it was. But we have a problem with authors who:

a) Imported their 40k traitors into heresy. McNeill for example: NONE of named Iron Warriors will die, Forrix, Falk, Kroeger and Soltarn Vull Bronn will die in 40k.

 b ) Exported horus heresy characters from the series and put them in 40k before the Siege showdown. Example: French with his Ahriman series with Amon and Hathor Maat still alive in 40k.

Now it backfires.

 

 

Generaly I have a feeling that evaluations of Loyalist characters have taken place and decision have been made that unless X character is present post siege as a chapter master or else, he dies.

 

Jubal was mayby not some pemiere WS character present in every WS story we got, but as I said before, being one of the top Legion fighters/commanders and replacing Xa as a "first captain" (which was very important)  should guarantee him some screentime in the Siege series.

[Marshal Rohr]

It also connects to that issue ADB raised about prequels naturally falling into fan service. I think he used Anakin Skywalker building 3P0 as an example. It doesn't all need to connect. Right now 40k is essentially just like 'three hours later' of the Heresy. 

[rendingon1+]

I no longer know what's prequel and sequel in BL...

[Morovir]

Well, I can reassure you that Hathor Maat

 

doesn't even make it to the Siege of Terra, let alone beyond it into the present day.

[rendingon1+]

Well, I can reassure you that Hathor Maat

 

doesn't even make it to the Siege of Terra, let alone beyond it into the present day.

Hm...Crimson King?

[Morovir]

Yes.

[Fedor]

The White Scars will probably get their moment triumphing over big name opponents with Khan vs Daemon Fulgrim who has now become an outright disposable enemy without needing to repeat the classic " and then the marines delayed the victor by getting slaughtered long enough for X to escape " sort of scene.

 

Shiban might get a notable scalp or two, but i can't think of any big already established characters off-hand, at least from EC or DG.

Edited April 24, 2019 by Fedor

[rendingon1+]

He can kill pretty much every EC/DG character - either Fabius or Nurgle resurrects him back lol.

[1ncarnadine]

 b ) Exported horus heresy characters from the series and put them in 40k before the Siege showdown. Example: French with his Ahriman series with Amon and Hathor Maat still alive in 40k.

Now it backfires.

 

On top of Hathor Maat biting it in The Crimson King, Amon was killed in the very first Ahriman book...  neither made it to M32  

Edited April 24, 2019 by LetsYouDown

[rendingon1+]

Damn...

I read it too long ago it seems. I take it back. But surely there are some OTHER examples

[Nazguire]

I think there is an issue where too many characters which are in the HH series make it past the HH.  So you cannot kill them off. The other characters which are HH only (e.g. Loken) become fan favourites and don't die (or they do and are resurrected).

 

Killing off Loken, Aximand, etc. would go down a treat but the authors seem to play it very safe in respect of this.

[b1soul]

No issue with named characters biting the dust during the Heresy/Siege.

 

Jubal Khan is just an odd choice. He was promoted to replace Xa and went from being the Lord of Summer Lightning to being the first Master of the Hunt. Then he gets chopped before the Siege proper even begins. That's an odd way to wrap up his character arc.

[Marshal Rohr]

No issue with named characters biting the dust during the Heresy/Siege.

 

Jubal Khan is just an odd choice. He was promoted to replace Xa and went from being the Lord of Summer Lightning to being the first Master of the Hunt. Then he gets chopped before the Siege proper even begins. That's an odd way to wrap up his character arc.

It probably means Chris didn’t have plans for him during his own book.

[1ncarnadine]

He was introduced by John French in a Sigismund story, I think?

[bluntblade]

Yes, that's the case

[MegaVolt87]

I just want enough loyalist characters to stick around to fill out most of the first chaptermasters of the first founding chapters. Make some money off more FW character series haha. 

[MarineRaider]

I am on my second reading. I have a question...

 

So at the strategy meeting with Dorn, the Angel, Malcador, Valdor and the Admiral where they are making Dorn feel good about the strategy he formulated the past decade they keep saying in this book and others the strategy is to delay, delay and more delay for the Ultramarines to save the day. My question is simple.....just how big is RG legion currently and how many ships? I have read he started with about 250k before Calth and he favored numerous smaller ships to better police the 500 worlds. But now that Horus has shown he has 8k ships plus just how worried can he be about the Ultramarines or even they with the Dark Angels. This strategy seems very odd.

[SkimaskMohawk]

Basically guilliman mass recruited from his 500 world's to give him back a good chunk of numbers during the years of IS, while also gathering a bunch of the shattered legions and army/naval assets via the pharos. He also scoops up literally everything nearby during his offensive push to allow sang through.

 

So sure horus may have more ships, but he can't afford to let guilliman get him from behind; resources are stretched thin and his forces are fraying in terms of commitment. He has to end it before his forces unravel and guilliman either hits them mid siege (if they commit) or before he takes back swathes and they lose even more resources and fray more.

[MarineRaider]

Basically guilliman mass recruited from his 500 world's to give him back a good chunk of numbers during the years of IS, while also gathering a bunch of the shattered legions and army/naval assets via the pharos. He also scoops up literally everything nearby during his offensive push to allow sang through.

 

So sure horus may have more ships, but he can't afford to let guilliman get him from behind; resources are stretched thin and his forces are fraying in terms of commitment. He has to end it before his forces unravel and guilliman either hits them mid siege (if they commit) or before he takes back swathes and they lose even more resources and fray more.

 

Of all the Primarchs I expect RG to be the one to best marshall all the forces he can so I can buy that. I wish in the recent Ultramarines novella they would have provided some insight to RG doing a mass recruitment and ship build-up.

[Lord_Caerolion]

 

Basically guilliman mass recruited from his 500 world's to give him back a good chunk of numbers during the years of IS, while also gathering a bunch of the shattered legions and army/naval assets via the pharos. He also scoops up literally everything nearby during his offensive push to allow sang through.

 

So sure horus may have more ships, but he can't afford to let guilliman get him from behind; resources are stretched thin and his forces are fraying in terms of commitment. He has to end it before his forces unravel and guilliman either hits them mid siege (if they commit) or before he takes back swathes and they lose even more resources and fray more.

 

Of all the Primarchs I expect RG to be the one to best marshall all the forces he can so I can buy that. I wish in the recent Ultramarines novella they would have provided some insight to RG doing a mass recruitment and ship build-up.

 

 

I believe that it's mentioned in Slaves to Darkness that the Ultramarines fleet, when it appears, is comprised of a whole bunch of different classes and categories of ships, rather than all being standard Astartes vessels.