Blood Angels Unit of the Week series Unit of the Week: Scout Squad

[Khorneeq]

I'm modelling my sergeant to have a grav pistol and hope for some lucky tank harassing. Theory sounds well, practice will verify that. I'll post an update after a game

[Demoulius]

I used to run scout snipers as objective baby sitters way back in 4th and 5th. Back then they also wounded monstrous creatures on 4's though and rending could make them quite nasty. Currently I dont feel sniper scouts are worth it though, other units outshine them in that regard. Intercessors  when parked in cover have a 2+ AS as well and with bolter dicipline they can dish out some nice firepower at 30 inches.  Having 2 wounds and attacks a piece also means they outshine scouts in survivabilty and punch in combat as well. And when you are done outfitting the scouts with cloaks, missle launcher and snipers a full squad is actually more expensive then the Intercessors are

 

So uh....yeah. For sitting on a home objective I dont see them beeing that valuable anymore. Now, if you were to infilitrate them ontop of an objective thats in the middle of the field, thats another story. I feel bolters or bolt pistol and ccw is the way to go for them now. You can still add the cloaks to make them annoying to deal with but I feel as a firebase other units do it better.

 

Maybe they could be used to run up a flank and be a nuisance I guess? Aside from the 4+ AS they are still marines in stats. Could tie down units that your opponent would rather have shooting at our elite units

[Leonaides]

Scout snipers have been in my list for 1 reason - characters. Keeps them honest, can reach out and tap the annoying support character in the back lines or threaten one who is wounded and trying to get to safety behind a screen. Nearly took out unwounded azrael once too.

[Klod]

I have a squad of 5 sniper scouts. I bought them originally for Kill Team, but I also use them in 40k. Usually they do nothing. Until they decide to roll ridiculously hot and oneshot a Cryptek. That was so funny.

[Majkhel]

Adding an idea from Stephen Box's list that made a big smile on my face - CCW scouts Sarge can exchange his pistol for a CS for an extra attack, bringing him to 4A base

Post Blood of Baal our rank-and-file CCW scouts now rock 3A on the charge each and Sergeant with combat blade+chainsword has 5. Add another 1A for a charge with Savage Echoes if they live that long. 

Edited March 2, 2020 by Majkhel

[Karhedron]

That's nasty. I like it!

[Jolemai]

With the plastic Scouts, do the weapons come moulded to the arms?

[Karhedron]

With the plastic Scouts, do the weapons come moulded to the arms?

Yes, they do.

 

[Majkhel]

Yeah, there is also no option on the sprue to give a CCW to a scout's right hand. That is probably why barely anyone uses the double CCW option, even though it's listed in the Codex. All right hands are holding either a boltgun, a bolt pistol, a shotgun or a heavy weapon. 

[Xenith]

With the plastic Scouts, do the weapons come moulded to the arms?

 

It's a very small matter in plastic to cut off a BP and replace with a combat blade. 

 

Alternatively the scout bike squad comes with a right handed combat blade that you can pair with the left handed chainsword on the scout sprue. 

[Shaezus]

Scouts in 8th Ed ITC have always taken up all my troop slots. All cc squads barring one with bolsters and heavy bolter. two squad sergeants with power swords and hand flamers, another with pistol and hand flamer. Those power swords pack a nasty surprise and I have the flexibility to decide which squads deploy aggressively and which hang back on objectives, depending on the type of enemy troops.

 

I've only just started using a rhino again. Still in trial phase I suppose but it fits in with supporting a turn two assault whilst protecting the scouts from fire on turn 1.

 

CC scouts add way more than their points to my army. More so now with shock assault and savage echoes.

[Xenith]

So i have a unit of scouts with shotguns. I only have 8 of the old metal shotguns, leaving room for a sergeant and heavy weapon, though I'm thinking that actually no heavies work well with shotguns. Is it best to keep the unit purely shotguns? Their role will be midfield harassment. I could always field as 2x5 and have a second serge. 

 

Good loadouts there? I'm loathe to have a powerfist in a 5 man unit, but a sword or axe might work. Thunder hammer+shotgun in a 10 strong scout squad?

Edited May 13, 2020 by Xenith

[keeblerartillery]

Honestly man, I’d avoid all of that. CCW and pistol or bolters. Keep it simple and cheap. Spend points on toys for more survivable units like intercessors

[Xenith]

Honestly man, I’d avoid all of that. CCW and pistol or bolters. Keep it simple and cheap. Spend points on toys for more survivable units like intercessors

 

Noted! Though shotgun and chainsword is free, and scouts get as many attacks as intercessors, so are better in combat point for point? Agree, they die very easily. 

[keeblerartillery]

Truth they get as many attacks but do you want that power fist on a 1W, 4+ save mode or a 2W, 3+ save? I don’t think scouts will be punching anything that requires a fist to kill - especially T3+. Whereas your intercessors might still be alive. I think scouts are great - I just don’t know that pouring points into them is wise.

[Jolemai]

Would appreciate if don't go down the "use something else" route on a thread which is about how to use Scouts...

[Covenant]

If you don't live in the most competitive scene and are more a fun-gamer with 4 games/year, Scouts with fists are great. Zone the opponent out, let them live in fear of that 20 Points Veteran that has tasty 4 Attacks in round 3+. TBH shotguns worked better in 5th then 8th. But you know: rule of cool... ;)

[Djangomatic82]

i have a question for those that may have fielded 10 scouts/tac marines lately (I don't have enough of either to try out in game). Would running 10 scouts be comparable to running 5 intercessors, survivability wise? they have the same 10 wounds, though a 4+ instead of 3+, but CCW equipped would be rocking 31 attacks versus intercessor 16. 110points versus 85 base seems tempting to me, i just have no experience really regarding 1 wound models. Is that per model wound difference a factor at all, or does it being a 10 wound unit be all that matters in comparing them?

[keeblerartillery]

So I’ve gotten to play a fair bit recently and I think the difference isn’t in total wounds but wounds per model. I run 3x5 scouts and 2-3 squads of incursors/intercessors. When you get a bunch of 1D dakka from say a thunderfire cannon, that 1W v 2 W is big. Now - having 10 bodies v 5 may change the calculus of what shoots at you, but I think keeping scouts small and aggressive is a better use of points to enable us to capitalize on our elite heavy army. Edited May 13, 2020 by keeblerartillery

[The Unseen]

5 2w models are worse than 10 1 wound models if all else is equal.

1 damage weapons are the same, anything with a damage of 2 or better is doing twice as good vs primaris than regular scouts

 

Plus, 10 scouts put out more damage than 5 intercessors.

But its complicated by the fact that Primaris units have a 3+ rather than a 4+.

And if you have a fnp equivalent, it gets weird, because a 2w model can end up absorbing an extra hit bringing the difference closer together.

Plus, intercessors aren't double the cost of scouts, so they're more points efficient per wound if you are getting hit with D1 weapons, as a scout wound is 11 pts and an intercessor wound is roughly 8.5 pts

[Panzer]

The main problem is that 10 Scouts are also more expensive. If you want to invest more points than necessary you'd rather use it for some Elites, Heavy Support or Fast Attack instead. Scouts are good because they are cheap so they can fill Battalions easily and because they aren't completely useless thanks to their Infiltration ability and decent amount of attacks, not because they can compete with Intercessors or whatever.

[Djangomatic82]

interesting feed back from everyone. my question was primarily prompted by my feeling that 5 scouts get shot off a bit too easily for my taste. I get Panzers view point on scouts being the "cheap" option, but i guess I'm not really sold on cheap being a big enough selling point for only 5 wounds. I'm seriously considering a few reiver kits to bash up as scouts and the prospect of 31 CC attacks at 110 points is still pretty alluring, especially considering Unseen's input.

[Xenith]

So, going back to the question of "what is the best loadout for shotgun scouts?".

 

Assume I'm taking the unit and want to have it the best it can be, and not swapping it for something else.

 

My inclination now is to keep it cheaper and go shotgun+power axe on the serge. 

[Panzer]

Considering you are taking Shotguns in the first place you probably want to use them for close ranged shooting purposes which means they are likely to die next turn anyway since they won't be able to hide behind terrain, out of range, etc.

So I'd either give the Sergeant a cheap melee weapon like an Axe or a Combi-Flamer which synergizes nicely with the 6" sweet spot of the shotguns and isn't too expensive either. Perhaps a Combi-melta if you want to be cheeky and spend a little more on them. That one would be more of a "for teh lulz" choice though I'd say. :sweat:

[Xenith]

That one would be more of a "for teh lulz" choice though I'd say.

 

That's the reason I play 

 

I hadnt even thought about combis - though they're index/legends only, right?