BSB Speculation

[Mekhitar]

Maybe the “model you don’t want to miss” for next week is the exorcist - they haven’t shown us anything on it yet and it is perhaps the most iconic sisters unit (After celery). If we are lucky, we might even get a preview of the rules changes they have indicated in the past.

 

I wonder if the rhino was made a different pattern from the immo just to prevent interchangeable kits?

[Ficinus]

The rhino reveal may very well compel me to buy two of the old Immo kits to use as rhinos before the release.  Not that I really need any more.

[Closet Skeleton]

Does anyone have any insight o why they might release this Rhino if they plan to have a Demios pattern base for the other tanks? Whats the point of not releasing the Demios as the standard Sister's Rhino? I can't really think of one.

 

 

Depends when the other tanks get released and how many waves the Sisters are coming in (I doubt its one but with any luck they'll be close enough together to not matter too much)

[Slasher956]

Well they may have decided to use the brazier style exhausts on the salamanders vehicles instead (if you look at the leaks of the new salamander character he has the brazier from the sneak peeks on his back pack)

[dracpanzer]

The Deimos stuff and the braziers are going to be on the Exorcist and Immolator kits.

[Slasher956]

Spitballing / wishlisting here....immolator / repressor kit - the immolator losing the dedicated transport tag to help keep the vehicles different

 

& an exorcist/ new AA variant kit

 

Is this something that’s possible?

[dracpanzer]

The Immolator would have to get a massive bump up to become something that isn't a Dedicated Transport. Not impossible, but.

 

I suspect that we'll be able to just buy the Immolator kit and field rhinos or immolators from the same box. More bling = better.

[jakerichmond]

I suspect that we'll be able to just buy the Immolator kit and field rhinos or immolators from the same box. More bling = better.

We've always been able to do that. You can do that with any rhino based tank, since they're all just Rhinos with an extra sprue.

 

I'd really like to see the Immolator come with an alternate build. Repressor seems obvious, but really anything would be nice.

[ThePenitentOne]

I suspect what drac was implying is that there won't be an actual sisters rhino box; people who want to field sisters rhinos will be buying immolators or exorcists and choosing not to attach the extra bits that make them immos and exos. That's how it is right now, and gw will probably stick to that pattern in the new release. This will allow us to add spare immo turrets to baneblade sponsons and exorcist launchers to other kits, which will make up for the fact that we're paying immo price to field a rhino.

 

As for making the Immo into a non transport, I'm not sure we're getting a repressor. I want one- actually I think it's the best chance GW has to guarantee broad based player satisfaction with the new release. There haven't even been teasers or ambiguous statements. They could be holding it back as a surprise, but I'm not counting on it. 

 

I've never fielded a repressor, so to me the immo is inextricably linked to dominions. I imagine the argument goes that firing ports maximize the impact of the dom special weapons, but I'm not sure that makes up for the loss of the Immo turret. This is especially true unless GW clarifies their position on using AoF, the auras of accompanying characters, and strategems to augment shooting from inside the vehicle. Losing the immo turret plus any shooting buffs for the doms inside?

 

I'm going immo every time. So I'd prefer it keep transport capacity.

[Montford]

After reading the Iron Hands mini-dex I have a wish for a master crafted Immolator

 

*edit* I note how they copy-catted the Order traits of the Sacred Rose ;)

[Slasher956]

Just a note - I never said for the immolator to lose the ability to transport people but to change slot from dedicated transport to another slot....

[dracpanzer]

 

I suspect that we'll be able to just buy the Immolator kit and field rhinos or immolators from the same box. More bling = better.

We've always been able to do that. You can do that with any rhino based tank, since they're all just Rhinos with an extra sprue.

 

I'd really like to see the Immolator come with an alternate build. Repressor seems obvious, but really anything would be nice.

 

I know, hence Deimos pattern rhino's for Sisters players. The Immolator already comes with three different load outs, I don't suspect that will change. Repressor would be nice, but as long as the FW Index doesn't get torn to shreds or they put it into the legends book, it should be okay for conversions.

[ATPete]

 I was just looking back at the BSB and the "second painted rhino" looks suspiciously like it's just the same rhino with different accessories attached 

 

All I'm wondering is how they attached the things to the sides and front so snugly.

[Slasher956]

I was just looking back at the BSB and the "second painted rhino" looks suspiciously like it's just the same rhino with different accessories attached :lol:

 

All I'm wondering is how they attached the things to the sides and front so snugly.

Even down to the rhino having the same name.....

 

As to fitting snugly - greenstuff and sanding!

[ThePenitentOne]

Just a note - I never said for the immolator to lose the ability to transport people but to change slot from dedicated transport to another slot....

 

 

Ahhh. Gotcha. My bad.

[ATPete]

 

I was just looking back at the BSB and the "second painted rhino" looks suspiciously like it's just the same rhino with different accessories attached 

 

All I'm wondering is how they attached the things to the sides and front so snugly.

Even down to the rhino having the same name.....

 

As to fitting snugly - greenstuff and sanding!

 

 

 It was the weathering and highlights wot tipped me off

[ERJAK]

Just a note - I never said for the immolator to lose the ability to transport people but to change slot from dedicated transport to another slot....

Just remove it from the codex at that point. A transport that relies on target saturation to accomplish anything being limited by the rule of 3 would be sad days.

[Slasher956]

Ro3 is a tournament rule that doesn’t have to be implemented in games...

 

Plus you can make the slot for squadrons (thin Leeman Russ or armigers) instead of single models

 

Edit - or they could just give it a rule that overrules the Ro3.... i mean it’s not like drop pods don’t have a rule that only works in match play.....

[taikishi]

Ro3 or not, moving the Immolator from Dedicated Transport to a slotted unit when it serves the same function as a Razorback makes no sense, Repressor or no. Immolators would have to be more akin to Predators or Land Raiders in order to warrant such a change.

 

In fact, the Immolator is just a modified Razorback that replaces Chapter Tactics for a 6++.

[Legionnaire of the VIIth]

I would rather not see units cut just because of tournaments. That is just laziness on the part of GW when they could try and actually figure out a way for it to work or you know, allow those who don't play tournament to still have their toys without having to create house rules for things and get another party to agree upon those rules.

[ERJAK]

Ro3 is a tournament rule that doesn’t have to be implemented in games...

 

Plus you can make the slot for squadrons (thin Leeman Russ or armigers) instead of single models

 

Edit - or they could just give it a rule that overrules the Ro3.... i mean it’s not like drop pods don’t have a rule that only works in match play.....

Ro3 is a rule that is implemented in 75%+ of games.

 

There is a rule like that, it's called 'dedicated transport'.

 

There's no version of this where the immo isn't made worse switching to another slot...unless it becomes a troop choice.

[ThePenitentOne]

In one version- witch hunters, I think- you could take it as a heavy or a dedicated transport.

 

As for the Immo being like other tanks, I'm not sure what the razorback's flame option is,  but 2d6 auto hits to 12"; S5 -1AP. Not super amazing, but I think I remember reading somewhere that it was superior to other Imperial flame options. Either way, an important part of what makes the immo fabulous is it's synergy when transporting doms. The scout move really impacts the first turn threat range, so the flamer has an easier time seeing use early in the game. If you are playing against someone who insists on Ro3, you're only going to get that synergy on 3 immos, whether they're transports or not. Having said that, I still believe they should continue to be transports.

 

And speaking of Ro3: I think there's really a lot going on when you try to pin that down into a percent. The scope of the statement is huge, and without further clarification, even if the 75% claim could be sourced, it is meaningless.

 

Was it derived from GW's big ole huge electronic survey that they did a few years back? Because if so, you can safely say 75% of respondents use Ro3. But that's not really the same thing as 75% of games, right? (Sorry for being a pedantic jerk)

 

Now I happen to agree that based on personal experience, most probably do follow it, but even that is more complicated than it sounds. I'd argue that for many players, the idea of purchasing more than three of the same unit is something they'd never consider. I can't say how many fall into this category; competitive tourney types, or even those who play primarily in stores are somewhat more compelled to chase the meta, but just as often us narrative campaign crazies come up weird scenarios that might necessitate special builds (a mountain convent accessible only by seraphim, etc).

 

But many of the people who seem to be obeying the rule of 3 may never have found themselves in a position to take a stand one way or the other.

[ERJAK]

In one version- witch hunters, I think- you could take it as a heavy or a dedicated transport.

 

As for the Immo being like other tanks, I'm not sure what the razorback's flame option is, but 2d6 auto hits to 12"; S5 -1AP. Not super amazing, but I think I remember reading somewhere that it was superior to other Imperial flame options. Either way, an important part of what makes the immo fabulous is it's synergy when transporting doms. The scout move really impacts the first turn threat range, so the flamer has an easier time seeing use early in the game. If you are playing against someone who insists on Ro3, you're only going to get that synergy on 3 immos, whether they're transports or not. Having said that, I still believe they should continue to be transports.

 

And speaking of Ro3: I think there's really a lot going on when you try to pin that down into a percent. The scope of the statement is huge, and without further clarification, even if the 75% claim could be sourced, it is meaningless.

 

Was it derived from GW's big ole huge electronic survey that they did a few years back? Because if so, you can safely say 75% of respondents use Ro3. But that's not really the same thing as 75% of games, right? (Sorry for being a pedantic jerk)

 

Now I happen to agree that based on personal experience, most probably do follow it, but even that is more complicated than it sounds. I'd argue that for many players, the idea of purchasing more than three of the same unit is something they'd never consider. I can't say how many fall into this category; competitive tourney types, or even those who play primarily in stores are somewhat more compelled to chase the meta, but just as often us narrative campaign crazies come up weird scenarios that might necessitate special builds (a mountain convent accessible only by seraphim, etc).

 

But many of the people who seem to be obeying the rule of 3 may never have found themselves in a position to take a stand one way or the other.

The greater point is that the vast majority of games are using rule of 3. This based on it being both tournament and pick-up game standard as well as appealing to casual and fluff players as a way to limit list building they'd see as abusive. The actual % is irrelevant.

 

The rest is possible but outlandishly speculative.

 

Even beyond that though, it doesn't change the overarching point that DT is the second best slot the immo could be in behind troop.

 

Now if you wanted TROOP immos I'd be all for that.

[Slasher956]

So we are 'due' a BSB today....

 

what do we think it'll be?  an brakedown of whats in our new army book?  a sneek preview of the codex?  an ETA on the box?  or admission that the general release of the army wont be until the new year?

[A.T.]

So we are 'due' a BSB today....

what do we think it'll be?

 

Immolator and/or exorcist.