BLACK BLŒ FLY Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Personally I’m not an advocate but I’m seeing this thrown out a lot more often. What’s your opinion on this matter ? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
mertbl Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Really with the keyword system you could do it. No need to keep wulfen out of the marine codex when they already have "Space Wolves" keyword on their data sheet. It would be a massive tome, worthy of only the strongest astartes. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5355968 Share on other sites More sharing options...
redmapa Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 With Primaris making every chapter look and play more similar I think it should be done, Horus Heresy proved you can have 18 armies with different play styles all sharing one army list so if GW cant pull it off with 9 then it just shows their own incompetence. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5355969 Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolvar Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 We BTs got thrown into the vanilla codex and well, I still think we should have our own codex. The issue with being in the same book is that you get eclipsed by ultramarines, specially regarding lore entries. Paint galleries are also an issue, with almost every unit painted in blue. It's true that if every SM chapter get rolled into the same book it would be easier to have all core stuff (regarding units) working equal for every chapter. Same base rules, same base equipment, point costs, etc... That would leave a window to expand chapter specific rules/traits/wargear... In theory. The reality is that you get far less rules, wargear, stratagems and less chance to get unique units, because let's face it, vanilla codex is ultramarines codex. So no, with their current line of work, every chapter that shares the same book that ultramarines gets almost squatted by comparison Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5355978 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Reinhard Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 I would be for it if it meant that all chapters still got their fair share of the limelight and focus. Practice has taught me it doesn't. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5355994 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ciler Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Personally I’m not an advocate but I’m seeing this thrown out a lot more often. What’s your opinion on this matter ? As usual in these cases, the main issue is going to be the execution. In theory, the idea is sound : from a rules standpoint it makes sense to regroup all marine codexes are they are mostly the same units/weapons/rules. In practice, this is very likely to create some problems : As bolvar pointed, fringe chapters are likely to get diluted. In their own (v4) codex, Templars had half a dozen pages of unique lore, and as many colour pages. Rolled into the main marine dex they went to 2 pages of lore and 2 colour pages. Try and imagine the Space Wolves lore fitted in two pages... An ancillary issue is lore degradation, because the editors have less space to fit the lore, they are then likely to reduce its scope, making everyone's favourite snowflake less unique in some respect or another. Finally, and likely the biggest problem, cost. Such a codex would likely be huge, and therefore expensive. Marine players already have to contend with one of the most expensive armies (in terms of €/point) unless you can get a battleforce or something, so I'm not sure slapping a huge book on top, 30% of which is irrelevant, is going to be a popular move. In short, it can be done, but it's likely that what would make the move interesting for GW (financially) would be poorly received by the customers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5355998 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARK0SIAN Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 It’s not really something I can see the point of. I don’t get what benefit Space Wolves/Blood Angels/ Dark Angels would get out of it and I don’t see what benefit the other codex chapters would get either. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356006 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 There should be two books. One is ‘Codex Space Marines’ which includes a comprehensive army list of every single unit choice. The second is a running series of ‘Index Astartes’ books. These books contain chapter traits and special rules. The first Index Astartes should cover the 9 First Founding, the Black Templars, the Crimson Fists, the Flesh Tearers, and three more for fifteen total. The next Index should be the Badab War chapters, and any following Indexes should cover a specific group of chapters engaged in a certain historical or new narrative campaigns. This series should run beyond the life of each edition. For 8th Edition 2.0 they need to bring back the army list format, and include keywords the way they used to include special rules to encourage maximum conversion and counts as potential. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356027 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wassa Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 It would be huge with all the lore, datasheets, relics, stratagems, and warlord traits for each one. I remember in 3rd there was one generic codex and you had to buy the supplement chapter codex anyway. I’d rather just have one specific for my chapter. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356030 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sete Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Yes and no. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356087 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbienw Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 I'm going to go with no, based on the fact the likes of DA, BA, Deathwatch et al would have a vastly reduced amount of in codex fluff. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356105 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slave to Darkness Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 No, people already complain about rules bloat and having to carry extra books, faq's etc etc... One massive book full of blue gloryboys and a few pages for the lesser (greater IMHO) chapters with a huge price tag? Nah. Whilst having all the rules in one place would be a good idea in theory, what about those who only play one chapter and have no interest in any other? It would kinda be forcing their hand into wasting money that would be better off spent on more important things, food, rent, Black Tempars upgrade sprues... Scrap the Ultras and give us codex Templars, would be a better read with far superior warriors flexing between the pages. *breathes heaavily* SETE HAND ME MY BROADSWORD!!!!!!!!!! ++EDIT++ Could fold all PRIMARIS into one dex, no difference between a Blood Angel or a Ultramarine considering all chapters only have a handful of identical units, just have a page or two of rules per chapter like the Chaos 3.5 dex. But for real Space Marines sticking all the current content onto one book would be a bad idea... Either way no matter what GW go there will be a vocal minority making the biggest noise saying it was the wrong choice. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356107 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sete Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 I'm going to go with no, based on the fact the likes of DA, BA, Deathwatch et al would have a vastly reduced amount of in codex fluff.This wasn't an issue for anyone when BT got rolled. (Except for BT players)So it should not be an issue now. ;) Just cut Ultras stuff by 75%. :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356118 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jukkiz Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 I'm going to go with no, based on the fact the likes of DA, BA, Deathwatch et al would have a vastly reduced amount of in codex fluff.This wasn't an issue for anyone when BT got rolled. (Except for BT players)So it should not be an issue now. Just cut Ultras stuff by 75%. NAh, just make everything primaris and up point values about 23% and it´s all good, Different colours sell more same kits~~ As in, sarcasm and no thanks. Certain chapters need their OWN codex. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356131 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbienw Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Yeah but BT aren't as widely poplar as the other non codex marines :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356133 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slave to Darkness Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Yeah but BT aren't as widely poplar as the other non codex marines Well I blame Twilight for the rise in Blood Angel and Space Wolf forces... We need a popular film franchise with some good old crusading to capture peoples imaginations, Monty Pythons Holy Grail will only get us so far!! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356136 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blindhamster Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 There should be two books. One is ‘Codex Space Marines’ which includes a comprehensive army list of every single unit choice. The second is a running series of ‘Index Astartes’ books. These books contain chapter traits and special rules. The first Index Astartes should cover the 9 First Founding, the Black Templars, the Crimson Fists, the Flesh Tearers, and three more for fifteen total. The next Index should be the Badab War chapters, and any following Indexes should cover a specific group of chapters engaged in a certain historical or new narrative campaigns. This series should run beyond the life of each edition. For 8th Edition 2.0 they need to bring back the army list format, and include keywords the way they used to include special rules to encourage maximum conversion and counts as potential. This is exactly what I'd like to see. Yeah but BT aren't as widely poplar as the other non codex marines Well I blame Twilight for the rise in Blood Angel and Space Wolf forces... We need a popular film franchise with some good old crusading to capture peoples imaginations, Monty Pythons Holy Grail will only get us so far!! Wolves and BA were already more popular lol. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356137 Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Angel Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 No one “needs” their own codex, you just want them to have their own. They could evenly spread out the love and everyone could fit. Look at HH. Put all the stuff that’s the same in one section then have a section for each chapters unique stuff. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356150 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Father Ferrum Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Yeah but BT aren't as widely poplar as the other non codex marines Well I blame Twilight for the rise in Blood Angel and Space Wolf forces... We need a popular film franchise with some good old crusading to capture peoples imaginations, Monty Pythons Holy Grail will only get us so far!! That boat sailed with Kingdom of Heaven and Ironclad. Honestly though, every time this topic comes up I think back to 3rd Edition when there was Space Marine codex and all the chapters had supplements to it with their own units and additional special rules. It was clunky and when they went to the current codex system in 4th & 5th edition, the change was celebrated...and now everybody wants to roll it back despite the complaints that "there are too many books!" Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356161 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CCE1981 Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 One no, but reduce yes. Codex Compliant - Ultramarines, Imperial Fists, etc Minor deviation - Blood Angels, Dark Angels, etc Major deviation - Space Wolves etc Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356190 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claws and Effect Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 No. There are 5 First Founding Chapters in the Space Marine Codex that get virtually ignored already. Roll in the 3 that have vastly more lore written as well as unique units and you'll see those 5 get reduced from the 2-4 pages they get now to a couple paragraphs. Because that's what GW would do to prevent the book from weighing 12 pounds. Codexes aren't just rules, they are also a major source of lore for the Chapters that don't get the spotlight much. For example, have the Salamanders been prominently featured in a campaign book since Armageddon? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356192 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishagu Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 If it's a Primaris only book yes, otherwise No. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356193 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claws and Effect Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 If it's a Primaris only book yes, otherwise No. This is an exception I would be okay with. If it covers only Primaris in the datasheet section and the lore is pertaining to the challenges Primaris Marines face in being accepted by their Chapter* and cool things Primaris guys have done, then it could work. *It has been established that pretty much every Chapter has accepted Primaris into their ranks, but they haven't been enthusiastically welcomed by very many. Regular Marines resent them a bit in a lot of cases. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356200 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halandaar Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 I don't mind the idea of all the armies being in one book, but it would be so unwieldy and difficult to use. My vote would be for a single book which contains all the "shared" units and then a return to actual supplements which would contain the relevant unique units and special characters, along with a picklist of what you can take from the main book. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356213 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MistaGav Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 I would like to see something but as a 'gamers edition' so just datasheets, traits, relics, stratagem and all that without all the fluff. Basically a bit like what the index originally had. If you take all the fluff out then you could squeeze everything in I think. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/357432-should-all-the-chapters-be-rolled-into-one-codex/#findComment-5356215 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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