Discussion on the new C:SM & Possible BT supplement

[SydonianDragoon404]

While I appreciate rumors, especially when they start coming steady from multiple sources...it only stalls new army building.  No sense building a new list or expanding my forces if I know there is a new book on the way.  Even worse if it doesn't happen.  D:

I actually like this because it gives me time to paint my new models and backlog. My primaris ancient is still sitting there staring at me 80% finished. I just primed my invictor warsuit the other day, eager to get started!

[Brother Tyler]

New rulebook? Yes. But it won't be a codex. It will be a codex supplement.

 

Actually, make my previous "yes" into a "maybe." A worst case scenario is that the Black Templars won't get a dedicated codex supplement book such as we've seen with the Ultramarines, White Scars, Iron Hands, and Raven Guard (so far). Instead, you might see the Black Templars stuck with an Index Astartes article that includes a codex supplement, such as we saw with the Crimson Fists and Blood Ravens. That doesn't seem very likely, but I don't want to rule it out.

 

The far more likely scenario is that the new rulebook for the Black Templars will be a dedicated codex supplement.

 

As for a new character in a hypothetical BT/Orks box, sure, the Black Templars will get a Primaris Lieutenant Castellan.   It would be nice to see something more, but hoping for more is just bound to lead to disappointment.

[Sete]

A Castellan/Marshall and a sprue is enough for me to start making a primaris army tbh.

But doe to the packed release schedule i think maybe only next year if it happens with the book after eldar.

[Sete]

While I appreciate rumors, especially when they start coming steady from multiple sources...it only stalls new army building. No sense building a new list or expanding my forces if I know there is a new book on the way. Even worse if it doesn't happen. D:

Well i had 1k points primed when Primaris dropped and i spent quite a few quid to kit every single one with DW veterans BT pads.

 

They are in a box somewhere. I was quite proud of my Marshall and EC minor conversion.

Here they are!

http://bolterandchainsword.com/uploads/gallery/album_10028/gallery_79735_10028_56852.jpg

[Marshal Reinhard]

 

spent quite a few quid to kit every single one with DW veterans BT pads.

 

What I did with my Primaris Crusade, got close to some 100 of those pads between every one

[TheOneTrueZon]

Here is what will be in the new BT GW Upgrade Sprue:

 

 

The upgrade sprue that has been coming out for all the other Chapters up to this point are such a far cry from our horribly outdated but entirely "gold standard" of what a chapter upgrade set should look like for Templars. If GW is holding to the same loadout schema of late, at BT upgrade sprue of the similar size as the SW, BA, DA, IF would mean some minor bling, a power sword, a chainsword and a few heads. PFFT, no tabards no deal. Also, how are they going to adapt tabards for the Primaris range? Surely it could be done, but with the way GW has been slicing the models for the sprue there would need to be a bespoke tabard for just about every different pose in a multipart Intercessor squad (if it's going to be a true tabard with a covered chest and fabric falling below the waist, let's just forget they're going to do anything for Reivers, Agressors or Phobos, for the sake of examples. This is why I think we're going to get a full on kit of Sword Brethren. Just like these:

 

 

.... just, ya know, Primaris.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

I ordered an old school upgrade last month from my FLGS, (I'm partly future proofing in case that particular kit gets squatted.) the owner hadn't seen one in a while and was pleasantly surprised by the value. It was only a few quid more than the new ones, and you get so, so much more for your money.

[TheOneTrueZon]

That makes me think I should get one last BT Upgrade box as well so I have a solid "master" of all those bits....

[Marshal Vespasian]

That makes me think I should get one last BT Upgrade box as well so I have a solid "master" of all those bits....

I have been having similar thoughts...

[Sete]

I have been using the BT blanche artwork as a pillar of the new BT look.

You will have the HQ with all the shabang and the rest of the dudes with no bling.

 

Looking at the ultras as example, only the Victrix guard has some bling and its minimal. If we ever get sword bros, expect the same.

[4ndroid]

But I still haven't painted my old marines yet :( 

 

bring on the BT codex!!! 

[Mmmmm Napalm]

 

 

Here is what will be in the new BT GW Upgrade Sprue:

The upgrade sprue that has been coming out for all the other Chapters up to this point are such a far cry from our horribly outdated but entirely "gold standard" of what a chapter upgrade set should look like for Templars. If GW is holding to the same loadout schema of late, at BT upgrade sprue of the similar size as the SW, BA, DA, IF would mean some minor bling, a power sword, a chainsword and a few heads. PFFT, no tabards no deal. Also, how are they going to adapt tabards for the Primaris range? Surely it could be done, but with the way GW has been slicing the models for the sprue there would need to be a bespoke tabard for just about every different pose in a multipart Intercessor squad (if it's going to be a true tabard with a covered chest and fabric falling below the waist, let's just forget they're going to do anything for Reivers, Agressors or Phobos, for the sake of examples. This is why I think we're going to get a full on kit of Sword Brethren. Just like these:

 

.... just, ya know, Primaris.

I agree that the old BT upgrade has great value, but I still would like them to release a new one for Primaris. The details on the old one aren't very sharp or symmetrical compared to modern bits, and a lot of the components on those sprues can't even be used for Primaris.

[Marshal Reinhard]

 

*snip*

 

I've argued before that to get real swordbrethren, it would have to be a full dedicated kit, sure. I just don't think we'll get this now.

[Sete]

To be honest now is our best chance.

The way things are going, with us barely making an appearance on the main codex, not part of the IF supplement, having our own tab on GW site, a paint named after us, its all small things that add up to maybe having a bit of focus.

I don't want to be overly optimistic, its not my nature, but it just wont make sense to have all this work to just ditch us.

Several rumours covered BT, both from sources with previous correct rumours.

Now we just need to wait.

I believe both rumours to be correct. We will be part of the 2nd book, and we will feature in a box facing someone like elder and deldar.

Could be orks but it wont be ghaz.

Its a great opportunity to make new plastic HQ both for BT and Orks, and add a couple units.

I can see an Emperor Champion, and a box of sword brothers for us.

Why? Sword bros can triple as elite CC unit, as Castellans or Marshals, even command squads.

With one kit GW could cover a lot.

Emperor Champion can face the new plastic Ork Weirdboy (Ghaz can beat the living snot out of ragnar), to show how much of a badass he is, introducing some new ork boys or whatever, and Helbrecth or Grimaldus  can later appear in other campaign.

 

This are my 0.2 thrones on all of this.

I could be horribly wrong and we get some rules only.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

Someone opined recently that our absence from the Codex, models wise, could be because GW are holding back on a few bits or kits?

[Smirnov]

Someone opined recently that our absence from the Codex, models wise, could be because GW are holding back on a few bits or kits?

I think the theory was that after seeing Templar presence in surveys, GW went 'oh, shiiii~' and started scrambling kits, which pushed IF back because we had to be cut out of the book.

Personally I think this is a bit too far-fetched. I don't know the design cycles of GW of course, but I don't see it working that fast.

[Marshal Reinhard]

There's an image floating around in the news forum, which was what Valrak's leaker initially sent him in order to prove he's legit, as it shows a handwritten message for Valkak, along with all first founding codex supplements (missing UM oddly enough) and as well as codex chaos knights (why doe?)....

 

Going back to when the C:SM 2.0 was announced and that it would come with multiple codex supplements, they initially showed an image of 6 books, with most titles redacted (though anyone with half a brain could figure out it was one for each first founding chapter), which meant at least, the image didn't include us... now Valrak's leaker shows an essentially complete collection of these supplements (not sure why UM was switched with C:CK though?), and it again drives home the point, there's no Codex Supplement: Black Templars in there among them.

 

 

Now I'm not saying this just to go "Oh Boohoo, we're getting shafted", but it does imply very heavily, that we're not seemingly not getting a supplement like the others, or at the very least, not at this time... And since there's on the flipside been rather hefty rumours that we are getting "something" relatively soon, it does beg the question of what that something will be...

[balordazul]

It is still hard to say what impact we had in the survey.  Most people are going to say I want more of my own army.  This can be anything from more model support and that is justified across almost every faction to make my army more competitive.

 

Personally don't see us getting Sword Bros unless we get a major focus by GW.  A new crusader replacement unit is much more likely and even more likely then that is a new odd ball HQ out character out of left field.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

Valrak didn't say when he received that picture though. Maybe it was some months/weeks back? Before they changed what was in the IF book.

[AlmightyWalrus]

To be honest, a Crusader Squad box could very easily be built as Sword Brethren as well, since the major difference would be the colour of the pauldrons. It'd suck to not get any cloaks for the Bros, but not having them included would make the kit much more feasible.

[Marshal Reinhard]

Valrak didn't say when he received that picture though. Maybe it was some months/weeks back? Before they changed what was in the IF book.

 

The picture shows a printed completed IF book

[Sword Brother Adelard]

Well, it shows a spine.

[Marshal Reinhard]

I'm sorry, but what's your point right now? Yes it could be fake, yes it could be an early prototype that was changed? This is phyiscally possible. Why would we think so? We know the leaker was legit in so far that he leaked things that are true, they revealed the models pretty much because of it.

 

My point is, this person with his seemingly complete set of supplements, or abilty to look at them at will, shows a collection of "all" of them, and that collection does not feature us, which suggests something else is in store for us, which has been vaguely hinted before. Yes it's not definate in any way, but not for the reason that the image could be fake, and he doesn't actually have access to the supplement?

[Sword Brother Adelard]

Yeah, I don't doubt the image is real. But It doesn't show all of the supplements, as one is missing. It's also entirely possible that one for us, known to be the last one released, wasn't ready yet. I also infer from the presence of the Chaos Knights book that this image was sent to Valrak some weeks back, as why else would it be relevant to show Valrak this guy knew his cuss?

 

Simply put, I just don't think that the rules for our entire unique units and abilities will be in a campaign book. Had it not been for the rumour, no one would be suggesting that as an outcome.

 

Why do I think that? Because it hasn't happened in all of this edition to any other sub-faction. In addition, so far every single chapter focussed on in C:SM has had a supplement, except for the Crimson Fists, who we know are in with the Imperial Fists. (Which makes sense really) But now we know we're not in that book, so why would we be the ONLY chapter singled out in that way?

 

What makes you so sure we aren't getting a supplement? Nothing in that image says we aren't getting a supplement, so I prefer to stick with hope.

 

I sincerely hope I'm right, not because I want to be proved right, and be smug or lord it over all the naysayers, I don't care about that. But because I really want a new book, for all the rules, for the artwork, the painting guides and to clarify some of the many fluff problems that you and I have agreed upon in the past.

 

I know I have no guarantees, only a belief based on some logical inferences and a lot of hope. I will be disappointed if I'm wrong, because I think we deserve more than a campaign book

I mean, if we don't get one, and end up left in with a load of non Templar stuff then I will wish that we had been in the IF book with our brothers.

[Marshal Reinhard]

You're jumping a few steps right now, just because it doesn't look like we're getting a codex supplement in the same form like the rest,or at the very least, it looks like we aren't getting that right now, it does not mean we're being put in a campaign book full stop. I don't even suggest that we are.

 

We appear to already have been singled out. It's not clear for what. This statement does not even rely on the campaign book rumors. We're very seemingly not part of the initial wave of codex supplements. An initial number for them was suggested, and reached, and this leaker has no BT book to show, which suggests, if we are getting one, that it will arrive later. Perhaps with something entirely different in the meantime. This seems pretty safe as far as bets goes.

 

The pattern of releasing things like this means GW could actually give us something else, maybe a mini supplement together with sisters for Psybook 2 and perhaps later add a codex supplement. It seems pretty clear to me they're planning something, and it does not seem to be in line, or following the schedule of the other chapters. If it did, valrak's leaker would have had something, or we would've been in the IF supplement. 

 

Again, you're jumping to conclusions when you say I think we're not getting anything. I'm saying there's something clearly different about what's in store for us. It's true, it might simply just be the timing of what's coming that's different, or there might be something else.