On Primaris and the future of 40k

[Ishagu]

One of the coolest bits of lore is when an Iron Warrior dives under a Repulsor to try and plant Melta Bomb, and is crushed into a bloody stain on the ground.

 

A very brutal Hover Tech

[Panzer]

I honestly wish the repulsor units would reflect that on the board as well. Some kind of damage ability when moving over units, regardless of friendly or enemy.

[MegaVolt87]

I honestly wish the repulsor units would reflect that on the board as well. Some kind of damage ability when moving over units, regardless of friendly or enemy.

I remember DE having something like that on their hover stuff, no idea if they still do now.

[Jukkiz]

One of the coolest bits of lore is when an Iron Warrior dives under a Repulsor to try and plant Melta Bomb, and is crushed into a bloody stain on the ground.

 

A very brutal Hover Tech

Oh please no, It´s hard enough in Eternal crusade to fight against Eldar and them drifting over half a team and killing all.

 

 

[Legionnaire of the VIIth]

 

I honestly wish the repulsor units would reflect that on the board as well. Some kind of damage ability when moving over units, regardless of friendly or enemy.

I remember DE having something like that on their hover stuff, no idea if they still do now.

 

You are talking about Chain-snares and bladevanes, a model with either of these would do damage to a non-vehicle unit they passed over. 7th edition changed them so that Chain-snares allowed Raiders and Ravagers to tank shock (but not ram) and bladevanes gave hammer of wrath. 8th edition bladevanes allow the vehicle to have a melee attack and chain-snares allow for a reroll for 1s.

[Jackalwolf]

It's hard to say that categorically, if the remakes were done with old marks of armor at Primaris scaling then they might have sold better. As it is I didn't buy any of them because they may have been crisper in detail but were basically the same thing as the pile of marines I already had, but if they had fixed the scaling at the same time I may have replaced my entire army.

So much this, if they redid old armour marks with primaris scale I'd throw a bunch of money gw's way

[Lucerne]

Basically, the current state of the true Marines being in limbo is an insult to everyone that likes them and a wasted opportunity for GW to make money. If fans don't know if their model line will even exist in any meaningful way within the next decade...

 

 

 

It's hard to say that categorically, if the remakes were done with old marks of armor at Primaris scaling then they might have sold better. As it is I didn't buy any of them because they may have been crisper in detail but were basically the same thing as the pile of marines I already had, but if they had fixed the scaling at the same time I may have replaced my entire army.

So much this, if they redid old armour marks with primaris scale I'd throw a bunch of money gw's way

 

This is literally what fans wanted all along and which GW perversely refuses to just follow through on.

[Jackalwolf]

I did speak with Jes Goodwin the day primaris were revealed. He did say that they were afraid of an outright scale change and that this way it felt more progressive and catering to current marine users.

 

It is a pity. It really felt from the conversation that we were a different outcome of a couple of meetings away from having true scale marines and primaris never being born. Sigh.

[Red_Shift]

It's true scale/primaris scale terminators, assault marines and breachers that I most want to see but it I'm a bit dubious that we will see them realised. The new shrike model does suggest a direction for a new assault marine though.

 

I love the indominatus pattern terminator helm and the overall design knocks gravis out of the water, imo.

[Vermintide]

Basically, the current state of the true Marines being in limbo is an insult to everyone that likes them and a wasted opportunity for GW to make money. If fans don't know if their model line will even exist in any meaningful way within the next decade...

 

 

 

It's hard to say that categorically, if the remakes were done with old marks of armor at Primaris scaling then they might have sold better. As it is I didn't buy any of them because they may have been crisper in detail but were basically the same thing as the pile of marines I already had, but if they had fixed the scaling at the same time I may have replaced my entire army.

So much this, if they redid old armour marks with primaris scale I'd throw a bunch of money gw's way

 

This is literally what fans wanted all along and which GW perversely refuses to just follow through on.

 

I have a feeling that in the future you will see special releases or upgrade sprues for "relic armour" or some such, in Primaris scale. You will be able to have your cake and eat it. They'll be intercessors at a base design level, but for just a bit of extra cash you'll be able to make them look like they're wearing a mix of classic Crusade, Corvus and Aquila armour.

 

We already have special releases for marines wearing old fashioned heresy era armour, after all, right? And stuff like the beaky Corvus armour is itself a throwback to the original Rogue Trader design. Same thing in principle.

[Jackalwolf]

I'm in. Who knows, after I read spears of the Emperor I might start that army as primaris When I'm done with my wolves.

[Bryan Blaire]

Since we know that the Armor of Heraclus is a modification/reforging of components from the Armor of Antilochus, it's a good bet we'll continue to see the incorporation of "relic armor" into the Primaris armors, especially as we see more of the Primaris Marines made through the Rubicon process as 'Ascended.'

[Guest Triszin]

Since we know that the Armor of Heraclus is a modification/reforging of components from the Armor of Antilochus, it's a good bet we'll continue to see the incorporation of "relic armor" into the Primaris armors, especially as we see more of the Primaris Marines made through the Rubicon process as 'Ascended.'

who else has "relic "armor though, it seems like almost everyone else has the standard armor.

[Bryan Blaire]

who else has "relic "armor though, it seems like almost everyone else has the standard armor.

Like a named relic? Almost no one. Plenty of artificer armor that would very likely be in relic status that could be worked with though.

 

But since many pieces of armor may be relics, such as the Mk3 vambrace that Company Champion Thionel wears, or rune-bearing armor that a Wolf Lord wears, we may see the incorporation of those into some Primaris armor at some point (may be some what easy to do things like the vambrace now actually, and the Primaris Lieutenants' and Gravis Captain's vambrace are already similar on form without the raised piping on the edges) - after all, Jes already talked about Marines keeping a favored pauldrons or helm (which is easy enough to do without any conversion at all).

[BitsHammer]

I did speak with Jes Goodwin the day primaris were revealed. He did say that they were afraid of an outright scale change and that this way it felt more progressive and catering to current marine users.

 

It is a pity. It really felt from the conversation that we were a different outcome of a couple of meetings away from having true scale marines and primaris never being born. Sigh.

I'd argue this lends support to my theory about the Marine updates in 2013 and 2015 not selling as well as projected leading to a belief that another resale wouldn't sell at the expected numbers.

[jaxom]

 

Since we know that the Armor of Heraclus is a modification/reforging of components from the Armor of Antilochus, it's a good bet we'll continue to see the incorporation of "relic armor" into the Primaris armors, especially as we see more of the Primaris Marines made through the Rubicon process as 'Ascended.'

who else has "relic "armor though, it seems like almost everyone else has the standard armor.

 

 

Emperor's Champion?

[Lucerne]

I did speak with Jes Goodwin the day primaris were revealed. He did say that they were afraid of an outright scale change and that this way it felt more progressive and catering to current marine users.

 

It is a pity. It really felt from the conversation that we were a different outcome of a couple of meetings away from having true scale marines and primaris never being born. Sigh.

If you ever get the chance again, it'd be a huge favor for the hobby to express just how much people want updates for classic Marines rather than the frankensteined versions.

 

 

 

Basically, the current state of the true Marines being in limbo is an insult to everyone that likes them and a wasted opportunity for GW to make money. If fans don't know if their model line will even exist in any meaningful way within the next decade...

 

 

 

It's hard to say that categorically, if the remakes were done with old marks of armor at Primaris scaling then they might have sold better. As it is I didn't buy any of them because they may have been crisper in detail but were basically the same thing as the pile of marines I already had, but if they had fixed the scaling at the same time I may have replaced my entire army.

So much this, if they redid old armour marks with primaris scale I'd throw a bunch of money gw's way

 

This is literally what fans wanted all along and which GW perversely refuses to just follow through on.

 

I have a feeling that in the future you will see special releases or upgrade sprues for "relic armour" or some such, in Primaris scale. You will be able to have your cake and eat it. They'll be intercessors at a base design level, but for just a bit of extra cash you'll be able to make them look like they're wearing a mix of classic Crusade, Corvus and Aquila armour.

 

We already have special releases for marines wearing old fashioned heresy era armour, after all, right? And stuff like the beaky Corvus armour is itself a throwback to the original Rogue Trader design. Same thing in principle.

 

That would be the lazy, cynical cash grab approach...so yeah, pretty good odds. It'd be obnoxious for us to just have to take Intercessor chassis power armour as loyalists  as it's much less visually interesting than the classic aquila and looks like a third party "sky warrior" bootleg...But if that's what GW goes for, that'd be the unambiguous death of the classic marine design in a way that's more fan-friendly than just leaving everyone in limbo for half a decade.

[BitsHammer]

 

 

I did speak with Jes Goodwin the day primaris were revealed. He did say that they were afraid of an outright scale change and that this way it felt more progressive and catering to current marine users.

 

It is a pity. It really felt from the conversation that we were a different outcome of a couple of meetings away from having true scale marines and primaris never being born. Sigh.

If you ever get the chance again, it'd be a huge favor for the hobby to express just how much people want updates for classic Marines rather than the frankensteined versions.

 

 

 

Basically, the current state of the true Marines being in limbo is an insult to everyone that likes them and a wasted opportunity for GW to make money. If fans don't know if their model line will even exist in any meaningful way within the next decade...

 

 

 

 

It's hard to say that categorically, if the remakes were done with old marks of armor at Primaris scaling then they might have sold better. As it is I didn't buy any of them because they may have been crisper in detail but were basically the same thing as the pile of marines I already had, but if they had fixed the scaling at the same time I may have replaced my entire army.

So much this, if they redid old armour marks with primaris scale I'd throw a bunch of money gw's way

This is literally what fans wanted all along and which GW perversely refuses to just follow through on.

I have a feeling that in the future you will see special releases or upgrade sprues for "relic armour" or some such, in Primaris scale. You will be able to have your cake and eat it. They'll be intercessors at a base design level, but for just a bit of extra cash you'll be able to make them look like they're wearing a mix of classic Crusade, Corvus and Aquila armour.

 

We already have special releases for marines wearing old fashioned heresy era armour, after all, right? And stuff like the beaky Corvus armour is itself a throwback to the original Rogue Trader design. Same thing in principle.

That would be the lazy, cynical cash grab approach...so yeah, pretty good odds. It'd be obnoxious for us to just have to take Intercessor chassis power armour as loyalists as it's much less visually interesting than the classic aquila and looks like a third party "sky warrior" bootleg...But if that's what GW goes for, that'd be the unambiguous death of the classic marine design in a way that's more fan-friendly than just leaving everyone in limbo for half a decade.

Maybe, if you want GW to listen to your feedback, try phrasing it better than insulting the man's work.

 

Also we have a way to contact the 40k dev team already: through the FAQ email.

[Lucerne]

 

 

I did speak with Jes Goodwin the day primaris were revealed. He did say that they were afraid of an outright scale change and that this way it felt more progressive and catering to current marine users.

 

It is a pity. It really felt from the conversation that we were a different outcome of a couple of meetings away from having true scale marines and primaris never being born. Sigh.

If you ever get the chance again, it'd be a huge favor for the hobby to express just how much people want updates for classic Marines rather than the frankensteined versions.

 

 

Basically, the current state of the true Marines being in limbo is an insult to everyone that likes them and a wasted opportunity for GW to make money. If fans don't know if their model line will even exist in any meaningful way within the next decade...

 

 

It's hard to say that categorically, if the remakes were done with old marks of armor at Primaris scaling then they might have sold better. As it is I didn't buy any of them because they may have been crisper in detail but were basically the same thing as the pile of marines I already had, but if they had fixed the scaling at the same time I may have replaced my entire army.

So much this, if they redid old armour marks with primaris scale I'd throw a bunch of money gw's way

This is literally what fans wanted all along and which GW perversely refuses to just follow through on.

I have a feeling that in the future you will see special releases or upgrade sprues for "relic armour" or some such, in Primaris scale. You will be able to have your cake and eat it. They'll be intercessors at a base design level, but for just a bit of extra cash you'll be able to make them look like they're wearing a mix of classic Crusade, Corvus and Aquila armour.

 

We already have special releases for marines wearing old fashioned heresy era armour, after all, right? And stuff like the beaky Corvus armour is itself a throwback to the original Rogue Trader design. Same thing in principle.

That would be the lazy, cynical cash grab approach...so yeah, pretty good odds. It'd be obnoxious for us to just have to take Intercessor chassis power armour as loyalists as it's much less visually interesting than the classic aquila and looks like a third party "sky warrior" bootleg...But if that's what GW goes for, that'd be the unambiguous death of the classic marine design in a way that's more fan-friendly than just leaving everyone in limbo for half a decade.

Maybe, if you want GW to listen to your feedback, try phrasing it better than insulting the man's work.

 

Also we have a way to contact the 40k dev team already: through the FAQ email.

 

No artist manages to have successes every time, and it's honestly disingenuous to try and say the Intercessor design doesn't look like a copyright friendly version of the classic Marine designs.

 

https://spikeybits.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/Black-Ops-Steam-Lords.jpg

 

among countless others

 

Do we?

[Lord_Caerolion]

MkX looks like MkVII armour with an altered MkIV helmet. It's no more different to MkVII armour than MkIII is.

[Bryan Blaire]

No artist manages to have successes every time, and it's honestly disingenuous to try and say the Intercessor design doesn't look like a copyright friendly version of the classic Marine designs.

 

https://spikeybits.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/Black-Ops-Steam-Lords.jpg

 

among countless others

 

Do we?

:lol: :lol: :lol:

 

Oh man, that was a good one.. . You're right - no one could genuinely think that the current Primaris lines look like that hot mess. You'd have to be looney to suggest it...

 

Don't get me wrong, there are some nicely done classic Marine and Primaris 3rd party pieces, but what was shown was not, nor does it compare with either line line a meaningful way. If there was a bright star at the center of the universe representing a point to be made, linking that puts the attempt on the planet it's furthest from.

[Lucerne]

MkX looks like MkVII armour with an altered MkIV helmet. It's no more different to MkVII armour than MkIII is.

And if a swollen Mark III was meant to be a replacement design for Mk 7 and ate all of its development time and release schedule, then was passed off as the "new Mk 7" for multiple release schedules, I'd be livid about that- because that's not what it's supposed to be.

 

Mk X (Intercessors rather than the escaped concept art variants that made it into the other mk X types which should really be judged against the units that fill the same niches) looks like a game of mad libs with power armour features gone wrong.

 

It's AQUILA ARMOUR but with IRON ARMOUR LEGGINGS, EXTRA ARMOUR PLATES, PLATFORM SHOES, and A BOOTLEG MAXIMUS HELMET.

 

The end result is something with enough plausible deniability to not be used as/mistaken for the iconic power armour no matter how much players try to fix the design choices with increasingly creative conversions, but close enough that someone a few steps above designers in the GW food chain might feel emboldened to pass it off as an adequate "standard space marine design" at some point.

[Panzer]

 

I did speak with Jes Goodwin the day primaris were revealed. He did say that they were afraid of an outright scale change and that this way it felt more progressive and catering to current marine users.

 

It is a pity. It really felt from the conversation that we were a different outcome of a couple of meetings away from having true scale marines and primaris never being born. Sigh.

If you ever get the chance again, it'd be a huge favor for the hobby to express just how much people want updates for classic Marines rather than the frankensteined versions.

 

 

 

Basically, the current state of the true Marines being in limbo is an insult to everyone that likes them and a wasted opportunity for GW to make money. If fans don't know if their model line will even exist in any meaningful way within the next decade...

 

 

 

It's hard to say that categorically, if the remakes were done with old marks of armor at Primaris scaling then they might have sold better. As it is I didn't buy any of them because they may have been crisper in detail but were basically the same thing as the pile of marines I already had, but if they had fixed the scaling at the same time I may have replaced my entire army.

So much this, if they redid old armour marks with primaris scale I'd throw a bunch of money gw's way

 

This is literally what fans wanted all along and which GW perversely refuses to just follow through on.

 

I have a feeling that in the future you will see special releases or upgrade sprues for "relic armour" or some such, in Primaris scale. You will be able to have your cake and eat it. They'll be intercessors at a base design level, but for just a bit of extra cash you'll be able to make them look like they're wearing a mix of classic Crusade, Corvus and Aquila armour.

 

We already have special releases for marines wearing old fashioned heresy era armour, after all, right? And stuff like the beaky Corvus armour is itself a throwback to the original Rogue Trader design. Same thing in principle.

 

That would be the lazy, cynical cash grab approach...so yeah, pretty good odds. It'd be obnoxious for us to just have to take Intercessor chassis power armour as loyalists  as it's much less visually interesting than the classic aquila and looks like a third party "sky warrior" bootleg...But if that's what GW goes for, that'd be the unambiguous death of the classic marine design in a way that's more fan-friendly than just leaving everyone in limbo for half a decade.

 

 

All I can say is ... speak for yourself. There are plenty who like Primaris Marines and according to GW they sell even better than expected so far. Face it, you are part of a loud minority and if you stick with that mindset you aren't part of the future.

[Lucerne]

 

 

I did speak with Jes Goodwin the day primaris were revealed. He did say that they were afraid of an outright scale change and that this way it felt more progressive and catering to current marine users.

 

It is a pity. It really felt from the conversation that we were a different outcome of a couple of meetings away from having true scale marines and primaris never being born. Sigh.

If you ever get the chance again, it'd be a huge favor for the hobby to express just how much people want updates for classic Marines rather than the frankensteined versions.

 

 

 

Basically, the current state of the true Marines being in limbo is an insult to everyone that likes them and a wasted opportunity for GW to make money. If fans don't know if their model line will even exist in any meaningful way within the next decade...

 

 

 

It's hard to say that categorically, if the remakes were done with old marks of armor at Primaris scaling then they might have sold better. As it is I didn't buy any of them because they may have been crisper in detail but were basically the same thing as the pile of marines I already had, but if they had fixed the scaling at the same time I may have replaced my entire army.

So much this, if they redid old armour marks with primaris scale I'd throw a bunch of money gw's way

 

This is literally what fans wanted all along and which GW perversely refuses to just follow through on.

 

I have a feeling that in the future you will see special releases or upgrade sprues for "relic armour" or some such, in Primaris scale. You will be able to have your cake and eat it. They'll be intercessors at a base design level, but for just a bit of extra cash you'll be able to make them look like they're wearing a mix of classic Crusade, Corvus and Aquila armour.

 

We already have special releases for marines wearing old fashioned heresy era armour, after all, right? And stuff like the beaky Corvus armour is itself a throwback to the original Rogue Trader design. Same thing in principle.

 

That would be the lazy, cynical cash grab approach...so yeah, pretty good odds. It'd be obnoxious for us to just have to take Intercessor chassis power armour as loyalists  as it's much less visually interesting than the classic aquila and looks like a third party "sky warrior" bootleg...But if that's what GW goes for, that'd be the unambiguous death of the classic marine design in a way that's more fan-friendly than just leaving everyone in limbo for half a decade.

 

 

All I can say is ... speak for yourself. There are plenty who like Primaris Marines and according to GW they sell even better than expected so far. Face it, you are part of a loud minority and if you stick with that mindset you aren't part of the future.

 

I mean, there's always going to be some members of the fandom that buy up any given GW release because their subjective tastes mean they consider something a well-designed and appealing product, especially when it's advertised constantly? I wish you, personally, every bit of enjoyment you can get out of Primaris releases as their own limited subfaction- as an individual fan. As you said, you can only really speak for yourself.

 

But that doesn't actually mean Intercessors are a good design when representing anything but the "Primaris Intercessors" unit- or that this is a customer-friendly way to handle fans of the iconic designs and factions. Releases like Shrike where the Primaris fan club's enthusiastic spending habits resulted in the loss of classic designs in favor of unrecognizable releases that frankly were below the standard set by basic kitbashing are...not a good omen of the way things will go if the "make it all Primaris and just throw away the classic designs" mindset wins out and is catered to over the rest of the hobby.

[Panzer]

 

 

 

I did speak with Jes Goodwin the day primaris were revealed. He did say that they were afraid of an outright scale change and that this way it felt more progressive and catering to current marine users.

 

It is a pity. It really felt from the conversation that we were a different outcome of a couple of meetings away from having true scale marines and primaris never being born. Sigh.

If you ever get the chance again, it'd be a huge favor for the hobby to express just how much people want updates for classic Marines rather than the frankensteined versions.

 

 

 

Basically, the current state of the true Marines being in limbo is an insult to everyone that likes them and a wasted opportunity for GW to make money. If fans don't know if their model line will even exist in any meaningful way within the next decade...

 

 

 

It's hard to say that categorically, if the remakes were done with old marks of armor at Primaris scaling then they might have sold better. As it is I didn't buy any of them because they may have been crisper in detail but were basically the same thing as the pile of marines I already had, but if they had fixed the scaling at the same time I may have replaced my entire army.

So much this, if they redid old armour marks with primaris scale I'd throw a bunch of money gw's way

 

This is literally what fans wanted all along and which GW perversely refuses to just follow through on.

 

I have a feeling that in the future you will see special releases or upgrade sprues for "relic armour" or some such, in Primaris scale. You will be able to have your cake and eat it. They'll be intercessors at a base design level, but for just a bit of extra cash you'll be able to make them look like they're wearing a mix of classic Crusade, Corvus and Aquila armour.

 

We already have special releases for marines wearing old fashioned heresy era armour, after all, right? And stuff like the beaky Corvus armour is itself a throwback to the original Rogue Trader design. Same thing in principle.

 

That would be the lazy, cynical cash grab approach...so yeah, pretty good odds. It'd be obnoxious for us to just have to take Intercessor chassis power armour as loyalists  as it's much less visually interesting than the classic aquila and looks like a third party "sky warrior" bootleg...But if that's what GW goes for, that'd be the unambiguous death of the classic marine design in a way that's more fan-friendly than just leaving everyone in limbo for half a decade.

 

 

All I can say is ... speak for yourself. There are plenty who like Primaris Marines and according to GW they sell even better than expected so far. Face it, you are part of a loud minority and if you stick with that mindset you aren't part of the future.

 

I mean, there's always going to be some members of the fandom that buy up any given GW release because their subjective tastes mean they consider something a well-designed and appealing product, especially when it's advertised constantly? I wish you, personally, every bit of enjoyment you can get out of Primaris releases as their own limited subfaction- as an individual fan. As you said, you only really speak for yourself.

 

But that doesn't actually mean Intercessors are a good design or that this is a customer-friendly way to handle fans of the iconic designs and factions. Releases like Shrike where the Primaris fan club's enthusiastic spending habits resulted in the loss of classic designs in favor of releases that frankly were below the standard set by basic kitbashing are...not a good omen of the way things will go if the "make it all Primaris and just throw away the classic designs" mindset wins out and is catered to over the rest of the hobby.

 

 

Saying people who enjoy Primaris are people who buy up any given GW release is just condescending. That's definitely not the case.

 

And the second paragraph is just again 100% your subjective opinion, don't try to sell it as facts.