Neuralshock Posted December 2, 2019 Author Share Posted December 2, 2019 Canticle of Yeet. Love it. Out of curiosity, did you play charges as +1 from Red Thirst and +2 from Canticle of Yeet? Or simply just Canticle of Yeet overrides Red Thirst for grand total bonus of +2? No I only counted the +2 from canticle of yeet (hate) as it explicitly states is not cumulative with other bonuses to charge distance, no matter how much wishing we want it to be. This is different from quickening which doesn't say that, so +4 to charge distance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 I do kinda wonder what the page count difference between reprinting vanguard units vs reprinting our unique units and rolling us into codex space marines would have been. The latter would avoid some of these inconsistencies. Though I expect we will lose some legacy stratagems (kill shot?) when the FAQ comes out - in the same way Vigilus Defiant lost stuff when the marine FAQ came out. All our units would probably about 10 pages of Datasheets. Then about 2-4 pages of Stratagems, 3 pages of Relics/Special Issue Wargear, 1 page Warlord Traits, 1 page Psychic powers, 2 pages Flesh Tearers stuff. So about 20 pages probably I'd say. However considering how much we share with the vanilla Codex it would have definitely made more sense for us to become a slightly more beefy Supplement instead of keeping our own Codex imo. Pathstrider 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neuralshock Posted December 2, 2019 Author Share Posted December 2, 2019 Thinking about it, having Lemartes with the litany of faith might be REALLY good on the first turn because it's a 6'' 5+++ aura for UNITS, pair this with 4++ impulsors and you'll have super tanky vehicles that would be a hard nut to crack and survive first turn shooting! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 Thinking about it, having Lemartes with the litany of faith might be REALLY good on the first turn because it's a 6'' 5+++ aura for UNITS, pair this with 4++ impulsors and you'll have super tanky vehicles that would be a hard nut to crack and survive first turn shooting! Heya bud. Minor mistake in understanding there. LoF is only for mortal wounds. Not other wounds. Would be amazing though. Canticle of Yeet. Love it. Out of curiosity, did you play charges as +1 from Red Thirst and +2 from Canticle of Yeet? Or simply just Canticle of Yeet overrides Red Thirst for grand total bonus of +2? No I only counted the +2 from canticle of yeet (hate) as it explicitly states is not cumulative with other bonuses to charge distance, no matter how much wishing we want it to be. This is different from quickening which doesn't say that, so +4 to charge distance. I have to quote this again- because it's so accurate. This is really, really, really clear. They may change it (Especially the FT bonus), but if they do it will be in an Errata. Thinking about it, having Lemartes with the litany of faith might be REALLY good on the first turn because it's a 6'' 5+++ aura for UNITS, pair this with 4++ impulsors and you'll have super tanky vehicles that would be a hard nut to crack and survive first turn shooting! Heya bud. Minor mistake in understanding there. LoF is only for mortal wounds. Not other wounds. Would be amazing though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FormelyKnownAsSmashyPants Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 (edited) LoF and the deny the witch warlord trait could be good in a list against psyker heavy armies like GK an TS. That and throw in Mephiston and a a phobos librarian for good musre, so plenty of denying and some 5+++ goodness against MW/smite spamming. Edited December 3, 2019 by Captain Smashy Pants Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 My response: Greetings, team! GREAT job on the recent book, this is ABSOLUTELY amazing. Really nice to see what the studio is doing. I just wanted to raise a few points of concern given oddities arising from the rules: STRATAGEMS: 1: "Honour the Chapter" (BA codex) does not follow the updated wording of the SM codex. While this is great for the BA (as it's more powerful as written in the BA dex), it will cause confusion and seems like an oversight. 2: "Armory of Baal" (BA codex) also does not follow the updated wording of the SM codex. This is a 1/3CP stratagem for BA and has a limit of 2 additional relics, while the SM (and all supplements) have the equivalent for 1CP and can use this multiple times. Once again, it seems like an oversight. 3: "Faith and Fury Character Upgrades" - currently it's unclear if the BA (though, more importantly and specifically BA successors) can take these. It's understandable that the regular BA cannot, given the named characters at their disposal with those keywords (Astorath: Master of Sanctity, Mephiston: Chief Librarian) - but this seems like a lost opportunity for BA successor chapters. UNITS: The BA Sanguinary Priest doesn’t have "Angels of Death" keyword, but the section before data sheets specifically says everything has it. If Sanguinary priests do not have it, wouldn’t that break the combat doctrines rule? Lemartes seems to be missing the "Black Rage" rule- but he has always had it and its a core part of the character from a lore perspective, this seems like an oversight. Dante didn’t seem to get an update regarding his "Chapter Master" ability to reroll. All the latest Chapter Masters (as well as the Chapter Master stratagem have the wording to allow rerolls for all hits, not simply all failed attacks. Artificer Armour special issue wargear provides a 5+ invulnerable – Mephiston is listed with Artificer Armour, but not a 5+ invulnerable. Is this intentional? DC Intercessors - this is a wonderful shout out to fans and a fantastic progression of the BA lore -but the unit seems a little misplaced. Is there something missing here? They're not Troops (understandably - but reducing their use), have the same attacks as regular Intercessors when charged, LESS if you're comparing Veteran Intercessors, they have lower leadership, and cant access the armies 5+ "Feel no pain" without a stratagem. Is there something excluded here? ARMY WIDE: Currently, it appears that the Flesh Tearers alternative “chapter tactic” does not stack with Assault Doctrine (the wording in the Assault Doctrine rules excludes all other bonuses to modifiers). This seems like a terrible oversight. Thanks for taking the time to read through this!! Looking forward to the FAQ in a few weeks. burningsky25, Blindhamster, Remtek and 1 other 4 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolchiate Remembrancer Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 Nicely done! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neuralshock Posted December 3, 2019 Author Share Posted December 3, 2019 Thinking about it, having Lemartes with the litany of faith might be REALLY good on the first turn because it's a 6'' 5+++ aura for UNITS, pair this with 4++ impulsors and you'll have super tanky vehicles that would be a hard nut to crack and survive first turn shooting! Heya bud. Minor mistake in understanding there. LoF is only for mortal wounds. Not other wounds. Would be amazing though. Welp, impulsors are still durable craft I'd think. Morticon 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaezus Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 Is there any love for Baal Preds, Furioso dreads or assualt marines in P3/CA? I have not been able to deepdive in the new stuff yet. Saw the sanguinary guard changes, they look very strong now :) You've just made me consider it, but drednoughts assaulting out of a Lucius pod are more effective now. Particularly DC dread with magna grapple, +3 to charge plus the extra attacks. Assault squads... I wish I could use them, but it's difficult to find a place for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 So I think the biggest miss with this release is that we now have a load of Stratagems without cards!!! Indefragable and Dolchiate Remembrancer 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverson Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 Run furioso dreads as invictus war suits and win? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FormelyKnownAsSmashyPants Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 (edited) ^^^ Yeah that's a bummer I love cards. Also does anyone know the wording for quake bolts, just wondering whether I can give them to my smash captain as part of his wargear if I give him a combimelta Don't care if I can shoot the combimelta at the same time either. The quake bolts provide the benefit of the the thunder hammer relic with the no overwatch part of the Angel's Wing. Probably better off with the MC bolter now I think of it. This guy is going to be an even bigger beat stick than before. Frees up the Angel's Wing for the chaplain. Edited December 3, 2019 by Captain Smashy Pants Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedemptionNL Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 Invictors are the same size as Redemptors, so they're much bigger than the old fashioned dreadnoughts. Silverson 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neuralshock Posted December 3, 2019 Author Share Posted December 3, 2019 Invictors are the same size as Redemptors, so they're much bigger than the old fashioned dreadnoughts. "Don't talk to me or my gene-son ever again" Zephaniah Adriyen and Silverson 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blindhamster Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 I love the new dreads. Their scale is very imposing. It's a shame their rules arent just a smidge better. But they're still cool Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolchiate Remembrancer Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 So I think the biggest miss with this release is that we now have a load of Stratagems without cards!!!It's why I spent last night googling options to keep track of it all. No luck so far! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaezus Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 Make cards of your own using photos from the book / internet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 I love the new dreads. Their scale is very imposing. It's a shame their rules arent just a smidge better. But they're still cool Put them out of LOS T1 for protection in case you don't go first. Put "Big guns never tire" and move them into firing position to ensure a good first turn of shooting where the OGC and HOGC can benefit from the Devastator Doctrine ("Wisdom of the Ancients" is optional). Stormbolters are now the best hull weapon for extra dakka and get a little extra benfit in the Tactical Doctrine. Use "Duty Eternal" to keep him alive a little longer if necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 Big guns never tire and Devastation Doctrine will be sooooo nice for my Redemptor. I'm sure my opponents will be surprised how much of a difference hitting on 3+ with AP-2 makes compared to before when it was just hitting on 4+ with AP-1. At least for the first one or two games. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont-Be-Haten Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 Eventually we will move to a new tactical section. But to turn the conversation a bit. Someone over on Facebook was talking about giving Quake Bolts to a phobos captain to snipe characters out so we get all the +1 to hits against said character. Seems like a great option to me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neuralshock Posted December 3, 2019 Author Share Posted December 3, 2019 I think the classic 2x TLC contemptor mortis is still the best bang for your buck with BGNT. Tucking it out of LOS and popping up to blapp any no invuln 3+ save vehicle is a good way to ensure a kill 1 first turn. Turns 2/3 are going to be our bread and butter/break or make, and having the T1 beefiness helps with securing board control. Karhedron and Indefragable 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panzer Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 I was thinking about sniping characters with quake bolts but to be fair when we get into melee with a character we should be able to kill him with our melee units anyway. I for one will test the quake bolts on my Gravis Captain so his Boltstorm Gauntlet feels a bit more useful and if it ever happens that he finds himself in a drawn out combat he can still shoot the enemy with it since it's a pistol. ^^ Blindhamster 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hintzy Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 Eventually we will move to a new tactical section. But to turn the conversation a bit. Someone over on Facebook was talking about giving Quake Bolts to a phobos captain to snipe characters out so we get all the +1 to hits against said character. Seems like a great option to me! If we're thinking of the same discussion, Chris Chance (?), I don't think he was talking about sniping characters. I think he chose the Phobos Captain primarily because that's the character most able to put the Quake Bolts where you need them with his long range and scout deploy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indefragable Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 I do think that the Quake Bolts get the award for "sneakily most useful item" in the new book. Need to review the precise wording (do you just have to Hit your target or cause an unsaved wound?) especially around exactly who is eligible to take them, but there is massive potential with them. I'm also surprised that people aren't talking about the Icon of Angels wargear that lets you re-roll charges. That's an almost auto-include for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatbudda Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 Are quakebolts available to any character or are they a successor relic? I'm not really sure what the deal is with the special issue wargear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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