BA and 9th Ed

[Jolemai]

New Datasheets in the next SM codex:

Captain with HBR

Primaris captain entry will include indomitus loadout

Primaris lieutenand entry will include indomitus loadout

Primaris Chaplain on bike

Primaris Techmarine

Assault Intercessor

Heavy Intercessor

Bladeguard Ancient

Bladeguard Vets

Veteran Intercessors

Relic Terminators (Cata or Tartaros most likely)

Outrider Squad

Invader ATV Squad

Stormspeed Hellstrike (and two more variants people were unable to make the name of)

Eradicator Squad

Firestrike Support Platform

Gladiator Lancer/Reaper/Valiant (each their own entry to circumvent rule of three or whatever)

Hammerfall Bunker

[Guest Triszin]

I have a feeling we may see the other three chapters be relatively early in the 9th ed roundup to be honest. At which point the book requirement will drop again. If marines are october. I could see DA being November, BA in December and SW in January. Kind of like the other marine supplements before

if historical trends are to go by, BA and DA will be by Nov. 2020

Wolves supp will be Nov of 2021.

 

didn't wolves get pretty much that with saga of the beast?

 

ours and flesh tearers seem to follow the rules from blood of baal.

Wolves had 6" HI on characters, now its replaced with 3" HI for all.

Edited July 25, 2020 by Triszin

[Indefragable]

New Datasheets in the next SM codex:

Captain with HBR

Primaris captain entry will include indomitus loadout

Primaris lieutenand entry will include indomitus loadout

Primaris Chaplain on bike

Primaris Techmarine

Assault Intercessor

Heavy Intercessor

Bladeguard Ancient

Bladeguard Vets

Veteran Intercessors

Relic Terminators (Cata or Tartaros most likely)

Outrider Squad

Invader ATV Squad

Stormspeed Hellstrike (and two more variants people were unable to make the name of)

Eradicator Squad

Firestrike Support Platform

Gladiator Lancer/Reaper/Valiant (each their own entry to circumvent rule of three or whatever)

Hammerfall Bunker

https://www.reddit.com/r/WarhammerCompetitive/comments/hxqsi1/new_space_marine_codex_table_of_contents/

 

^leaked table of contents. Maybe someone has better eyes than I, but supposedly it shows that Scouts are now Elites, and Assualt Marines and Devastators are Troops? That last part definitely does not make sense to me, but this is the chatter on reddit.

 

Note: even the above is passed on to me second hand.

[Panzer]

I don't want to relive days when we were just red marines with a gimmick. 

 

But here's  the thing. That's what we pretty much already are. That's what pretty much every chapter is. They all are coloured Marines with one or two gimmicks. Even Ultramarines all memes aside. It's just that for a long time we were one of the few lucky ones who got the love of having our gimmicks representated as more than just fluff. Something GW has slowly expanded to the other "vanilla" (they really aren't that vanilla if you actually read their fluff) chapters as well with the supplements. Those supplements can easily get extended with more unique units too.

[ThatOneMarshal]

Personally I’m just excited that we will always be getting updates to our baselines rules at the same time as everyone else.

 

Speaking as someone who plays BA, Black Templar’s and ultramarines I don’t overly mind the supplement life style.

 

Yes for my BT it sucks a lot but I personally put that down to GW just keeping us because we are grandfathered into the game and they have to keep giving the bare minimum. We had only two unique units for ourselves and had one actual codex. We also compete with blood angels and space wolves for being the close combat armies. We probably aren’t as popular so we get the last pick normally.

 

On the other hand my ultramarines got a ton of really unique stuffing in their supplement that made me excited enough to start an ultramarines army fully. Past attempts always felt too boring to me as they always felt too vanilla. In terms of fluff they got a ton of stuff that hadn’t been explored in the past (or it had been tucked away in obscure books). Also the nicest thing was the fact that a lot of the stratagems in their were able to incorporate the mainline marine codex.

 

Also another keynote that’s pretty neat is even when my own unique units for the BT suck I can usually stay competitive by using the rest of the marine book. More importantly I get a ton of more variety to try out whenever I want to which keeps me going whenever I want to collect or play non competitive games. That’s not really something I can say for my blood angels.

[pandion40]

In theory it could be great, removing all the non unique unit’s to the Sm dex could give them more space for lore, rules and unique units in our supplement. But in my opinion GW hasn’t been putting in much effort to our codex for a long while, very much by the numbers and done out of obligation not love.

 

So my opinion the most we’ll get with the new supplement is a possible Primaris Dante and over multiple editions a reduction in our uniqueness as our old units go over to legends and no new ones are added.

 

I often hear people asking when will we get Primaris Sanguinary Guard but for me the question should be will we get Primaris Sanguinary Guard at all. Death company has been done with minimal effort, just paint the Standard marines black and the Primaris chapter upgrade sprue is a joke compared to the old standard marine one.

 

I predict a move to all units being available to all chapters in the future. Not good news for us but it may be good news for Xenos to get more attention, on the other hand GW will probably just compensate with even more Ultramarines love instead.

 

Sorry for being a bit down, I’m actually ok with Primaris and most of the new lore, I just don’t think there’s anyone in key positions at GW that has any love for us.

 

On the upside though I think we’ve had some great love from the Black Library writers, The Dante and Mephiston series have spoiled us plus I’ve heard ADB has a soft spot for us so hopefully his siege book will be good for us.

Edited July 26, 2020 by pandion40

[Aztec]

Flesh Tearers chapter tactic seems at a glance at stills taken from the codex video to stack with doctrines which i hope is correct, althoug due to quality of the video might be incorrect. I'm not bothered whether it is better or worse than the BA's +1 adv/charge rolls in the end with this change, but just the fact that we can actually make use of the trait now inside assault doctrine makes me so much happier than before.

Edited July 26, 2020 by Aztec

[Blindhamster]

Death company always used to be black blood angel marines and really should just be that. The death company set from 2nd ed was literally the blood angel marines in a set. When they started having "death company models" it always seemed odd to me as the lore is they paint their armour black and add saltires.

[pandion40]

Death company always used to be black blood angel marines and really should just be that. The death company set from 2nd ed was literally the blood angel marines in a set. When they started having "death company models" it always seemed odd to me as the lore is they paint their armour black and add saltires.

Even I agree with this but I can see why you’d think I don’t. I was always in 2 minds with the old kit because it looked cool but didn’t really fit.

 

My point was it’s the least effort way of adding Death company to the game, I didn’t mean to imply a value judgment on this though I can see I did. It’s just a comment to support my opinion that we’re going to see a reduction in support for the more unique aspects of the BA, SW and DA going forward.

[SnorriSnorrison]

Flesh Tearers chapter tactic seems at a glance at stills taken from the codex video to stack with doctrines which i hope is correct, althoug due to quality of the video might be incorrect. I'm not bothered whether it is better or worse than the BA's +1 adv/charge rolls in the end with this change, but just the fact that we can actually make use of the trait now inside assault doctrine makes me so much happier than before.

Are you certain that's true? So far, the latest FAQ states that they can't stack their AP with the Assault Doctrine and the overview of the codex leak doesn't seem to change that...

[Panzer]

 

Flesh Tearers chapter tactic seems at a glance at stills taken from the codex video to stack with doctrines which i hope is correct, althoug due to quality of the video might be incorrect. I'm not bothered whether it is better or worse than the BA's +1 adv/charge rolls in the end with this change, but just the fact that we can actually make use of the trait now inside assault doctrine makes me so much happier than before.

Are you certain that's true? So far, the latest FAQ states that they can't stack their AP with the Assault Doctrine and the overview of the codex leak doesn't seem to change that...

 

 

Iirc in the leak it explicitly mentions that it stacks with the assault doctrine, however of course nobody is absolutly certain without holding it in their own hands.

[Aztec]

 

Flesh Tearers chapter tactic seems at a glance at stills taken from the codex video to stack with doctrines which i hope is correct, althoug due to quality of the video might be incorrect. I'm not bothered whether it is better or worse than the BA's +1 adv/charge rolls in the end with this change, but just the fact that we can actually make use of the trait now inside assault doctrine makes me so much happier than before.

Are you certain that's true? So far, the latest FAQ states that they can't stack their AP with the Assault Doctrine and the overview of the codex leak doesn't seem to change that...

 

 

 

Best quality i could find from the video. I read "On an unmodified wound roll of 6, improve the Armour Penetration characteristic of that attack by 1. This is cumulative with the bonus from the Assault Doctrine if it is active for your army".

Edited July 26, 2020 by Aztec

[Thoridon]

Aye, I personally won’t mind if we don’t get DC Primaris models as long as they get a decent datasheet. If we can build them from Assault intercessors and just paint them black that works for me. The key things for me would be that they get options to take more than just chainswords and then a jump pack option, as being restricted to footslogging melee units would be a pain after all the mobility we’re used to.

 

I anticipate an Assault Intercessor equivalent with jump packs will be released at some point, though so far all jumpy units have been in units of 3 rather than 5-10. Anyhow, once there is a generic Primaris jump pack melee unit I could see us having the ability to use them, assault intercessors and regular intercessors as DC versions.

 

In terms of making the generic models more BA-ish there are the upgrade sprues. Those of us who’re long term BA players probably also have substantial bits boxes which is a luxury over a new player starting a BA Primaris force from scratch.

 

But yeah... generic boxes with upgrade sprues/spare bits would make sense to me. I guess a big influence will be their data on how well the current DC kits sell compared to regular kits - if it’s worth it to them we’ll see DC Primaris kits, if they largely take up stock space we probably won’t.

Edited July 26, 2020 by Thoridon

[Thoridon]

Best quality i could find fromt he video. I read "On an unmodified wound roll of 6, improve the Armour Penetration characteristic of that attack by 1. This is cumulative with the bonus from the Assault Doctrine if it is active for your army".

I read the exact same from that picture. Looks like good news - though in the past they have printed things like that and then changed their mind 2 weeks later in errata.

[SnorriSnorrison]

 

 

Flesh Tearers chapter tactic seems at a glance at stills taken from the codex video to stack with doctrines which i hope is correct, althoug due to quality of the video might be incorrect. I'm not bothered whether it is better or worse than the BA's +1 adv/charge rolls in the end with this change, but just the fact that we can actually make use of the trait now inside assault doctrine makes me so much happier than before.

 

Are you certain that's true? So far, the latest FAQ states that they can't stack their AP with the Assault Doctrine and the overview of the codex leak doesn't seem to change that...

 

Best quality i could find from the video. I read "On an unmodified wound roll of 6, improve the Armour Penetration characteristic of that attack by 1. This is cumulative with the bonus from the Assault Doctrine if it is active for your army".

Oh Golly! That’s good then, didn’t make sense at all when BoB hit. That’s great news for our more dire brethren!

[Midnightmare]

I know what colour I will be painting my Assaulty bois!

[Blindhamster]

I know what colour I will be painting my Assaulty bois!

looks like this is just a regular death company intercessor.

[Midnightmare]

False alarm then* :(

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*I will still be painting them that colour :)

[Blindhamster]

False alarm then*

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*I will still be painting them that colour

I still hope there is the option! Im hoping they make DC intercessors have the options for any of the intercessor weapon options including assault and maybe whatever heavy are.

[Hintzy]

Can't figure out how to post photos from my phone, even in desktop mode, without turning my post into a code scramble. But it looks like they just reused a model from one of the original DC Intercessor pics.

 

https://images.app.goo.gl/8Ky6fqHx2EDDMcpK6

Edited July 26, 2020 by Hintzy

[The Unseen]

If they let outriders go up to 6 like classic bike squads, I think they'll do great for us as a huge character screen when backed up with a sanguinary ancient with the SoS. Having to chew through 12 T5 3+ saves with a 5+++ before you can ignore them for Look Out Sir. And they move fast enough jump pack characters can move+advance and still be behind them.

 

Extra spice with shield of sanguinius from a librarian. Think its the first unit I think actually warrants the 5++.

[ThatOneMarshal]

I’m surprised nobody brought this up yet but a big change for us is the rule that we only get 1 captain per a detachment. I think we are the only ones (ravenguard and white scars might too) that’ll be hurting from that rule considering our fondness (as a faction) for running multiple smash captains.

 

Considering the changes to assault, characters, and detachments I have a feeling most of us weren’t considering running a lot of characters in the first place.

[Blindhamster]

I’m surprised nobody brought this up yet but a big change for us is the rule that we only get 1 captain per a detachment. I think we are the only ones (ravenguard and white scars might too) that’ll be hurting from that rule considering our fondness (as a faction) for running multiple smash captains.

 

Considering the changes to assault, characters, and detachments I have a feeling most of us weren’t considering running a lot of characters in the first place.

unless you didn't rely on the smash captain crutch in the first place :D :D :D

but seriously, i think it's good, makes perfect sense from a lore perspective.

[SnorriSnorrison]

I’m surprised nobody brought this up yet but a big change for us is the rule that we only get 1 captain per a detachment. I think we are the only ones (ravenguard and white scars might too) that’ll be hurting from that rule considering our fondness (as a faction) for running multiple smash captains.

 

Considering the changes to assault, characters, and detachments I have a feeling most of us weren’t considering running a lot of characters in the first place.

I agree with Blindhamster, it makes more sense this way. You can still field a Smash Captain or his successor, the Smash Chaplain! Just not spamming Captains, which is fine by me from a fluff perspective. Also I like the command structure with one Captain and two Lieutenants, I wonder if there will be any more to this in the future.

 

I do realize that this is a nerf to us, but it's a nerf to all SM armies as well. While we really didn't need any of the points changes or nerfs to the charge phase, I think this is a change that we can adapt to quite easily. And yes, the Slamguinius is a crutch. I've never played with a Smash Captain and while I've lost a fair share of my games in 8th, I've won some as well without him.

[Jolemai]

Third game against Ad Mech booked in for Sunday (1500 points).

Death Guard rather and I finally beat them! Will post more later tonight :)