Hintzy Posted November 29, 2020 Share Posted November 29, 2020 (edited) Giving a Judiciar the 6" Heroic Intervention trait would effectively return his Tempormortis to 6"+, no? And with how cheap he is, he might be a decent option for Angelic Sacrifice. With a 4++ he could survive, but if he doesn't it's much less of a loss. Could be a decent way to blunt the charge of a strong melee opponent. Maybe even throw in Visage of Death to make the units he's protecting ObSec and improve his durability. Thoughts? Edit: plus, if he uses Angelic Sacrifice and dies you likely won't need to bother spending CP on Only In Death to get his swings in, as he'll likely have already fought due to his Tempormortis. Edited November 29, 2020 by Hintzy Karhedron 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaezus Posted November 29, 2020 Share Posted November 29, 2020 Giving a Judiciar the 6" Heroic Intervention trait would effectively return his Tempormortis to 6"+, no? And with how cheap he is, he might be a decent option for Angelic Sacrifice. With a 4++ he could survive, but if he doesn't it's much less of a loss. Could be a decent way to blunt the charge of a strong melee opponent. Maybe even throw in Visage of Death to make the units he's protecting ObSec and improve his durability. Thoughts? Edit: plus, if he uses Angelic Sacrifice and dies you likely won't need to bother spending CP on Only In Death to get his swings in, as he'll likely have already fought due to his Tempormortis. This is a great combo. If you happen to have a chaplain nearby who recited the +2 charge litany, the judiciar could use that extra 3" pile in too as a bonus. Visage of death removes obsec from enemy units; if you want to make your units obsec you'd have to make the judiciar your warlord, give him rites of war and pay CP to give him selfless valour for the HI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hintzy Posted November 29, 2020 Share Posted November 29, 2020 (edited) Right, got that backward. Thanks. Probably not worth it then. Edited November 30, 2020 by Hintzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted November 30, 2020 Author Share Posted November 30, 2020 Right, got that backward. Thanks. Probably not worth it then. No, you are right, Visage of Death provides 2 buffs. One turns off ObjSec but the other provides a -1 to-Hit in melee. I agree that it is a pretty good fit for a Judiciar since he already has an Invuln. The other item that it quite good for him is the Adamantine Mantle for a 5++. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaezus Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 Just noticed an oddity with the Sanguinary Ancient. His datasheet allows him to take a power axe or power fist, yet neither are listed under his points values. Same thing happened in the index. Free fist for the ancient it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhavien Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 The Sanguinor is locked to a WLT of which he only can use half of it and not even the good half? Impressive GW... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matarno - Lord of Skyfall Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 Thinking that a Chapter Master with dual traits and dual relics is going to be legit. Angel Artifice and Master Crafted Weapon thanks to Artisan of War, plus Imperium's Sword. Relic Blade at S8 on the charge kicking out 3 Damage. Storm shield to get that 1+, 4++ and T5 with 6 wounds... Seems like a great candidate for tanking hits via Angelic Sacrifice. Also, Master of Sanctity relic also makes for a great candidate to protect important units. Big base on a terminator or bike chaplain should force a ton of enemy models to force attacks in with no rerolls in sight. Karhedron 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blindhamster Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 The Sanguinor is locked to a WLT of which he only can use half of it and not even the good half? Impressive GW... Yeah he has the one he has because it makes sense from a lore perspective - he bolsters the other blood angels leadership. IMO he should have also had a rule that reduced the chance of succumbing to the flaw post game in crusade tbh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smileyjim Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 Thinking that a Chapter Master with dual traits and dual relics is going to be legit. Angel Artifice and Master Crafted Weapon thanks to Artisan of War, plus Imperium's Sword. Relic Blade at S8 on the charge kicking out 3 Damage. Storm shield to get that 1+, 4++ and T5 with 6 wounds... Seems like a great candidate for tanking hits via Angelic Sacrifice. Also, Master of Sanctity relic also makes for a great candidate to protect important units. Big base on a terminator or bike chaplain should force a ton of enemy models to force attacks in with no rerolls in sight. You can't take Master crafted on a relic blade unfortunately Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smileyjim Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 The Sanguinor is locked to a WLT of which he only can use half of it and not even the good half? Impressive GW... Yeah he has the one he has because it makes sense from a lore perspective - he bolsters the other blood angels leadership. IMO he should have also had a rule that reduced the chance of succumbing to the flaw post game in crusade tbh. Actually that's an interesting point, given Mephiston is now the anti sanguinor they totally missed the opportunity give his character some cool fluffy rules around that too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matarno - Lord of Skyfall Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 Thinking that a Chapter Master with dual traits and dual relics is going to be legit. Angel Artifice and Master Crafted Weapon thanks to Artisan of War, plus Imperium's Sword. Relic Blade at S8 on the charge kicking out 3 Damage. Storm shield to get that 1+, 4++ and T5 with 6 wounds... Seems like a great candidate for tanking hits via Angelic Sacrifice. Also, Master of Sanctity relic also makes for a great candidate to protect important units. Big base on a terminator or bike chaplain should force a ton of enemy models to force attacks in with no rerolls in sight. You can't take Master crafted on a relic blade unfortunately Unless I missed an FAQ update, there is nothing preventing the use of the Master Crafted special issue wargear upgrade on a relic blade. You can't use Master Crafted on a Relic of Baal, but a relic blade is just basic wargear for a Captain. You can't use it on a master crafted power sword, as the wording of Master Crafted specifically states that you can't use it on wargear that has master crafted in the name. If I have missed something, I would love to know but I don't think that I have. Karhedron 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smileyjim Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 Its in the wording in brackets, I've still not figured out images on this forum so I can't post the pic. Here us the wording, (This cannot be a relic or a weapon whose profile includes master crafted) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smileyjim Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 Oh I just reread your post again. Hmm.... yeah maybe your right, the blade is called a relic but that's in name only BLACK BLΠFLY and Matarno - Lord of Skyfall 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matarno - Lord of Skyfall Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 Oh I just reread your post again. Hmm.... yeah maybe your right, the blade is called a relic but that's in name only As I understand it, the meaning is that you can't use Master Crafted on a Relic of Baal. Like the Hammer of Baal, or the Figure of Death. A relic blade is not a Relic of Baal, meaning it can be boosted to that sweet Gravis murdering 3 damage. BLACK BLΠFLY and Karhedron 2 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dice4thedicegod Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 I’m thinking: Flesh Tearers Captain in terminator armor [crimson plate relic] and pair of lightning claws [artisan of war to allow master crafting]. That’s a movement 6, advance and charge, 7 attacks at D2, beatstick with extra pile in and consolidate movement. Between that and sanguinary priests with chainsword relics and Gabriel Seth (and give a jump captain the hammer of Baal via loaner strat) then the flesh Tearers got a whole bunch more decent hero builds than they had for a long time. smileyjim 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smileyjim Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 Oh I just reread your post again. Hmm.... yeah maybe your right, the blade is called a relic but that's in name only As I understand it, the meaning is that you can't use Master Crafted on a Relic of Baal. Like the Hammer of Baal, or the Figure of Death. A relic blade is not a Relic of Baal, meaning it can be boosted to that sweet Gravis murdering 3 damage. Yeah I agree mate. I had it in my head that you couldn't take it when I wanted to put it on teeth of terra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaezus Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 "..cannot be a relic.." A "Relic blade" is a relic, surely? In the same way that the Axe Mortalis, Vitarus etc. are relics. Their absence from the relic section doesn't mean they are not relics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keeblerartillery Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 "..cannot be a relic.." A "Relic blade" is a relic, surely? In the same way that the Axe Mortalis, Vitarus etc. are relics. Their absence from the relic section doesn't mean they are not relics I think that is conflating some issues/rules. Those pieces of war gear only go with named characters - who cannot be given any kind of war gear or warlord trait different than what they come with. So when the rule is referring to relics it is referring to those items listed under relics. Just because it has the word relic in its name does not in fact make it a relic for the purpose of the rules. That would be like saying I can equip a character with a relic contemptor now because it is a relic. Karhedron, BLACK BLΠFLY, Matarno - Lord of Skyfall and 1 other 4 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indefragable Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 "..cannot be a relic.." A "Relic blade" is a relic, surely? In the same way that the Axe Mortalis, Vitarus etc. are relics. Their absence from the relic section doesn't mean they are not relics I think that is conflating some issues/rules. Those pieces of war gear only go with named characters - who cannot be given any kind of war gear or warlord trait different than what they come with. So when the rule is referring to relics it is referring to those items listed under relics. Just because it has the word relic in its name does not in fact make it a relic for the purpose of the rules. That would be like saying I can equip a character with a relic contemptor now because it is a relic. Precisely.... A relic blade is a generic type of wargear, while a Relic is a Named Relic specifically listed under the "Relics" section. GW loves to recycle terms, so blame that. A different example would be if a unit can take a "power axe", and then under Relics there was one named "The Power Axe!" .....the former is not a Relic, but the latter is because it's a Named item and more importantly it's specifically listed on the Relics page. Special characters are an exception, since their named wargear is counted as being Relics by default. ****************************** On a different note...... <grumbles> https://www.goonhammer.com/hammer-of-math-death-company-vs-wulfen/ I'm never one to be jealous of other kids' toys, but I've been annoyed at Wulfen since their launch back in 7th Ed since they feel like everything Death Company should be, and the Goonhammer math clearly shows that.... ....which honestly is fine in a vacuum, except when it comes to an equal number of points of each, Wulfen still are WAY better. <Grumble> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diagramdude Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 Has anyone pointed out that Blood Angel Inceptors can drop down now and get +1 to hit with Descent of Angels? Majkhel 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaezus Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 Well, learn something new every day Has anyone pointed out that Blood Angel Inceptors can drop down now and get +1 to hit with Descent of Angels? Really? How so?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diagramdude Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 Descent of Angels is now ignore any penalty to charges and +1 to hit for a jump pack unit that arrived from reinforcements. Karhedron, Shaezus and Captain Caine 24th 3 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted December 1, 2020 Author Share Posted December 1, 2020 It is a really strong ability. It is a shame Plasmaceptors now overheat on natural 1s so you will likely still need a Captain around if you want them to Overcharge. Still, it is a great way to boost their firepower and well worth considering. Also makes a useful combo with "Death from Above" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diagramdude Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 Or a libby dread flying over to their drop site to share some ancient wisdom! Karhedron 1 Back to top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keeblerartillery Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 I have indeed noticed that and fully intend on using that strat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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