--++ Legio Solaria Titans ++--

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

Inspired by the great Blackadder (see here for one of the best build logs on the internet), I have been spending a week or two drawing up my own vision of the Imperator-class Titan.

 

Obviously this is a great deal easier to do in the 3d memory of a computer than physically in real life, however nonetheless I present to you all the "Pillar of Terra's Wrath"...

 

 

In doing this modelling work, I have attempted to match fluff with appearance.  the Imperator is, as depicted here, a little under 70 m tall, from feet to top of the central tower (ignoring the dome on top).  The converts to slightly over 227 feet tall, compared to the 32.76 m / 107' 6" of the Mars pattern Warlord.  At 40k scale then, the Imperator would be approx. 1.32 m / 4' 4", whereas the Forge World warlord stands approx. 22.5" tall.  This makes sense to me, as if the Imperator can mount primary Warlord weapons en masse on it's carapace there surely must be a significant size difference.

 

In some images there is a Land Raider for scale... so the Imperator isn't as big as one might first image!

Edited December 1, 2020 by Lord_Mephistopheles

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

Update:

 

After a TOTAL rebuild of the 3D model, i present the following for comment in my gallery.

 

 

Meet "The Scion of Dying Light".

 

 

Now, as we all know, GW has a scale problem with titans.... something i have attempted to rectify.  The small red blob you may be able to see against the carapace is 1No. 9ft tall Primaris-style Astartes... This, reference combined with a "typical" 6ft human and rough dimensions for the tertiary and point defence weapons leads to from feet to top of the highest spires, The Scion being a little over 207 metres tall (a fraction under 680 feet for our US brothers and sisters).  This seems to match better with the imagery on the covers of the latest BL books.  By this scaling and that reference, I suspect a Warlord would be about 92 m / 301 feet tall, which would work for the scale of the Warlord weapons mounted on the carapace.  A Warmaster would thus be roughly 122 m / 400 feet tall

Edited March 23, 2021 by Lord_Mephistopheles

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

No, I don't have an obsessive disorder with giant robots... why do you ask?

 

My "re-inventions" of the Titans.  In my head-canon, these are all Tigrus-pattern titans, from the home Forgeworld of Legio Solaria.  Bit of a halfway house between the more common Mars-pattern, and the Lucius-pattern. 

 

I've tried to make them "sensible" in terms of weaponry, especially the point-defense systems which Titans seem to habitually struggle with.  They're thus decked out with heavy bolters and lascannons for dealing with what i will call "tabletop level" threats.  Most of the Battle titans also have at least one "tertiary" weapon system (typically in the form of Arachnus heavy lascannons) for dealing with slightly bigger stuff.  They all also have some form of air defense, as it always seemed to me that your average Titan was reliant on a bit of good luck and voids to avoid being bombed into the 43rd millenium, much like the demise of the battleship in WW2.  There is therefore some flavour of Hydra flak battery on everything from the Warlord up, with the Reaver and Warhound instead relying on weight of fire from autocannon arrays - the Reaver having 4 storm cannons (16 barrels), and the Warhound settling for a three-point twin-linked autocannon array.

 

The sizes of these titans have been scaled roughly from a human, the assumption being that the carapace "flat surface" (the bit between the battlecannon turrets that the big towers sit on) is big enough for someone to walk around in.  That gives me the height of the Imperator as a little bit over 270 metres / 680 ft to the tip of the rear spires. 

 

The Imperator is, obviously, armed to the absolute teeth, based on both the old school Imperator from the 90s and the Apocalypse datasheets which are floating round on the web.  I beefed up the plasma weapon until it looked right, taking inspiration from the Warmaster Suzerains, and the Warlord Sunfury.  I re-imagined the Hellstorm cannon - the fluff can't decide whether this is a laser or projectile weapon, so I decided to make it a huge neutron particle weapon.  Each of the carapace turrets is armed with a battlecannon, and either an Iliastus Accelerator turret, or twin-link lascannons.  This is the closest thing to "ENUFF DAKKA" that I could feasibly fit on the thing, without dedicating it to Mork and Gork.

 

 

I scaled the Warmaster to fit between the Imperator and the Warlords in scale, based roughly on the size comparison image that GW put out - the Warmaster is therefore 130 m to the top of the Revelator missile array on the carapace.  The Hellstorm Destructors that the "Forgotten Kingdom" is armed with are my own invention, being a scaled down version of the weapon on the Imperator.  I'll be tweaking these again into a smaller version, probably twin-barrelled, to mount as an arm-weapon on a Warlord.

 

 

I then based the size of the Warlords on the cover of "The Burden of Loyalty", which shows them coming up to about the weapon-mount level on the Imperator.  Thus, the Warlords are, to the top of the vents adjacent to the carapace weapons, 101.6 m / 333' 4".

 

 

The Reaver and Warhound were scaled appropriately from the same image - 80.9 m / 265' 5" and 47.7 m / 156' 6" respectively.  I don't have names for any of these yet, so I'm open to suggestions.  

 

These sizes are, obviously, quite a bit bigger than the quoted sizes that GW have put out, but seem to be more fluff-compatible.

 

 

In the group shot above, you may be able to see a small smudge between the feet of the Scion... which is a 9ft tall Mk-X armoured Primaris.  The giant robots are, therefore, quite giant!  

 

Still got quite a lot of detailing to do.  The Reavers and Warhounds are, obviously, in a much more "unfinished" state.

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

Well.

It's been a while since I posted anything to THIS topic!

Instead, i've been merely lurking in the background, mostly watching the amazing Blackadder build his 40k scale Imperator.  I don't hide it - he was largely the inspiration for this project of my own!

 

This project has, to some extent, grown arms and legs as the level of boredom in my day job has waxed and waned, hence why this now isn't limited to the giant robots - my favoured Astartes have gotten some love as well!  I also got enamoured by the Imperial Knights, and despite saying I wasn't going to touch Astra Militarum, i've ended up modelling some of the more "sensible" tanks as well.

This is why you don't mess with the Imperium of Man.

[Raziel-TX]

Very cool. Thanks for sharing. 

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

This grabbed a bit more attention than i was expecting... including from Doghouse, whose artscale marines i remember from 'lo so many years ago!

 

Anyway, i've gone ahead and rendered some additional views of some of the smaller or harder-to-see items from the above composition, and we're starting with the Big Fellas!

 

The Scion of Dying Light:

 

The Scion is - if you read back through the thread to my earlier posts - what started this whole thing off, and is my attempt to capture not only the essence of the old classic "Imperator" model from the 90s Titan Legions games, but also to draw something that fits the current GW aesthetic and also something which befits the Apocalypse rules for such a monstrosity that were around a few years ago.

 

 

 

So much inspiration from so many different artists on the internet that I'd find it difficult to credit them all.

Edited December 8, 2022 by Lord_Mephistopheles

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

Pillar of Wrath

 

The Pillar is, much like the Scion, a reinterpretation of some old school GW 90s badness.  Those of you of a certain vintage may remember the Warmonger class Emperor titans for Titan Legions, which were conceived as a long-range fire-support platform to supplement the more general-assault Imperator.  Borne of the same basic chassis, but built for the specific purpose of putting ordnance on a target.  You may remember the model which was briefly available, with the Doomstrike missile launcher on one harm, and the Vengeance cannon on the other, with 4 AA batteries of some kind on the carapace.  It looked - and i'll be generous here - derpy.  I've tried to make it less so.

 

 

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

Jackal-class Light Scout Titan

 

This is the first of my "entirely invented from my own brain" Titans - and these were borne of a combination of things:

 

1) the old-school 80s metal Warhounds which were later produced in 40k scale by Armorcast;

2) the idea that there are Imperial Knights almost as big as a Titan (presumably meant to be the Warhound, but that didn't work for my headcanon)

3) the release of the Dire Wolf Heavy Scout for 'Adeptus Titanicus' - more on that later.

 

Thus was born the Jackal-class.  Smaller, lighter, less heavily-armed and -armoured than a Warhound, but also much quicker and stealthier as a result.

 

The weapons were based off the idea that they are less heavily armed than a Warhound, so began with the idea that each "arm" mounted half of the equivalent Warhound weapons - thus the turbo-laser got split in half, as did the plasma blastgun.  Where the Warhound version (in-game) would do 2 shots at a single target from each weapon (simplistically), the Jackal would do a single shot from from each weapon of equivalent strength from each arm.  The remaining plasma weapon - which is an upscaled plasma fusillade from the Deredeo dreadnought; and the other las-weapon (which is effectively a large-scale multi-laser, based loosely off the Arachnus Storm Cannon on the Telemon dreadnought) - fulfill different tactical roles for dealing with mass heavy infantry and comparatively light vehicles (Leman Russ equivalent things).

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

Raptor Heavy Scout Titan

 

I told you we'd come back to the Dire Wolf...  When it was first released i was quite excited, but the more time went by the more and more i grew to dislike the official model.  While it fit a niche in the game, it became very obvious it existed PURELY to fill that very specific niche, hence the lack of options.  I couldn't shake the idea that it made sense though, but it needed some tactical revision.

 

Having already invented the Jackal-class, and the lighter weapon systems associated with them, it made sense to me that the appropriate loadout for the Heavy Scout was a set of the lighter arm weapons, combined with the carapace-mounted heavier Reaver weapon (volcano cannon or neutron laser).  Having blocked the design out, i was suddenly struck by how amusing the tiny "arms" looked against the obvious necessity of a larger body to accommodate a large carapace weapon, and it took me by surprise that i suddenly thought "T-rex", and the rest is history!

 

The legs are obviously beefed up due to the extra weight and the "recoil" from the carapace weapon, and the "claws" on the feet are an affectation for stylistic purposes, rationalised as being able to anchor the Titan to the ground prior to firing.  I attempted to bled both Reaver and Warhound aesthetics to some extent, and Hasbro take some credit for the Grimlock-inspired head design.

 

(As an aside, there exists in my modelling folder on my laptop a quadrupedal titan named the Carnivore-class... inspired in itself by a throwaway line in 'Titandeath' which referred to an archaic class of tripedal Imperial Titan... however an extremely trustworthy source of first-hand knowledge about the past of GW assures me that "Jervis would have had my balls in a sling" for proposing a non-bipedal Imperial Titan design...)

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

Adeptus Astartes

 

Most of the Marine vehicles are effectively direct copies of the GW models, adjusted for scale.  There are some minor stylistic differences and affectations i have introduced to give a common aesthetic, but otherwise they are what they are.

 

Some went through some more substantial changes however to meet my own headcanon, the first of which being the Spartan.  Primarily this was updated to match the style of the current Land Raider, but also tweaked the weaponry somewhat to suit its role, so it gained not only twin-linked heavy flamers to replace the heavy bolters, but also a Razorback turret for additional firepower - and because it's the Son's of Sanguinius, it HAD TO BE twin-linked assaulkt cannons... :

 

 

Next, the jetbikes.  Given that jetbikes used to be a thing, and that Marines still have access to anti-graver speeder technology, and further that the Astraeus is something the Primaris have access to via Cawl, it makes no sense to me that there are no jetbikes, so i tried to create one, matching the aesthetic of the Storm Speeder prototype and also the Scimitar jetbike.  There is both a heavy weapon version and a non-heavy weapon version which is armed simply with twin-linked bolters.

 

 

 

The Mastodon is a bit of a reinvention.  The Super-heavy transport was first mentioned in 'Fear To Tread', and FW eventually released a model, which i found a bit underwhelming.  I've tweaked the design to my own tastes, and also tried to link the design to the Thunderhawk and the Stormbird.  For scale, the larger rear tracks are reversed drive sections from the Spartan, and the front sections are from the Sicaran... the Mastodon is BIG.

 

 

 

Finally, the Mammoth.  Those who used to play Command and Conquer may recognise the name and the inspiration.  It also conveniently works nicely as it is a vehicle based on the Mastodon, so makes sense for the names to be connected as well!  The Mammoth is intended to be a pure anti-armour vehicle, and as such it is armed with twin Titan-class turbo-lasers in a turret-mount.  The idea was that the Astartes would need weaponry capable of taking down Titan-sized targets, once the voids were taken down by massed fire from other sources.  One could potentially replace the turbo-lasers with twinned Reaver-class Volcano cannons....

 

 

Edited December 8, 2022 by Lord_Mephistopheles

[Naryn]

Absolutely glorious stuff, what a wealth of inspiration. Love it!

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

Mars-pattern Imperator Titan - [unnamed]

 

Well, it's been a while, but my obsession has continued unabated in the background!  Something never quite looked right about my previous Imperator.  The Tigrus-pattern looked ok from some angles, but from others it was just.... "off", in some indistinguishable way.

 

So, given i'm now more experienced at defining more complex shapes, i figured i'd give it another go!  And this is, thus far, the fruit of my labour!

 

The proportions on this model are, to my eye, slightly better in a "more Imperium" way.  The lower head and higher main guns are more evocative of the original Imperator model from the early-90s Titan Legions game; as are the legs which already work better than previously, albeit the hips are too wide i feel and are limited by the inner "toes" clashing, hence the rear-inner toes may undergo a Titan-sized toe-ectomy.

 

Other modifications - as this pattern is built only on Holy Mars, the bastion of lost Mechanicum technology - i have relegated further the use of projectile weaponry such as quake cannons etc as my feeling is that these are replacements utilised by the less-advanced Forge Worlds that perhaps don't have access to the capacitors, focussing crystal lenses etc. to be able to manufacture energy weapons in sufficient quantity.  Therefore, only the tertiary carapace weapons utilise battlecannon, but these are of the "accelerator" flavour much as on the Astartes Fellblade - rather than the more mundane "gunpowder" launched variety. 

 

The Quake Cannon is replaced with a twin Belicosa Volcano Cannon.  The Gatling blasters are replaced with a second bank of turbo-lasers.  And under-carapace Volkite Eradicators are added, just to make stripping voids that little simpler for the coup-de-grace from the Plasma Obliterator, which is unchanged.  

The other change of note is the addition of another barrel on the Hellstorm Cannon, which has improved the balance of the primary weaponry as previously the Hellstorm was a bit "thin and weedy looking" in comparison.

 

There remains a deal of detailing and faffing to get this model to the same level as some of my previous, but i shall continue undeterred!  Comment and suggestions gratefully received!

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

 

Having gotten so far with the detailing on the updated pattern, i've hit a conundrum...

I think i like the new design much much more than my older "Tigrus-pattern" Imperator, shown on the left...

 

I've done some component mixing and matching which has resulted in the above... and now i'm even MORE in a conundrum, as I really can't decide which design i like best!!

The carapace fortress on the central design would need to be slightly widened to suit the wider primary weapon arrangement, but otherwise seems to work well.  Clearly some of the carapace weapons are missing to speed up the quick render, but otherwise, what are the opinions of the B&C hive-mind?

[Firedrake Cordova]

I think for me, the flat surface of the armour around the head, and on the lower legs, looks a little "plain" to me? But that's just me  

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

On 11/17/2023 at 12:29 PM, Firedrake Cordova said:

I think for me, the flat surface of the armour around the head, and on the lower legs, looks a little "plain" to me? But that's just me  

Thanks for the feedback. The chest armour needs some additional detailing that I've just not got round to yet.

 

The lower legs aren't finished either - they will get the cathedral doors as the previous model for the infantry to disembark. 

 

I think I've decided that either the central or rightmost work best. The original model always had some angles where the proportions just didn't look right, and it was a source of irritation to me.

 

Headcanon is that the Imperator-pattern Emperor Titan is an STC that is ONLY held on Mars, so they make all of them, but the top fortress, armour and weapons is either installed or repaired/replaced by the forge worlds attached to the parent Legion, which explains the different appearances. 

[Firedrake Cordova]

Ah, right. In that case ... I think the middle one looks better than the left-hand one, because it looks a little less "hunched" when you look at where the head is, and how the carapace sits in relation to the head. I think the carapace on the one on the right works well and may be better, but my opinion is somewhat coloured by being old enough to remember when GW made an Imperator Titan model (i.e. nostalgia-goggles  )

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

Fully agree. I have similar nostalgia goggles, but I never liked the 90s Imperator model.

 

I'm thinking more of the artwork on the HH books, particularly "Titandeath".  But the legs on those never look quite right either. 

 

I think the one on the right blends well with the Mars pattern Warlord and Warmaster though 

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

15 hours ago, Firedrake Cordova said:

Ah, right. In that case ... I think the middle one looks better than the left-hand one, because it looks a little less "hunched" when you look at where the head is, and how the carapace sits in relation to the head. I think the carapace on the one on the right works well and may be better, but my opinion is somewhat coloured by being old enough to remember when GW made an Imperator Titan model (i.e. nostalgia-goggles  )

 

For reference however, the only difference is the carapace.  The head etc is in exactly the same place.  The only difference is the carapace wrap-around armour drops down below the carapace level.  The "level" of the underside of the carapace is identical.

[Firedrake Cordova]

Ah, that's interesting. Maybe it's because the middle model is taller than the left-hand model, so the camera angle is different? It's interesting how it's fooling my senses, either way!

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

Well the camera angle is slightly different because it's off to one side rather than dead-on, but these were all rendered in the same pass, so it isn't like they've been stitched together.

 

Probably what's doing is is that the "flat surface" that the carapace is built off is at the same level in both, but in the rightmost version, the curved armour panels extend down below the carapace surface, whereas in the central model clearly there is no armour, so all you're seeing is the flat surface.

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

Another Monday.  Another morning of pointless meetings.

 

Which, paraphrasing Thanos, means that more giant robots are "inevitable".

 

 

Update to the Imperator are general tidying up and the thigh armour, albeit this needs tweaking.

 

I got distracted by updating the Warmonger instead... which has come along at pace.  I've made some subtle changes to the torso to indicate these are a variation on a shared-STC, while retaining some visual identity.  The Warmonger now gives off Blastoise-vibes, but again, i think represents a significant visual improvement on the previous version.  Not visible are the 2 secondary reactors mounted on the underside of the carapace at the rear to power the additional weapons-systems - another idea stolen without shame from the Warmaster titan!

 

I do need to work out how to visually-incorporate the Doomstrike missile launcher - older Titan fans may remember the awkward arm-mount array from the late-90s model which looked ridiculous.  The issue is that a vertical launch arrangement makes it largely invisible on the carapace; and a rotary launcher looks too much like the Revelator-array on the Warmaster.  I welcome suggestions.

 

Also - to give me a break from the detailing of these, i have another plan in mind...

 

 

Yes, i know it's meant to just be a Warlord... but it has been drawn differently, hence i envisage a larger fire-support titan in the same vein as the Warbringer is basically Reaver-size with a larger-class weapon... there may be some tech-heresy involved!  No-one tell the Fabricator General!

[ZeroWolf]

These are fantastic 

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

--++ DEATHBRINGER-NEMESIS HEAVY SUPPORT TITAN ++--

 

I mentioned in my previous post that i'd been inspired by the artwork contained therein, and that i had accordingly envisaged a heavier fire-support titan based loosely on the Warlord in the same vein as the Reaver / Warbringer Nemesis.

 

Accordingly, here are the early images of my progress on my third class of "invented in my brain" Titans... the Deathbringer-Nemesis!

 

 

Clearly, there is some work needed to bulk this out, and the carapace armour may yet change form and "droop" slightly lower with a tighter curvature.

 

This is intended to largely be a "single-weapon loadout" class of titan, with the twin Belicosa being almost secondary to the twinned Hellstorm Arquebus array mounted on the carapace.  These are a slightly smaller, less rapidly-firing version of the Hellstorm Cannon particle-beam weapon found on both the Imperator and the Warmonger.  I had originally considered tech-Heresy by trying to envisage a Mechanicum-version of the T'au railgun tech, but i couldn't make it look right so reconsidered for the sake of aesthetics.

 

In common with the other "fire support titans" in my re-designs, the CIWS weaponry on this will be comparatively light - this is not an assault machine in the sense of being swarmed by infantry!  If there are that many enemy infantry crawling around close enough to cause an issue, then your lines have been breached and you've got bigger issues!

 

As ever, I welcome comments - be they criticisms or ideas!

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

 

It doesn't look THAT much different I grant you, but the Deathbringer-Nemesis now has more bulk and more detail to it, and also now has a name!

 

Say hello to "The Subtle Shift In Emphasis", with all due credit to Iain Banks.

 

 

You'll note the torso has been bulked out; the Bellicosa Volcano Cannons on the arms have been updated; and the Hellstorm Arquebus array on the carapace have had a small amount of further blocking out and detailing.  I still need to work out and detail the mounting rails for these.  Tertiary weapons were also added for point= and air-defense.

[Lord_Mephistopheles]

 

Seen here from left-to-right, the latest updates to my newly-updated Mars-pattern titans.

 

Leftmost - the Scion of Dying Light, an Imperator-class engine, armed with a Plasma Obliterator and a Hellstorm Cannon on the primary armatures, a twin Volcano Cannon and a Defense Laser Battery as secondary carapace weapons, and tertiary weapons of paired Turbo Laser Blasters, paired Turbo lasers, and paired Volkite Eradicators.

 

Central - the Subtle Shift in Emphasis, a Deathbringer-Nemesis-class engine, configured for long-range fire support, armed with a Hellstrom Arquebus array on the carapace, and paired Bellicose-pattern Volcano Cannons on the arm mounts.

 

Rightmost - the Pillar of Wrath, a Warmonger-class engine, armed with a Hellstorm Cannon and a Neutron Laser Blaster on the primary armatures, paired Quake Cannon and paired  Defense Laser Batteries as secondary carapace weapons, and tertiary weapons of paired Apocalypse Launchers, paired Turbo lasres, and paired Volkite Eradicators.  (To be added is the Deathstrike missile array, once i work out how to integrate what is basically a multiple-ICBM launcher without it looking terrible).

 

The observant amongst you may notice the thigh-swap between the two largest engines - this being because the chunkier thighs never looked right on the IMperator, whereas heavier legs makes sense on the fire-support Warmonger.  I think i've finally arrived at designs for my Emperor-class Titans that I'm completely happy with, and that look similar enough to be the same basic template, but different enough to show they are different beasts with different purposes... albeit that the Emperor-class machines have grown in size somewhat and are now bigger than ever before!

 

At some point I will re-render my "Don't Mess with the Imperium" group shot with all the various minor tweaks and updates that have been made over the last 18 months or so...