State of the Union (Heresy)

[Noserenda]

I dunno, it feels like that would replicate a huge amount of basic stuff and depending on release cadence permanently mess with power balance, just from misprints or errors, let alone tweaks to the second book released. A Book with the full Legion army list and a second book with all the Legions modifiers is a better idea, especially when FW still isnt really doing FAQs. 

[MARK0SIAN]

Yeah one of the major strengths of heresy is that every legion gets its core stuff from one place. That means if it’s good it’s good for everyone and if it’s under/over powered at least it’s like that for everyone too. I don’t see how separating that stuff into two books benefits anyone and potentially could cause issues.

 

Plus I really like that you have the flexibility in heresy to play at any time point in it. You can field a force of traitors pre-heresy if you want and several of the rites allow for that by not specifically restricting them to a traitor force. A good example is the EC ones, Maru Skara is playable by loyalist and traitor EC whereas the 3rd company elite is restricted to traitors because it focusses on kakophoni. I’d be worried about a potential loyalist versus traitor book split removing that flexibility.

[SkimaskMohawk]

Yea other than characters there's only a handful of units that are legion locked like red butchers and kakaphoni. A number of traitor legions also have loyalist characters, further complicating matters.

 

The big draw of the AT book is it compiles most of the scattered rules from across 6 different books and puts them in one place. The 30k books already do that along a better split (legion rules, army list) than faction. They just to be updated from 5 years ago.

[Hfran Morkai]

I've just picked up both Legions army books so that'll undoubtedly mean they announce AoD 2.0 with refreshed everything soon.

 

FW normally announce on a Friday, right?

[Bung]

You could do an Imperialis Army list including:

Militia, Solar Auxilia, Custodes, Sisters of Silence

 

and a Mechanicum book with loyal and traitor Mechanicum.

 

That would only leave Deamons of the Ruinstorm.

Edited April 8, 2021 by Bung

[Aias]

You could do an Imperialis Army list including:

Militia, Solar Auxilia, Custodes, Sisters of Silence

 

and a Mechanicum book with loyal and traitor Mechanicum.

 

That would only leave Deamons of the Ruinstorm.

 

They already do that. There's the Mechanicum Taghmata list and the Crusade Imperialis list which cover those groups. Like the Astartes army list, though, they need to be updated.

[Bung]

 

 

You could do an Imperialis Army list including:

Militia, Solar Auxilia, Custodes, Sisters of Silence

 

and a Mechanicum book with loyal and traitor Mechanicum.

 

That would only leave Deamons of the Ruinstorm.

 

They already do that. There's the Mechanicum Taghmata list and the Crusade Imperialis list which cover those groups. Like the Astartes army list, though, they need to be updated.

I was replying to Hfran Morkai what Else they could do after giving the Astartes list an update.

Adding Custodes and Sisters to the Imperialis Book would help, as you curently need 2 Black books to play them.

 

And Mechanicum could be expanded to have demon possesed vehicles etc. for traitors if they rework the Thagmata list.

[Doctor Perils]

I think at this point it may be preferable for them to make all the legions have separate "codex supplements" to add to the main red book, bundle in their black book lore with their updated rules.

 

This would mean you could get just the supplements that you are interested in, and not feel like you've missed out on the early black books.

 

Also, move the current presentation of black books and red books to be the "limited editions", giving room for a cheaper format for books generally (and probably offer eBooks for sale too)

[Allart01]

I think at this point it may be preferable for them to make all the legions have separate "codex supplements" to add to the main red book, bundle in their black book lore with their updated rules.

 

This would mean you could get just the supplements that you are interested in, and not feel like you've missed out on the early black books.

 

Also, move the current presentation of black books and red books to be the "limited editions", giving room for a cheaper format for books generally (and probably offer eBooks for sale too)

 

The problem I have with that is that there would be no way they'd release them all together, and since they just released the full rules for all 18 legions after ten years (!) I'd hate to see them start all over again.

[Doctor Perils]

In fairness, most of the legions deserve an update anyway, and there's no way they'd get released all in one go either. At least this way the turn around time may be slightly reduced?

[sarabando]

as much as i dislike 40ks style of rules i think legion codex's may be the way forward. Have a base army list that can be used for any legion in the main rule book with a selection of characteristics you can take to flavour your army like they had in the 4th? edtion marine dex and then have specific legion codexs with all their own rules and stand alone lists.

and they should look at releasing each of these codexs in under a year, no need for minis with them tbh. just like 2 a month or so.

Edited April 11, 2021 by sarabando

[Cris R]

The legion core list and supplements would also allow FW to experiment with different size books for the gaming community. The Red Books and the Black Books - both hardcover and softback - are nice pieces to have at home. But I wish we had more portable print options in con friendly sizes like the paperback mini version of the 7th edition rules that would transport more easily and take up less space on crowded gaming tables. A digital version of each codex would also go a long way in addressing this problem as well.

 

I could see FW doing special discounted online bundles where they offer the codex, a praetor, and legion-specific upgrade pieces for the core plastic range we've been discussing so far. They already do online bundles for certain legions like the Blood Angels, so there's precedence for this move.

Edited April 11, 2021 by Cris R

[SkimaskMohawk]

I don't like that very much.

 

Part of what makes legion vs. Legion 30k great is that everyone has the same base toolkit when it comes to list building. Every legion has access to leviathans, or veterans, or dreadclaws or any other good unit. There's going to be some variation in how units are leveraged, but the limiting factor is money or self-handicapping with a narrative focus.

 

This already kind of happens with some rites. Some legions can build lists in ways that aren't very replicable, or get so many bonuses there's no point in building that way on another legion. But the choice to try and do it still there. You also aren't forced to deal with the more forceful list building restrictions if you don't want to. You're not saying "X legion will always be unable to take Y unit, or only ever have 1 selection of Heavy Support" .

[depthcharge12]

I have it from my reliable source now that even though the Suez Canal is unblocked, the recent passing of Prince Phillip has lead the specialist team at GW to relocate the final unnamed Heresy employee over to the bloodbowl group. So no new praetor sculpts from legions released 8 years ago in the immediate future.

[Morngrym]

I have it from my reliable source now that even though the Suez Canal is unblocked, the recent passing of Prince Phillip has lead the specialist team at GW to relocate the final unnamed Heresy employee over to the bloodbowl group. So no new praetor sculpts from legions released 8 years ago in the immediate future.

 

Perhaps he could finish just a few more new Praetor sculpts before he goes?  

[Doctor Perils]

I don't like that very much.

 

Part of what makes legion vs. Legion 30k great is that everyone has the same base toolkit when it comes to list building. Every legion has access to leviathans, or veterans, or dreadclaws or any other good unit. There's going to be some variation in how units are leveraged, but the limiting factor is money or self-handicapping with a narrative focus.

 

This already kind of happens with some rites. Some legions can build lists in ways that aren't very replicable, or get so many bonuses there's no point in building that way on another legion. But the choice to try and do it still there. You also aren't forced to deal with the more forceful list building restrictions if you don't want to. You're not saying "X legion will always be unable to take Y unit, or only ever have 1 selection of Heavy Support" .

I'm doing my best to not be sarcastic and snarky here (it's 6am during my holidays, this is not a natural time for me ^^') - what you are saying is perfectly in keeping with "legions red book + single legion supplements" format that we are talking about here. Just like the current space marines codex and supplements.

[Joe]

 

Cropped up again on the website early this morning, according to a friend. Seems to appear every now and again depending on what you search.

 

Think this is the fiftieth time it's been pointed out by now, lol.

[Allart01]

 

 

Cropped up again on the website early this morning, according to a friend. Seems to appear every now and again depending on what you search.

 

Think this is the fiftieth time it's been pointed out by now, lol.

 

Now this is encouraging! :)

[Gorgoff]

 

Cropped up again on the website early this morning, according to a friend. Seems to appear every now and again depending on what you search.

 

Think this is the fiftieth time it's been pointed out by now, lol.

I don't get it. What do we see on this screenshot?

[SkimaskMohawk]

 

I don't like that very much.

 

Part of what makes legion vs. Legion 30k great is that everyone has the same base toolkit when it comes to list building. Every legion has access to leviathans, or veterans, or dreadclaws or any other good unit. There's going to be some variation in how units are leveraged, but the limiting factor is money or self-handicapping with a narrative focus.

 

This already kind of happens with some rites. Some legions can build lists in ways that aren't very replicable, or get so many bonuses there's no point in building that way on another legion. But the choice to try and do it still there. You also aren't forced to deal with the more forceful list building restrictions if you don't want to. You're not saying "X legion will always be unable to take Y unit, or only ever have 1 selection of Heavy Support" .

I'm doing my best to not be sarcastic and snarky here (it's 6am during my holidays, this is not a natural time for me ^^') - what you are saying is perfectly in keeping with "legions red book + single legion supplements" format that we are talking about here. Just like the current space marines codex and supplements.

I should have hit quote, because ChrisR replied before I posted; I was talking about sarabandos post about stand alone lists.

 

As for legion supplements in the vein of 40k ones, it could be a thing; the rites, legion rules and units come to about the same page length as the 40k rules, but the 40k supplements are notably terrible value for the rules they provide. Its 20 cad for one digital supplement, while the digital age of darkness legions is 34 cad. So uhh, pay 10x the price for the same amount of rules content.

 

Honestly, the current method is the best in terms of rules accessibility for cost. Just needed to be updated more than twice a decade.

[Lucien Eilam]

I don't get it. What do we see on this screenshot?

“The Horus Heresy” and “Warhammer Forge” appearing as top-level categories in the main site search.

 

I doubt it means anything, it’s been happening for months/years now, probably since they migrated Forge World and Black Library to the same platform as games-workshop.com.

[sarabando]

its the 3rd time in 2 years iirc that forge has shown up but i think its the first time HH has appeared.

[Darkwrath121]

 

its the 3rd time in 2 years iirc that forge has shown up but i think its the first time HH has appeared.

Both HH and Forge tabs have always appeared together, 3 times now since last June or July. Gives the impression that they'll be launched together, whatever it ends up being.

From December, when they last appeared:

Edited April 12, 2021 by Darkwrath121

[Petitioner's City]

Although where is AOS on those tabs? Is that under Warhammer forge? It seems weird the second major gaming system isnt there for this future website update

[Darkwrath121]

Although where is AOS on those tabs? Is that under Warhammer forge? It seems weird the second major gaming system isnt there for this future website update

Edited April 13, 2021 by Darkwrath121