Black Templar Teaser and Rumors

[Blindhamster]

wow you guys are hard to please. I'd kill for an upgrade sprue that was half as good.

you'll have spare crusade helms in both the crusader and brethren squads without a doubt, same goes for shoulder pads. I'd bet that between an upgrade set, crusader set and brethren set, you'd have enough bits to suitibly black templarify an intercessor and bladeguard squad too (plus bits for some characters).

[T14]

wow you guys are hard to please. I'd kill for an upgrade sprue that was half as good.

You misunderstand, brother. We are just full of ZEAL^TM

Our previous chapter upgrade was also quite good, considering the time of production, so it would be dissappointing to settle for less after years of waiting. I am quite happy with the upgrade in visual quality this time round. I am just anxious about the quantity proportions

 

And I am sure the BT releases are a sign of the quality of content in the pipeline for other chapters

 

 

you'll have spare crusade helms in both the crusader and brethren squads without a doubt, same goes for shoulder pads. I'd bet that between an upgrade set, crusader set and brethren set, you'd have enough bits to suitibly black templarify an intercessor and bladeguard squad too (plus bits for some characters).

I have had a break from 40k for several years while my local group focussed on Epic40k (6mm) games. The whole primaris thing kind of put me off space marines tbh, but with these releases I am ready to restart the crusade in a footslogging primaris format. I expect to retire my firstborn infantry alltogether, but will strip and repaint my forgeworld dreads for the new crusade. I am planning to bulk out my force using boxes of assault intercessors, crusader squads and sword brethren. The spare part content of these templar releases will decide what proportion of the three boxes I settle on.

 

-T14

[Marshall Bretton]

Also just spotted that one of the spare heads on the upgrade sprue (top left on the pic) is definitely meant to be the other character in that blanche artwork. I can't get over how many nods to the old art and models there have been in this release

[Crom's Will]

Since there are several bits meant for neophytes, there surely must be primaris scouts on the horizon or at least an inclusion of models in a future set. Why else would they push in that direction for models which will only be in the release next week?

[jaxom]

Since there are several bits meant for neophytes, there surely must be primaris scouts on the horizon or at least an inclusion of models in a future set. Why else would they push in that direction for models which will only be in the release next week?

 

The Primaris Crusader squad gets a box after the initial army launch set. The Primaris Crusader box will contain neophytes. Players who want to give them shotguns or those other "several bits" will have to buy the upgrade sprue even though the upgrade sprue is mostly redundant for that kit. Or they will buy the kit already to upgrade Intercessor, Assault Intercessor, Gravis squads, and characters and then can use the rest with the neophytes.

 

If anything, by gating the miniatures and their unit options behind Chapter specific units and kits, I think it is less likely there will be a new scout kit for non-Phobos scout units in Codex: Space Marines.

[Marshal Reinhard]

 

Since there are several bits meant for neophytes, there surely must be primaris scouts on the horizon or at least an inclusion of models in a future set. Why else would they push in that direction for models which will only be in the release next week?

 

The Primaris Crusader squad gets a box after the initial army launch set. The Primaris Crusader box will contain neophytes. Players who want to give them shotguns or those other "several bits" will have to buy the upgrade sprue even though the upgrade sprue is mostly redundant for that kit. Or they will buy the kit already to upgrade Intercessor, Assault Intercessor, Gravis squads, and characters and then can use the rest with the neophytes.

 

If anything, by gating the miniatures and their unit options behind Chapter specific units and kits, I think it is less likely there will be a new scout kit for non-Phobos scout units in Codex: Space Marines.

 

They initially 'gated' intercessor sergeant weapons behind different chapter specific upgrade sprues. thunder hammers and handflamers were initially onl yavailable from the salamanders upgrade sprue, but open to everyone.

[jaxom]

That is an excellent point!

[Odd-ad]

New article is up, vows and passions

 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/10/05/when-the-black-templars-take-a-vow-in-their-new-codex-supplement-they-really-mean-it/?utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=Twitter&utm_campaign=Twitter&utm_term=TemplarVows051021&utm_content=TemplarVows051021

[Odd-ad]

Looks like GW took inspiration from the old codex again, each vow has a bonus, but also a drawback.

 

e.g. Accept Any Challenge puts all units in combat in the assault doctrine and gives an extra attack (doesn't stack with shock assault) but you can't fall back

[Marshal Mattias]

That's fantastic, I love it! Not sure I have ever voluntarily fallen back from a combat anyway

[BitsHammer]

I like how they give buffs but have drawbacks. It'll be nice if GW could do that with every ruleset.

[Medjugorje]

i am not impressed with AAC. I hoped for reroll all hits so that we can play our army as MSU.

being in the assault doctrine was always possible in any form with Crusader helment, stratagems and 3rd round.

This Vow seems to be really bad. not comulative with shock assault is sooo baad

[Banjulhu]

Always on Assault doctrine seems useful.

 

I wonder if Knights of Sigismund is still in there and if it is written in such a way as to work with the vow (current wording would not work as it requires the Combat Doctrine to be active rather than just getting the bonus as if the doctrine was active.

[Blindhamster]

i am not impressed with AAC. I hoped for reroll all hits so that we can play our army as MSU.

being in the assault doctrine was always possible in any form with Crusader helment, stratagems and 3rd round.

This Vow seems to be really bad. not comulative with shock assault is sooo baad

honestly thought totally the opposite. Being able to guarantee you're able to use assault doctrine without burning CP, or using a specific relic, from round 1, is very good. It means you can launch the assaults before other marines are able to fight back effectively. The +1 in attack essentially means where other marines hit hard at the start, templars just keep fighting with as much skill. It's very good for any fight that lasts more than a round - which makes sense as the theme of the vow is fighting no matter the odds.

[Odd-ad]

AAC would also pair nicely with our Devout Push shenanigans, if we keep it that is

[Medjugorje]

That's fantastic, I love it! Not sure I have ever voluntarily fallen back from a combat anyway

in our tournament Whatsapp group we are all common sence. This Trait is far more worst then dont having that. Its really bad.

 

Falling back is often important (gamewise - although I know that its not very templar ´ish).  But the main concern for me is that the bonus is not good. Its not just an additional ap or something.Its finally just 4th round tactical doctrine. For all other cases we used to have the crusader helmet and the stratagem which take the most important unit into the assault doctrine. 

 

 

That more I think about  I am really frustrated. And Admech and Drukhari are still super stupid good.

 

i am not impressed with AAC. I hoped for reroll all hits so that we can play our army as MSU.

being in the assault doctrine was always possible in any form with Crusader helment, stratagems and 3rd round.

This Vow seems to be really bad. not comulative with shock assault is sooo baad

honestly thought totally the opposite. Being able to guarantee you're able to use assault doctrine without burning CP, or using a specific relic, from round 1, is very good. It means you can launch the assaults before other marines are able to fight back effectively. The +1 in attack essentially means where other marines hit hard at the start, templars just keep fighting with as much skill. It's very good for any fight that lasts more than a round - which makes sense as the theme of the vow is fighting no matter the odds.

 

How many charges are possible in first round usually?

With devot push and will of the emperor maybe ONE.

In all competitive games the opponent dont give you the option to charge more then one unit.

 

C´mon GW ... that sucks.

[Blindhamster]

lol, i repeat my previous comment, you guys are hard to please!

[Brother Talarian]

I really don’t think it’s bad….. in my experience either:

Your units are all engaged before T3 so you nearly never get a bonus.

Games are often decided by T3/4 so if you can get your bonus ASAP that’s a good thing…

 

EDIT:

This is also the first snippet of the rules that we see, let’s wait and see. Maybe there’s a strat that gives army wide +10 attacks permanently. We don’t know. Wait and see.

 

It’s an obvious buff to what it used to be. OP? Maybe not. Time will tell

Edited October 5, 2021 by Brother Talarian

[Medjugorje]

I really don’t think it’s bad….. in my experience either:

Your units are all engaged before T3 so you nearly never get a bonus.

Games are often decided by T3/4 so if you can get your bonus ASAP that’s a good thing…

 

EDIT:

This is also the first snippet of the rules that we see, let’s wait and see. Maybe there’s a strat that gives army wide +10 attacks permanently. We don’t know. Wait and see.

 

It’s an obvious buff to what it used to be. OP? Maybe not. Time will tell

in my experience ( and i played already in lots of tournaments) you are always in assault docrine. Especilly if the charge is important. Because of Crusader helmet. And back then we had autowounds on 6s which is not a bonus anymore what makes that even worst.

[Banjulhu]

On the plus side it would appear the Sword Bretheren kit has at least 3 power swords in it.

And the Bladeguard Ancient shows up again.

Now it would be cool if the Sword Bretheren unit got the Bladeguard keyword so they could get the +1 to hit from the ancient.

[Medjugorje]

lol, i repeat my previous comment, you guys are hard to please!

thats because I really hoped to see Reroll to hits or  +1 to hit in general for this treat - like it was in 3rd to 5th edition. 

 

And with our current lists this Vow has no positive impact in the whole game. 

[Sword Brother Adelard]

I think it's great. Turn 2 in particular, shoot with the benefit of tactical doctrine, fight with the benefit of assault. 
Even turn one, if you go second and get charged turn one by a fast army, the fight back has as many attacks as the first round of combat. 

I think it's great, and considering how little I fall back, it's all good.

[redmapa]

I mean if you really wanted to get a turn 1 charge you can totally do it, infiltrating warsuits or with drop pods with a chaplain it, you can most certainly get a 9" charge off if you are rerolling it and adding 2" from the chaplain. Drop pods arent that good but reserves come off on turn 2 and with fast units you should be able to get stuck in by then, AAC opens the possibility for you to stay in Tactical while always benefitting from Assault doctrine. I honestly dont see aa negative to this.

 

I do think you will have to lean on these buffs to get the most of them and that will maybe change what your list priorities are. For example Abhor the Witch isnt great but a mechanized list will benefit from it since all your infantry now gets out an extra 6" and not just 3", Impulsors make everyone even faster! Might be heresy but with Impulsors shooty units can now be anywhere and if Devout Push stays then that unit gets an extra 18" movement.

[Medjugorje]

I think it's great. Turn 2 in particular, shoot with the benefit of tactical doctrine, fight with the benefit of assault. 

Even turn one, if you go second and get charged turn one by a fast army, the fight back has as many attacks as the first round of combat. 

 

I think it's great, and considering how little I fall back, it's all good.

But be honest... how many charges are possible in competitve games? most likely one or two. And then you use Vangaurd Vets with claws and buffed with crusader hlemet and litanies and so on.........

 

If there are not great stratagems then I swear to you that all of us wont take that vow  in next frew month.

 

The great thing ( while being so negative at the moment)... we can choose one of the 4 each game. So we dont have to take AAC all the times except there is maybe one opponent where it might be good.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

Unless the other two are very good, why would you not take it? It adds consistency because you have the same amount of attacks whether it was a turn with charges or not. Falling back in a melee army is usually more bad than good, because you can't do anything, where at least if you stay in combat you can shoot pistols and swing again with an extra attack.