How are people adapting to the massive changes?

[Gilbertus1]

1 hour ago, Bulwyf said:

then the poster above who doesn't play Night Lords but was arguing with me an actual Night Lords player about them

You do realise anyone who makes a custom warband can claim to play all the legions?

As I said anyone can read the book and see the stengths and weaknesses, you don't need to specifically play the army to know what is good and what isn't.

Merely saying something is bad, isn't evidence it is. Claims and opinions do not define reality, evidence and logic does.

 

 

[Prot]

2 hours ago, Brom MKIV said:

@prot so is there a thread to vent about the book? A collection of valid complaints can be constructive as I suspect GW can read. Hell they probably have accounts here. If they pay sites to give positive reviews why not joining a forum too?

 

Re read my post. Nothing is stopping someone from starting a topic and having a productive conversation about the legion  rules.. I can tell you newer members, we have had this in the past. The thing is, this topic is getting side tracked into these side debates. I can tell you from experience it eventually degrades into an echo chamber. So please let’s keep this thread more towards its intended topic by the OP : How are you Adapting?

Edited July 5, 2022 by Prot

[Bulwyf]

1 hour ago, Gilbertus1 said:

You do realise anyone who makes a custom warband can claim to play all the legions?

As I said anyone can read the book and see the stengths and weaknesses, you don't need to specifically play the army to know what is good and what isn't.

Merely saying something is bad, isn't evidence it is. Claims and opinions do not define reality, evidence and logic does.

 

 

I am not going to derail this thread with more back and forth. You are a newer member here. I'll give some advice as a veteran member: when the mods say cool with something they mean it. I'm more than  happy to debate this with you in another thread that is about Night Lords or I guess constructive criticism of the book as a whole. But not any more in this thread. 

Mods feel free to delete this post if you feel it is warranted. I was trying to help the new member out.

[Iron Father Ferrum]

Here's an idea: create a thread specifically debating the relative merits of (or lack thereof as case maybe) the new Night Lord rules.  I've got a whole thread going just about the scaly boys, you can start one all about the scary ones.

[Khornestar]

++ I think we can find a middle ground, then.

If this thread has value to frater here as per the OP, it can stay open.

If the thread is simply a reservoir of complaints, off topic comments will be hidden, and if there is no further productive conversation will be locked. ++

Edited July 6, 2022 by Khornestar

[dice4thedicegod]

Question regarding Fabius bile and the dank apostle units:

each of these units has a character keyword model and one or two models which lack the character keyword… I assume that they all benefit from ‘look out sir’?   That your opponent can’t just  shoot at  the surgeon acolyte (because it lacks character keyword) and then have any extra hits spill onto fabulous bill?

[Lord Raven 19]

15 minutes ago, Dice4thedicegod2 said:

Question regarding Fabius bile and the dank apostle units:

each of these units has a character keyword model and one or two models which lack the character keyword… I assume that they all benefit from ‘look out sir’?   That your opponent can’t just  shoot at  the surgeon acolyte (because it lacks character keyword) and then have any extra hits spill onto fabulous bill?

You are correct, look out sir keys of a target unit containing any character models (with less than 9 wounds).

[Kaiju Soze]

 

39 minutes ago, Dice4thedicegod2 said:

Question regarding Fabius bile and the dank apostle units:

each of these units has a character keyword model and one or two models which lack the character keyword… I assume that they all benefit from ‘look out sir’?   That your opponent can’t just  shoot at  the surgeon acolyte (because it lacks character keyword) and then have any extra hits spill onto fabulous bill?

 

23 minutes ago, Lord Raven 19 said:

You are correct, look out sir keys of a target unit containing any character models (with less than 9 wounds).

 

Also protects the Dark Commune.

Edited July 6, 2022 by Kaiju Soze

[Slave to Darkness]

On 7/5/2022 at 7:13 PM, Cel_Morgaris said:

I`ll try to find another forum with less busybody mods I guess, thanks.

Good luck with that, you may have less moderation on other 40k sites but you get more toxicity and poop throwing... Theres a reason why B&C has been around for 20 years, and threads that turn into the same argument over and over (especially as the thread is for adapting to the new dex and not for how bad it is) should get locked, hell Ive been the cause of thread locking myself over the years, at least now I keep most of my iffy comments off this forum and just blast GW on FB and Discord as I dont want to sour the community here. Whilst I may not agree with the mods decisions all the time I understand why they do the things they do. 

 

 

 

As for the actual topic at hand, for an army that mostly uses Possessed, Terminators and Chosen (I literally have 1 troop choice in my army and thats a single unit of Sonic Marines) what do people think would be better, Creations of Bile or Emperors Children?

Edited July 6, 2022 by Slave to Darkness

[WrathOfTheLion]

So Fallen (datasheet) no longer exists, but now there is no restriction on picking 'Fallen' as your legion, only on World Eaters, Thousand Sons and Death Guard.

So I guess if you wanted to play them, they're just another warband now? I guess that works, at least there's some stability to the faction now if so.

Edited July 7, 2022 by WrathOfTheLion

[Slave to Darkness]

19 minutes ago, WrathOfTheLion said:

So Fallen (datasheet) no longer exists, but now there is no restriction on picking 'Fallen' as your legion, only on World Eaters, Thousand Sons and Death Guard.

So I guess if you wanted to play them, they're just another warband now? I guess that works, at least there's some stability to the faction now if so.

They have had a codex every edition since 2nd edition, but for some reason GW always called them Dark Angels instead of correcting the Typeo 

[Prot]

It’s good to know about the character unit rule. I was reading the dark Communion rules wondering how it would work.  I just really didn’t put it together.  I may look at that HQ now but to be honest I still find our HQ slot exceptionally good. So much so I haven’t  even revisited the Daemon Prince. 

[Gothical]

6 hours ago, Prot said:

It’s good to know about the character unit rule. I was reading the dark Communion rules wondering how it would work.  I just really didn’t put it together.  I may look at that HQ now but to be honest I still find our HQ slot exceptionally good. So much so I haven’t  even revisited the Daemon Prince. 

I keep thinking that I want to wait on any Daemon Prince build ideas because of the new model that Warhammer Community previewed - a new Datasheet will be on the way whenever that kit drops because it clearly has a gun built into it's vambrace and there's no option of that on the existing Datasheet. Whether that is the only change or not, or if everything will get a revamp, obviously remains to be seen. Until then, I don't want to think about combos that may soon be invalid or superseded with better options.

So far I am finding useful tricks for every other HQ choice (personally skipping the Dark Commune too as it doesn't really fit my Iron Warriors). The regular Chaos Lord and the Exalted Champion are the most niche but even they have a place in certain builds/playstyles.

[Toldavf]

Deamon princes of nurgle can do some serious damage to single targets.

[Evil Eye]

I never actually picked up the new CSM book and now I'm glad I didn't bother because if what I'm reading about wargear options is anything to go by oh dear.

[Khornestar]

10 hours ago, Evil Eye said:

I never actually picked up the new CSM book and now I'm glad I didn't bother because if what I'm reading about wargear options is anything to go by oh dear.

Oh dear you don’t want to deal with changing the configuration of your minis, or oh dear you don’t think the options are good, or what?

That response really doesn’t contribute to the discussion at hand.

Edited August 24, 2022 by Khornestar

[Iron Father Ferrum]

It honestly has been near as large an impact as the vocal whiners have made it out to be.  It hurts the most with Termies, but they're all the rage as a durability block rather than as a strike unit at the moment.

Lords and Sorcs are honestly the poor relations of the HQ slots in competitive play too, with Discos, DPs, and MoPs hogging the limelight so the option losses there are also not felt on the tabletop as much.

[DesuVult]

It is interesting to me to be described as vocal whiner because I like terminators performing as more than a stack of wounds and like to model them as I did in the past in this army, how I do in my other 40k army, and how I do in 30k.  

[Khornestar]

They do perform as more than just a stack of wounds, though.

How did you run them in your games with the new codex? What were your opponents playing and using against them? What targets did you pit them against?

Edited August 25, 2022 by Khornestar

[tychobi]

Possessed are amazing especuslly with black rune of d, all god marks are great, disco lords with flames of spite so murdery, ive been running over all opponents with word bearers. We are a melee dex now. Incidental shooting is fine but very few dedixated shooters are worth the points. Master of posession trip casting with venom crawler bonuses and a exsulted possession demon prince do a lot of heavy lifting too.  Play the way of chaos and get in there. This is a great book if you are willing to get agressive and play on the edge. 

[Iron Father Ferrum]

20 hours ago, DesuVult said:

It is interesting to me to be described as vocal whiner because I like terminators performing as more than a stack of wounds and like to model them as I did in the past in this army, how I do in my other 40k army, and how I do in 30k.  

If the shoe doesn't fit, don't wear it.

 

A five man squad can take three combis and a heavy, so they can still generate decent volumes of shooting.  It's not quintuple plasma, I know, but it's not terrible.