Wh40k 10th Edition Faction Focus: Thousand Sons

[Dr. Clock]

47 minutes ago, sairence said:

what exactly is the way something like Sisters of Silence counters psychic armies now?

Swiftly murdering any psyker they're pointed at? Since they get Precision and Devastating 4+ against psychers, I'd imagine that you can chew down 1KSons Cabal points with some ease. Also Sisters are ignoring all psychic attacks 2/3 times. It looks like 'shutting down buffs and de-buffs' is not really a thing, which I'm fine with. If you pay some points to do a thing to your own models, or don't directly attack, I don't think the enemy should be able to mess with that much at all. Also if we don't really have many options for psychic powers in general, I think it's wise not to have constant interaction just to pull the levers you've built your main strategy around.  Psychic defence is now properly defence.

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

[9x19 Parabellum]

3 minutes ago, Dr. Clock said:

 If you pay some points to do a thing to your own models, or don't directly attack, I don't think the enemy should be able to mess with that much at all. 

 

Power Armor would like to have a word with Twist of Fate.

[Orange Knight]

These rules look thematic, powerful, and most importantly - very fun.

 

I am really liking what GW is doing with all the factions. I just hope they don't muddy the water too much with an avalanche of different detachments over the coming years.

[Frogian]

They don't look very fun for the opposition. 

[Indy Techwisp]

26 minutes ago, Commissar Yossarian said:

especially if the Epic Hero tag does prevent Magnus and Ahriman being in the same list.

 

It's one of each type of Epic Hero, not only one Epic Hero.

So Magnus and Ahriman on a Disk in the same army is OK, but Ahriman on a Disk and Ahriman on foot in the same Army isn't OK.

[Naryn]

So these rules look pretty nice on the whole, I'm very relieved that we got some solid wizardry to pull off. At the same time, Inferno bolts have gotten worse again? We went from negating armors saves of 3+ entirely in 7e, to being AP-2, and now we're AP-1, which is only slightly more dangerous than your average bolter?

[Indy Techwisp]

Also, where does the TSons Sorc on the Thumbnail come from?

It took me a sec to realise that's not a Helmet he's wearing, but instead that's his entire head.

[DemonGSides]

I sold all my TSons last year, but they have some of the coolest looking head options for any Space Marine.

 

edit: Just realized those aren't horns on his head in the pic above, THEY ARE HANDS.

Edited May 25, 2023 by DemonGSides

[Tokugawa]

3 minutes ago, Indy Techwisp said:

Also, where does the TSons Sorc on the Thumbnail come from?

It took me a sec to realise that's not a Helmet he's wearing, but instead that's his entire head.

His arms....isn't him a secret agent of GSC? 

[sairence]

36 minutes ago, 9x19 Parabellum said:

 

Power Armor would like to have a word with Twist of Fate.

 

Any Armour would like a word. Especially my entire collection of tanks, who have exactly 0 defence if their armour gets ignored. But I suppose we're just talking about 150-500p a turn/phase here.

 

As for switfly murdering them...the day mass bolters swiftly murder anything but chaff hasn't arrived yet, at least not in my local scene.

 

Like don't get me wrong, it's great that Thousands Sons are getting cool and interesting stuff. But it's probably the first faction focus where I got really worried about counterplay 

Edited May 25, 2023 by sairence

[WrathOfTheLion]

8 minutes ago, Indy Techwisp said:

Also, where does the TSons Sorc on the Thumbnail come from?

It took me a sec to realise that's not a Helmet he's wearing, but instead that's his entire head.

He's in the Thousand Sons Codex, they have art like that for the heads of each of the cults or something like that.

[Rain]

Feels like it will be strong. The ability to just turn off armor saves, move in the shooting phase, and assign mortal wounds all seem quite good. Potentially in a “feels bad” way for Twist of Fate, as others have said. Not getting to roll anything to try to save your dudes as your opponent rolls lots of dice to mow them down feels demoralizing.
 

On the other hand, previewing TS and not showing Tzaangors is like previewing DG and not showing Plague Marines. Unthinkable.

[9x19 Parabellum]

At least, with the way T has increased, your tanks are getting wounded on 6's against bolters. (or 5 with Ahriman, or 5 with rerolls vs. Ahriman + Rubrics).

Power armored dudes are getting wounded on 3's.  Even so, I feel ya. 

[Doobles57]

41 minutes ago, Dr. Clock said:

Swiftly murdering any psyker they're pointed at? Since they get Precision and Devastating 4+ against psychers, I'd imagine that you can chew down 1KSons Cabal points with some ease. Also Sisters are ignoring all psychic attacks 2/3 times. It looks like 'shutting down buffs and de-buffs' is not really a thing, which I'm fine with. If you pay some points to do a thing to your own models, or don't directly attack, I don't think the enemy should be able to mess with that much at all. Also if we don't really have many options for psychic powers in general, I think it's wise not to have constant interaction just to pull the levers you've built your main strategy around.  Psychic defence is now properly defence.

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

Precision and Devastating 4+ against psykers is good, but for Rubrics only the Aspiring Sorcerer is a psyker. So does the unit count as a Pysker unit? The AS also isn't a character so precision only means you can snipe a character that's been attached rather than the AS (unless I've missed something where unit leaders are considered characters?). Plus even with those abilities, bolters aren't going to be chewing through marines at a rapid pace regardless.

 

Sisters have defence against psychic attacks, but Doombolt doesn't appear to be a psychic attack. Just a psychic ability like the others on the list. So do they get a FNP or not?

 

Anyway, enough about SoS. TSons feel pretty strong on first reading. The psychic phase sort of returns and I think it's a good application. Potentially some very strong abilities in there especially with Ahriman dropping one for free. Removing armour saves entirely from a unit is......rough. Jeez.

Also the Mutalith might have a place! Never seen one in use before.

 

[Special Officer Doofy]

Jealous... Looking good!

[Dr. Clock]

1 hour ago, 9x19 Parabellum said:

Power Armor would like to have a word with Twist of Fate.

Fair; there's definitely some feelsbad on the high end of de-buffs. It's not an attack on its own, though... making it occasionally deniable wouldn't make it okay all of a sudden to my mind. GW appears to be building psychic on a mostly non-interactive model other than as weapon profiles, so whether this is balanced well or not, it should be at least consistent with how they've set up the rest of psychic in the game.

 

There are enough 4++/5++ units in the meta that while Twist of Fate looks like 'CTRL-X anything without an invulnerable', it doesn't do much against large swathes of potential targets. It's strong, certainly, but dedicating the likely majority of your army special rules into a 'de-buff this unit out of existence' is good, but it's also... a little niche in being likely 'good' against basic ~200pt units, somtimes excellent against heavy hitters at 250+ (provided their T and inv. together don't make it less than worthwhile), and pretty unnecessary into MSU builds.

 

Any list that puts hammers behind good/reasonable invulnerables and goes MSU elsewhere should be able to mitigate these Twists, or at least lean into it until you can bring Cabal points under 9 per turn. Indeed, any player that doesn't expect to likely lose an important tool (or 2 less important ones) every turn has been playing a different game than I have for the past several years.

 

30 minutes ago, Doobles88 said:

So does the unit count as a Pysker unit? The AS also isn't a character so precision only means you can snipe a character that's been attached rather than the AS (unless I've missed something where unit leaders are considered characters?).

 

Oh - true; in my head it was more like current Sniper business where you could just pick anyone out of a unit... Aspiring Sorcs will indeed be difficult to pull out first, while any actual Characters will still be copping quite a few mortals if they get caught by Sisters.

 

Time will tell, but this looks like lots of fun tbh.

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor. 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 25, 2023 by Dr. Clock

[ThePenitentOne]

I would argue that when GW writes Doombolt (Psychic), they are identifying it as psychic, and anything that does damage (which doombolt does) is an attack; if it is both psychic AND an attack, it does not need to be labelled specifically as a Psychic Attack.

 

But then, maybe that's just me and my RAI over RAW every day of the week and twice on Sundays attitude.

 

 

[Commissar Yossarian]

1 hour ago, Indy Techwisp said:

 

It's one of each type of Epic Hero, not only one Epic Hero.

So Magnus and Ahriman on a Disk in the same army is OK, but Ahriman on a Disk and Ahriman on foot in the same Army isn't OK.

There it is. Thank you. I didn't remember what duplication it prevented.

 

Now it will be interesting to see how much resiliency a TS list can build to maintain 9+ cabal points per turn in a standard game size.

[Large and Moving Torb]

Wow. These rules look pretty good. I'm glad GW allowed TSons to retain psychic powers that weren't shooty. Though now TSons players will have to make hard choices about what to take as I assume they will want to maximize Cabal points but might need higher strength weapons to get maximum effect for ToF.

 

I'll also note that yet another faction has access to FNP. DG players...

[System Sound]

Now hopefully with the new TS Codex we can get new troop models that are not goats...

[Prot]

4 hours ago, TrawlingCleaner said:

Wow! Thousand Sons look like a blast to play!

Doombolt can target Lone Operatives too which is rad. Twist of fate at 9 Cabal points shouldn't be too hard to do either

 

I know right? I'm regretting selling my large TSons army considering the difficulty of painting it.... I honestly wasn't looking forward to TSons in 10th after hearing the psychic phase was done. This is a pleasant surprise! I think (or so it seems) they did a great job of leveraging a system that compensates for a lack of having 'their phase' decommissioned. I love it on paper at least. I may have to try it.

[GenerationTerrorist]

Very, very nice. Probably the most powerful set so far, IMHO.

[Indy Techwisp]

1 hour ago, System Sound said:

Now hopefully with the new TS Codex we can get new troop models that are not goats...

 

I hope so too.

That said, I also hope the new troops would be a kind of Rubric Marine and not just giving us the Mutated Cultists from CSM as well as the ones we have now.

[bigtrouble]

This looks super fun. I might need to start a new army!

[Sorceress]

ok not really impressed or excited about this, aspiring sorcerers only power is roughly the same as the balefire tome. and ahrimans psychic attack is super limited, his buff is nice depending on what he can join and his once per game is good, but right now he is more of a expensive unit upgrade.

the rituals look neat but your likely to get 1 good one and 1 or 2 reroll a single save per full battle round so not really overwhelming.

 

ignoring armor saves is great, sometimes, other times not so much. like if they have a 5+ save its not really great and they would die easily anyways, if they have terminators type 2+/4++ it's also not great because with ap-1 bolters your really just knocking them down 1 more point. it seems decent to use on a tank but only really for your dedicated anti tank like predators, but if it's just bolters the will be wounding on 6s and your better off saving a few cabal points and just using doom bolt.

 

it will be great for removing good armor save units with no invulnerable save and mid ranged toughness.