Wh40k 10th Edition Tyranids Index

[Lord_Valorion]

18 minutes ago, Karhedron said:

 

These are just the Index sheet. Full flavour will probably come when the new codex is released.

They said in a Stream that the books will only have enhancements, detachments and datasheet for NEW models. These index sheets are here to stay.

[Mogger351]

1 minute ago, Toxichobbit said:

 

I'm sure there is a mid-ground between dozens of stratagems, upgrades, warlord traits, relics etc (which I agree was a massive problem) and 10th's generic weapon profiles & almost zero customisation.

The profile differences between scything talons, rending claws and boneswords wasn't distinct enough to warrant existing as they were. It was trash > better > betterer. Worse yet they were all all forms of basic infantry killers but without enough of a gap between GEQ or MEQ to make the swords worse against the GEQ.

 

What I will say is the rules are a mess in terms of consistency. Why blend the 3 not that different melee weapons, but not the 3 not that different guns? Why have a mandatory prime per unit? Why 4 heavy weapons per unit? Why aren't carnifex streamlined at all? 

[Toxichobbit]

Just now, Halandaar said:

 

Wasn't that a Forgeworld/non-Codex unit anyway?

 

Yes & no. The models only existed as FW, but the rules for flying Rippers were in the Codex. Though I think they may have gone the way of the dodo in ... 8th maybe?

[acrozatarim]

5 minutes ago, Halandaar said:

 

It's the model in the kit with the bigger thing on it's back. Kit is 11 models; 10 Neurogaunts and 1 Nodebeast

 

 

Yeah, what I mean is that they are called out as specific separate models/champions but they don't seem to do anything extra. No special rules, no special stats, so they''re effectively just an extra neurogaunt model.

[Redcomet]

7 minutes ago, Toxichobbit said:

 

I'm sure there is a mid-ground between dozens of stratagems, upgrades, warlord traits, relics etc (which I agree was a massive problem) and 10th's generic weapon profiles & almost zero customisation.

That middle ground is not easy to find with a monster game like 40k. And these are indexes, a reset of the game, ao bound to be oversimplified 

[Malakithe]

Not sure why they needed to split the Warriors

[Toxichobbit]

I'm not convinced at all that the Codexes will change my opinion. As I said in a reply to Karhedron this feels much more like a design paradigm. I hope I'm wrong. 

[Indy Techwisp]

2 minutes ago, acrozatarim said:

 

Yeah, what I mean is that they are called out as specific separate models/champions but they don't seem to do anything extra. No special rules, no special stats, so they''re effectively just an extra neurogaunt model.

 

Just a different name for the "Sargent" in the unit.

Also Lorewise it's the specific bioform that allows for their Unit ability to work.

[Redcomet]

7 minutes ago, Mogger351 said:

The profile differences between scything talons, rending claws and boneswords wasn't distinct enough to warrant existing as they were. It was trash > better > betterer. Worse yet they were all all forms of basic infantry killers but without enough of a gap between GEQ or MEQ to make the swords worse against the GEQ.

 

What I will say is the rules are a mess in terms of consistency. Why blend the 3 not that different melee weapons, but not the 3 not that different guns? Why have a mandatory prime per unit? Why 4 heavy weapons per unit? Why aren't carnifex streamlined at all? 

Checks and balances. Simplicity some allows complexity other places 

[Halandaar]

3 minutes ago, acrozatarim said:

Yeah, what I mean is that they are called out as specific separate models/champions but they don't seem to do anything extra. No special rules, no special stats, so they''re effectively just an extra neurogaunt model.

 

Oh I see. Don't know then, maybe in the Codex there's a stratagem that interacts with the Nodebeast or something. 

[Mogger351]

2 minutes ago, Toxichobbit said:

I'm not convinced at all that the Codexes will change my opinion. As I said in a reply to Karhedron this feels much more like a design paradigm. I hope I'm wrong. 

They've been telling us this is what to expect for over a month at this point.

[Toxichobbit]

Just had a thought. If the theory that the Prime & Neurothrope have been rolled into the Warriors & Zoanthropes is correct, then it's likely we won't see Shrikes, otherwise the winged Prime would be part of that unit and we'd have seen a different HQ in Leviathan.

[DemonGSides]

It isn't a theory, its on the datasheets.

[Indy Techwisp]

Just now, Toxichobbit said:

Just had a thought. If the theory that the Prime & Neurothrope have been rolled into the Warriors & Zoanthropes is correct, then it's likely we won't see Shrikes, otherwise the winged Prime would be part of that unit and we'd have seen a different HQ in Leviathan.

 

The Warriors and Zoanthropes have "1 Tyranid Prime" and "1 Neurothrope" listed in their Unit Composition.

 

We could always be getting winged Hive Guard instead maybe and they got mistaken for Warriors, assuming someone's "speculated" on Winged Warriors.

[Toxichobbit]

2 minutes ago, Mogger351 said:

They've been telling us this is what to expect for over a month at this point.

 

So? Does that make it somehow more acceptable for people who enjoy some customisation? I've been saying I don't like the way they're going since the first announcements. But quite frankly it's worse than I expected, even with expectations based on their previews. Not only are the options for customisation massively reduced, they're also just boring. The more stuff has got revealed since the initial announcement, the more generic everything feels. I don't think it's quite as bad as 3rd, but it's not far off.

[Indy Techwisp]

6 minutes ago, Evil Eye said:

Neurothropes and Primes straight up gone.

 

They're unit leaders now for Zoanthropes and Warriors respectively.

[DemonGSides]

See I view it the opposite direction; I can customize my models however I want now, and in most cases, it's not a penalty; oh :cuss: you took Spinster Cannons but actually the best weapon is VenomGarglers, and spinsters cannons actually are so bad that you're gimping yourself for using them.

The army customization comes from the units I bring, not a bunch of esoteric "well my relic says" , or even worse, Strategem Roulette.  Am I trying to play a swarm army?  Great, put in swarm units.  Am I building Kaiju Simulator?  Have at it!  Want to do both?  BE OUR GUEST!

It's freeing.

[Toxichobbit]

6 minutes ago, DemonGSides said:

It isn't a theory, its on the datasheets.

 

5 minutes ago, Indy Techwisp said:

 

The Warriors and Zoanthropes have "1 Tyranid Prime" and "1 Neurothrope" listed in their Unit Composition.

 

We could always be getting winged Hive Guard instead maybe and they got mistaken for Warriors, assuming someone's "speculated" on Winged Warriors.

 

Ty. I somehow glossed over that completely. So, if they're going to stay consistent then we probably won't see Shrikes. Shame. But I'm sure there will be plenty of other interesting stuff.

[Redcomet]

2 hours ago, Toxichobbit said:

 

So? Does that make it somehow more acceptable for people who enjoy some customisation? I've been saying I don't like the way they're going since the first announcements. But quite frankly it's worse than I expected, even with expectations based on their previews. Not only are the options for customisation massively reduced, they're also just boring. The more stuff has got revealed since the initial announcement, the more generic everything feels. I don't think it's quite as bad as 3rd, but it's not far off.

All fair views to have. It is almost impossible to please everyone. As many people who are now happy that the game is less of a chore to play, just as many are probably angry that they can’t choose which type of pistol their troops can carry. 
 

But maybe give the game a chance and play it for a bit before writing it off? 

Edited June 8, 2023 by Tyriks
removed non constructive comment

[Karhedron]

25 minutes ago, Quantum said:

The information you need is in, I do not dispute that, but I find this way of presenting the information horrendous. For some datasheets one or both sides are mostly blank. 

There must have been a more visually appealing way to present the necessary information.

 

I may be in the minority but I kind of like it. One side deals with all the detail you need during the list-building stage (unit size, upgrade options, units it can lead etc) and the other deals with the rules you need during the game.

 

Use all the cards' side A while you build you lists. Then simply flip over to side B during the game.

Edited June 8, 2023 by Karhedron

[Kallas]

Fun fact: you can put a Hive Crone or Harpy into a Tyrannocyte to get your Aircraft on the battlefield Turn 1 

[CL_Mission]

1 minute ago, Toxichobbit said:

 

 

Ty. I somehow glossed over that completely. So, if they're going to stay consistent then we probably won't see Shrikes. Shame. But I'm sure there will be plenty of other interesting stuff.

Well we still might see shrikes with the codex but their not going to give the game away by putting the unit in the index with no models.

[Redcomet]

4 minutes ago, DemonGSides said:

See I view it the opposite direction; I can customize my models however I want now, and in most cases, it's not a penalty; oh you took Spinster Cannons but actually the best weapon is VenomGarglers, and spinsters cannons actually are so bad that you're gimping yourself for using them.

The army customization comes from the units I bring, not a bunch of esoteric "well my relic says" , or even worse, Strategem Roulette.  Am I trying to play a swarm army?  Great, put in swarm units.  Am I building Kaiju Simulator?  Have at it!  Want to do both?  BE OUR GUEST!

It's freeing.

This is where I am at. All that modeling freedom is fantastic.

[Malakithe]

I just hope they dont charge for these 'cards' in the future. Playing AoS has taught me never to buy them again as the first FAQ or balance whatever makes the cards as obsolete as the books. 

 

But if they update the digitally and I can simply redownload them then all good

[DemonGSides]

7 minutes ago, Toxichobbit said:

Ty. I somehow glossed over that completely. So, if they're going to stay consistent then we probably won't see Shrikes. Shame. But I'm sure there will be plenty of other interesting stuff.

 

I'm thinking maybe not; the Tyranid Prime is basically a melee Shrike, so I could definitely see them making a Ranged Winged Prime, and that's essentially just a very fancy Shrike.

 

They have already stated there's plenty more units for both Tyranids and SM coming out, so I think it's a distinct possibility.  They could release Winged Warriors at that exact same time, and then actually get rid of the Winged Tyranid Prime's datasheet if they wanted to and fold them both into their own specific squads.  I don't think they'll go THAT far, but I'm not totally ruling out Winged Warriors by any means.

 

2 minutes ago, Malakithe said:

I just hope they dont charge for these 'cards' in the future. Playing AoS has taught me never to buy them again as the first FAQ or balance whatever makes the cards as obsolete as the books. 

 

But if they update the digitally and I can simply redownload them then all good

They've already stated that Digital is the way to go for updates, and they plan on keeping them updated on their website.

The cards are for ease of use.  And those big blank spaces could be used to write balancing notes in for your home cards, if you wanted to.

Edited June 8, 2023 by DemonGSides