11th edition SW info

[DanPesci]

17 hours ago, TiguriusX said:

It's the maps/missions that determine our success in 11th

 

Learn how to maximize the new hidden mechanic and how to score your primary.  Denying opponent primary scoring is not as easy as it was in 10th edition 

 

I now believe 4x5 GHs using veterans detachment is powerful and likely a must take for us as a faction 

 

4 turns of 15 OC who can advance/fallback and still perform an action (never shooting though...keep hidden)

 

GHs are how we control/contest the central objective

 

GHs should perform well in any force disposition except purge by helping in the middle and being action monkeys wirh mobility 

 

That leaves you flexibility to fill in the remainder of your army and detachment/disposition as you please

 

Can't wait to see armies and battle recaps being shared from you all 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I should be having my first learn to play 11th games down our club this weekend.

 

Initial plan is running 30 GH, just as I have the models and theyre deserving a run out. Going to use the first 20 to split into 4x5 and then use 1 squad of 10 with the battle leader and shooty enhancement as a late game ingress option. Not sure the 10 is worth it but I had success with them last edition as a late game reserve once the battlefield is cleared a bit. Fillin out the rest of the list with headtakers, 2x scouts and maybe even a bloodclaw unit to have some early adv+charge threat....but definately wary that sending anything up early is going to probably end up with them dead haha.

[Karhedron]

Just noticed that Divergent Chapters get Repulsor Executioners 10 points cheaper than vanilla marines (230 vs 240). In the case of Blood Angels, it is to balance that they pay extra for melee specialists like Assault Intercessors and BGVs.

 

So does this mean that we are paying a premium somewhere else for some codex units?

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

It's possible we are I haven't noticed any thing being more expensive for us though. Granted we weren't exactly setting the world on fire either. I also just noticed that Intercessers get a 10-point discount for squads of ten . Really hoping @TiguriusX is right that the detachment is good cause they shouldn't be 15 points cheaper than grey hunters. I just want grey hunters to be good lol.

[Karhedron]

24 minutes ago, Jorin Helm-splitter said:

I also just noticed that Intercessers get a 10-point discount for squads of ten

 

Probably to account for the fact that you still only get one special melee weapon the Serg, even in a 10-man squad.

[TiguriusX]

2 hours ago, Jorin Helm-splitter said:

It's possible we are I haven't noticed any thing being more expensive for us though. Granted we weren't exactly setting the world on fire either. I also just noticed that Intercessers get a 10-point discount for squads of ten . Really hoping @TiguriusX is right that the detachment is good cause they shouldn't be 15 points cheaper than grey hunters. I just want grey hunters to be good lol.

 

That discount doesnt bother me bc

I dont see the purpose in taking 10 Intercessors for most SM lists (DA with Azrael leading sometimes does it)

 

The value comes from being cheap 5 man MSU who have useful shooting and sticky 

 

And unless there is a rule I dont know you cant split a 10 man Intercessor into two 5 man squads as needed.

 

With 10 GHs and the veteran detachment we get to split them into two separate 5 man 15 OC MSU squads who can advance and do actions

 

 

[Kassill]

I'm pretty ok with most of our points. Not the greatest things i've ever seen but nice to see wolf scouts down a bit and at least cheaper options on some things if you leave the shields at home (although you still probably take shields 9/10 times so they stay about the same) 

time to brew some lists. If purge ends up the defacto go to meta disposition I am second guessing msu disruption lists but idk, will just have to see how the dice roll 

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

5 hours ago, Karhedron said:

 

Probably to account for the fact that you still only get one special melee weapon the Serg, even in a 10-man squad.

 

Right but I can only take one special weapon in grey hunter squad. In fairness I felt that sticky was a lot better than OC3 in 10th, and I'd rather have ranged AP-1 than melee AP-1, so I just view intercessors as the better unit. The re-roll wound ability when an enemy is in an objective and with how important hidden feels that may change.  Tigurius is right though that even with the discount most people wouldn't take 10-man intercessor squads. It just frustrates me because I don't see a gameplay reason to take grey hunters unless I take a certain detachment. Technically that's an improvement because I couldn't justify the 10-man squad with any of the detachment options we've had to this point, but it doesn't feel good. 

 

I'll drop it for a while to see how things shake out, I just needed to vent when I saw it. I just want grey hunters to make sense in most forces not in just in specific ones.

 

 

[TiguriusX]

Now that we have official points etc. why don't we share and get all our creative ideas flowing...here are the next 2 lists I intend on testing (sat/sun I have a few scrimmages lined up)
*Disclaimer...when I play SW lists I always try to maximize SW unique units/rules

 

Also...I think Bjorn with helfrost and parked right behind your expansion is gonna be standard SW play.  He can overwatch and torrent any small fast infantry that try to out OC you or he can heroic anything that charges on to try and kill your expansion holders.

 

List A tests out GHs as the SW specific action monkey (can pick Priority or Disruption...I don't know what is better yet...will try Priority first)

Spoiler

11th Headhunting and GHs (1990 points)

 

Space Marines

Space Wolves

Strike Force (2000 points)

Headhunter Task Force and Veterans of the Fang (3 Detachment Points)

Force Dispositions: Disruption, Priority Assets

 

 

CHARACTERS

 

Bjorn the Fell-Handed (160 points)

  • Warlord

  • 1x Heavy flamer

    1x Helfrost cannon

    1x Trueclaw

 

Iron Priest (55 points)

  • 1x Helfrost pistol

    1x Tempest hammer and servo-arm

 

Lieutenant with Combi-weapon (85 points)

  • 1x Combi-weapon

    1x Paired combat blades

 

Logan Grimnar (110 points)

  • 1x Axe Morkai

    1x Storm bolter

    1x Tyrnak and Fenrir

 

Predator Annihilator (155 points)

  • Headhunter Task Force Keywords: Character

  • 1x Armoured tracks

    1x Hunter-killer missile

    2x Lascannon

    1x Predator twin lascannon

    1x Storm bolter

  • Enhancement: Gunnery Honours

 

Vindicator (225 points)

  • Headhunter Task Force Keywords: Character

  • 1x Armoured tracks

    1x Demolisher cannon

    1x Hunter-killer missile

    1x Storm bolter

  • Enhancement: Astartes Tank Ace (Aura)

 

Vindicator (205 points)

  • Headhunter Task Force Keywords: Character

  • 1x Armoured tracks

    1x Demolisher cannon

    1x Hunter-killer missile

    1x Storm bolter

  • Enhancement: Firestorm Coordinators

 

 

BATTLELINE

 

Grey Hunters (165 points)

  • 1x Grey Hunter Pack Leader

    • 1x Bolt carbine

      1x Bolt pistol

      1x Power fist

  • 9x Grey Hunter

    • 9x Astartes chainsword

      9x Bolt carbine

      9x Bolt pistol

 

Grey Hunters (165 points)

  • 1x Grey Hunter Pack Leader

    • 1x Bolt carbine

      1x Bolt pistol

      1x Power fist

  • 9x Grey Hunter

    • 9x Astartes chainsword

      9x Bolt carbine

      9x Bolt pistol

 

 

OTHER DATASHEETS

 

Fenrisian Wolves (45 points)

  • 5x Fenrisian Wolf

    • 5x Teeth and claws

 

Fenrisian Wolves (45 points)

  • 5x Fenrisian Wolf

    • 5x Teeth and claws

 

Predator Destructor (140 points)

  • 1x Armoured tracks

    2x Heavy bolter

    1x Hunter-killer missile

    1x Predator autocannon

    1x Storm bolter

 

Predator Destructor (140 points)

  • 1x Armoured tracks

    2x Heavy bolter

    1x Hunter-killer missile

    1x Predator autocannon

    1x Storm bolter

 

Repulsor Executioner (230 points)

  • 1x Armoured hull

    1x Heavy laser destroyer

    1x Heavy onslaught gatling cannon

    1x Icarus rocket pod

    1x Ironhail heavy stubber

    1x Repulsor Executioner defensive array

    1x Twin Icarus ironhail heavy stubber

    1x Twin heavy bolter

 

Scout Squad (65 points)

  • 1x Scout Sergeant

    • 1x Astartes chainsword

      1x Bolt pistol

      1x Close combat weapon

  • 4x Scout

    • 4x Bolt pistol

      4x Close combat weapon

      4x Combat knife

 

 

Primary Detachment is Headhunter Task Force because I believe 11th is a mobile shooting meta.  

This gives all my vehicles auto advance 6"

I have an enhancement that gives assault within 6"

Combine those and my vehicles can get where they need to toe in terrain for LOS and blast away

Detachment also gives full damage reroll if you don' t advance.  That means vindicators get to address their worst trait (random D6 damage)

 

Other cool stuff...the annihilator with enhancement is basically a gladiator lancer on steroids

With Iron priest rapid fire for main gun I have 3 S14 weapons capable of rerolling wound and damage rolls...just give oath to hit

 

And don't sleep on the machine vengeance stratagem....if anyone fires at and fails to kill a vehicle I can spend 1 CP and return fire immediately (RepEx excluded)

 

 

So...the vehicles in this list do the fighting and heavy lifting

2 destructors + RepEx to hit incoming infantry

2 vindicators + annihilator to hit enemy monsters/vehicles

 

The GHs do the actions and objective contesting with 15 OC per MSU...they can also spot targets and add detection range if needed for the vehicles

 

No idea how it will perform...but I like the lethality on paper

My personal goal is for my list to threaten 5 big knights playing purge

 

 

 

 

List B tests out the SW specific terminator detachment for Take and Hold

Spoiler

Headhunter Saga of Song (Take and Hold) (1995 points)

 

Space Marines

Space Wolves

Strike Force (2000 points)

Headhunter Task Force and Legends of Saga and Song (3 Detachment Points)

Force Dispositions: Priority Assets, Take and Hold

 

 

CHARACTERS

 

Arjac Rockfist (105 points)

  • 1x Foehammer

 

Bjorn the Fell-Handed (160 points)

  • Warlord

  • 1x Heavy flamer

    1x Helfrost cannon

    1x Trueclaw

 

Lieutenant with Combi-weapon (85 points)

  • 1x Combi-weapon

    1x Paired combat blades

 

Logan Grimnar (110 points)

  • 1x Axe Morkai

    1x Storm bolter

    1x Tyrnak and Fenrir

 

Vindicator (225 points)

  • Headhunter Task Force Keywords: Character

  • 1x Armoured tracks

    1x Demolisher cannon

    1x Hunter-killer missile

    1x Storm bolter

  • Enhancement: Astartes Tank Ace (Aura)

 

Vindicator (205 points)

  • Headhunter Task Force Keywords: Character

  • 1x Armoured tracks

    1x Demolisher cannon

    1x Hunter-killer missile

    1x Storm bolter

  • Enhancement: Firestorm Coordinators

 

 

OTHER DATASHEETS

 

Fenrisian Wolves (45 points)

  • 5x Fenrisian Wolf

    • 5x Teeth and claws

 

Infiltrator Squad (110 points)

  • 1x Infiltrator Sergeant

    • 1x Bolt pistol

      1x Close combat weapon

      1x Marksman bolt carbine

  • 4x Infiltrator

    • 4x Bolt pistol

      4x Close combat weapon

      1x Helix Gauntlet

      1x Infiltrator Comms Array

      4x Marksman bolt carbine

 

Scout Squad (65 points)

  • 1x Scout Sergeant

    • 1x Astartes chainsword

      1x Bolt pistol

      1x Close combat weapon

  • 4x Scout

    • 4x Bolt pistol

      4x Close combat weapon

      4x Combat knife

 

Terminator Assault Squad (170 points)

  • Enhancement: Thirst for Glory (Upgrade)

  • 1x Assault Terminator Sergeant

    • 1x Twin lightning claws

  • 4x Assault Terminator

    • 4x Twin lightning claws

 

Terminator Assault Squad (170 points)

  • Enhancement: Thirst for Glory (Upgrade)

  • 1x Assault Terminator Sergeant

    • 1x Twin lightning claws

  • 4x Assault Terminator

    • 4x Twin lightning claws

 

Wolf Guard Terminators (175 points)

  • Enhancement: Fierce Example (Upgrade)

  • 1x Wolf Guard Terminator Pack Leader

    • 1x Relic greataxe

  • 4x Wolf Guard Terminator

    • 4x Master-crafted power weapon

      4x Storm bolter

 

Wolf Guard Terminators (370 points)

  • Enhancement: Fierce Example (Upgrade)

  • 1x Wolf Guard Terminator Pack Leader

    • 1x Relic greataxe

  • 9x Wolf Guard Terminator

    • 2x Assault cannon

      7x Master-crafted power weapon

      2x Power fist

      7x Storm Shield

 

 

Leaning heavily into the terminators and our special detachment here

 

Take and Hold is all about holding your expansion and the middle...the rest is whatever

 

The assault terminators get OC+1 per model (10 OC per MSU) and their job is dig in...they touch objectives...hide and go to ground and force enemies in close

If someone puts a horde of OC on the objective then you go and wolverine the crap out of them to clear it and regain control

 

The fighting force of this detachment is 2 vindicators and 1 brick of WG with Arjac

Vindicators have the same strengths as discussed above

And we know a brick of Arjac and friends can do their fair share of damage as well...they rapid ingress in (gotta touch terrain and be hidden though)

I don't have lance or lethals...so the primary job is tarpit and annoy rather than outright delete things...these guys pushing enemy expansion or home can't be ignored though

 

The worst thing I predict is that this list has a single minded and repetitive play style

 

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

I got two games in yesterday, both against Chaos, I went 1-1. The app does have the tactical secondaries on it, and a way to draw random cards which was a nice surprise. I ordered the cards, and I still think I'll prefer them because they'll be right in front of me. You do have to manually update the app, and you and your opponent can enter different vp totals which is kind of annoying. It also seemed to log me out a fair a bit, but I was using the free version and there probably were a ton of people playing. I tried both the take & hold and the disruption mission against purge.

 

I had logan with a squad of 5 WGTs and really think going up to 15-20 termies might make sense if you're going take & hold (I only have 5, but I was already planning on getting more once I finish painting my new stuff). Disruption felt rough though, granted my secondary draws were meh.. My wolf scouts had rough games, but I felt like I had to get something on the center of the table ASAP, and they were my best option. Purge just puts you on a clock, I really don't mind the urgency but it wouldn't shock me if it gets tuned down a bit.. I'm going to try Bastion next, but it'll probably be a couple of weeks.  

[TiguriusX]

I had 2 games against different GK purge lists with a version of List A above

 

Went 1-1

 

I could definitely feel the pressure of having to fight AND do action when facing a purge list

 

In both my post game chats I was told am still playing with a 10th mindset and spreading out and doing secondary cards etc. 

 

Instead I need to focus on my specific primary scoring

 

Slowly but surely...gotta learn the nuances of 11th