Aidoneus Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 Okay, I've gone and opened this can of worms! I hope you've all heard of the rumors of the Void Dragon? If you're interested in the cult mechanicus, you really need to go read all the fluff in the Necron codex. Seriously! Simply put, the Necron fluff strongly implies that there is something of great import to the Necrons lying within Mars. There is a possibility that it is one of the two still-missing C'Tan star-gods, namely the Void Dragon. There is also a possibility that the cult mechanicus has been worshiping this alien god as their "Machine Spirit" or Omnissah for some time now. All of this, of course, is very foggy and skeptical. So, what are your opinions? Do you think the Cult of Mars has been worshipping a false god for millenia? Do you think the Void Dragon will emerge soon? Will there be a civil war amidst the adeptus mechanicus because of it? Are the tech-priests already aware of this immensly powerful being? Come on! Let's have some good conspiracy theorizing here! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodGore Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 That's a tough one! But if the CoM does know about it they sure as 'warp' aren't going to give it to the necrons! and I hope they don't to! that nightbringer is enough trouble Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1046454 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Tyler Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 What if the AM beliefs were benign in their intent, but were influenced by the Dragon? The premise here would be that the AM don't actually worship the Dragon. Their beliefs in the Machine God are, to the best of their knowledge, true and pure. The Dragon, meanwhile, was exerting influence over those beliefs from behind the scene, manipulating the Adeptus Mechanicus to several different purposes. The first would be to ensure that the superstition the AM holds technology in would be an impediment to technological advances. The second would be to secretly prepare the way for the Dragon's eventual freedom, subverting the wards and devices that imprison him. Humanity has the potential to rule the galaxy one day. Internally, friction preventing this from happening is caused by a number of factors. Included in those factors is the fact that technology is held in a regard akin to magic and superstition. If mankind were to take a more intelligent view of the technology around them and to remove all of the superstitious mumbo jumbo, the Imperium might be able to actually improve life and its hold on things. Instead, with technological advances held mostly in check for over ten millennia (and expected to be held in check for the unforeseeable future), mankind helps to keep itself from having more power. What if this were a deliberate plan of the Dragon (and, by extension, the Necrons) in order to ensure that their path to domination is a little easier? We've only seen the tip of the iceberg with regard to the Necrons and the Star Gods. They're coming, and they want the galaxy back. We're just one of several hindrances to this. Imagine if mankind took a view towards technology as enlightened and intellectual as the Tau. We'd be pretty hard to beat, even for some Star Gods. The Dragon doubtless hopes to eventually be freed of [his] imprisonment. The Eldar were responsible for his capture and warding. Perhaps the activities of the AM, unknown to them, are secretly eroding the effectiveness of the containment on the Dragon. This could eventually lead to either the Dragon freeing [himself], the Necrons being able to destroy the final barriers, or a combination thereof (most likely). Imagine a Star God either destroying or dominating the center of the Imperium's technological mastery. The Imperium would suffer a mighty blow if this were ever to happen. The face of the Cult Mechanicus is ostensibly human - reverence for technology for the furtherance of humanity and its manifest destiny of dominating the galaxy. There are some differences of philosophy, some considered heretical by thte more mainstream members of the AM. Many of these deal with the role of xenos technology, although others look towards incarnating the Machine God. Perhaps these "heresies" are secretly the workings of the alien Star Gods, seeking to cripple humanity and ensure the success of the Star Gods. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1046570 Share on other sites More sharing options...
gorilla_dan Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 you mean a bit like in those films and books where some people are being manipulated into worshippng something so that it can manifest in this dimension? its in various things, but i cant name any... :tu: just one problem...if the AM really is under the sway of the void dragon (out of interest, where did that name come from? and what is the name of the other missing c'tan?) wouldnt they be putting their efforts into building more necrons? my reasoning is that necrons are sentient machines, right? and the AM are dead set against AI unless its servitor-based...SO AM=against the necrons. oh, and for fans of the latest Dr. Who (sorry you guys in the US...): dont the necrons remind you of the cybermen? perhaps the AM plan to 'upgrade' humanity at some point... (hang on, if the star gods are really that powerful, they cant just be after the galaxy...i reckon the whole universe is at stake, possibly other dimensions...) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1046775 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Severus6 Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 It is one of those instances where another possible schism could erupt. You saw the same issues with the Heresy and the advent of the Dark Adeptus,...you could very well see the same choice being made between those who remain loyal to the Empire of Man and those who will cast there lot with the C'tan. It could end of being a three way or possibly four way split. Loyal AM, Chaos DA, C'tan worshipping AM, those who support none of the other factions and seek to pull away and return to the days prior to the emergence of the Emperor. Severus6 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1047035 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidoneus Posted July 6, 2006 Author Share Posted July 6, 2006 @ Dan: The four remaining C'Tan are the Nightbringer, the Deceiver, the Dragon, and the Outsider. The first two names are pretty obvious, given the personalities + background of those two beings. The Dragon definitely resides inside Mars, but not much else is known about it. And virtually nothing is known about the Outsider. He seems to be absolutely insane, and that's about it. That's all you need to know about them really, since this topic is just about the Dragon and his connection with Mars. @ Tyler: I agree that the AM don't know about the Dragon. The fluff is pretty clear about that, I think. If anyone at all knows, it's just the absolute highest-ranking tech lords, who must guard the secret jealously. But no, I think they're all ignorant. After all, the adept Corteswain is being held prisoner in a very secure prison for his speaking his 'heresy' about the truth of the Machine God. To quote Corteswain himself, "The Machine God does not love us, nor does it want our worship. We are naught but playthings to it... If it has turned its attention our way once more then we are naught but food for the gods!" So here's what I'm thinking, now that I've looked back over some of the Necron fluff. When the Enslaver virus was unleashed by the Old Ones, the four remaining C'Tan fled into stasis chambers, awaiting a time when they could re-emerge and feast once more. The Dragon's chamber is deep inside of Mars. During the Golden Age of Technology, the sleeping god fed its thoughts to the humans, and through it they learned many secrets of incredible technology. However, the technology was too advanced for the humans to truely understand, and therefore too advanced for them to use properly, and that is what brought about the Dark Age of Strife. Through all of this, the tech-priests knew nothing of the Dragon, and thought they were gaining knowledge for mankind. They worshipped the Machine God, but knew little or nothing about its true form. Now, in the 41st millenium, the Dragon is still sleeping, but with the waking of two other C'Tan, it is becoming restless, and will soon emerge to feast once more. There is a short passage in the Necron codex about a couple small Necron ships flying into Mars' atmosphere, and even managing to set down on Mars (I believe right outside the Noctis Labirynth) before being destroyed. It is my belief that these Necrons were trying to re-awaken the sleeping god. If that's the case, it means the tech-priests couldn't have done so themselves, which means they don't knowingly worship the C'Tan. So, here we are. The tech-priests of Mars are unknowingly worshipping and being influenced by a sleeping C'Tan. The big question is, what happens when it wakes? Where do their loyalties truely lie? Will they remain faithful to humanity, or will they remain faithful to their god, even when he shows his true form? If the latter is true... Emperor save us all! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1047042 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Veritas Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 As for the AM being dead set against the Necrons. Most all of the novels I've read have Tech Priests falling over themselves worshipping the Necrons. Namely, Xenology and Caves of Ice. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1047164 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironloki Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 The Outsider is aparently the most powerful but he's gone a little crazy :D My question is what about the Emperor? Did he not know of the Dragon? was he aware of the war with the Old ones? As for the AM Heirarchy I guess its usual to become deluded with your own work. Perhaps they believe its some kind of personification of the Emperor to them guiding them through the machine spirit. Also was there a kind of mystery in regards to technology while the Emperor was around or did this develop once he faded away into his throne? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1047316 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidoneus Posted July 6, 2006 Author Share Posted July 6, 2006 There are conflicting reports about which C'Tan is the most powerful; I've heard all three non-Deceiver ones reported as being the 'most powerful' at least once. My vote still goes to the Nightbringer. As for Cult Mechanicus ideology: In Imperial theology the holy spirit of the Omnissiah worshipped by the Tech-priests of Mars is a facet of the Immortal God-Emperor of Mankind - their dogma is as categoric on the matter as it is filled with praise for the holy nature of the machine. However, the most ancient and zealously guarded records of their Order tell of a time before the coming of the Emperor when a far older power was paid homage on Mars. They make veiled reference to unspeakable knowledge won in the Golden Age of Technology, and how it brought about Mankind's eventual downfall in the Age of Strife. I think the mystification of technology has only increased over the millenia, but I'm not sure what the attitude towards it was in the Golden Age. Certainly, it was the foremost goal of mankind, and any gain in knowledge was considered a good thing. But other than that I'm not sure, since the fluff isn't terribly specific on the subject. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1047550 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Severus6 Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 The mysticism that currently surrounds technology happened over time. My guess is that after the Heresy there were great gulfs between technology known and used and technology unknown and used. The unknown fell away after it broke and the known was "dumbed down" in an effort to maintain at least the most basic capabilities. You see the same thing in what little we know about the reconquest of Earth by the Emperor. Once he had total control of the planet and civilization again took root, technology ceased to be mystical. Severus6 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1047575 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironloki Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 Order tell of a time before the coming of the Emperor when a far older power was paid homage on Mars.Hmmm interesting, Thanks. Im unsure why the Emperor never clicked onto the fact there was something hidden on Mars. Then again I guess he thought he would have time to deal with that menace once man had claimed the Galaxy. Also how big are we talking here? Are the Ctan as big as the models or are they massive? Wondering how big the Dragon would be (i.e. buried under the AM temple or in a smaller shrine) +edit+ Also looking here http://www.specialist-games.com/assets/ThorianSource.pdf They talk about "the reawakening of the Necrontyr, and a growing Adpetus Mechanicus schism" Perhaps something is already happening ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1047803 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidoneus Posted July 6, 2006 Author Share Posted July 6, 2006 Also how big are we talking here? Are the Ctan as big as the models or are they massive? Wondering how big the Dragon would be (i.e. buried under the AM temple or in a smaller shrine) The C'Tan were immense, disperesed energy beings, with no real physical form. The Necrontyr (Necrons before they became machine-ified) built them bodies of living metal. These bodies were quite big, but not enormous. I'd say they're about the size of the actual models (relative to the other models, of course). Thus, it'd be pretty easy to hide in any small cavern. There is mention of a Noctis Labyrinth; I think that's where he's buried. The rulers of Mars claim that the area around the Labyrinth was virus-bombed during the heresy, and it is death (to flesh and metal) to walk there now. However, one of the "heretic" tech-adepts in the Necron fluff claims to have been there. So I'm thinking someone is trying to hide something. The question then becomes, do they really know what it is they're hiding? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1047845 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bannus Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 Some interesting information for all to digeat: I don't remember where I saw this info, but I do remember it came from someone of significance at GW (like Graham McNeill for example). The only info on the situation that was given was that YES - the Dragon is on Mars and NO - he is not being worshipped as the Machine God. So there is appearently a third element in the mix that we know almost nothing about. Another thing to consider comes from the Iron Hands fluff - Ferrus fought and 'destroyed' a 'Great Wyrm' made of living metal on Medusa. Could this have been the fabled Dragon? Possibly. The living metal of creature was absobed into the hands/arms of the Primarch. Was the Great Wyrm actually destroyed? Maybe. The Iron Hands fluff goes on to infer that Ferrus Manus did not die on Istvaan, but he had been taken to Mars where he resides still. While no evidence supports this, it is well known that the Iron Hands receive a lot special attention from the Cult Mechanicus and the =][= does not see how the AM benefits from this relationship. While the Iron Hands novel speaks of ancient oaths sworn between the two organizations, the IA article strongly implies that the relationship seems very one-sided in favor the Iron Hands. I suspect that this is because Ferrus Manus actually is on Mars and that the Adeptus Mechanicus is showing this favoritism towards the Sons of Medusa to somehow 'appease' Ferrus Manus. Whether he is concoius or not or even aware of this attention is open to speculation. But it does make sense. Perhaps Ferrus Manus is in some form of stasis like the Emperor. In this state, his living metal hands may be free to "function on their own" with their host laying dormant (assuming that the 'Great Wyrm' didn't actually die in their encounter but transformed itself). The attack on Mars by the Necrons was not an attempt to free or kill the Dragon. Had the Necrons really wanted to successfully invade Mars, they would not have used such a token force and nothing the Am could have done would have stopped them. Whatever their mission was, you can be sure that they succeeded in completing it. Perhaps it was to plant something on the planet - who knows. But you can bet they weren't there to invade. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1047996 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironloki Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 Perhaps Ferrus has become the host for the Dragon. Dun dun dun :rolleyes: (j/k) Hmmm strange that some GW people say they don't worship the Dragon. But how are we to know that some may not view the Dragon as the machine god? If you are sitting saying a prayer towards a circuit board and then this huge hulking metal God appears from the ground then your first reaction would be that it was the Machine God. Then again if that was the case then why haven't we had the AM bow down before Necron armies or the other C'Tan as they are big giant metal men. The story of Ferrus and his metal hands is a strange one. I doubt he could have killed a C'tan unless it was severly weakened or absorbed into him (But im sure his brothers and father would have sensed something) but im not sure what else it could have been. There is mention of a Noctis Labyrinth; I think that's where he's buried. The rulers of Mars claim that the area around the Labyrinth was virus-bombed during the heresy, and it is death (to flesh and metal) to walk there now. However, one of the "heretic" tech-adepts in the Necron fluff claims to have been there. So I'm thinking someone is trying to hide something. The question then becomes, do they really know what it is they're hiding? Now this is interesting. Im personally inclined to think that they do not know what they are harbouring. As a sidenote would they be well aware of the C'tan in the first place? Is it common knowledge. What they think it is though is a mystery. Do they believe the machine god has been personified in this being? Wouldn't it appear to be a Xenos? One other question from me, can the Dragon (and C'Tan in general) influence things around them? Chaos is a warp entity and can whisper in the ears of man or appear as visions but how could the dragon influence the AM? can he also whisper secrets to them or influence mechanical things around him? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1048020 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Severus6 Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 "The attack on Mars by the Necrons was not an attempt to free or kill the Dragon. Had the Necrons really wanted to successfully invade Mars, they would not have used such a token force and nothing the Am could have done would have stopped them. Whatever their mission was, you can be sure that they succeeded in completing it. Perhaps it was to plant something on the planet - who knows. But you can bet they weren't there to invade." Quote from bannus I would say, that is a rather bold statement and not necessarily true. The AM have time and again shown that they have substantially more firepower at their disposal than what is generally assumed. Their Explorator ships are proof of that. Whatever the reason for the attack/reconnaisance by the Necrons it was successfully beaten back by the forces of the AM. As for Ferrus Manus being on Mars, as of yet, there is absolutely no evidence that he is on the planet. Additionally, the special bond/ relationship between the AM and the IH could be nothing more than the fact that the IH are one of the few SM Chapters that share their beliefs. I would venture to guess that all SM Chapters are treated with respect by the AM and the SM view the AM as loyal servants to the Emperor,...but there are always, generally speaking, seems to be special considerations given or expected when dealing with one of your own. I would imagine that certain Chapters like the Iron Hands, Brazen Claws, Red Talons, and possibly the Mentors are seen as such. Severus6 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1048022 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidoneus Posted July 7, 2006 Author Share Posted July 7, 2006 Now this is interesting. Im personally inclined to think that they do not know what they are harbouring. As a sidenote would they be well aware of the C'tan in the first place? Is it common knowledge. What they think it is though is a mystery. Do they believe the machine god has been personified in this being? Wouldn't it appear to be a Xenos?Oh, wow. Good point Ironloki! I'd say it's a fairly safe bet that the C'Tan are not yet known to the Imperium, at least not by that name. All the young races (except the Kork) have a fear of death that was artificially instilled by the Nightbringer (i.e. the Grim Reaper). And there are many recordings of a trickster-being that has doomed small races. And I'm sure the C'Tan have been encountered before in battle, but I am less certain as to how many men survived those battles. But in the entire Necron codex, not one single human utters the word "C'Tan" nor any of the gods' names. A couple humans have mad ravings about creatures of immense power and hunger, but anything specific or credible is told from the perspective of the Eldar (or, in the case or 1 passage, Abaddon). One other question from me, can the Dragon (and C'Tan in general) influence things around them? Chaos is a warp entity and can whisper in the ears of man or appear as visions but how could the dragon influence the AM? can he also whisper secrets to them or influence mechanical things around him? The C'Tan are anathema to the Warp. They have no warp-reflections, and they abhor anything to do with the warp. Hence, pariahs. However, they do have absolute inconceivable powers in the physical dimension. It is perhaps the only mention of such non-technical, non-warp-related powers in 40k. So, to answer your question, yes, C'Tan can influence things around them. However, I'm sure sure exactly how or in what manner they could do so. Ferrus fought and 'destroyed' a 'Great Wyrm' made of living metal on Medusa. Could this have been the fabled Dragon? Possibly. The living metal of creature was absobed into the hands/arms of the Primarch. Was the Great Wyrm actually destroyed? Maybe.I doubt it. There are a couple factors that go into this conclusion. First, I disagree with Ironloki. Yes, C'Tan are mighty beings, but so are Primarchs, so I don't think it's inconcievable that Ferrus could best one. However, when a C'Tan is defeated in combat, the only real result is that its living metal shell, its Necrodermis to be precise, is destroyed. The C'Tan, being an energy being, will leave the necrodermis and re-form later in a Necron tomb somewhere. Thus, if Ferrus did defeat one, it wouldn't have stayed with him on his hands like that. Also, the Dragon has not yet awakened. It is still locked in its stasis chamber, sleeping. We think that chamber is on Mars, but in any case, the Dragon could not have been on Medusa for Ferrus to fight. he attack on Mars by the Necrons was not an attempt to free or kill the Dragon. Had the Necrons really wanted to successfully invade Mars, they would not have used such a token force and nothing the Am could have done would have stopped them. Whatever their mission was, you can be sure that they succeeded in completing it. Perhaps it was to plant something on the planet - who knows. But you can bet they weren't there to invade. I agree with part of what you've said here. I think its fairly obvious that the 2 Necron ships were not trying to invade Mars. However, that doesn't mean they succeded in their mission. I'm not sure if I made this clear or not ealier, but the C'Tan are locked in their stasis tombs. They cannot simply awake whenever they're ready. The Nightbringer's awakening is described in the novel Nightbringer. I think he was awakened by an explorator party or something like that. The Deciever's awakening is described in the Cypher fluff in (US) WD 280 pg 108. Simply put, Cypher woke him up. We're not sure how or why. Anyway, my point is that i think those Necrons were trying to awaken the Dragon. All they needed to do was get to the stasis tomb and activate it. Hardly a task for more than a few dozen Necrons. I think they met with much more resistance than they anticipated, and are taking time to plan their next attempt better. You guys are making lots of good points. I may not agree with everything that's said, but there are some real insights in there. And of course, I don't have all the answers, so where we disagree you might be right. I think it's funny how many insights have been made here simply because most people know next to nothing about C'Tan fluff. :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1048156 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadlight Posted July 7, 2006 Share Posted July 7, 2006 My question would be, which side will the Iron Hands be on when the Dragon awakens? They worship the machine... "The flesh is weak." Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1048167 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidoneus Posted July 7, 2006 Author Share Posted July 7, 2006 My question would be, which side will the Iron Hands be on when the Dragon awakens? They worship the machine... "The flesh is weak." Yeah, them and the AM. All I can say is, things are going to get very interesting! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1048178 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ju'kosian Posted July 7, 2006 Share Posted July 7, 2006 Read 'nightbringer' when the nightbringer starts to awake, the ultramarines's minds get filled with horrofic visions of slaughter.. The normal humans going insane and clawing their eyes out and such.. So yes C'tan are somehow able to corrupt humans.. The nightbringer was awoken by a human (and dark eldar lord) who thought they could harness it's power to their own use... There were 5 necron ships who attacked Mars... There is something on Mars we cannot deny it, it's mentioned in the fluff..And if something can make Abaddon laugh, I'm very curious to find out what it could possibly be. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1048255 Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordXaras Posted July 7, 2006 Share Posted July 7, 2006 But in the entire Necron codex, not one single human utters the word "C'Tan" nor any of the gods' names. This is not entirely true. On the second last page there are a few documents, the one in the background (written by one Joagul Maskelyne) clearly says "Ctan" in its last sentance. The existance of the mysterious C'tan must also be known within the Imperium, since they know to call the phase blades of the Officio Assassinorum "C'tan phase swords", and that certain individuals that have been exposed to the dark vaults on Terra (such as Keeper Cripias, 3rd Ed rulebook) clearly know and fear the name. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1048258 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidoneus Posted July 7, 2006 Author Share Posted July 7, 2006 Okay, you got me there. I just glanced over that document because it's pretty much indecipherable. But yeah, the word C'Tan is definitely in there. So at least someone within the Imperium knows about them. But I'm still willing to bet knowledge of them is extremely limited. The C'Tan phase blade is made of the same living metal as the C'Tan (and, presumably, the monolith). I think it's called that because some ancient, perhaps Eldar, reference to the living metal of the C'Tan gods. I don't think the name of the blade necessarily proves that humanity has knowledge of the gods. After all, there are 2 reported instances when one of the C'Tan gods was stabbed with a C'Tan blade, even though anyone which knowledge of the gods would know the blade just gets absorbed into the god. Both a Callidus assassin and Cypher himself were disarmed that way. They obvisously had little or no knowledge about their foes. So maybe a few high-ranking individuals have knowledge of C'Tan. I doubt that they would share that knowledge with the AM. I just don't see any reason for them to do so. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1048454 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archangelus Posted July 7, 2006 Share Posted July 7, 2006 So maybe a few high-ranking individuals have knowledge of C'Tan. I doubt that they would share that knowledge with the AM. I just don't see any reason for them to do so. Wouldn't a Fabricator General or an Archmagos Veneratus be high-ranking enough? The High Lords of Terra should be informed if an ancient threat to the Imperium rises again and if any info is available on that. The Imperium is bureaucratic and inefficient, but some things can be communicated when the danger is real enough. Just my 2 cents Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1048459 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidoneus Posted July 7, 2006 Author Share Posted July 7, 2006 The High Lords don't know everything that goes in the Imperium. I was thinking more like high-ranking Inquisitors or stuff like that. The High Lords all have their own duties in addition to high-lordship, so they really don't have time to hear about everything. But really, its all a moot point anyway. Even if you assume every man, woman, and child in the Imperium knows about the existence of C'Tan, they don't know much in the way of detail, and they certainly don't know the resting place of the last two C'Tan (probably don't even know that there are 4 left). So they would have no way of knowing 1 is on Mars, or that the Cult Mechanicus worships/is affected by it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1048479 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Severus6 Posted July 8, 2006 Share Posted July 8, 2006 More than likely there are several high ranking individuals in the AM that are not only aware of the C'tan but are knowledgeable of their history and capabilities. The Inquisition probably has their experts as well,...possibly the two groups have exchanged information,...more than likely not. Regardless the AM would most certainly be aware of them as much if not more so than any other group within the High Lords as their Explorators would find, collect, research, report back any evidence gathered. Its in their nature to do so. Severus6 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1049131 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidoneus Posted July 9, 2006 Author Share Posted July 9, 2006 More than likely there are several high ranking individuals in the AM that are not only aware of the C'tan but are knowledgeable of their history and capabilities. The Inquisition probably has their experts as well,...possibly the two groups have exchanged information,...more than likely not. Regardless the AM would most certainly be aware of them as much if not more so than any other group within the High Lords as their Explorators would find, collect, research, report back any evidence gathered. Its in their nature to do so. Okay, I'll buy that. It makes sense anyway. So, do you think they have any idea that they're sitting right on top of one of the ancient star gods? Here's another thought. If the sleeping Dragon influenced humanity's technological development during the Golden Age of Technology, do you think some of the really high-tech AM hardware resembles Necron stuff? I think it just might. I doubt there's anything on Mars that looks exactly like a Necron weapon; that would be too obvious. But maybe there are some similarities. I actually made use of that assumption when building my Tech Marine servitors. I wanted a plasma cannon servitor, so I left an arm off one of the tech servitors and put in its place a Guass Cannon from a Necron Destroyer. It looks really good, I think. At the very least, you can definitely tell that it's a plasma cannon. And it just amuses me becuase of my conspiracy theories. I'll try to post a picture later tonight. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/91013-the-am-mars-the-void-dragon-and-necrons/#findComment-1049266 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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