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I'm reading The voice of Mars and have come across some fluff bits that are new to me. The chaplaincy and libraius have no in put in chapter decision making. Clan racoon have a AI controlled starfort that is self aware and refuses to accept a crew. It's fairly out in the open that kristos might be a heretek When you join Clan racoon/kristos cult you have all prior memories of self removed. Medusa's maximum population is 2 million. Personally I think guymer is doing a pretty good job

For Warlord Traits, I've been using Storm of Fire and Iron Resolve; in most cases, my Warlord carries a hammer & shield so the Chapter specific trait Merciless Logic does me no good. In the interest of brainstorming, how would you gear a Warlord to take advantage of it? The most Dakota I can come up with is a stormbolter and power fist with wrist launcher -- max of seven shots -- but then you lose out on close combat chances to use it. Taking the relic axe, relic sword, or a generic relic blade all give decent CC stats without a hit penalty, though you can't take the axe with a Terminator Captain (my preferred option) and as a codex we're not particularly vaunted at melee anyway. It's quite the predicament. Any ideas? Anyone actually use Merciless Logic and if so, what was your opinion on its utility?

So I've purchased well more than my fair share of the Iron Hands Tac Squad boxes (though now I think they serll the hits as a separate pack?), so I've got probably a dozen of the bionics arms holding thunder hammers. I was going to put one on my Sternguard Sergeant but that's is inexplicably prohibited in the Codex, so...what would you guys do with all those hammers?

Morning gents. I had a scout around and I couldn't find any clan info for Sabik Wayland. If and one can point me in the right direction that would be great.

If there is a Techmarine next to a unit of Honor Guard and the Techmarine is shot, it wounds, he fails his armor save and the 6+ "feel no pain", or whatever it is called now, but then the Honor Guard rolls for their ability to take the wound instead of the character and succeeds, do they to get the 6+ "feel no pain"? So, is that ability kinda better for the Iron Hands? Please excuse grammar, Spelling mistakes and such.

Brother Astartes, the ETL is upon us once again. And once again we are united as a codex. Yet now our foes have multiplied ten fold with the inclusion of the foul xenos. But we shall not waver, for there can be no meeting of minds with such beings that exist in the dark places of the galaxy. There is simply a choice, defeat them... or be defeated by them. And defeat them we will. FOR ARE WE NOT SPACE MARINES? ARE WE NOT THE CHOSEN OF THE EMPEROR, HIS LOYAL SERVANTS UNTIL DEATH? TO THE DARKNESS WE BRING FIRE, TO THE IGNORANT WE BRING FAITH. THE EMPEROR'S WILL IS YOUR TORCH, WITH IT, DESTROY THE SHADOWS! THE TEMPLARS CALL YOU TO WAR, WILL YOU ANSWER?

In preparation for the new model being released tomorrow I thought I'd make a thread where people who like the model, have some conversion ideas or tweaks they want to make to the model and for people to show off their version of him. Obviously there's a separate thread for his rules side and this is purely a modelling/painting appreciation thread. I really love this new model, honestly way better than I thought it would be. When we were shown previews way back, just the image of the model alone was enough to get me back into my space marine army. That said there's a couple of things I would like to change mainly: 1) that weird block thing near the bottom of the axe 2) the dangle claw 3) his face 1 and 2 are easy fixes for me. Just switching the dangle claw for something more fixed, maybe the claw from a rocket launcher backpack or the new havoc kit and cutting off that box on the axe. 3 is a bit more difficult because of the way I want to do it. I basically want to replace his face with a visor helmet from the inceptor kit. It may now be more of a pain because the gravis hood is further back. What are your thoughts on the model? Got any ideas for conversions? Post your versions for the Sons of Ferrus to appreciate

So the consensus seems to be that Iron Hands are top tier and possibly overpowered(unproven). It is possible that a rules change by GW could result in nerfs. What do you think might be reasonable possible changes they might make? Are changes necessary? If no changes come is that a signal of power creep to come? My personal opinion is that a small change is coming and will pull back on stacking defensive abilities in some way. It should be noted that my ability to predict GW rules changes is poor

Hi all. I’ve been reading through the Space Marine codex, looking for different units that would combine well with the Iron Hands traits (beside the obvious ones). There were a few units that caught my eye, but the Whirlwind has truly peaked my interest. A Whirlwind with a Castellan launcher has 2D6 (meaning an average of 7) Str 6 and AP -1 shots on anything within 72”. And I mean anything since it ignores LOS. Then add in the Iron Hands ability to move and shoot heavy weapons with no penalties and re-rolling 1s, and the strat to fire a Whirlwind twice in one turn. And all this for a unit that costs 80 points. How is this not a thing in more Iron hands lists? 1 or 2 in any list can be a major nuisance. Am I missing something? Has this been brought up before? Let me know if I’m totally out to lunch here.

Group shots of Clan Nartek. Some are a bit dusty, A clan of medusa exiled and tasked with guarding a secret hidden deep with in the Hariden nebula in ages past, with the coming of the rift, The iron council has decided that the Secret within the nedula is needed once more and has reinforced the clan with the primaris strain and gifts of Cawl. Imperials who have fought beside Clan Nartek talk of astartes new and old taking damage that should fell terminators and reduce them to Ash having little to no effect and when a astartes finally falls they rapidly rise seeming to be iron automata rather than flesh and blood. Hariden Nedula. 2 inhabited systems Naxos system. Brown dwarf star. 1 Beta class forge World, 6 large asteroid belts that are the remains of 6 planets destroyed Billions of years ago, these belts provide a massive mineral wealth for the forge world.The forge world Naxos Prime is one of the last holdouts of the legio cybernetica they provide the clan with Domitar and Thallax class constructs as part of the ancient compact between the Forge and the Clan. Ontur system 4 planets Ontur-1 Clan World a molten hell world with the clan fortress in orbit and small dark age arcologyies floating on the surface Ontur-2 Dying hiveworld. In ages past a world with Trillions of inhabitants in the current age its down to 22 million people huddled in the slowly dying hives. Ontur-3 jungle world. Made up of lots of small continents each populated by many warring clans battling for dominance. Primary clan recruiting world Ontur-4 Agriworld. In ages past it was a mono crop world but with the fall on Ontur-2, large scale farming has fallen by the wayside and the world developed into pastoral idyll, one of the rare sparks of light in the growing darkness

I dont often add new models to my collection any more, but lately Centurions have caught my eye. Here's the question: Are they worth taking? I know that they are not too tier and are too expensive for what they do, but does combining them with Iron Hands chapter tactica and an Apothecary make them more useful by making them more survivable?

With the advent of this new beta rule, how might it impact the Iron Tenth and their way of war specifically? Captain on Bike with Primarch's Wrath and Merciless Logic stands out as an obvious beneficiary for a mobile, shooty warlord, perhaps accompanied by a bike squad of some kind. Thoughts? Has anyone's calculus uncovered other gems?

So I've used our Chapter stratagem on all kinds of vehicles: Dreadnoughts, Razorbacks, Hunters, Stalkers, Vindicators, Stormtalons, and Stormhawks. Right now, since they provide a hefty amount of my firepower, my most common target is my aircraft (Stormtalons hitting in 2s can lay down a LOT of pain). What is your preferred machine to empathize with?

Since Iron Hands can survive damage other marines would die of, do they have more veterans then other Chapters? Would they also be able to survive dangerous wounds better from them knowing how to fix broken bodies with bionics? Please excuse grammar, Spelling mistakes and such.

Just wanted to know if people think how CA18 impacted IH chapter tactics directly or indirectly. I'm actually looking into fielding Redemptor and simple dreadnoughts as they are much cheaper now and so the benefit of our tactic is quite higher. Your thoughts?

Owing to the rather changeable nature of Iron Hands lore, I thought it would be best to actually have a thread that sets out what the lore on the structure of the Iron Hands actually is, as of David Guymer's works. Obvious spoilers for those who have not read any of the recent Iron Hands novels. Clan Companies: Currently, Clans nominally obey the tents of the Codex Astartes, with Clan Avernii being the 'Veteran Company', Clans Garrsak, Raukaan, Kaargul and Haarmek being the 'Battle Companies', Sorrgol and Borrgos being 'Tactical Reserve Companies', Clan Morlaag being the 'Assault Reserve Company', Clan Vurgaan being the 'Devastator Reserve Company' and Clan Dorrvok being the 'Scout Company'. However, despite this structure, the eight central clans are still very much independent. Each of them carries out their own recruitment, with their recruits going into Dorrvok for the duration of their training, and then returning to the company that originally selected them upon their ascension to full battle-brother status, though it is noted that ascendant scouts can be bartered around companies, and so a scout marked for Borrgos may be acquired for resources and recruiting rights by Garrsak. Currently, there is a deficit of lore on ascension to Avernii, though there is an example of a disgraced brother of Avernii being acquired by another company in the same manner as a scout. Also, while nominally 'reserve companies', Sorrgol, Borrgos, Morlaag and Vurgaan are still fully-autonomous, conducting independent operations much like the 'battle companies', rather than individual claves being attached to other clans for support. This does not appear to be the case for Avernii, with only a single clave operating on Thennos, but there is too little information available to be certain. Rather than having a central armoury, each clan has its own Techmarines, and is responsible for maintaining its own vehicle pool. Each clan is led by an Iron Captain, who may be an Iron Father, depending on seniority. Clan Avernii: Clan Garrsak: Clan Raukaan: Clan Kaargul: Clan Haarmek: Clan Sorrgol: Clan Borrgos: Clan Morlaag: Clan Vurgaan: Clan Dorrvok: Clan Council and Iron Fathers: There is no Chapter Master of the Iron Hands. Instead, the Iron Hands are run by the Clan Council. The Chapter Master equivalent is the Warleader, who occupies a position similar to a dictator of the Roman Republic. The Clan Council is situated in the Eye of Medusa. Made up of 41 Iron Fathers, it is from this body that the Warleader is elected to head each individual endeavour, though he cedes his power back to the Council afterwards. The 42nd seat is held by the triumvirate of magi known as the Voice of Mars, who technically do not have an individual vote, but instead place proxy votes for each absent Iron Father not already represented, thus giving them a disproportionate degree of influence over the Iron Hands. The Eye of Medusa is a vault beneath the Felgarrthi mountains. It is surrounded by a maze of ironglass depictions of the Iron Hands, with rumours that the skull of Ferrus Manus lies at the centre of the maze, guarded by a Helfather. The council chamber itself is circular, hung with banners of current and past clans. The Iron Father are plugged into 41 podiums that face the centre of the room, where the podium of the Voice of Mars is situated, though upon the election of a Warleader, the Voice will cede the podium to them. Surrounding these are two hemispherical enclosures that non-Iron Fathers spectate from. Debates take place both across the noosphere and in archaic spoken Medusan. The symbol of the Medusan Mechanicus is an Opus Machina with a black MKV faceplate in place of a human skull. In the most recent iteration of the lore, Iron Fathers are fully separated from the Chalpain-Techmarine role they previously held. Now, they are the highest ranking members of the Iron Hands, being those that sit on the Iron Council. Upon being selected for ascension to Iron Father, the Iron Hand is sent to Mars for training as a Techmarine, though his training will be more in depth than that of an ordinary Techmarine, and he will also be given the implants that allow him to communicate in the Eye of Medusa. In this way, each Iron Father could theoretically fulfil the function of a Techmarine. Owing to their status, Iron Fathers habitually are either clad in Terminator armour or reside within a Dreadnought. Each Clan has multiple Iron Fathers. The guardians of the Iron Council are the Helfathers. Clad in unmarked black Terminator plate, and bearing multiple heavy weapons, the Helfathers are figures of awe and dread even to other Iron Hands. They are revealed to be fallen Iron Hands reanimated through usage of the Keys of Hel, the forbidden tools of cybernetic resurrection returned to use after the death of Ferrus Manus. While ostensibly under the control of the Iron Fathers, it is shown that it is truly the Mechanicus that holds their reins. Reclusiam: The Iron Hands do possess Chaplains, referred to as Iron Chaplains. While attached to individual companies, the Reclusiam still maintains its own motor pool. Iron Chaplains are responsible for the spiritual care of the battle-brothers of their clan, as well as blessing their weapons in the same manner as Techmarines from other chapters would do. Librarius: While recruited by the Librarius, each individual Librarian spends the majority of their tenure attached to a specific Clan Company, with the most senior Librarian in each clan referred to as the Chief Librarian. Much like the Reclusiam, the LIbrarius maintains its own motor pool. The Librarius is also known to take psykers from the Black Ships as well as Medusa for their recruitment process. Both the Reclusiam and Librarius lack sway in the politics of the Iron Council. Apothecarion: Very little is known about the Apothecarion, other than that each Clan Company has its own Apothecary, who is responsible for assessing the genetic compatibility of potential recruits, as well as overseeing both the implantation of Astartes organs within recruits and bionics within battle-brothers. It is noted that there is a certain level of overlap between the roles of Techmarine, Chaplain and Apothecary within the Chapter Fleet: The Iron Hands fleet is sizeable, with each clan possessing an ironbarque as its capital ship, as well as battle-barges, strike cruisers, frigates and destroyers. The ironbarques were made for the Iron Hands by the Mechanicus in M33 in return for a 9999-year lease of one of their worlds, and are sizeable, with a battle-barge described as having two-thirds of the tonnage of one of them. In particular Clan Vurgaan is noted as having multiple battle-barges as well as its ironbarque. Thennos, the furthest planet from the star in the Medusa system, was leased to Mars in return for the ironbarques. It will be returned to direct Medusan rule on 062099.M43. The ironbarques will not be returned. Think of it as someone paying rent to live in a house - at the end of the lease, the person vacates the house, but they don't get their money back. This information is far from complete, as there will be things that I have either forgotten or missed. Please let me know if there is anything obviously wrong or missing, and I will address it. As more information becomes available, I will update this. Feel free to make any comments or enquire further.

Hey all: I just got into 40K over the summer. Currently I am thinking of starting an Iron Hands force. One thing that is vexing me is the current approach to dealing with Chaplains. It seems that in previous editions, they were considered out of place and their role was somewhat given to the Techmarines or Iron Fathers. But now with 8th, they seem to have been tossed back into the pool of available units without explanation. So it almost seems like a case of "inclusion by omission" where Chaplains are only allowed in Iron Hands lists because they haven't specifically been DISallowed (and because GW doesn't plan to give Iron Hands the attention it would take to treat them as anything but a "codex-compliant" chapter). Going forward, would it be safe to just go ahead and treat an Iron Hands Chaplain like any other vanilla version of same (from a rules perspective anyway)? Or has there been some indication on GW's part that Chaplains are still off-limits for Iron Hands but the whereases and therefores are still forthcoming? Given that there is still no Primaris version of a Techmarine, I could see GW releasing an Iron Hands upgrade sprue in conjunction with a Primaris Techmarine which would convert the generic Techmarine to a special Iron Hands unit with some Chaplain abiltiies (and therefore invalidating the inclusion of actual dedicated Chaplain units). Any thoughts? Am I dreaming if I expect GW to even address this at all?

So, my marines can build Dreads and perhaps TDA's too. But how many Dreads, fluffwise, would be logical? They are perhaps worse in Spacehulk missions, becaurse of their size and cant climb ladders. I was thinking 5-10 per Company, does this sound about right? Please excuse grammar, Spelling mistakes and such.

So I can't take it anymore. The more I look at Iron Hands the more I like them. Sure they are strong and people may put me in the bandwagon group but I really don't care. I have always enjoyed the idea of mobile pillboxes. Sisters of Battle can do it with their Repressor that is most likely going bye-bye. But Iron Hands can do it with Scout Squads in Land Speeder Storms. This combo is just amazingly good with many chapters but Iron Hands just have it on lock imho. Iron Hands do so much for this unit that it is almost silly not to take them. In my opinion you can kit them out for three different setups. Short-Ranged Support, Mid-Ranged Support, Long-Ranged Support. I have provided three builds below and how they are best used. Rules that benefit these units: Calculated Fury: Move and fire heavy weapons without penalty. Reroll 1s when firing heavy weapons. Devastator Doctrine: -1 ap on heavy weapons Iron Hands Chapter Tactics: 6+ FNP, Overwatch on 5-6, Double wounds on dmg chart does not affect Land Speeder Storms Long-Ranged Support Role [T] Scout Squad: Sniper Rifle x4, Missile Launcher x1 [Transport] Land Speeder Storm: Heavy Bolter, Cerberus Launcher The LRSR configuration is designed to skip around the battle field staying at the 36" range. The goal being to keep out of the range of rapid fire and most of the opponents more dangerous weapons. This unit can baby sit back field objectives on either side of the board with it's 18" move. Mid-Ranged Support Role [T] Scout Squad: Storm Bolter(Sgt), Bolter x3, Heavy Bolter x1 [Transport] Land Speeder Storm: Heavy Bolter, Cerberus Launcher The MRSR configuration is designed to harry the enemy. It will run into the 12" rapid fire range and unload is firepower. Then move back around and continue to pepper the enemy from odd angles making it difficult to assault or even counter productive. Ex. You move the speeder onto a building that puts you within 12" but makes the assault very difficult for your opponent. Ex2. You position your speeder in a location that will force the enemy to move in the wrong direct if they want to assault you. (This second point is where I think this build will really shine. Forcing your opponent to make a decision to assault his harasser or move toward the objective.) Another point is that if this unit ends up camping on an objective you can make use of bolter drill. Short-Ranged Support Role [T] Scout Squad: Combi-melta(Sgt), Shotgun x3, Missile Launcher x1 [Transport] Land Speeder Storm: Heavy Bolter, Cerberus Launcher The SRSR configuration is designed to get in close to get the double dice wound roll for the Combi-melta. The shotguns are assault as well as the combi-melta and will allow the unit to move and still fire at full capacity. It has a focus on anti-armor but also has a good amount of anti-infantry with the Frag/Krak Missile and shotguns. There is a close combat build but I really don't think it is worth the effort. If you want to assault with scouts you should be playing Black Templars or Blood Angels. -------------------------------------------------------- These are the three builds I think will work best with Iron Hands. There is an argument for the more melee focused build to be used to soak overwatch for a more assault-based Ironhands force but I don't think we'll see many of those. If anyone has any suggestions or if I've made a mistake somewhere please let me know. **Updated as I now have the codex in hand. Still need to verify if storm bolters are in the sgt list. Forgot to check on my lunch.

Found a painting guide for a flat black that I really like. I'll do the highlights differently but the flat black is impressive and the weathering looks really good to. Thought I would share it with the community just in case. Source: Goonhammer

what do you guys think? we can make one or more dreads a character (stratagem) and bc they are a character we can give them a warlord trait (stratagem) like FNP 5+ not sure if a relic is allowed ive read somewhere that vehicles cant have relics. for me the obvious pick would be IronClad dread, 4 attacks + 1 double CC choice + 1 shock assault + 1 character stratagem , T8, chainfist, and 8 wounds

If you use the supplement, can you still use stratagems, warlord traits and relics from the main codex? Please excuse grammar, spelling mistakes and such.

Any new thoughts on this guy for Iron Hands? I know most people think it is over-costed and lacking in efficiency. But with the Iron Hands bonus's and the current meta...I kinda think it has a place. At least in an army that focus's on a primaris theme that wants to take on flyers. The point cost is roughly over that of 2 repulsor executioners. The damage output is variable in comparison. But for a tough tank sitting next to a techmarine and getting a 2+ to hit from whatever source you want (Feirros, psyker, chaplain).....this thing can reliably kill a flyer per turn(never suffers negative modifiers to hit on main gun), has its 5++, decent save, and a few extra guns that are nothing to sneeze at. And a good candidate for the ironstone post-faq, and one hell of a distraction carnifex. It flies, moves 12" and can be difficult to tie up, has ok combat potential with the grav. And a 3" negative modifier to charges. However, it does not get it's 5++ in combat, but it does prtoect against mortal wounds, and the void shields will degrade less with the iron hands trait. I dunno, not looking to make this a main go-to, just wanted to re-evaluate it's usefulness and potential. And possibly anything I missed. I'll be looking to playtest it soon.

Inspired by the entire "everyone runs Feirros+Leviathan" discussions - what might be hidden gems that may not be that famous, but still more than usable with our supplement? With the models around anyway, I intend to try Tarantula sentry guns. They are a staple for my Raptors lists, denying large areas for deep strike while thinning chaff ranks, and a nice speedbump for the more aggressive armies. In our case, they make better use of Feirros' targeting array (at usually BS4+), resulting in that nice rerollable 2+ to hit. Automated Targeting might still make them a bit unwieldy, but it's a cheap way of spamming more heavy weapons. Twin assault cannons, on a unit of 3, racks up 192p for 12W T5 - which might not be the most resilient choice we have, but averages 35 hits S6 AP-2 per round, or 14 hits in overwatch (without CM around), making it near suicidal to charge with the usual 10 GEQ squads or 5 MEQ squads. The cheaper heavy bolter variants combined with a single twin lascannon works too, being considerably cheaper and packing AT as well as anti chaff. Bonus points for their ability to entirely ignore the fact that someone is within 1" of them. Not only can they still fire unimpeded (yes, at the very unit currently hitting them), but also your remaining army can shoot that target too. I've had more than one opponent run their units into CC with a tarantula to save them from getting shot, only to get shot by both the tarantula and everyone around. With their base size, that's also a nice wall to block movement/CC.