Dark Apostle Thirst Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 He had already breached the palace though...? Once again, Codex Chaos Marines The Palace is not like a big open box, where once you get through a wall the inside is open and exposed. It was a truly huge fortress, designed to withstand any siege, to prevent any enemy from getting access to the Emperor's Throne Room. It did. Getting in your girlfriend's house is not getting into her bedroom, ya dig? And one codex does not trump all the other sources that say the opposite of what yours suggests. No, mine doesn't but what it does say is that they breached, fought in the corridors for a while (those two took up most of the siege right there, then did the whole fiasco. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c-wrex Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 I agree man, I have that dex as well. Based on the data we have, it stands to reason that if Horus had more time, he most certainly could have breached all the way and succeeded. However, as we know, he did not have that time, and therefore his efforts ultimately failed. I'm glad we have come around, after all our discussion, and arrived at a common ground. :) That said, my favorite primarch is VULKAN!!! firefirefirefirefirefirefirefirefirefirefireVULKAN,VULKANfirefirefirefirefirefirefirefirefirefireVUL KAN,VULKAN!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Eh, close enough. One thing though, it most definately says he did breach though. Just clarifying. Corax and Night Haunter myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c-wrex Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Eh, close enough.One thing though, it most definately says he did breach though. Just clarifying. Corax and Night Haunter myself. Agreed. And Corax and Night Haunter are pretty rad primarchs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Pretty nice that this whole thing is finally over. Gah! Vulkan is pretty awesome,master of the forge! Don't have a weapon? Make one, and it will be master crafted. Dirty? Discount on purifing flame, buy one now and get a free sample of the Emperors mercy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c-wrex Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Word up :D ! Did you know he also wails out guitar solos so insane he once killed an entire WAAAGH? Fact. I often think that Corax and NH represent kind of good cop/bad cop duality in the days of the legions. I don't know of any instances where they worked together, but their methods of careful infiltration and causing chaos inside and behind enemy ranks are awfully similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Yeah, why do you think I like them? It's like I have two halves there, one half of me wants to go for those sheer awesomeness primarchs (Ferrus, Sanguinus and of course Vulkan), and my other half likes to wait in the shadows, take them out before they even know death has come. Only thing I have aginst them is Night Haunter was insane, and the whole Nevermore line (why did the have to steal it so obviously?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UltimateJake Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Perhaps next time we all start a debate we should start a new topic. :D Vulkan is awesome, but Ferrus is the BEST. just kidding, their all equal. No need to start anymore debates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c-wrex Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 I think hands down, no question about it, the most awesome, most badass primarch is Russ. Period. He's totally nuts, but completely focused, a hard drinker, but never a lush, a big eater, but never a glutton, a fierce warrior, but never a murderer. He's very close to my favorite, but, ya know, I love things which are affiliated with: the color green, fire/burning, and dragons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Word up :D ! Did you know he also wails out guitar solos so insane he once killed an entire WAAAGH? Fact. I often think that Corax and NH represent kind of good cop/bad cop duality in the days of the legions. I don't know of any instances where they worked together, but their methods of careful infiltration and causing chaos inside and behind enemy ranks are awfully similar. Are you breaking up the band?! :D WLK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Perhaps next time we all start a debate we should start a new topic. :D Oh yeah, sorry to the OP for hijacking your thread, and apoligies to anyone I offended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c-wrex Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Word up :D ! Did you know he also wails out guitar solos so insane he once killed an entire WAAAGH? Fact. I often think that Corax and NH represent kind of good cop/bad cop duality in the days of the legions. I don't know of any instances where they worked together, but their methods of careful infiltration and causing chaos inside and behind enemy ranks are awfully similar. Are you breaking up the band?! :D WLK What? Never! I was just extolling the awesome virtues of my liege, as I'm sure you can understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Very well, we all know that the true cause of the Heresy was Horus being kicked out of the band. WLK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c-wrex Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Very well, we all know that the true cause of the Heresy was Horus being kicked out of the band. WLK "Singing lessons," Said Horus, "You think I need singing lessons?!?!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 just went through this, noticed i never really went into my favorites... well obviously Russ, but he is closely followed by Vulkan. I also got some love for Corax and Dorn. here is some of the why: Russ: totally awesome Viking, rock god (drums), able leader of men, honorable, and once friends with, friends with for LIFE. also for his views of the common man of the Imperium Vulkan: the closet thing 40k has to the good guy of the story, totally humanitarian yet will beat you with a hammer til you die if you mess with him, able to rock your face off with his guitar solos Corax: Batman of 40k, without the insaneness of Cruze. cleans up his own messes. Dorn: as a middle child, i empathize with Dorn. while never the best primarch (battle record wise), was left to basically defend the Imperium against Horus while the Emperor was beneath the Palace and did a decent job of it. His total flip out and actions during the Scouring were understandable was well. WLK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. Lysander Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 I highly doubt it was a mistake for Horus lowering the shields. He knew that the Space Wolves, Dark Angels, and Ultramarines were coming quickly along with whatever reinforcements they had picked upon the way. When they reached Terra they would surround Horus's fleet and probably just blast them apart. Or they would've forced their way through any blockade set up by Horus and managed a mass troop landing on the surface of Terra. Horus knew that if they arrived his advantage of numbers and likely orbital superiority would be taken away. So he wanted to finish it off as fast as possible. The only way to do this QUICKLY was to kill the Emperor. If the Emperor was dead then the space marine legions on Terra would probably be broken and easily destroyed. So Horus wanted to end it very very quickly. So he lowered his shield and awaited the Emperor and anybody else he brought with him. But, he died and then the Heresy was crushed so the end of story... This is how I view the story... Edit: Whoa, my fault for not reading the last page xD On topic: Remembering 'Alternate Heresy' story's account of Angron being cool headed, I think we all would have liked him a lot more if it did indeed turn out that way: but of course then his legion wouldn't have fallen to Khorne :). The Khan is also really cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hendrik Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 off topic; no insults taken, this was actually one of the most interesting conversations i've had here for a while;) on topic: Leman russ ofcourse, not only is he a fierce warrior, but he is imo also the most human primarch of all. i especially love how he get's described in wolf's honour; always losing the spear he got from the emperor. can there be a more human thing then to lose objects? :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tormented Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Guilliman is my favourite primarch. He was in my opinion one of if not the greatest strategist having liberated the most worlds of all the primarchs and he built a prsoperous empire of several systems. The Emperor himself thought Robute was a primarch with unsurpassed vision and ability. Because of his skill as a strategist his legion grew to be the largest and i dont think this comprimised the marines skills to fight or for the legions ability to wage war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Mournival Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Dorn: as a middle child, i empathize with Dorn. while never the best primarch (battle record wise), was left to basically defend the Imperium against Horus while the Emperor was beneath the Palace and did a decent job of it. His total flip out and actions during the Scouring were understandable was well. WLK Whoa! not cool man! Dorn had a great combat record; if you've read Horus Rising you might wanna read it over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Posted January 7, 2010 Share Posted January 7, 2010 Dorn: as a middle child, i empathize with Dorn. while never the best primarch (battle record wise), was left to basically defend the Imperium against Horus while the Emperor was beneath the Palace and did a decent job of it. His total flip out and actions during the Scouring were understandable was well. WLK Whoa! not cool man! Dorn had a great combat record; if you've read Horus Rising you might wanna read it over. i mean no insult, and perhaps should have said it better. how does this sound: amongst the best battle records, but never the star, must have grated him (atleast a little). WLK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philpill Posted January 8, 2010 Share Posted January 8, 2010 so while you might say they were in the "last room", the Canon material itself says otherwise. it also says Jaghaitai Khan wasnt present yet, as if he was he woudl have also joined the boarding team. he IS present when Dorn returns with the Emperor to entomb him on the golden throne. I'm sure I remember reading that Khan led the counter attacks from the gates which kept the enemy at bay ... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Posted January 8, 2010 Share Posted January 8, 2010 so while you might say they were in the "last room", the Canon material itself says otherwise. it also says Jaghaitai Khan wasnt present yet, as if he was he woudl have also joined the boarding team. he IS present when Dorn returns with the Emperor to entomb him on the golden throne. I'm sure I remember reading that Khan led the counter attacks from the gates which kept the enemy at bay ... ? that is always one thing that bothers me, as the star fortress was destroyed was it departed to pickup the khan, but he is just there when Dorn and the survivors return and leading the defenses... maybe one of the future writers will make sense fo this. so either i got something wrong and missed the bit that returned the khan to the palace WLK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Wilhelm Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 Um, I might want to remind you that if Horus hadn't lowered his shps shields, Dorn would have been screwed... that is the only reason why the seige of Terra failed. You know that right? There are 2 issues that seem to get blurred 1] Dorn answered Fulgrims question. "No, even Perturabo could not defeat me at Terra" What Dorn said was true and was proven. Perturabo did not beat Dorn. Perturabo could not beat Dorn even with help. Dorn + Terra > Perturabo. Perturabo had 4 Legion's help. Dorn had 2. Dorn does more with less. 2] Perturabo couldn't beat Dorn. Horus had to bait the Emperor to break the deadlock. Dorn was not, and would not have been, screwed. Horus dropped the shields because he couldn't win. Had he not dropped the shields, Perturabo still would not have beaten Dorn. Though I know the fluff, it has been a while and I'd got it wrong and let what I thought and wanted to happen come into my post. I was implying that Dorn had thoroughly resisted Perturabo and that the Palace would never have been over-run, ever, barring a massive passing of time. Which isn't true. In my words, Dorn said "No, even Perturabo could not defeat me at Terra" Perturabo would have beaten Dorn at Terra within a few months. (Of course that means the UM, DA and SW "weren't coming" but I was saying that even if they weren't, Perturabo would never have beaten Dorn on Terra) The Siege failed because 3 Legions in a Castle outperformed 5 Legions with Daemons. *This is not to re-open "The Great Divergence of 2010". I don't want to talk about it here. I had scored 4 days work, with long hours in 35+ C heat (90s in F) and after sitting on my bottom at school for 11 months, I have been exhausted. So that is some of 'the why' I am late in my post. It seems I have missed quite a party! ;) So mostly to Dark Apostle Thirst but also to the rest of you, I would like to confess I have Fan-Boyed and I apologise for that. Would you forgive me for that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Apostle Thirst Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 Yeah I forgive you. It's actually alright, as long as you don't base your argument off of the 'my primarch is so awesome something could/couldn't happen' line. To tell you the truth, I had already figured out your, erm, devotion to Dorn was very high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philpill Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 Word up :lol: ! Did you know he also wails out guitar solos so insane he once killed an entire WAAAGH? Fact. Now, that is real ultimate power! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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