The Neurode Crusade - Updates and Fixes to HQs and Elites

[Duke Danse Macabre]

So this is what a plog looks like for someone who likes creating things more than gaming?

Got to adm,it, been reading this at work for the last few hours and its awesome.

 

You have inspired me to hate you and start doing allot of freehand as it looks so damn good.

Your Marshal kicks arse as well.

Was starting to wonder what model I should base my new one off as my old is in Terminator armour.

[Brother Christopher]

I'm happy to read that you enjoyed browsing my thread! Thanks for your time ;) I just regret that so many things herein will probably never be finished. Also, I can't paint as well as I'd like, so I'm distracting people with free-hand attempts and just hope that the overall effect will be noticed and not the mess-ups.

[Marshal_Roujakis]

I request your counsel, brothers!

 

At the moment, the only thing I'm doing with the hobby is thinking about the things I want to make. I figured that something changed in my attitude towards units, and I'm not sure if it results from practicality or laziness. The shift is from my initial love for bling and customization, to a very stark approach: leave things (especially vehicles, like the Ironclad from a couple of post up) as plain as they can be, because (from a fluff perspective) all the ornaments will get destroyed during combat.

 

I'm planning to progress with my Ironclad and Sicaran this month. So the question is: bling or not? After a period of abstinence, I think I'll go with more ornaments this time. Especially the relic Sicaran, a tank thousands of years old, still remembering the times of HH, should get some proper treatment: chains, crosses, heraldry shields and purity seals in abundance. Or leave it a black brick?

 

I usually go with its capability first on the tabletop over just my own personal opinions... in fact the same treatment applies to weaponry as well...

 

for example: I was planning to build a Crusader Squad that was geared for ranged combat... Bolters, a Rhino, a Heavy Weapon and a Special Weapon... I leave them without weapons at first and get a few games with them changing their equipment from time to time... the squads Rhino always seem to get wrecked in the 1st few turns, but has a rather  pleasant  and nasty kill-streak with it's Storm Bolters... so upgraded it to a Razorback because it can shoot... the squad as well seems to favor Missile Launchers so I equipped it that... and the Flamer has roasted more light infantry than I can count with that squad... so flamer it is... now the squad is equipped with such and the squad also had a few fights under their belts worthy of bling and decorations... their Razorback as well has become their personal ride denoting their Sword Brother's personal heraldry and battle markings...

[Marshal Mattias]

As my fellow Marshal suggests, this slow-growth approach can be great fun. Start it basic, and see what bling it earns as you play?

 

My ironclad was just that - 'Ironclad.'

He performed admirably time and again, now he has a personality of his own, and a name and title to go with it. As his feats of heroism increased, I felt his unassuming banner pole was too small, so I have acquired a good sized dread-banner, magnetised and ready to be painted with new honours. As his legend grows, so too will he ;)

[Brother Christopher]

This is an amazing idea, yet, I'm sorry to say this, there is one major flaw. It implies playing, and I don't do that. Unfortunately, 40K-days at my local hobby stores coincide with my most busy workdays. And this means I "officially" retired from gaming, at least till September.

 

Mattias, where did you get that banner from?

[Marshal Mattias]

It comes from the ironclad sprue I believe; I got it from a 'part-used' kit on auction, which conveniently had both CC-arms, frag launchers and a couple of spares, all for about 3 quid. I think someone had basically built a 'shooty' variant and wanted rid of the extras. Allowed me to convert my old dread up anyway!

[Marshal_Roujakis]

There's also the alternative of just having mock battles or as my brother calls it.... "rolling random dices" when you're at home...

I have a few extra models of Tyranids and Chaos Space Marines that my Templars practice and hone their skills from... I usually do this to test if the model will actually be effective with their weapon loadout before an actual game, but this method could also be used I guess to see if a model is entitled to have bling or not :p

 

Or if you have a family member/friend that could be taught the hobby real quickly, you could have a Templar vs Templar battle with just your models and your friend/family...

whoever wins gets to get bling'd up :D

[Acebaur]

My opinion on Templars is generally go bling or go home.  That said I think there should be varying degrees of it as there are varying degrees being veteran.

 

With veteran units(like Stern/Vanguard) I go heavy bling, these guys are the best of the best and will have all the trappings to prove it. 

 

Then there are veteran initiates. These guys are usually the ones with tabards and multiple upgrade sprue options, and of course a healthy dose of seals. Often they are armed with a some kind of a specail weapon, be it a PW or ranged gun.

 

The regular initiates come next. They have a few of seals and a couple of sprue bitz.  I do this so I can spread out the love of a single upgrade sprue better while still maintaining enough bling to satisfy my taste.

 

Finally are the newbs or as I like to call them, the Shiny's.  Because to quote Star Wars, "Your armor is shiny and new, just like you"  I've only recently painted a few of this type. Mainly because I had some neglected marines that were "rescued" from ebay and they were already put together. So I figured there would bound to be some marines who were just promoted to initiate and haven't acquired the honors of their more veteran brethren.

 

Vehicles are almost always treated like veterans. These machines have been in service for sometimes multiple centuries and will have the honors to show for it. 

[Brother Culter]

I take the same approach as Acebaur and go big on the bling. The only problem I have now is that all my initiates look like SB's as they mostly have tabards, shoulder pads and weapons from the upgrade sprue. On this point has anyone built honor guard using other parts but still keeping them "Templar looking"?

 

Also Brother Christoper I'm really liking your Iron clad, It's not to different to mine

 

http://s5.postimg.org/8aicd118z/DSC_1176.jpg

 

http://s5.postimg.org/ctukyjj4j/DSC_1177.jpg

[Marshal_Roujakis]

Brother Christopher I apologize for hijacking your thread, but as per the post above I mixed GK with FW, the BT upgrade sprue and some green stuffing to come up with my Honour Guard:

 

http://i1151.photobucket.com/albums/o622/Marshal_Roujakis/New%20Templar%20Box%202014/DSC_0395_zps38dd5015.jpg

 

and as per the case of these... I went full bling because they are Honour Guard, and the Land Raider Crusader is the HQs main ride.

[Honda]

With veteran units(like Stern/Vanguard) I go heavy bling, these guys are the best of the best and will have all the trappings to prove it.

 

 

The other side of the coin is, if you're really that good, everyone knows it, therefore bling isn't necesary.

 

Save it for the Art School Boys (i.e. BA). ;)

[Brother Christopher]

@ Acebaur - that's what I used to think. Then I kind of forgot about it. Especially vehicles should get some proper treatment. But the problem I'm having is where to put these ornaments: at first I think "this is a cool place to put this cross", but later, before actually adding the ornament I am more like "well, that doesn't make sense, and what about the other side?"

 

@ Culter - that is a cool Ironclad. And the things in the background are equally cool!

 

@ Roujakis - Hijacking will not be tolerated!!   No, wait. These models of yours are extremely cool, go ahead.

 

That being said, I am going to try and add detail to my Sicaran. Chains, shields, seals, maybe an Imperial Fists badge somewhere (to pay homage to our predecessors, as the tank probably 'remembers' those ancient times). I don't know how that'll work, but I'm going to try. Duh. On the one hand, I can't wait to paint that tank. On the other, I just can't find time to devote to the task of fixing and priming it. It seems that I have to set a reasonable deadline and stick to it. Otherwise, the future of my 40K will be dim (not grim and dark, as it's supposed to be, but just dim and neglected).

[Acebaur]

 

With veteran units(like Stern/Vanguard) I go heavy bling, these guys are the best of the best and will have all the trappings to prove it.

 

 

The other side of the coin is, if you're really that good, everyone knows it, therefore bling isn't necesary.

 

Save it for the Art School Boys (i.e. BA).

 

 

Maybe, but then what I said really applies to virtually all of 40K. The whole setting is filled with ridiculous over the top stuff that.  Between backpack banners, skulls everywhere, cloaks tabards and all the various chapter specific decorations, it's everwhere. It's not just SM either, other races, both "good" and "evil" do it too. It's also all over the art too, so I've always felt it's just part of the culture of the universe. That is the more badass you are, the more stuff you have on your armor :lol:

 

@ Bro Christopher: I put smaller stuff like shields, seals, swords etc, on the smoke stacks of the rhino chassis's. Larger stuff on the rear and side doors, then add crosses to the front to flavor. I also like to use the large rear hatch FW decals on my rhino's as well, makes them pop on the table top ;)

[Brother Culter]

@ Brother Christopher thanks for the comment. That pic was taken when Brother Ludwig (my Ironcad) was overseeing the arrival of some flying support and some new LRC's.

 

Regarding your last point our vehicles are perfect for adding details. I don't have much in the way of sculpting or modelling skills so I used the FW upgrade doors and etched bass. The rear rhino hatch with Templar shield also looks amazing and made my hunter / stalker look great!

[Brother Christopher]

Now, I don't want to start another topic just to ask this, so I'll put it here. What's your advice on the lodeout of a Sicaran: sponson mounted Lascannons or Heavy Bolters? The point difference amounts to 20, which isn't much. Hence, I'm leaning towards the Lascannons for the additional anti-armour and anti-MC punch, and the Accelerator Autocannon appears to be a gun able to damage higher AV too, so the LCs won't be that obsolete (with LC sponsons and armoured ceramite, the tank still remains below 200 points). Yet, HBs have their merits too:  they deliver more shots and are in slightly better synergy with the front and turret autocannon. At the moment, I'd like to decide between the two variants: I want to avoid magnetizing and I'll have spare parts for a different vehicle. Any thoughts?

[Marshal Reinhard]

Lascannons. You already have one hull mounted heavy bolter. Lascannons lets you deal more reliably with high AV targets, and you're dishing out plenty of shots anyway

[Brother Christopher]

Thanks for answering. This is what I hoped to hear. This is the second time I'm having "this" dilemma.  Unlike the case of a Stormtalon, I suppose, the LCs on the Sicaran are worth it. Firstly, you get two of them, instead of twin-linked. Secondly, a Sicaran appears to be a much more reliable "platform". Thirdly, a the weapons on a Sicaran work together well in terms range, while a LC Talon suffers from its Assautcanons. Right?

[Acebaur]

Thanks for answering. This is what I hoped to hear. This is the second time I'm having "this" dilemma.  Unlike the case of a Stormtalon, I suppose, the LCs on the Sicaran are worth it. Firstly, you get two of them, instead of twin-linked. Secondly, a Sicaran appears to be a much more reliable "platform". Thirdly, a the weapons on a Sicaran work together well in terms range, while a LC Talon suffers from its Assautcanons. Right?

 

If points are a problem I'd sooner have the melta immunity instead of the LC's, just my 2 cents

[Brother Christopher]

I'm in the final stages of prepping my Sicaran for painting. Now, I'm not sure about the ornaments. This is my first idea:

 

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k260/krj_38/sicaran/P10909531_zps64cbe798.jpg

 

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k260/krj_38/sicaran/P10909541_zpsda4eb1ea.jpg

 

Side ornaments are supposed to be symmetrical. There's a BT icon, an IF icon (to show the history of the tank), and BT swords on top of tracks. I'm not sure about these swords, though. Apart from these ornaments, I'm planning to add some purity seals and freehand BT crosses.

 

I was also considering adding some chains, but after much deliberation I guess there isn't a really good spot for those: the chain is misplaced and looks clumsy, I feel. (Unlike a Rhino chasis, this one doesn't have hatches. And hatches seem like a really nifty place to add bling.) 

 

Oh, and BTW: My personal sad story about this tank (which I thought is an original model where in fact it turned out to be a recast) turned out quite okay. I contacted the seller and informed him about my dissatisfaction with the product and he agreed to refund a part of the price. That way I have a decent-looking Sicaran for a very reasonable price (the money saved are worth the overall quality and the effort I put into assembling and 'repairing' the tank).

Edited January 17, 2015 by Brother Cristopher

[Firepower]

I'd lean towards asymmetry with the details on the front, seeing as the armor itself is asymmetric.  In either case, it doesn't look like those swords really fit on such a small space.

 

I see plenty of spaces where you could hang some chains that would look perfectly fine.  Though if the space is particularly large, you generally want to add ornaments to the chain itself, or else it looks a tad odd.  The first spot that really pops out at me is on the side, in the recessed section.  Hang a chain from one of those little circles to the second, and use something like a small shield to decorate it in the center.  The decoration will also help pin the chain to the model.

 

Another spot, you could hang a loose chain in front of the viewing-window-slit-thing on the front.  I'd use a chain with a finer link size for that though.  You could get away with a larger size for the previous spot.

 

What bitz do you have to work with?  Any Cities of Death?  Forgeworld brass etch?  Bretonnian?  A box of old Transformers?  I'd recommend taking inventory.  Perusing the bitz supply is a good way to rev up the brain batteries.

[Brother Christopher]

I have mixed feelings about the swords myself. But they do one thing great: cover the dreadful mouldlines and the generally ruined "mudguards".

 

With the chain up front, I don't have a suitably thin one. So if I'll hang a chain, on the side it'll be. Now... considering what you said about the recessed surface, I can't remember why I dismissed the idea of placing the chains in the armour recess in the front part. I suppose the reason for that was that I wanted to leave a nice spot for a free hand cross (or something else). But maybe I'll hang a chain on one side and paint something on the other.

 

The chain would be similar to that on the BT upgrade rhino door - hang from 2-3 spots and with decoration, just as you said.

 

When it comes to bits: no fancy bits here. Just regular Marine/BT stuff.

[Acebaur]

I agree with Firepower that it should be asymmetrical, that way it looks like stuff was added over the centuries as opposed to planned out that way.

 

As for the side stuff. I'd move the IF symbol into the recessed area as I feel like this is where the chapters emblem would normally go.

 

Do me a favor? If you have a SM vehicle transfer sheet see which of the IF logo's would fit in that space.  I plan on getting one of these soonish and I want to know what my options are ahead of time ;)   

[Brother Christopher]

Posting about the tank got me thinking even more about how to ornament the tank. Right now I'm quite determined to try something else than recently. I were hooked by the bare looks of SM vehicles from GW and FW websides (stores) and found most fun ideas impractical.
 
Thanks for your opinions! I'll gow for asymmetrical sides and try to add a chain here and there. The ornament on our vehicle chapter upgrade sprue don't make much sense. Why bind purity seals with a chain? O why bother with parchment on tanks at all? It's going to be ruined anyway, right? I limited myself by comparing 40K stuff to real things (too much Battlefield 3 it seems), which is a mistake. 40K is so cool because it is so nonsensical and over the top! So now I'm determined to add something to the Sicaran and pimp my AOBR/Ironclad.
 
With the IF symbol up front, I'm not sure about that. As you said, I too feel that it's a place for chapter symbols. The problem is that it's a BT tank now, and I want to add the IF symbol just as a honorific.
 
The other idea I had was to paint the entire tank black with the exception of the recessed area that would be yellow with the IF emblem. But, yeah: not sure about that.
 
Ace, sorry: I don't want to damage my transfer sheet (I want to sell it), so I won't cut the symbol out. Instead, here is a pencil 'circle' the size of the the emblem (big IF emblems, second row).

 
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k260/krj_38/sicaran/WP_20150118_002_zpsd8f0c972.jpg

 

I hope that helps!

Edited January 18, 2015 by Brother Cristopher

[Acebaur]

No worries at all, I was just looking to make sure it would fit in there so that is perfect thanks!

 

As for painting that recess yellow, I was kind of thinking the same thing for mine whenever I get it.  I think that despite the fact that the tank is BT and probably has been for a long time(read millennia) they are extremely rare and I think it might have angered the war spirit to change all the symbols over. 

[Brother Christopher]

Glad to hear it! It fits kind of perfectly.

 

Before posting, I had everything planned. Now things change, for the better. We'll see how it'll all turn out. Right now I feel more and more like painting the areas yellow and to put a black cross on it.