Kol Saresk Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 So yeah, I was looking at it and I noticed something, to me, that was very weird. The Alpha Legion and Sons of Horus are Distrusted Allies. But in the IA article, Alpharius and Horus were very close. So I sort of have some confusion about how all of this came about it. I mean, I know the Alpha Legion is all super-secretive but why would they be Distrustful of each other? Is it just one of those things where the Primarchs got a long but the Legions didn't? Meanwhile, what a some Ally combinations do you like or were interested to see? For example, maybe the Sworn Brothers between the Night Lords and the Death Guard? Or how the Salamander Bros are Sworn to the paranoid Dark Angels? Or maybe the opposite, what Ally combinations were you disappointed to see? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackoption Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 If you noticed, the allies matrix is not symetrical. Infact, if you look at the Death guard to Night lords, they are fellow warriors, but from night lords to death guard they are sworn brothers. The most interesting is the white scars are sworn brothers to sons of horus, but the sons of horus distrust the white scars.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted June 28, 2013 Author Share Posted June 28, 2013 Except that in the case of the Alpha Legion and Sons of Horus, it is symmetrical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darog Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 The story changes, as an example early scars were friends with the wolves, and now the scars despise wolves, though they behave worse than berserkers, following the latest books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 Though, at the end of Deliverance Lost, when Alpharius turns in the corrupted genetic data to Horus, it feels like there isn't that much trust left between them. I feel that at that time, Alpharius already knows that he is no longer their "brother" in a proper way, just a mad king hell-bent on dominance. What I like is the non symmetrical relationship between the imperial army and the Alpha Legion. Fluffy and fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted June 28, 2013 Author Share Posted June 28, 2013 Maybe. The more I think about it, the Sons of Horus have been presented being very straightforward warriors so while Horus may appreciate the unconventional tactics of the XX, nothing says his warriors have to follow his lead. Well, you know what I mean. And it maybe vice versa for the Alpha Legion Astartes when they think of the XVI Legion. So not necessarily "distrustful", just that they get along so well they might as well be distrustful allies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 Mmm. The Alpha Legion's preferred tactics wouldn't chime well with most rank & file from other legions I would imagine, like Fear to Tread shows. The Alpha Legion owuld probably just disappear at strange times and popping up later with a unit you didn't think they had there, give away very little information about their actual forces and strengths. They would unexplainably have vital information on their enemies without giving away their sources (that would make anyone distrustful, heh). They wouldn't brotherly socialize with the other legionnaires as other legions would, and they would all go around calling themselves "Alpharius" all the time, making it frustrating for the enemy to keep track of who is who... ...yeah, "Alpha Legion - the social legion" isn't exactly their title... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskRaider Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 I find the relationship between Death Guard and Night Lords interesting. Obviously as we know from background information, Curze and Mortarion were close brothers, and I believe that the Night Lords would be drawn toward the stoicism of the Death Guard Legion, but the Death Guard themselves may be a bit off with Night Lords' style of warfare. It's interesting and ties well with the background. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyaenidae Posted June 28, 2013 Share Posted June 28, 2013 The story changes, as an example early scars were friends with the wolves, and now the scars despise wolves, though they behave worse than berserkers, following the latest books. I actually like that the Scars are friends with very few others. They are isolationists, and give their friendship to no one who hasn't earned it. I think that, in the end, the Scars and the Wolves of Fenris's friendship will be created in the fires of the Heresy. Nothing builds brotherhood between two contrasting groups like a bond created under fire from an enemy. When I was out at a firebase in Afghanistan, I was working alongside a group of Polish Soldiers who, to be honest, I didn't get along with often. After our first firefight, though, I suddenly found myself kicking back with these fellas, playing cards (mean dudes at poker, lol), trying to learn their language, and generally BS'ing with those who spoke English. Honor to the 16th Battalion Powietrzno-Desantowy; brothers of a different flag, but brothers none the less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted June 28, 2013 Author Share Posted June 28, 2013 I gotta laugh that that the Wolves and World Eaters are "Fellow Warriors" though. I can sort of see both Legions(not the Primarchs) sort of getting over the Night of the Wolf, but I don't see the Wolves doing it quite as fast or as graciously, a word which really shouldn't apply to the World Eaters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizwald23 Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 I was wondering who are battle brothers with the blood angels in the allied matrix. I want to add a couple units from another legion when I do my heresy blood angels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Eremon Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 Imperial Fists, Ultramarines and Salamanders. Going by the other side of the chart, add Sons of Horus. Edit: And I can see the War Hounds and Space Wolves being rather close. I like the idea that the relationships are at least in part influenced by their pre-Primarch identities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 Space Wolves. World Eaters. Best buddies. What is this I don't even. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted July 4, 2013 Author Share Posted July 4, 2013 It was before Betrayer. So basically before any contention between the Space Wolves and World Eaters existed, or rather before any was recorded. Besides, I see each Legion being able to move on since each Legion thought that they won. That and who doesn't like a good killing buddy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Eremon Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 They are the kind to hardcore rustle and brawl, laugh about it afterwards and ultimately forge a close relationship over it. Look at the Dark Angels and Space Wolves. Their poor relationship originates from the Lion's inability to just that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 I do! I do! There exactly the same in reality X=World eaters - butchers nails = angry yet not pshyco killers Y=Space wolves - Wulfen = angry yet not pshyco killers Therefore X+Y= 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depthcharge12 Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 I do! I do! There exactly the same in reality X=World eaters - butchers nails = angry yet not pshyco killers Y=Space wolves - Wulfen = angry yet not pshyco killers Therefore X+Y= 1 Psycho killer....Qu'est-ce c'est? ba ba ba bam baba bum bum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 Ha!! See kids algebra and music are used in real life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Semper Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 Or how the Salamander Bros are Sworn to the paranoid Dark Angels?I don't think there is a credible answer to this so far. Nothing in the fluff points to any reason why this should be the case. And it's really not an easy match... It'd be easier to accept say the SoHs or even ECs or BAs... But Salamanders? It doesn't make much sense to me at all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torva Minoris Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 It was before Betrayer. So basically before any contention between the Space Wolves and World Eaters existed, or rather before any was recorded. Besides, I see each Legion being able to move on since each Legion thought that they won. That and who doesn't like a good killing buddy? Sorry, dont want to go off topic. But I thought that the night of the wolf happened shortly after Angron took control of the World Eaters. It is a flash back when they are talking about it in Betrayer. So I still don't understand why they are bros on the allies chart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted July 4, 2013 Author Share Posted July 4, 2013 I meant that the chart was published before Betrayer was published, so anything in the Night of the Wolf had no bearing on the Allies chart because technically the fluff didn't exist yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torva Minoris Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 I meant that the chart was published before Betrayer was published, so anything in the Night of the Wolf had no bearing on the Allies chart because technically the fluff didn't exist yet. I gotcha, that makes perfect sense now. Thanks for clarifying for me :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Eremon Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 The chart also specifies that it can mean lots of different things, such as factions within one Legion that betrays or refuses to betray, which ever the case may be, the Emperor allied with another Legion of similar loyalties, such as a loyalist World Eater or a traitor Space Wolf. Which is why I like to say that the Chart may take into account times when the Legions felt wildly different from each other than at the Heresy, such as the Dusk Raiders and War Hounds perhaps, or the Imperial Heralds and the First. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChapterGrim Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 If you noticed, the allies matrix is not symetrical. Infact, if you look at the Death guard to Night lords, they are fellow warriors, but from night lords to death guard they are sworn brothers. The most interesting is the white scars are sworn brothers to sons of horus, but the sons of horus distrust the white scars.... A satisfactory explanation for this was never given, though I would suppose that the effect would be guided by the Legion in the Primary Detachment... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Or how the Salamander Bros are Sworn to the paranoid Dark Angels?I don't think there is a credible answer to this so far. Nothing in the fluff points to any reason why this should be the case. And it's really not an easy match... It'd be easier to accept say the SoHs or even ECs or BAs... But Salamanders? It doesn't make much sense to me at all... I think it has more to do with the Salamanders being friendly with everybody who isnt a psychopath. Standoffish and paranoid, sure, but they are reliable allies when egos are not in play. WLK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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