Ashur Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Id actually love for Mortarion to take the words to heart, attempt to change sides and rush to Earth only to get becalmed and beg nurgle for forgiveness. Doubt itll go exactly that way though :/ That's exactly what I was thinking about. Mortarion triying to preserve the "purity" of their cause, while around him his brothers fall to Chaos worship (Lorgar, Fulgrim), don't give a damn anymore (Curze, Perturabo) or end up giving their support to Chaos for their own reasons (Horus, Alpharius). He gives up to desperation when he realizes that, after being corrupted by Nurgle, there is no way back and he has become what he wanted to destroy, even if the price was rebellion. One way or another, WE NEED A DEATH GUARD NOVEL FAST. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskRaider Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 I actually really like the idea of Mortarion attempting to defect back to the Imperium. I highly doubt the Emperor would take him back, but you never know... He did try to turn Horus before having to kill him, and the XIVth would be a boon to the Terran defense. He definitely seems to be unsure of his alliance during his interaction with the Khan. We've also seen very little activity from Mortarion post-Isstvan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 If my choices are "Have Mortarion be the one Traitor Primarch who was so pathetic he decided to try whining his way back to Dear Poppa after killing billions including his own gene sons" and "No more Death Guard in the Heresy novels ever" I'll take option B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskRaider Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 It's not whining, it's choosing the lesser of two evils. I honestly think he's in too deep, and it's unfortunate because at this point he seems to be the only Primarch still possessing a level head that's sided with Horus. It would be an interesting twist, even if he decides to take option C and rather than attempting to go back into the Imperial fold, he actively defies both sides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Lorgar has a level head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskRaider Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 He's also fallen to Chaos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Lorgar has a level head. As does Perturabo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depthcharge12 Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Lorgar has a level head. As does Perturabo. As does Ferrus Manu- awww too soon? :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nazguire Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Lorgar does not have a level head. He is utterly corrupted by Chaos. If you read Betrayer, his insane devotion to the 'song' of Chaos, the 'truth', etc reads like a man who has lost his mind. He may come across as calm and in control, but he is certainly not level-headed, reasonable or following any sort of logical, rational thought. That's the point of his character: he's a religious zealot, where calm thinking is put behind blind faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 So, the whole of Betrayer was Lorgar wearing his underpants on his head and drooling on his shoes, with his intentions for Angron and the Ruinstorm only coming about because of pure coincidence and not a calculated plan on Aurelian's part? One of us must own some sort of limited release special edition of the book that is very different from the other's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Mine was signed and my name was spelt wrong :/ But I think the stories the same Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskRaider Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Lorgar is a looney and a zealot. You're viewing him from the perspective of the characters, and even then you can tell he's an extremist. He's many things, but none of which are level headed. In fact, he's so unhinged that he went on a crusade to find something - ANYTHING - to worship, that he turned to Chaos, knowing full well they're full intentions for humanity, sacrificed his brother (Horus) to expediate the process of potentially destroying mankind, just so he could satisfy his innate desire to kneel before something. He is not level headed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demus Ragnok Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 So, the whole of Betrayer was Lorgar wearing his underpants on his head and drooling on his shoes, with his intentions for Angron and the Ruinstorm only coming about because of pure coincidence and not a calculated plan on Aurelian's part? One of us must own some sort of limited release special edition of the book that is very different from the other's. I think we can all agree that being crazy and being able to carry out complex intelligent plans can go hand in hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostMalone Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 The most pshycotic of us are usually the most sane as the old saying goes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Ones inability to grasp the Primordial Truth should not give them free reign to judge the sanity of others.... Level-headedness (sp??) displays sound judgment. Lorgar judges that humanity requires the powers of the Warp to survive. Is that truth? Who are we to say? Its an ugly statement regardless, and Chaos is shown to consume the sanity of many, yet some do persist in acting with a set of best interests in mind. Argel Tal saw Chaos. He was possessed by a Daemon, he still was shown to have a sense of perspective. When the setting is displayed well, there are arguments to be made both for, and against, the traitor primarchs actions. When the setting is done poorly, its time to twirl some mustaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 So, Lorgar finds out that every soul that perishes goes to the Warp to burn forever (The First Heretic) and sets out to solve this problem by causing humanity's mass ascension as a race of Warp beings (...is our future. Humanity's future. Immortal strength, and an eternity to learn the universe's secret metaphysics. He didn't die, Khârn, he ascended." Betrayer 402). Meanwhile, the Emperor presumably has the same knowledge and his solution to the "Everyone's souls being eaten by hell gods" problem is to stick his fingers in his ears and say "NAH NAH NAH I CAN'T SEE YOU CHAOS GODS". Yes, clearly Lorgar is the crazy guy here. :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Thats why I really cant wait for Master of Mankind. I need the Emperor done better, because frankly I cannot grasp how anyone can support (m)any of the choices he made. Are the Primarchs beings of the Warp, well beyond anything truly material? Yes, yes they are. Did Chaos some how take the Primarchs, or cause them to go hither and yon? Yes, yes they did. Did the Emperor lie, to the Primarchs, the beings which where instrumental in unifying (under slavery) the Human Race about the nature of reality? Yes. That, and many other lies, contradictions, or misrepresentations of the Emperor's position need to be explained, because at this point, hes as bad as many felt Abbadon was (13 failures, trololol) or Lorgar (pffft, guy just sucked at everything, full stop) or Angron (rage out, hulk smash..zzzzzz) Notice how its ADB who has, or will be, saving these characters? The Emperor needs it just as much if not more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashur Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Thats why I really cant wait for Master of Mankind. I need the Emperor done better, because frankly I cannot grasp how anyone can support (m)any of the choices he made. Do we know how much we have to wait for that one ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 No clue, I actually have no idea now that Unremembered Empire and Scars are done, what we will be getting next? Seems like we are at a bit of a cross roads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Let's see...the Fists, Iron Hands, and Night Lords still need books (frankly, so do the Death Guard and Salamanders, Flight and VL are about Garro and Vulkan, not the Legions.) A Fists book would have to be about the Siege. The Night Lords are supposed to be ADB's baby, but he'll probably be a while getting to them with The Talon of Horus, Master of Mankind, cutting down the tallest tree in the forest with but a herring, and slaying the Nemean Lion. The Iron Hands will be...complicated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribe Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Thats even assuming they do a book for each. Iron Hands are likely going to be a one off 'weird' addition to the canon. Fists, yar, at Terra. Night Lords, running around and doing their thing, I think this could/would/should be a flash back type book, like TFH, to show where they came from, especially Curze, and the process of their fall, but then jump into the rest of Thalamas? Maybe? Death Guard and Salamanders, well...I dont see the Salamanders getting much more love for a good while, but the Death Guard have had next to nothing (I did like Sanders micro-short though). AL and Wolves keep fighting, there are a few books possible there I guess, but out of the 'traditional' arc, are there any big moments left? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Thalamas? I don't know, I knid of want to see something more along the lines of following specific combat groups, see the Legionaries and what they do during the Heresy, that way we can see their thought processes behind the event as well. A bit like Betrayer, but without the Primarchs. And it has the potential to work. Especially in the case of the Iron Hands and the Night Lords since the Iron Hands no longer have their Primarch and the Night Lords are so distant from theirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Rohr Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 A DB is doing a heresy night lords novel isn't he? About the legion post Thramas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 Don't know when or what it;s about, but there are rumors of a novel called Nightfall in the works sometime after Master of Mankind, although the title might change since there is already a 40K Night Lords short story called Nightfall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depthcharge12 Posted October 28, 2013 Share Posted October 28, 2013 "In a time of insanity...look toward the mentally unsound to guide your path" ....yeah I just dropped that quote. Whatcha gonna do about it? I would even throw a John Blanche piece of artwork to go with it, but too many minds on this forum would explode from awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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