Knights Errant, Dark Angels, Grey Knights Discussion

[depthcharge12]

My opinion is and is most likely to remain that saying "Sevatar could be a Grey Knights founder if he could have turned his back on the Atramentar and Curze" is a lot like saying "Angron could have been the Warmaster if he could have just learned to control that temper of his". If ADB as author wants to have that happen, it's his prerogative to do so, but I feel it would require significantly altering if not ignoring key aspect's of Sevatar's character to pull off.

 

No, as far as possible GK founders go, what about Crysos Mortug, the Death Guard ex-Librarian who survived Isstavan III? So far he's only appeared in Forge World's fluff, but he does have the psychic talent AND the unbreakable loyalty to the Emperor the role (in my opinion) requires.

 

 

Yes a good one, but I believe he is being held for proto Death watch as his title was "Black Shield"

 

 

Probably his role as a leader of the destroyer cadre that specializes in terminating xenos species is a good indicator too as well as the fact that he was the de facto leader of a rag tag group composed of various legion elements and ordo reductor.

 

 

Thats what I'm betting at least

[RapatoR]

One thing just occurred to me, but admittedly it is very long shot: Night Lords, the eight legion , circle of leaders - Kyroptera and Grey Knights, eight brotherhood, grand master - Khyrion. Maybe one of the Night Lords will become GK.

[Scribe]

There's very little to suggest the VIIIth have any loyalty to the Emperor as a Legion. Very little.

[Perrin]

Apart from the spelling of Khyron. If there are loyalist Word Bearers and World Eaters there can be loyalist Night Lords. Perhaps a Terran that is sickened by what the Legion has become.

[Scribe]

I guess something could be added. I just mean given what we have already to work with, even the Terran's seem to have bought in to the Legion mentality pretty much completely.

 

Then again, this whole sub plot is without basis so why not. :p

[Lord Marshal Ragnrok]

My opinion is and is most likely to remain that saying "Sevatar could be a Grey Knights founder if he could have turned his back on the Atramentar and Curze" is a lot like saying "Angron could have been the Warmaster if he could have just learned to control that temper of his". If ADB as author wants to have that happen, it's his prerogative to do so, but I feel it would require significantly altering if not ignoring key aspect's of Sevatar's character to pull off.

 

No, as far as possible GK founders go, what about Crysos Mortug, the Death Guard ex-Librarian who survived Isstavan III? So far he's only appeared in Forge World's fluff, but he does have the psychic talent AND the unbreakable loyalty to the Emperor the role (in my opinion) requires.

 

 

 

My opinion is and is most likely to remain that saying "Sevatar could be a Grey Knights founder if he could have turned his back on the Atramentar and Curze" is a lot like saying "Angron could have been the Warmaster if he could have just learned to control that temper of his". If ADB as author wants to have that happen, it's his prerogative to do so, but I feel it would require significantly altering if not ignoring key aspect's of Sevatar's character to pull off.

 

No, as far as possible GK founders go, what about Crysos Mortug, the Death Guard ex-Librarian who survived Isstavan III? So far he's only appeared in Forge World's fluff, but he does have the psychic talent AND the unbreakable loyalty to the Emperor the role (in my opinion) requires.

 

 

Yes a good one, but I believe he is being held for proto Death watch as his title was "Black Shield"

 

 

Probably his role as a leader of the destroyer cadre that specializes in terminating xenos species is a good indicator too as well as the fact that he was the de facto leader of a rag tag group composed of various legion elements and ordo reductor.

 

 

Thats what I'm betting at least

 

i have thought about him. as you said i feel like he might be used for more of a DW role.

 

One thing just occurred to me, but admittedly it is very long shot: Night Lords, the eight legion , circle of leaders - Kyroptera and Grey Knights, eight brotherhood, grand master - Khyrion. Maybe one of the Night Lords will become GK.

 

that is most ludicrous idea iv ever heard in the past week

[Lord Lorne Walkier]

 

My opinion is and is most likely to remain that saying "Sevatar could be a Grey Knights founder if he could have turned his back on the Atramentar and Curze" is a lot like saying "Angron could have been the Warmaster if he could have just learned to control that temper of his". If ADB as author wants to have that happen, it's his prerogative to do so, but I feel it would require significantly altering if not ignoring key aspect's of Sevatar's character to pull off.

 

No, as far as possible GK founders go, what about Crysos Mortug, the Death Guard ex-Librarian who survived Isstavan III? So far he's only appeared in Forge World's fluff, but he does have the psychic talent AND the unbreakable loyalty to the Emperor the role (in my opinion) requires.

 

 

Yes a good one, but I believe he is being held for proto Death watch as his title was "Black Shield"

 

 

Probably his role as a leader of the destroyer cadre that specializes in terminating xenos species is a good indicator too as well as the fact that he was the de facto leader of a rag tag group composed of various legion elements and ordo reductor.

 

 

Thats what I'm betting at least

I think Mortug will be apart of the Grey Knights.  I think his survival and another on my list are tied together, Tarvitz.  I actually think all the named characters on the Loyalist side from that book made it.  So that means White Eyes, The World Eater also.  I don't think Mortug will be a Grandmaster however.  Talk about the Death Watch are WAY to premature.  It is my understanding that the Ordo Xenos and anything associated with them don't happen for many hundreds of years after the Horus Heresy.   At the start and for a long time afterward it was ONLY the Ordo Malleus.  The other major and minor orders happen a long time down the line.

 

One thing just occurred to me, but admittedly it is very long shot: Night Lords, the eight legion , circle of leaders - Kyroptera and Grey Knights, eight brotherhood, grand master - Khyrion. Maybe one of the Night Lords will become GK.

 

Any relationship to their parednt legions has to be whipped away.  Any simularities we might see have nothing to do with the origens of the Grey Knights.  It would be a weakness that could be exploited by the Archenemy.

[Kol Saresk]

Honestly, Khyron is too..... Indistinct to say it belongs to just one Legion. I mean, how many Greco-descendant names are there in 40K? Dozens. And they're not exactly bound by any one Legion. And when you look at a Legion like the Night Lords that recruited from at least two places on Terra(both of which encompass any number of subcultures and therefore any number of influences: ie Zso Sahaal doesn't exactly sound European but could still be from Albia), the entirety of Nostramo, possibly even the planets Nostramo associated with before the Imperium's arrival and whatever worlds sent them recruit tithes and the worlds they took recruit tithes from.

 

So, just going by a name, a little weak. The chain-glaive, possibly a bit more gumption in that direction since they aren't exactly the most common of items it seems. But on the flipside, it provides plenty of space for the various runes the Grey Knights would eventually incorporate into their weaponry. And also presents a unique possibility. Khiron could be a weaponmanster who saw the usefulness of a halberd and then sought to master it and teach it.

 

But honestly, I think the biggest clue for Khyron is in the name. We're believing Khyron is a perverted-descendant of Chiron. Chiron was a centaur of Greek mythology. Who was noted for being a trainer.

 

So honestly, I think we should be looking for someone who has a trainer-mentality and i skilled enough to learn how to master something like a chain-glaive. Granted, Sevatar has the weaponry down. But the patience to teach? He doesn't even have the patience to tolerate members of his own Legion. I doubt he's going to tolerate little boys.

[GhostMalone]

It could be that it's a emperors children loyalist, perfecting exotic weaponry and training to the highest possible standard, physically and pshyco logically or it could be a world eater that just wanted to reach his opponent quicker so tied a chainsword to a stick to beat the rest of the gang to the punch.

 

It's all working on an assumption, were given the bare bones to work with & until they give something more solid to work with Sevatar is MIA.

 

Now onto oandorax were given more to work with, for all we know it is zahriel or maybe it's nemiel?

[Lord Marshal Ragnrok]

i believe nemiel was killed (i think it was by the Lion too) around the time of the assault on Diamat. i would have to check that, as i have not read that in a while.  that would rule him out though.

[Perrin]

Honestly, Khyron is too..... Indistinct to say it belongs to just one Legion. I mean, how many Greco-descendant names are there in 40K? Dozens. And they're not exactly bound by any one Legion. And when you look at a Legion like the Night Lords that recruited from at least two places on Terra(both of which encompass any number of subcultures and therefore any number of influences: ie Zso Sahaal doesn't exactly sound European but could still be from Albia), the entirety of Nostramo, possibly even the planets Nostramo associated with before the Imperium's arrival and whatever worlds sent them recruit tithes and the worlds they took recruit tithes from.

 

So, just going by a name, a little weak. The chain-glaive, possibly a bit more gumption in that direction since they aren't exactly the most common of items it seems. But on the flipside, it provides plenty of space for the various runes the Grey Knights would eventually incorporate into their weaponry. And also presents a unique possibility. Khiron could be a weaponmanster who saw the usefulness of a halberd and then sought to master it and teach it.

 

But honestly, I think the biggest clue for Khyron is in the name. We're believing Khyron is a perverted-descendant of Chiron. Chiron was a centaur of Greek mythology. Who was noted for being a trainer.

 

So honestly, I think we should be looking for someone who has a trainer-mentality and i skilled enough to learn how to master something like a chain-glaive. Granted, Sevatar has the weaponry down. But the patience to teach? He doesn't even have the patience to tolerate members of his own Legion. I doubt he's going to tolerate little boys.

 

He was a renowned leader though, and the Atramentar were so loyal to him they disbanded when hearing of his death. Part of being a great leader would be moulding and training the men under his command. All we have seen of Sev so far is a little bit in TFH, a small part in the first short story of Lion v Curze and then Prince of Crows, we haven't seen him going about an ordinary day with his men. I've said enough about Sevatar in this thread anyway, I think people are getting tired of me mentioning him...

 

With regards to the spelling of Khyron, it makes me think it's a Night Lord, not Sevatar in particular. When someone becomes a Grey Knight they take a new name, it isn't mentioned who chooses the name but in this situation I assume it would be Malcador. The 3 names we have from the original 8 are all inspired by Greek/Roman myths, Janus, Khyron and Epithemius/Epimetheus. Khyron is based on Chiron, but the spelling of it is changed for no reason at all to match the spelling style of Nostramo, like they changed Chiroptera to Kyroptera.

 

Kyroptera - Chiroptera

Khyron     - Chiron

 

I admit it is grasping a bit, but it is the best I can do out of not a lot of info.

 

It could be that it's a emperors children loyalist, perfecting exotic weaponry and training to the highest possible standard, physically and pshyco logically or it could be a world eater that just wanted to reach his opponent quicker so tied a chainsword to a stick to beat the rest of the gang to the punch.

 

It's all working on an assumption, were given the bare bones to work with & until they give something more solid to work with Sevatar is MIA.

 

Now onto oandorax were given more to work with, for all we know it is zahriel or maybe it's nemiel?

 

I think Zahariel is a good bet, Nemiel got his head slapped off his shoulders for questioning the Lion's orders.

[Kol Saresk]

Actually, they said they followed him because "he told them the truth."

 

People consider Hitler a great leader. But he wasn't in control of the Hitler Youths. It was someone else's idea and baby. Hitler didn't teach the SS. Someone else did.

 

We see no evidence of Sevatar being a teacher. Leader, yes. But the two are not inclusive. Not necessarily exclusive, but not inclusive either.

 

As far as "changing the spelling", again its not exactly something specific to a single place or faction. Albion, Latin name for Great Britain. By 40K, its Albia. South America. Sud Merica. It can go on.

 

Personally, I think where the name came from, is more important than the spelling.

[GhostMalone]

Himmler was the daddy of the SS and their pure German idea. He's also the one that was trying to create an occult religion to replace Christianity

 

And I know nemiel is dead I'm just having a joke like how Sevatar is a GK founder

[Kol Saresk]

Himmler was the daddy of the SS and their pure German idea. He's also the one that was trying to create an occult religion to replace Christianity

 

Exactly. Hitler was the leader, but he was not the teacher.

[depthcharge12]

Himmler was the daddy of the SS and their pure German idea. He's also the one that was trying to create an occult religion to replace Christianity

/quote]

 

Exactly. Hitler was the leader, but he was not the teacher.

 

 

In the grim darkness of the far future, there is still a decieving liberal media

[Deathwatch/Grey knight]

Nemials not dead where did you read this?

[Bryan Blaire]

Nemiel is definitely dead, the Lion executed him with a single strike to the head. With his hand.

 

Happens in the DA short story in the Primarchs anthology.

[GhostMalone]

Yep he didn't mean to bitch slap him into oblivion but the lion temporarily lost control

[Scribe]

Or did he?!?

[Kol Saresk]

Hooray for short fuses! They lead to "explosive" outcomes. ;)

[GhostMalone]

We know he regretted his actions but he stood by his instincts.

 

Nemiel is dead end of story, let's not derail this to much :P

[depthcharge12]

I dont know. Everyones getting ressurected now a days. Im sure Nemiel stands a fair chance of coming back :P

[GhostMalone]

Yeah so does ferrus didn't you know he's now a megazord!

[Deathwatch/Grey knight]

Aww I was hoping nemiel and zahariel would have a one on one match

[Kol Saresk]

 

Yeah so does ferrus didn't you know he's now a megazord!

I knew it. B)