A Thousand Sons Warband - Questions

[Tenebris]

Greetings, I am a long time fan of Tzeentch, in fact the Thousand Sons are my first love when comes to astartes and since the great BL books on them I always felt the urge to make a warband of them. Now this is not to be a picture blog, another topic will be used for that but I have some questions to which the offical fluff seems lacking and while this is intentional to leave room for the fan to create his own warband I would love to use this topic to brainstorm a little on our favorite Sorcerers in 40k.

 

Questions:

 

- The Thousand Sons are a shattered legion after the fall of Prospero and the Rubic sealed the fate of the remaining legionnaires, my question is what happened next. Is the legion still functioning, are there efforts to rebuild the strength and boost the ranks of the Tzeentch faithful? 

 

- On the rebuilding, we know that astartes lacking in the psychic potential were turned into Rubicae but this still leaves a wealth of Sorcerers and geneseed stocks available to the XV legion. I presume that Tzeentch being the prime mutagen god of Chaos played with many astartes but wouldn't the success of the Rubic mainly comprise of a pure geneseed and a next generation of Thousand Sons freed from the curse of the Fleshchange?

 

- We know that most legions had Chaplains as an official part of the command echelon and while not as spiritual as their 40k incarnation they were the masters of lore, ritual and discipline in a legion. I also know that the Chaplains were tasked to maintain the edict of the Emperor post Nikea and now my question is, did the Thousand Sons legion had any Chaplains at all?

 

- Magnus teleported what remained of his homeworld and legion on the Planet of Sorcerers, so I presume Spire Guard, citizens and serfs were present on the Planet of Sorcerers. My question how much of the legion wargear would be teleported to the Planet of Sorcerers, how much legion hardware do the Thousand Sons possess after the fall of Prospero?

 

- We know that Magnus ordered a considerable number of his legion to flee Prospero and while some fates of this expedition are known (the Sorcerer searching among Prospero ruins), some speculated (Blood Ravens) what of the rest, are they Tzeentchian, did those feel the touch of the Rubic or not, was contact established with the survivors of the XV legion?

 

- We know form various books that Tzeentch has a powerful army, how do you think that the Tzeentchian warbands fight, what makes them unique, what are their strengths and their weaknesses?

 

- The Sorcerers are the Lords of the XV legion, the Rubicae the remains of the non psyker astartes, but what about the dreadnoughts, the titans, the knights and all the other branches of the army that followed every astartes legion in war. Do we have any knowledge of this forces?
 

- How big is the fleet of the Thousand Sons, do we have hits about their effective number post Prospero, post Rubic and potentially at the time of the 13th Crusade?

 

- What about the Thousand Sons Techmarines, Apothecaries, Chaplains, Pilots, Veterans... do we know anything of them?

 

 

Now this are just some questions that I would like to ask to the Chaos community, Thousand Sons fans in particular. I know that most answers will border on speculation since of all the legions the Thousand Sons are a big question, most authors either deliberately avoiding them or using the Thousand Sons as mere plot devices for the benefit of the other legions but I would really love some knowledge, some illumination about the XV legion and I would like you to brainstorm with me.

 

In the end we have no idea how the physical look of the individual astartes was, from which strains of humanity they recruited, which was their modus operandi, not only how they fought but why they fought, we have no idea when the Thousand Sons changed their colors and we neither have any idea on how individual companies, squads, formations worked... sadly we fans of the legion of scholars are the most ignorant in the lore and the background of our beloved legion... some light on those aspects would be most welcome indeed. 

 

And I refuse to think of the Thousand Sons as simply Sorcerers + Golems and feathered daemons. 

[Xenith]

Dreadnoughts - same as the rest of the legion. If they were psykers, they remained psykers, but may or may not be able to use their powers within their coffin. Non-psykers turned to dust and haunt the dread-shell.

 

The psyker-dreads were used to having their minds disembodied, so took to being dreadnoughts better than others, and go insane far less often.

[Lord General Bale Chambers]

My answers are below.

 

The Thousand Sons are a shattered legion after the fall of
Prospero and the Rubic sealed the fate of the remaining legionnaires, my
question is what happened next. Is the legion still functioning, are
there efforts to rebuild the strength and boost the ranks of the
Tzeentch faithful? 

 

The wiki / lexicanum has compiled what is known from BL sources and codex snippets.  The last action of the TS as a legion was the Battle of the Fang where Magnus fooled the majority of the Space Wolves into chasing where they thought he would attack next.  Instead, Magnus lead around 700 TS's with 2 million spireguard in an assault of the Space Wolf fortress monastery.  

 

The Wolves may claim it a victory in repelling the invaders, but Magnus and his legion were able to kill the SW apothacary whom nearly figured out a way to allow the SW geneseed to work on other homeworlds.  After the battle, the TS fragmented and never operated again as a legion.  It was also the last battle of the Prosperian Spireguard.  They were left behind when the TS's left.

 

Ahriman certainly has a sizable force, but they probably aren't strictly TS's.  I am sure there are other cabal's or covens of TSs with warbands around.

 

- On the rebuilding, we know that astartes lacking in the psychic
potential were turned into Rubicae but this still leaves a wealth of
Sorcerers and geneseed stocks available to the XV legion. I presume that
Tzeentch being the prime mutagen god of Chaos played with many astartes
but wouldn't the success of the Rubic mainly comprise of a pure
geneseed and a next generation of Thousand Sons freed from the curse of
the Fleshchange?

 

This is not touched upon as far as I know.  There are some questions left open, such as would new implants be bound by the rubicae or is the flesh change such a horror that considering new recruits with the TS geneseed is considered taboo?  Either way, it's a big galaxy, I am sure a sorceror has tried it.

 

 

- We know that most legions had Chaplains as an official part of
the command echelon and while not as spiritual as their 40k incarnation
they were the masters of lore, ritual and discipline in a legion. I also
know that the Chaplains were tasked to maintain the edict of the
Emperor post Nikea and now my question is, did the Thousand Sons legion
had any Chaplains at all?

The Horus Heresy book Thousand Sons may mention this at some point, but I don't recall any mention of Chaplains within their ranks. 

- Magnus teleported what remained of his homeworld and legion on
the Planet of Sorcerers, so I presume Spire Guard, citizens and serfs
were present on the Planet of Sorcerers. My question how much of the
legion wargear would be teleported to the Planet of Sorcerers, how much
legion hardware do the Thousand Sons possess after the fall of Prospero?

 

The answer is probably yes since the Spireguard fought at the Battle of the Fang.  Regarding hardware, I do not know how much they have, it is not stated anywhere I know.

- We know that Magnus ordered a considerable number of his legion
to flee Prospero and while some fates of this expedition are known (the
Sorcerer searching among Prospero ruins), some speculated (Blood
Ravens) what of the rest, are they Tzeentchian, did those feel the touch
of the Rubic or not, was contact established with the survivors of the
XV legion?

 

You know as much as I do.

 

- We know form various books that Tzeentch has a powerful army,
how do you think that the Tzeentchian warbands fight, what makes them
unique, what are their strengths and their weaknesses?

 

Any force that can divine the future with some degree of accuracy is going to have a huge advantage.  I see most Tzeentchian warbands being smaller in number, but attacking with clear objectives and having extremely good intel on their opposition (through arcane and other methods).  Deception and good planning would be their hallmarks.

 

- The Sorcerers are the Lords of the XV legion, the Rubicae the
remains of the non psyker astartes, but what about the dreadnoughts, the
titans, the knights and all the other branches of the army that
followed every astartes legion in war. Do we have any knowledge of this
forces?

I would bet there are rubicae dreadnoughts. 

 

- How big is the fleet of the Thousand Sons, do we have hits
about their effective number post Prospero, post Rubic and potentially
at the time of the 13th Crusade?

Unkown.

- What about the Thousand Sons Techmarines, Apothecaries, Chaplains, Pilots, Veterans... do we know anything of them?

 

Unknown

[Excessus]

Hiya Tenebris! :) I'll try to answer as lengthy as I have time for.

 

- The Thousand Sons are a shattered legion after the fall of
Prospero and the Rubic sealed the fate of the remaining legionnaires, my
question is what happened next. Is the legion still functioning, are
there efforts to rebuild the strength and boost the ranks of the
Tzeentch faithful? 

After the fall of Prospero, the legion was still partaking in the heresy. We haven't seen them in action from either BL or FW yet, Magnus has yet to make a final desicion (though I think it's close). We know they are at Terra for the final siege, assaulting the Eternety Gate, summoning daemons and providing support all over the place since they were few left. The three defending legions had to muster their combined librarius to battle them at the Eternity Gate, I am expecting a seriously epic battle there whenever BL gets that far!!! So they still have a few years to rebuild and regrow their legion. It's not until after the retreat from Terra that the mutations really start to get hold of them and the Rubric happens.

 

After the Rubric, Ahriman's cabal was exiled...that means all the senior sorcerers, Hathor Maat, Amon...and so on. They grabbed quite a few rubrics with them from what we can see in Ahriman: Exile every sorcerer seems to have a few. Now, chaos warbands work a bit differently than loyalist chapters, they aren't all from the same geneseed in any Legion warband, but "recruited" or made using stolen geneseed mostly. "Modern" Thousand Sons warbands would be a mishmash of rubrics, renegades, cultists, daemons, dark mechanicus and various sorcerers...all painted in the wondrous blue and gold of the Thousand Sons to show their allegiance.

- On the rebuilding, we know that astartes lacking in the psychic
potential were turned into Rubicae but this still leaves a wealth of
Sorcerers and geneseed stocks available to the XV legion. I presume that
Tzeentch being the prime mutagen god of Chaos played with many astartes
but wouldn't the success of the Rubic mainly comprise of a pure
geneseed and a next generation of Thousand Sons freed from the curse of
the Fleshchange?

The Rubric freed the geneseed of the catastrofically mutating factor of the pre heresy/heresy era, but they are still not immune to the "general" mutating powers of chaos, wheather they are in the eye or not, chaos mutates and warps stuff. What we do know is that the Pavoni are experts of biomancy, and are apothecaries as well. We also know that their master, Hathor Maat is still out there. If someone would be able to stabilise the geneseed it would be Hathor Maat if given 10k years, the Pavoni are crazy-skilled in biomancy after all, heck even Atharva from The Outcast Dead was able to snap his own genetic code making himself into a non-psyker in battle!

- We know that most legions had Chaplains as an official part of
the command echelon and while not as spiritual as their 40k incarnation
they were the masters of lore, ritual and discipline in a legion. I also
know that the Chaplains were tasked to maintain the edict of the
Emperor post Nikea and now my question is, did the Thousand Sons legion
had any Chaplains at all?

Thousand Sons had masters of lore all over the place, I doubt they had need for Chaplains in that regard. After Nikea the legion consolidated back to Prospero and ended their combat operations, they weren't needed to keep track of anymore with Chaplains either.

- Magnus teleported what remained of his homeworld and legion on
the Planet of Sorcerers, so I presume Spire Guard, citizens and serfs
were present on the Planet of Sorcerers. My question how much of the
legion wargear would be teleported to the Planet of Sorcerers, how much
legion hardware do the Thousand Sons possess after the fall of Prospero?

As far as I can remember, Magnus used a crystal put into the very armours of the astartes to teleport them to the Planet of Sorcerers, so I would assume that any equipment they were using at the time would have gone with them, though there weren't much of that left. They had retreated back to the last pyramid of Tiszca at that point so there weren't much of anything left...on Prospero... After Magnus has decised on a path, I would assume he would call for his fleet that was spread out before Prospero's fall. They would have all the equipment a legion carried with them into war, I assume not much equipment was down on the ground on Prospero anyway, a peacefull world with most likely some training regiments and such...

 

- We know that Magnus ordered a considerable number of his legion
to flee Prospero and while some fates of this expedition are known (the
Sorcerer searching among Prospero ruins), some speculated (Blood
Ravens) what of the rest, are they Tzeentchian, did those feel the touch
of the Rubic or not, was contact established with the survivors of the
XV legion?

We don't know, but I assume that when Maguns made a decision to join Horus he'd contact them and gather them up again for the assault on Terra. The Rubric is much later.

- We know form various books that Tzeentch has a powerful army,
how do you think that the Tzeentchian warbands fight, what makes them
unique, what are their strengths and their weaknesses?

They fight as varied as any other warbands, though with sorcerous support and sneaky schemes. Tzeentch favours the cunning, and is the architect of change. Any change is good...so revolutions, backstabbings, betrayals...all good! Thousand Sons prefer ranged, always has, but their recent allies and recruits might not...it all depends on the warband.

 

- The Sorcerers are the Lords of the XV legion, the Rubicae the
remains of the non psyker astartes, but what about the dreadnoughts, the
titans, the knights and all the other branches of the army that
followed every astartes legion in war. Do we have any knowledge of this
forces?

Knights, titans and mortals weren't astartes and as such weren't afflicted by the Rubric. Tank crew and dreadnought pilots were astartes though, so they all were affected, one way or the other.

 

- How big is the fleet of the Thousand Sons, do we have hits
about their effective number post Prospero, post Rubic and potentially
at the time of the 13th Crusade?

They are spread out into small warbands all over the place currently. Post Prospero we don't know yet as they haven't been written about since forever unfortunately, but as soon as Magnus makes his decision, we'll probably know...or when the HH book for prospero is released!

- What about the Thousand Sons Techmarines, Apothecaries, Chaplains, Pilots, Veterans... do we know anything of them?

Were they psykers, then they still are. Were they not, then they are rubrics. Newly recruited specialists are still normal though...

 

 

In the end we have no idea how the physical look of the individual
astartes was, from which strains of humanity they recruited, which was
their modus operandi, not only how they fought but why they fought, we
have no idea when the Thousand Sons changed their colors and we neither
have any idea on how individual companies, squads, formations worked...
sadly we fans of the legion of scholars are the most ignorant in the
lore and the background of our beloved legion... some light on those
aspects would be most welcome indeed. 

 

They were mainly recruited from the arabic/persian areas of Terra.

And I refuse to think of the Thousand Sons as simply Sorcerers + Golems and feathered daemons.

 

You would be correct in that thinking, they are not! :)

[Ethrion]

As an aside I cannot wait until the HH Thousand Sons book comes out (whenever that might be exactly), it's going to clear up and sort out a lot of unanswered questions - including most if not all of the above. 

[Excessus]

Oh, I forgot to write, we know when they changed their colours from red to blue. It was several thousand years after the heresy.