[HH1.0] 30k Alpha Legion Tactics

[hivey]

a thread for using the alpha legion rules from the horus heresy, but playing against 40k and 30k.

 

i'll kick it off with what i believe was my post in the other thread:

 

keep in mind, im thinking for playing against all armies, not just HH legions.

 

for units to steal with the AL rite, i like the idea of  using iron havocs. give them autocannon, and  2 or 3 missile launchers, and they can do a good bit damage to nearly any type of unit. the only thing theyd really struggle to hurt is AV14, because of the missiles still needing 6s just to glance.

 

one strategy im looking to try is having a full 20-man tactical squad with extra CCW. put a vigilator and master of signal in the squad. take the infiltrate special rule for the whole army. infiltrate the squad as close to its target as possible (probably only 18 inches), then use the scout move from the vigilator to move closer still. first turn, fury of the legion. second turn, you can probably get a charge off at something if theyre still on the table. putting alpharius in this unit will just make it hurt that much more when they hit home.

Edited May 30, 2014 by hivey

[Hyaenidae]

Moved to Tactica.

 

=][=

[AlanofAngels]

Unfortunately, a lot of the current GW/FW rules don't reflect Alpha Legion tactics, because they are such an antithesis to normal marine function. FW will be making some rules soon enough (which I'm really looking forward to). Seemingly they would run infantry-heavy lists, as stealth is top priority (and tanks aren't too stealthy ). That said, I don't see a problem using tanks in an Alpha Legion army (when I get back to my pre-heresy legion, I plan on mechanizing the hell out of it!). The beauty of the Alpha Legion is that they are so secretive that we really don't know what their tactics consist of. I think you're right in pursuing a fairly tactically flexible list, as the Alpha Legion seems to stress preparedness/tactical flexibility. I'm personally really excited to see what FW gives us for em'!  

[hivey]

I probably should have specified that the tactics are for FW Horus Heresy Alpha Legion. they do have their rules now, and this was originally posted in the horus heresy subforum.

[Hyaenidae]

Indeed they do, yet irrelevant. The Tactica subforum exists for tactics discussions, no matter their era.

[hivey]

wasnt meant to state it shouldnt be moved, just that i was talking about 30k army, but to be used against both 30k and 40k.

 

i do like what you said, alan. that is how i plan to make my list, being fairly flexible. the pride of the legion rite list will be a tad more flexible, as i'll have veterans instead of tacticals (still gonna have the big block), and they will be kitted with plasma guns and missile launchers.

[Grizwald23]

I think their should be a different forum for 30k and 40k tactics because it is going to be impossible to find things that are era specific

[Iron Father Ferrum]

Not an issue.  Tactics belong in TACTICA, period.  Just make sure the OP specifies the era.

[ImpiousSmart]

I'm trying to figure some sample lists out.  Some discussion points.....

 

1. Lernaen Terminators

I love the dreadclaw model, and would love to give them one as a transport, but with no other drop pods would they just get slaughtered round one?  With infiltrating tactics maybe they could have a little more support?  

 

If not dreadclaw, maybe a Land Raider Proteus with Augury Web?  Seems inkeeping with the legion, and relatively cheap.

 

Somebody mentioned them as backfield objective holders, if given a Conversion Beamer.  Interesting idea, but almost seems a waste of power axe armed terminators.  The aren't anything special though compared to other legions terminators, so interesting idea.  If so, would you max out with 10 and 2 conversion beamers? That's a lot of points to be sat around...

 

Finally taking Dynat might be the cheapest and safest way to insert them?

 

 

2. Exodus

I love this guy, super fitting character.  His Assassins shot rule combined with the Execution Shot's AP is good, but given the prevalence of Artificer armour on important models, I don't think this is that great?  

 

 

3. Veterans

I think quite a few of us have been looking at the Pride of the Legion RoW instead of the XX specific one.  But I'm struggling to make Vets seem worth it.  I feel they need to be equipped for one job - ie banestrike snipers, or tank hunting meltagun / meltabomb squad.  Any thoughts on making them effective?

[TemujinZero]

Mass infiltration saves so many points on transportation, and this is doubly true for terminators. You don't need any character - just use the legion trait. That way you can give them all the support you want.

 

I like to keep my XX vets cheap - fearless banestrike vets or sniper vets. I give them bulk discount melta bombs and nothing else. Other squads are better at specialist roles.

[hivey]

i have two army lists made. theyre made to being sorta flexible, and for playing against 40k armies as well as legions.

 

List 1:
 

Alpha Legion

Rite of War: Pride of the Legion

 

Lord of War:

415- Alpharius

 

HQ:

95- Centurion, Vigilator

 

85- Centurion, Master of Signal

 

115- Exodus

 

 

Elites:

165- 3x Apothecary, Artificer Armor

 

55- Rapier, Laser Destroyer

 

55- Rapier, Laser Destroyer

 

 

Troops:

295- 19 Tacticals, 1 Sergeant, Power Dagger, 20 Extra CCW

 

265- 9 Veteren Tacticals, Plasma Gun, Missile Launcher with Suspensor Web, 1 Sergeant, Power Dagger, Banestrike Ammo

 

265- 9 Veteren Tacticals, Plasma Gun, Missile Launcher with Suspensor Web, 1 Sergeant, Power Dagger, Banestrike Ammo

 

 

Fast Attack:

190- 4 Headhunters, Heavy Bolter with Suspensor Web and Banestrike Ammo, 1 Sergeant, Melta Bombs

 

Total: 2000

 

 

List 2:

Alpha Legion

Rite of War: Coils of the Hydra

 

Lord of War:

415- Alpharius

 

HQ:

85- Centurion, Master of Signal

 

95- Centurion, Vigilator

 

115- Exodus

 

 

Elites:

165- 3x Apothecary, Artificer Armor

 

55- Rapier, Laser Destroyer

 

295- 8 Iron Havocs, 1 Sergeant, 7 Autocannons, 2 Missile Launchers

 

 

Troops:

290- 19 Tacticals, 1 Sergeant, 20 Extra CCW

 

150- 9 Tacticals, 1 Sergeant

 

150- 9 Tacticals, 1 Sergeant

 

 

Fast Attack:

185- 4 Headhunters, Heavy Bolter with Suspensor Web and Banestrike Ammo, 1 Sergeant

 

 

Total: 2000

 

 

 

basic idea for both is to use the infiltrate rule. the big block of tacticals will be used as i described in the OP.

 

not really sure if the headhunter squad should be kept, or swapped out for something else.

[Hyaenidae]

So, just for the heck of it, I played a kill team against my son's 40k Black Templars against a counts-as Headhunter squad.

 

Crazy cool, man. Even being outnumbered two to one, I still made one heck of dent in his black-clad madmen. Banestrike ammo, BS 5, mixed with the preferred enemy (infantry) rule, made for many dead powered armoured foes.

 

I'll be making a real Headhunter squad for kill-teams now. Awesome squad.

[Transgressor O'Malley]

Remember that the Alpha Legion's thing is not necessarily stealth, it's deception, information control, and elaborate tactics and strategies just for the sake of being elaborate. If they can win by fooling the enemy into thinking they'll attack from the west and then overwhelming the east flank with Spartans full of terminators, they'll do it, as long as that wouldn't be too easy.

[Galron]

So what else have we come up with? I was thinking a general list without an RoW. I already have a NL drop pod with flyers list and was thinking of making an AL force using vehicles and ground pounders.

 

Was thinking for our normal 2500k games: Armywide infiltration for two 20 man Tacs, a headhunter and seeker squad, a recon squad, Alpharius and Exodus, a termy or Lermian squad in a Spartan, Sicaran and mortis contemptor, and maybe a heavy weapons squad in the background or tac support squads infiltrating in the front.

 

I guess I would toss Alpharius in one of the Tac squads, maybe a set of Apothecaries if I have the points.

[LostAlone]

I think Coils of the Hydra is pretty much the best you can hope for when it comes to RoW. On top of our legiones astartes rules that ensure it's easy to switch up your lists style between games, we also get the chance to bring in any other interesting unit that fits our chosen tactic for a specific game. That's pretty cool, and the flexibility to change your list between games matters more than you might think, even though most people don't really consider it to be an advantage on the tablet top (because no-one would ever cheese against the list you normally play would they?). 

 

However - I did want to ask if anyone knows what counts as a 'legion specific' and what counts as 'unique' when it comes to The Rewards of Treason? Specifically I'm thinking of taking Deathshrowd or Butchers as my RoT unit, but I'm not sure if either of them count as unique units or just legion specific. The rules in book 3 say you can't take uniques, but can take legion specific units. So that's kinda weird. 

[Slips]

Uniques means characters in this regard. So, for example, no AL list with Sigismund.

 

You can, however, have an AL list with Templar since they are Legion Specific unit.

[Krargan]

So two questions:

 

Regarding the RoW, the restriction mentioning troops having to have a dedicated transport or infiltrate, can someone explain that bit to me? I imagine the legion tactics infiltrate could count? But if not then you have to have transports? If you don't have transports can you not use any of the other legion tactics except for the infiltrate? Or am I just crazy and reading things wrong?

 

Second subject was in regards to headhunter kill teams. Is there no benefit to giving them combo bolters really? I want to (and probably will for rule of cool) give mine combo bolters, but they already hit on 2's with preferred enemy infantry. Realistically it seems like a waste of points.

[Slips]

For the RoW, the way I understand it is : if you want to use other tactics than infiltrate, take a transport. If not you're stuck using it.

 

For headhunters I would give them a combi-weapon (probably plasma) if you can since, yeha at BS5 + PE(inf) you probably wont be missing all that much. And if you do, its because you need heavier firepower.

[Krargan]

Yeah, they don't have combi weapon options, just the combi bolters, and a heavy bolter or two. I will still rule of cool it though. Idk why but I love regular power armour marines with combi bolters.

[PastelAvenger]

When using Alphas RoW how are people looking at filling the compulsory 3 troops tax, I don't want to go with the usual 20 man tact team as that's a lot of points. I was thinking of having 3 units of 10 tacos maybe with extra CCW keeps the cost down and is still pretty scary when popping up 18inches away from a unit. What are your thoughts though?

[Sanct]

Why not take pride of the legion and veterans. Infiltrate them up close in rhinos.  Move up, bail out and dakka them with double tap and a trio of sniper blasts/heavy flamers.

Or take vets and run them around in rhinos firing 2 tankhunting suspensored missiles from the top hatch.

Or even take combi-weapon terminators and infiltrate them real close for a first turn alpha before diving in for the punch.

 

What about a close combat unit in spartan/phobos infiltrating up for a turn 2 charge?

 

What about a tactical support with flamers jumping out their transports who tank shock a unit into a huddle so you get them completely covered by templates?

 

 

There really is a ton of fun to be had with AL. Join the Madness and get your free mindwipe! 

[PastelAvenger]

Because then I can't use other Legions unique units ;-) Edited November 28, 2014 by PastelAvenger

[hivey]

ive only used it in lower points games, 1500-2000. went with just 3 10-man tac squads, and took a 10-man iron havoc squad (6 autocannons, 4 missile launchers). did fairly well, but using pride of the legion, or no rite, seems to do better.

[PastelAvenger]

I dont see how PotL would help Alpha Legion, Headhunters look so much better at removing troubling inifintary than Vet Tac Squads and Im personally unsure about how a terminator squad would fit in.

[Kossaka]

Veteran Tactical Squads and Terminator Squads can take banestrike bolter rounds. For VetTac it also applies to the heavy bolters that they carry (I think).  it gives Veterans an edge on normal marines and on Terminators its vicious.