++ Gods of the Arena - A World Eaters Community ++

[Commissar K.]

Fantastic work OPTIM and Juggernaut! Tons of inspiration!

Also got the Codex early yesterday. Can confirm its a supplement to the Index.

Nowhere is the World Eater army bonus mentioned in the book but the back of the book still states you need the other 40k rules aswell.

As mentioned by GW, the Indexes arnt completely rendered irrelevant. How I see it is that all units who underwent a basic datasheet change where included. Due to gear options or otherwise base cost.

If people want pics, feel free to ask. 

Cheers

Edited August 11, 2017 by Commissar K.

[Commissar K.]

I'd be pretty shocked if Berzerkers were no longer troop choices in the new codex...has this been actually confirmed, or is it just speculation based on what's been leaked?

Confirmed, thing is, its a supplement to the index. Greater Daemons and the Daemon Daemon Prince arnt in it because they didnt change. What is in it is what changed.

 

No worries though, the Codex doesnt make the Index irrelevant or covers all there is in it. To me the Codex is an update for some lore, some units and the whole Artefact, Legion Tactics, Warlord Upgrades etc.

Edited August 11, 2017 by Commissar K.

[Sagentus]

I agree with Commissar K - OPTIM and Juggernaut that is some very inspiring stuff!! 

 

Currently getting my termi squad up to 5 (from 3) after the min squad number chaged lol 

[OPTIMVSCHRISTVS]

Thanks guys!

[OPTIMVSCHRISTVS]

Just picked up my codex- some pretty cool fluff about us in there. Especially liked a bit it had about a Wych Cult invading a Khornate daemon world's fighting pits, and Khorne being so pleased with the whole thing he brought everyone back to life after so they could go kill more stuff.

 

Was very pleased to see the Dominion of Fire was mentioned, had been planning on incorporating that into my warband's fluff.

[Cheex]

It's a shame that the Talisman wasn't an aura bonus; I was really expecting it to be one since it used to affect a whole unit before. Now it seems like it's made to go on a Daemon Prince - and to be fair, it actually makes the DP a very tempting choice for me. Throw in Unholy Fortitude so he can take a bit more punishment and use him as a harassment force, maybe even partnered with a Heldrake (put the 'drake in front so the DP can't be targeted).

 

Worth thinking about, at least.

 

I'll definitely be splashing in an Exalted Champion with Khârn and Friends, though. Maybe give him the Brass Collar, make him a dedicated support character.

Edited August 11, 2017 by Cheex

[BrassClaw]

When you find out that you have to wait until tuesday until your codex arrives

art by Elizaveta Bikuin

[Commissar K.]

Feel free to ask anything mate ;)

[Berzerker88]

G-Guys...

 

http://i.4cdn.org/tg/1502562702701.png

[Commissar K.]

G-Guys...

 

http://i.4cdn.org/tg/1502562702701.png

Warhammer 40.000 Facebook page is still not an official ruling for Errata.

 

What I see happening there a lot is that the right question isnt asked.

 

Yes you can go full elite with them.

The real question is if the World Eater army rules in the Index can still be used. The Codex doesnt say you cant.

[Berzerker88]

Are you saying an official statement from GW doesn't count because you don't like it?

[1000 Sons]

The thing about the elite detachment is you only get 1 command point, and with all the new stratagem you really want to get the maximum. On the positive side cultists have the legion trait so they get 3 attacks each on the charge. 3 minimum cultists units to be able to get the 3 command points out of the brigade detachment isn't too bad, might be able to add on the elite detachment for an extra cp with the berserkers there.

[1000 Sons]

Are you saying an official statement from GW doesn't count because you don't like it?

Traditionally, rules changes require faq or errata. Telling some one 'trust me, it was on facebook' is not the reason some one wants to hear when you say the codex rule doesn't count.

[Berzerker88]

 

Are you saying an official statement from GW doesn't count because you don't like it?

Traditionally, rules changes require faq or errata. Telling some one 'trust me, it was on facebook' is not the reason some one wants to hear when you say the codex rule doesn't count.

But don't Codex datasheets override the Index ones for the same unit?

[Commissar K.]

Are you saying an official statement from GW doesn't count because you don't like it?

I am saying that those who do the social media arnt the design team.

[Berzerker88]

 

Are you saying an official statement from GW doesn't count because you don't like it?

I am saying that those who do the social media arnt the design team.

No, they are it's voice.

[1000 Sons]

 

 

Are you saying an official statement from GW doesn't count because you don't like it?

Traditionally, rules changes require faq or errata. Telling some one 'trust me, it was on facebook' is not the reason some one wants to hear when you say the codex rule doesn't count.

But don't Codex datasheets override the Index ones for the same unit?

I believe it is supposed to, but they also mentioned that if things aren't in the codex, you use the index which will have people saying the legion rules are still good. Hopefully we'll have a fast errata like our thin blooded cousins codex and this will be cleared up but next weekend.

[Berzerker88]

 

 

 

Are you saying an official statement from GW doesn't count because you don't like it?

Traditionally, rules changes require faq or errata. Telling some one 'trust me, it was on facebook' is not the reason some one wants to hear when you say the codex rule doesn't count.

But don't Codex datasheets override the Index ones for the same unit?

I believe it is supposed to, but they also mentioned that if things aren't in the codex, you use the index which will have people saying the legion rules are still good. Hopefully we'll have a fast errata like our thin blooded cousins codex and this will be cleared up but next weekend.

They said if a UNIT is not in the Codex, the index entry is still valid. Khorne Berzerkers are in the Codex, not as troops, but it's the same unit.

[Bloody Legionnaire]

 

 

 

 

Are you saying an official statement from GW doesn't count because you don't like it?

Traditionally, rules changes require faq or errata. Telling some one 'trust me, it was on facebook' is not the reason some one wants to hear when you say the codex rule doesn't count.

But don't Codex datasheets override the Index ones for the same unit?

I believe it is supposed to, but they also mentioned that if things aren't in the codex, you use the index which will have people saying the legion rules are still good. Hopefully we'll have a fast errata like our thin blooded cousins codex and this will be cleared up but next weekend.

They said if a UNIT is not in the Codex, the index entry is still valid. Khorne Berzerkers are in the Codex, not as troops, but it's the same unit.

 

I'm sure if you read a few pages back you'd see that the "World Eater Army Rules" are located on page 45 of the Index. Page 45 of the index also has the language stating Berzerkers battlefield role changes to troops for a World Eaters Army. What everyone is getting at is since there is no rule in the codex explicitly over-riding legion "Army rules" such as "World Eaters Army Rules" then the Index does indeed have additional rules not covered in the Codex. So, while there are new dataslates in the Codex it doesn't matter because the "Army Rules" are not. 

 

If you're trying to operate under the logic that the Codex contains all the new dataslates and the Index is only for models that don't have a dataslate in the Codex then what do we say about Death Guard and Thousand Sons players? They would be in the same boat as WEs and EC and would not be able to take troops for their respected Armies if it were not for the Index. Obviously we know DG and TS are getting their own codex and their cult units will likely be troops for them in their respective book.... 

[Commissar K.]

 

I'm sure if you read a few pages back you'd see that the "World Eater Army Rules" are located on page 45 of the Index. Page 45 of the index also has the language stating Berzerkers battlefield role changes to troops for a World Eaters Army. What everyone is getting at is since there is no rule in the codex explicitly over-riding legion "Army rules" such as "World Eaters Army Rules" then the Index does indeed have additional rules not covered in the Codex. So, while there are new dataslates in the Codex it doesn't matter because the "Army Rules" are not. 

 

If you're trying to operate under the logic that the Codex contains all the new dataslates and the Index is only for models that don't have a dataslate in the Codex then what do we say about Death Guard and Thousand Sons players? They would be in the same boat as WEs and EC and would not be able to take troops for their respected Armies if it were not for the Index. Obviously we know DG and TS are getting their own codex and their cult units will likely be troops for them in their respective book.... 

 

 

This is exactly my thake on it aswell. As there are no new World Eater Army Rules in the Codex the question is left how much more the Codex replaces as Datasheets. Going with what has been written on the Warhammer Community website in regards to the Codex the awnser seems to be that Codex only add and as a overall rule the latest datasheets and wargear costs have to be used. Link: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/05/codexes-your-questions-answered-july-5gw-homepage-post-2/

 

So to me the rules found on page 44 in the Index have not been invalidated, likewise the army rules for Death Guard, Thousand Sons, EC, Daemons of Khorne, Tzeentch, Nurgle, Slaanesh, Chaos, Questor Traitoris and Chaos Bastions still are uncovered by the Codex aswell, meaning that the rules provided in the Index still can apply for so far they have not been covered in the Codex.

 

Offcourse GW could have had another intend, the Codex in itself has updated rules for Heretic Astartes but doesn't offer the same specrtum as the Index does either. Army rules found in the Index of Space Marines have not been invalidated since the Codex Space Marines. In other words, Blood Angel etc Army Rules can still be used despite them not being in their latest Codex. So feel free to explain why that would work differently for us Berzerker88.

Edited August 13, 2017 by Commissar K.

[Berzerker88]

 

 

 

I'm sure if you read a few pages back you'd see that the "World Eater Army Rules" are located on page 45 of the Index. Page 45 of the index also has the language stating Berzerkers battlefield role changes to troops for a World Eaters Army. What everyone is getting at is since there is no rule in the codex explicitly over-riding legion "Army rules" such as "World Eaters Army Rules" then the Index does indeed have additional rules not covered in the Codex. So, while there are new dataslates in the Codex it doesn't matter because the "Army Rules" are not.

 

If you're trying to operate under the logic that the Codex contains all the new dataslates and the Index is only for models that don't have a dataslate in the Codex then what do we say about Death Guard and Thousand Sons players? They would be in the same boat as WEs and EC and would not be able to take troops for their respected Armies if it were not for the Index. Obviously we know DG and TS are getting their own codex and their cult units will likely be troops for them in their respective book....

 

 

 

This is exactly my thake on it aswell. As there are no new World Eater Army Rules in the Codex the question is left how much more the Codex replaces as Datasheets. Going with what has been written on the Warhammer Community website in regards to the Codex the awnser seems to be that Codex only add and as a overall rule the latest datasheets and wargear costs have to be used. Link: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/05/codexes-your-questions-answered-july-5gw-homepage-post-2/

 

So to me the rules found on page 44 in the Index have not been invalidated, likewise the army rules for Death Guard, Thousand Sons, EC, Daemons of Khorne, Tzeentch, Nurgle, Slaanesh, Chaos, Questor Traitoris and Chaos Bastions still are uncovered by the Codex aswell, meaning that the rules provided in the Index still can apply for so far they have not been covered in the Codex.

 

Offcourse GW could have had another intend, the Codex in itself has updated rules for Heretic Astartes but doesn't offer the same specrtum as the Index does either. Army rules found in the Index of Space Marines have not been invalidated since the Codex Space Marines. In other words, Blood Angel etc Army Rules can still be used despite them not being in their latest Codex. So feel free to explain why that would work differently for us Berzerker88.

Well it's true that 'Army rules' are not mentioned anywhere in the Codex. But the problem is that GW's article doesn't say what you should do with 'Army rules'. So we will definetly need to take this, or wait for a potentially inconclusive FAQ.

 

Still, GW's FB reply should give us an idea of what their thoughts are on the matter. I expect them, but not hope for them, to double down.

[Bloody Legionnaire]

From the Codex release thread:

 

 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/05/codexes-your-questions-answered-july-5gw-homepage-post-2/

 

 

There are a few options that are missing in the codex that appear in the index: why is that? Does that mean I can’t use these models in my army anymore?

While the indexes are designed to cover a long history of miniatures, the codexes are designed to give you rules for the current Warhammer 40,000 range. There are a few options in the indexes for some Characters and vehicles that are no longer represented in the Citadel range – certain Dreadnought weapons that don’t come in the box, or some characters on bikes, for example.

 

Don’t worry though, you can still use all of these in your games if you have these older models. In these instances, use the datasheet from the index, and the most recent points published for that model and its weapons (currently, also in the index).

 

They still gain all the army wide-bonuses for things like Chapter Tactics and can use Space Marines Stratagems and the like, so such venerable heroes still fit right in with the rest of your army.

 

 

 

Until we receive an FAQ GW has told us everything we need to know as far as how Indexes work after a Codex "updates." 

Edited August 13, 2017 by Bloody Legionnaire

[Commissar K.]

 

Well it's true that 'Army rules' are not mentioned anywhere in the Codex. But the problem is that GW's article doesn't say what you should do with 'Army rules'. So we will definetly need to take this, or wait for a potentially inconclusive FAQ.

 

Still, GW's FB reply should give us an idea of what their thoughts are on the matter. I expect them, but not hope for them, to double down.

 

Not only is that true, the link (https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/05/codexes-your-questions-answered-july-5gw-homepage-post-2/) on the article specifically states this aswell:

 

 

 

 

I just bought Index: Imperium 1 – what should I do with it?

You’ll want to keep hold of your index. Codex: Space Marines doesn’t include rules for playing with Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Space Wolves, Deathwatch or Grey Knights armies, so you’ll still need Index: Imperium 1 to play with those

So if we translate that to Index Chaos, why wouldn't the Index Army Rules for playing with World Eaters, Death Guard, Thousand Sons and Emperors Children be available? As for the Imperium Codexi it is clear that you can still use the Index Army Rules.

 

Likewise we have this aswell:

 

 

 

If I have a Blood Angels, Dark Angels or Space Wolves army, will I need to buy Codex: Space Marines to use my army?

You don’t have to. Other Space Marines factions not covered in the new codex will continue to use all the datasheets, rules and points values in the index until their own codex is released

So how does this not translate to: If I have a World Eater army, will I need to buy Codex: Chaos Space Marines to use my army?

- You don't have to. Other CSM factions not covered in the new codex will continue to use all rules etc.

 

So far the World Eater Army Rules are what I call rules. In addition to that, the Facebook page for Warhammer 40.000 is not an official awnser from Games Workshops design teams and they have stated so in their previous replies many times. Whoever does the social media is not the same as doing the design nor do they have the final option to change designs through means of errata for example.

 

Whatever statement you choose, the Facebook statement directly contradicts the Warhammer Community article. 

Edited August 13, 2017 by Commissar K.

[Cheex]

While I agree that berzerkers remain Troops by RAW, I fully expect that the FAQ will invalidate the "World Eaters Army" page. I suggest we all come to terms with the possibility that this might happen, even as we hope that they rule that berzerkers do stay as Troops.

[Commissar K.]

While I agree that berzerkers remain Troops by RAW, I fully expect that the FAQ will invalidate the "World Eaters Army" page. I suggest we all come to terms with the possibility that this might happen, even as we hope that they rule that berzerkers do stay as Troops.

It certainly can happen, though it would make the article from just a month ago full of lies. Not really a cool thing to do

 

I just hope they'll make an official statement regard it soon. Though GW also cares very little about 40K Chaos so they might not come back on it at all.

Edited August 13, 2017 by Commissar K.