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Lord Asvaldir Veteran

Lord Asvaldir

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@chaosreigns: good to hear you got in a victory for Logar! Your observations on our trait/warlord trait are generally what I expected. Not flashy and amazing like say the AL trait but overall both abilities that will come in handy in pretty much every game at least. I am also quite pleased the cursed crozius did so well, already converted up a chaos lord in terminator armor armed with one so he can bash some heads in with it. Honestly think it's one of the best weapon artifacts in the book with solid strength, ap and damage. 

 

@Bloody Legionnaire: Welcome to the seventeenth legion! I think doing a fluffy build for Word Bearers is actually far easier this edition than in the previous one. Possessed are finally worth taking so you don't have to feel like they are a wasted choice anymore, and cultists as always have remained useful. If you want to use summoning as well that's always an option but the good thing is unlike 7th I don't feel forced to use summoning anymore, since if you don't use our legion specific stratagem there's always lots of other good ones to use. That being said with the pts cost to summoning daemons I'll probably leave 200-300pts aside for summoning a bunch of blobs of 20 lesser daemons. WIth our stratagem might even be possible to reach a twelve more easily on 3d6 and summon a unit of 30. 

 

If you summon a herald of tzeentch, or any model that uses psychic powers I'd say you generate them when you summon the unit. 

 

I do love the leviathan but I save my FW purchases for my 30k army so unfortunately won't be running one in 40k. 

Cryptix Veteran

Cryptix

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Jesus christ that Cursed Crozius is near broken. If you take a Chaos Lord in terminator armor, give him the cursed crozius and exalted champion for the warlord trait, hit him with diabolic strength, and then give him the fury of khorne stratagem and veterans of the long war and at some point give him boon of chaos for +1 strength (on average you get to choose your trait) he gets to strength 9 A6 fighting twice at -3 with 3 damage per swing and then has a 2+/4++ save to fall back on. He wrecked my heirodule in one turn!

Lord Asvaldir Veteran

Lord Asvaldir

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Yeah I wouldn't call that near broken, in a 2k game it's going to be pretty tough to devote that many stratagems and psyhic powers just to a chaos lord. The crozius is definitely a good weapon though, a welcome change from last edition when it was mediocre.
Bloody Legionnaire Venerable Brother

Bloody Legionnaire

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@Bloody Legionnaire: Welcome to the seventeenth legion! I think doing a fluffy build for Word Bearers is actually far easier this edition than in the previous one. Possessed are finally worth taking so you don't have to feel like they are a wasted choice anymore, and cultists as always have remained useful. If you want to use summoning as well that's always an option but the good thing is unlike 7th I don't feel forced to use summoning anymore, since if you don't use our legion specific stratagem there's always lots of other good ones to use. That being said with the pts cost to summoning daemons I'll probably leave 200-300pts aside for summoning a bunch of blobs of 20 lesser daemons. WIth our stratagem might even be possible to reach a twelve more easily on 3d6 and summon a unit of 30. 

 

If you summon a herald of tzeentch, or any model that uses psychic powers I'd say you generate them when you summon the unit. 

 

I do love the leviathan but I save my FW purchases for my 30k army so unfortunately won't be running one in 40k. 

Funnily enough my WBs started as a 30k Army.. I still think I'll use them but the WEs just have better 30k rules. 

 

I didn't even think about the possibility of summoning large units that definitely something to look into. I'll be honest, and this is considering all legions, as good as the new rules are it still feels like CSM is lacking in identity on the table top. It's the same way I feel about my SWs.. like GW doesn't actually know what kind of Army they want us to be. I feel like CSM should probably shy a little bit more towards brutal CC but I know that's not true for all the legions. I'm really hoping we get something like our response to the Redemptor when we start getting new models. 

 

The unfortunate thing about getting our Codex so soon is we wont be getting an actual "release" like the Loyalist/Primaris are getting... 

ChaosReigns Battle-Brother

ChaosReigns

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I'm actually soaking a Leviathan right now in preparation for assembly. Running double Grav-flux Bombards and double hull-mounted Hellflamers looks absolutely savage for clearing hordes and those Bombards should do work against vehicles too. On the other hand, dual Soulburner Ribaudkin also looks pretty great, especially if you're playing against Grey Knights or Custodes where most of the enemy army has high toughness, multiple wounds, strong saves etc. All of those guns are short-ranged, but hey, what else is Warptime for, right? 

 

I'll let you guys know how it does when I get some games in with it. Unfortunately it's probably going to be a while though because I'm a really slow painter...

Zectz Battle-Brother

Zectz

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Jesus christ that Cursed Crozius is near broken. If you take a Chaos Lord in terminator armor, give him the cursed crozius and exalted champion for the warlord trait, hit him with diabolic strength, and then give him the fury of khorne stratagem and veterans of the long war and at some point give him boon of chaos for +1 strength (on average you get to choose your trait) he gets to strength 9 A6 fighting twice at -3 with 3 damage per swing and then has a 2+/4++ save to fall back on. He wrecked my heirodule in one turn!

Sounds great. A lot of CP used there. If only there was a way to get more CP easily to take advantage of all these insane stratagems instead of pooling reserve points wasting CP summoning daemons right?

 

;)

Bloody Legionnaire Venerable Brother

Bloody Legionnaire

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I'm actually soaking a Leviathan right now in preparation for assembly. Running double Grav-flux Bombards and double hull-mounted Hellflamers looks absolutely savage for clearing hordes and those Bombards should do work against vehicles too. On the other hand, dual Soulburner Ribaudkin also looks pretty great, especially if you're playing against Grey Knights or Custodes where most of the enemy army has high toughness, multiple wounds, strong saves etc. All of those guns are short-ranged, but hey, what else is Warptime for, right? 

 

I'll let you guys know how it does when I get some games in with it. Unfortunately it's probably going to be a while though because I'm a really slow painter...

I was reading the rules on that Grav bombard.. the things is just nasty! I couldn't decide if I would build one with one CCW or go two shooty weapons. CC always seems more fitting for CSM even though shooting is more powerful. 

 

Just a quick tip, after soaking and scrubbing with a toothbrush I'll let my resin models dry and then spray them with a coat of flat varnish before applying paint/primer. It really helps the next layer going over top bite into the surface and becomes much more durable. 

Cryptix Veteran

Cryptix

Posted
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Jesus christ that Cursed Crozius is near broken. If you take a Chaos Lord in terminator armor, give him the cursed crozius and exalted champion for the warlord trait, hit him with diabolic strength, and then give him the fury of khorne stratagem and veterans of the long war and at some point give him boon of chaos for +1 strength (on average you get to choose your trait) he gets to strength 9 A6 fighting twice at -3 with 3 damage per swing and then has a 2+/4++ save to fall back on. He wrecked my heirodule in one turn!

Sounds great. A lot of CP used there. If only there was a way to get more CP easily to take advantage of all these insane stratagems instead of pooling reserve points wasting CP summoning daemons right?

 

:wink:

 

Cultists are cheaper than demons :teehee:. Note to self - buy up all the genestealer neophytes in the store :unsure.:.

Lord Asvaldir Veteran

Lord Asvaldir

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Sounds great. A lot of CP used there. If only there was a way to get more CP easily to take advantage of all these insane stratagems instead of pooling reserve points wasting CP summoning daemons right?

 

 

You really don't need to save that many pts for summoning nor do you even need to use that many CP. If you want to save pts for let's say 2 units of 20 lesser daemons, that's around 300pts, and you're not even necessarily going to need our stratagem reroll every time. Plus with an instrument in the unit, you only need an 8" charge to reach a unit on the turn they get summoned which is not bad at all. Yes a patrol detachment of daemons might be better, but I think I will at least try summoning in several games before writing it off as useless. 

 

@Swarmlord, cultists might be cheaper but daemons have a lot more milage. +5 invul plus khorne/slaanesh lesser daemons hit a lot harder in cc than cultists. 

Bloody Legionnaire Venerable Brother

Bloody Legionnaire

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But summoning adds so much more to your army's tactical flexibility. Even with just lesser daemons being able to throw a 20 strong unit anywhere on the board can be very strong if not crippling at the right time. And you're absolutely correct Asvaldir.. you don't need to use command points for the majority of units you would want to summon. 

Lord Asvaldir Veteran

Lord Asvaldir

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I have my Chaos Terminator lord. Should I look into replacing his axe head with a mace for the Cursed Crozarius? Consider that this character with the axe can currently use a Force Axe if he chooses as a Terminator Sorcerer.

Soon as I saw the stats for the crozius I threw a mace on my chaos lord. Fluff wise sure the dark apostle makes more sense but it's such a good weapon and I want it on the far tougher/stronger combat character.

Leonite Veteran

Leonite

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I have my Chaos Terminator lord. Should I look into replacing his axe head with a mace for the Cursed Crozarius? Consider that this character with the axe can currently use a Force Axe if he chooses as a Terminator Sorcerer.

Soon as I saw the stats for the crozius I threw a mace on my chaos lord. Fluff wise sure the dark apostle makes more sense but it's such a good weapon and I want it on the far tougher/stronger combat character.

 

I suppose I'll start looking for a mace head then. Maybe use some blu tac to swap between them for sorcerer/lord

Commissar K. Veteran

Commissar K.

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Am I right that our Helbrute doesn't benefit anything from the Legion Trait?

I dont even play Word Bearers but I'm actually legit pissed on how they managed to make this rule out of it.

 

Prime reason being is that Fallen and Fabius can be ignored for Legion Detachment 'completeness' yet for some unknown reason this doesn't apply for Word Bearers and Daemons? Which to makes A. No sence, B. Makes Dark Pact incredibly akward to actually use, C. As you said has very limited use in general (especially if you want to go for a narrative heavy design and use multiple Dark Apostles) and D. Makes me really scatch my head in terms of what I used to know about WB versus what they represent now.

I've been out of it for a long period but have Word Bearers changed from "top guys for Daemonic Pacts" to "Just hating the Imperium a lot"? Because the way it all interacts makes Word Bearers in the Codex be designed by somebody who just knew the latter part of the Word Bearers identity...

Lord Asvaldir Veteran

Lord Asvaldir

Posted
Posted

 

Am I right that our Helbrute doesn't benefit anything from the Legion Trait?

I dont even play Word Bearers but I'm actually legit pissed on how they managed to make this rule out of it.

 

Prime reason being is that Fallen and Fabius can be ignored for Legion Detachment 'completeness' yet for some unknown reason this doesn't apply for Word Bearers and Daemons? Which to makes A. No sence, B. Makes Dark Pact incredibly akward to actually use, C. As you said has very limited use in general (especially if you want to go for a narrative heavy design and use multiple Dark Apostles) and D. Makes me really scatch my head in terms of what I used to know about WB versus what they represent now.

I've been out of it for a long period but have Word Bearers changed from "top guys for Daemonic Pacts" to "Just hating the Imperium a lot"? Because the way it all interacts makes Word Bearers in the Codex be designed by somebody who just knew the latter part of the Word Bearers identity...

 

 

Actually doesn't really bother me a whole lot surprisingly. If I really want daemons in my WB army, it's simple enough to just put aside say 300pts for summoning, or just take a patrol detachment of daemons. Either way they end up in the force somehow. Multiple Dark Apostles isn't actually really narrative friendly though, since every host is lead by a dark apostle they are basically on the same rank level as chapter masters in the WB hierarchy, one in a army list is plenty. 

 

For making the cursed crozius, the chaos knight kit for fantasy has a lot of good maul/mace heads, I used one from there for my cursed crozius coryphaeus. 

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