[HH1.0] Emperor's Children Tactica

[Hesh Kadesh]

Fulgrim can only choose Strategic.

[MorgothNL]

Fulgrim can only choose Strategic.

Nope, he can choose from the HH Warlord traits too.

 

"..a single warlord trait from either the strategic tactical (bla bla bla).. Or the legion warlord traits from the crusade army book" 

Edited January 8, 2016 by MorgothNL

[Hesh Kadesh]

Cool, completely missed that, could have sworn it was strategical only.

[Theredknight]

Hmm, I'm pretty sure they don't function as a stand alone unit, like other special termies.(there's also a lot of fearless out there don't forget)

They can't hold their own without also having numerous additional characters supporting them enabling them to work properly.

 

If and when the rules come out in the next book they might come out the box, until then il spend 800+ pts somewhere else!

[Hesh Kadesh]

There really isn't a lot of Fearless tbh. There are ways to get it, sure, but few are actually taken. It's nice if you can get it, but you're usually tradinbg offensive power for defensive, and it's usually better to kill before being killed.

 

And I do beg to differ, that 15 WS4 (hopefully, WS5 come book 6) S5 I5 AP2 attacks with the ability to sweep need babysitting. Can actually make them a useable unit with needing to babysat by Palatines, or a Command Squad to let the unit sweep. If you really want to buff them, put either a Praetor with Paragon Blade for challenge wiping at Initiative 7 or a Forge Lord to make them wound on 2's AND take Meltabombs+Graviton Gun, and gain a 4++ Save. 

[Sanct]

The problem is that the only benefit to a forge lord taking terminator armour is the graviton gun and you don't really want that in a unit of ap2 melee dudes.  He even loses a melee attack by doing it.

 

You'd be better with the chaplain or just adding more fuel on the fire (in the form of models)

[Hesh Kadesh]

I'd have assumed you'd keep him him with a Phoenix Spear or Power Fist anyway, so the lost attack isn't an issue and he can take a pair of Twin LC's for the extra attack otherwise if you really need it. I'd have thought the addition of Radnades would make up for it as well.

[Theredknight]

In my experience, there's enough to make a difference on the units you want to be attacking with these expensive terminators which can't shoot. Characters that confer etc.

 

Also invulnerable saves are enough alone, only need to deflect a few blows and your taking power fists to the face in return then your at ap3.

Every time I have charged these at specialist or legion terminators they have been outclassed and susceptible to the attacks back. When that happens they are bogged down then.

Sure there's the possibility you could sweep them, but it's not very high.

I have tried numerous combinations, and only spending very high points on them they can function.. Unlike other legions termies who can stand alone and do their job for their price tag. (Sallies, if, justearin to a point)

If they get t an update then maybe il look at them again.

[depthcharge12]

Has anyone been nutty enough to take an EC character with a charnabal saber alongside a sonic shrieker for I8 in challenges? :P

[Theredknight]

I don't think the initiative is the problem, I tried tarvitz a few times who struck first and he got bummed by a Tac sarge with fist, charnabal sabres just don't get enough in for that chance rend always hoping for the 6!

[Hesh Kadesh]

Charnabal Sabres are +1 WS?

[depthcharge12]

Charnabal Sabres are +1 WS?

What do you mean? They improve I by one in challenges, so I5 base plus 1 for EC in challenge LA rule + 1 for sonic shrieker + 1 from the saber is I8, unless they don't stack.

 

+1 WS in challenges is the WE special rule.

[Hesh Kadesh]

Been that long since I ran Charnabl Sabres I'd convinced myself they did something useful.

[01RTB01]

Charnabal sabres are rending - palatines with them rock with volume of attacks and ws5. My ten man jump packers have 3 spears and rest with sabres. They always slaughter and have had a good go at firedrakes before which is no mean feat!

[Theredknight]

In numbers they might do it when needed, in a challenge though, they will fail you, trust me. Tarvitz even has a s5 (or 6?) sword and he still didn't do anything to an art armoured sarge with powerfist. Apart from spray his brain matter over his armour of course.

Wow you run pallys with j packs? You sir are a brave man, mind kept dying!!

[01RTB01]

Not bravery, perfect tactics :p they run along with eidolon. When your opponent also has a backyard leviathan to deal with as well as rushing fully loaded Spartan the palatines hug cover and don't get shot to death - usually...

[dark_elf]

How are your Leviathan's working for you? Grav and Claw?

 

I'm looking to add one because I love the model but it takes up a heavy support slot and with a DDP, its easily over 300pts. I would be interested in seeing the rest of your list if you have one around the boards.

[01RTB01]

Last game I played was 4k vs salamanders. Minimal losses and wiped them out. (Eidolon managed to seize the initiative which made a huge difference as I managed to kill his typhon without it shooting). We trialled kakophoni as troops with relentless (upcoming in book 6) and heavy 2 (hopeful red book upgrade)

 

HQ Lord Commander Eidolon + Jump Pack 205

Elites 10 Palatine Blades + 3 Phoenix Power Spears + Jump Packs 365

 

Elites 7 Legion Terminators + Cataphractii armour + Grenade harness 245

Combi plasma + power fist 12

Combi plasma + chain fist 17

Combi plasma + lightning claw 12

Plasma blaster + chainfist 25

Combi plasma + power fist 12

Combi plasma + chain fist 17

Combi plasma + chainfist 17

Transport """The Emperor's Pride"" Spartan Assault Tank + Flare Shield + Ceramite" 340

 

Elites """Brother Flavius"" Contemptor Dreadnough + 2 x Kheres Pattern Assault Cannons" 205

Contemptor Dreadnought + 2 Twin-linked Volkite Calivers 205

 

Troops 16 man tac squad + extra combat weapons + vox + vexilia + artificer + power weapon 272

 

Troops """The Enlightened - The Kakophoni"" 9 Chora + 1 Orchestrator" 245

 

Troops """The Kakophoni"" 9 Chora + 1 Orchestrator" 245

 

Troops "Tactical Support Squad x 8 + 8 Plasma guns + ""Sergeant "" + Artificer Armour " 275

Fast attack Anvillus Dreadclaw drop pod 100

 

Fast Attack """Xerxes"" Primaris-Lightning Strike Fighter + 6 Kraken penetrator heavy missiles + Battle Servitor Control + Ground-tracking auguries" 235

 

Heavy Leviathan Siege Dreadnought + Phosphex Launcher + Ceramite 320

Transport Dreadnought drop pod 65

 

Elites 3 Quad Mortars 180

 

Heavy Deredeo + plasma cannonade + aiolos 255

 

Heavy Deimos Vindicator Laser Destroyer 130

 

 

3999=

Love the leviathan and it plays like a dread should. I run claw and drill and it's been very smashy so far. Pod down, remain in pod, shoot out. Following turn go and smash!

 

I also took part in an 8 player game - 1500 each and took the list below. No pod so it just waddled towards a stompa and due to the game's oddities I got shot at for two consecutive turns - no damage :) - that included a fully upgraded dakka stompa. The leviathan then proceeded to wipe out fulgrim's bodyguard and nearly bested the primarch.

HQ Lord Commander Eidolon + Jump Pack + Pride of the Legion 205

Elites """Parthica"" 8 Palatine Blades + Jump Packs" 275

 

Troops """The Ustalik"" - 5 Veteran Tactical Marines + Sniper + 2 Plasma Guns" 140

 

Troops """Squad Cyrenaica"" 5 Veteran Tactical Marines + Sniper + 2 Plasma Guns" 140

 

Elites """Brother Flavius"" Contemptor Mortis Dreadnough + 2 x Kheres Pattern Assault Cannons" 180

 

Heavy """Sarissa"" Deimos vindicator laser destroyer" 135

 

Heavy """Deathrain"" Scorpius Whirlwind" 115

 

Heavy """Argus Panoptes"" Leviathan Siege Dreadnought + volkites + drill + Phosphex Launcher" 300

 

1490

Edited January 11, 2016 by 01RTB01

[Slips]

I hope you know that taking 2 Specials per 5 Tac Vets was an illegal Choice? They only get 1 in 5 for Special Weapons.

 

I'd also simplify the way you list out the Terminator Loadouts; for one remove the total points cost 'cuz Board Rules. 6x Combi-Plasma, 1 Plasma Blaster, 4x Chain Fists, 2x Power Fists and 1 Lightning Claw is sufficient

 

Also for Clarity's Sake keeping to the:

 

HQ

ELITES

TROOPS
FAST ATTACK
HEAVY SUPPORT
LORD OF WAR

 

Format helps avoid any possible confusion. Just specify beside their unit entry if they're to Join/Ride anything Specific.

 

Otherwise I'd be curious for an Actual Bat Rep if you could manage it

Edited January 11, 2016 by Slipstreams

[01RTB01]

I'll alter when I get chance and give a run down - typo re the plasma guns - I ended up using none for ease in the end :) I'll update later if or when opportunity arises :)

[Sanct]

I'd have assumed you'd keep him him with a Phoenix Spear or Power Fist anyway, so the lost attack isn't an issue and he can take a pair of Twin LC's for the extra attack otherwise if you really need it. I'd have thought the addition of Radnades would make up for it as well.

 

He's already got a power fist attack so I prefer to lean on the s6 provided by a power maul so he can ID t4.  Think he has a similar chance as Eidolon at killing someone in a first round challenge for 50 points less.

 

In numbers they might do it when needed, in a challenge though, they will fail you, trust me. Tarvitz even has a s5 (or 6?) sword and he still didn't do anything to an art armoured sarge with powerfist. Apart from spray his brain matter over his armour of course.

Wow you run pallys with j packs? You sir are a brave man, mind kept dying!!

 

Tarvitz really lacks.  FW did like to reduce attacks and make them 2-handed with no benefits in book 1.

Edited January 12, 2016 by Sanct

[Caustic63]

So the first month of the Escalation League is done, and my painting project is complete. I scored pretty high, though given that it was played at a GW location the amount of 30K players wanting games seemed low. I ended up playing against a Tau list using formations from the Mont'Ka book and it unsurprisingly went very poorly (though the fact I never rolled higher then 4" for my charge moves certainly didn't help - Maru Skara and Eidolon would've been helpful). Here are some pictures taken by the store manager on the day when I submitted my models for scoring:

 

 

Current point totals:

 

Painting Points:

 

Painted (3 colours and based) - 4/4 points

Washes / Highlights - 2/2 points

Sand/Grass/special details used on the base -1/2 points (no special details)

 

Gaming Points:

 

Play game at correct points/warscoll count level - 3/3 points

fully painted models - 2/2 points

Loss - 1/2 points

 

Hobby Points:

Converted HQ model - 3/3 points

 

Total = 16/18 points

 

 

Note that the Contemptor Mortis Dreadnaught is not the unique EC variety - I was forced to change it out for the Betrayal at Calth Dreadnaught by store rules since he only allows one unit/model of Forgeworld per point bracket (so 1 for 1000pts, 2 for 1500pts, 3 for 2000pts, etc). Of course I was only made aware of this policy one week before the painted models were due so it posed some significant last minute challenges for me. This same policy forced me to remove the Javelin Speeder from my army prior to the game, weakening me considerably in a matchup that was already stacked against me. Anyway, now I'm moving on to the 1500pts bracket which is due on February 13th. Here is the list I'm planning on using (pure Forgeworld units are bolded - GW models with Forgeworld upgrade parts such as Rhinos, Predators, Outriders and Dreadclaws are permitted):

 

HQ:

 

Legion Centurion (Warlord)

> Consul: Chaplain (Power Mace)

> Phoenix Power Spear, Sonic Shrieker

> Artificer Armour, MBs, Combat Shield

 

TROOPS:

 

Legion Tactical Squad (x10)

> Sergeant w Power Spear, MBs

> Legion Vexilla

 

Legion Tactical Squad (x10)

> Sergeant w Power Spear, MBs

> Legion Vexilla

 

ELITES:

 

Legion Terminator Squad (x5)

> Tartarus Terminator Armour

> Combi-Plasma (x5)

> Power Sword (x3)

> Chainfist (x2)

 

Contemptor Mortis Dreadnaught

> Two Kheres Assault Cannons

 

Apothecarion Detachment (x2)  [i'm converting these guys from two Fabius Bile models]

> Augury Scanner (x2)

 

FAST ATTACK:

 

Javelin Attack Speeder

> Cyclone Missile Launcher

> Hunter Killer Missiles (x2)

 

Legion Outriders (x5)

> TL Plasmagun (x5)

 

HEAVY SUPPORT:

 

Legion Strike Predator

> Executioner Plasma Cannon

> Heavy Bolter Sponsons

 

ARMY TOTAL                       1500pts

 

My basic plan for this list is to run the Chaplain with the Terminator Squad and use them aggressively while the Tactical Squads hang back and hold objectives with the Mortis Contemptor and the Executioner. I realize that Foot Terminators are a poor idea and if I had my way they would be 100% riding in a Dreadclaw (which I own), but the hobby challenge for next month is to paint a Flyer/Super Heavy/Gargantuan Creature and I won't get the 3 points then if I use the model now. At such a low points value (for 30K) no other mobility option is viable for them unless I change the character of the list and get a Spartan/Land Raider. However, I'd prefer to have the firepower units I've taken remain in my army. Removing the Terminators entirely would reduce my scoring presence, and force me to paint more models for Febuary 13th (in additon to making the effort I put into them wasted).

 

My overall goals for this Emperor's Children army is for it to be fast, aggressive and hard hitting. I'm still debating about whether including overpriced Assault Squads are worth it, given how cost effective larger Tactical Marine squads are. At this points level I can't quite afford to run a Maru Skara list yet, but rest assured I will once I reach the next points level (Eidolon and the coverted Palatine Blades are already assembled and ready to go). Some people have suggested that it's a weaker Rite of War, but my instincts are telling me that it isn't. I've talked about it thoroughly in previous posts in this thread, but in my first 30K game I kept hearing that voice in my head saying that if I had the extra 1" movement and 1" run and 1" charge and Eidolon's bonus I'd be in better shape. Nothing hurts quite like missing that charge by 1" or 2" and then losing your unit to enemy firepower next turn (in the case of Tau, he just Jet Packed away).

 

I also have two squads of Kakophoni on hand and ready to go - just in case the new Rite of War turns out to be THAT good next month.

Edited January 13, 2016 by Caustic63

[Charlo]

One unit/ model from FW, when you are using a 30k list? What idiot thought up that rule?

 

Your force looks awesome though!

[Hesh Kadesh]

One unit/ model from FW, when you are using a 30k list? What idiot thought up that rule?

 

Your force looks awesome though!

It is a store selling models. If it goes through FW store, it doesn't go through his till. And considering that is the reason for them...

[Hesh Kadesh]

Edit, been thinking about a light 3k list.

 

Fulgrim, Fireblade, (Pride, Infiltrate)

Consul

 

Phoenix Terminators, 4 Extra, Sonoc Shriekers, Infiltrate

Phoenix Terminators, Sonic Shriekers Dreadclaw

Phoenix Terminators, Somjc Shriekers, Dreadclaw

 

Legion Dread, Dual Grav, Chainfist, Dreadnought Drop Pod

Legion Dread, Dual Grav, Chainfist, Dreadnought Drop Pod

Rapiers, Graviton Cannons x3, Infiltrate

Rapiers, Graviton Cannons x3, Infiltrate

 

Kharybdis

Legion Predator, Heavy Conversion Beamer, Combi Bolter

Legion Predator, Heavy Conversion Beamer, Combi Bolter

 

Consul starts off the field, comes on amd attempts to deny home objectives. Infiltrating Rapiers make a mess of heavy assault vehicles, while Artillery Predators sit at range and put S10 AP1 Blasts on things to strip HP and hopefullybdamage weapons.

 

Turn 1, Fulgrim and his big unit come in supported by melee dreads who go for out of sight targets. Turn 2, the rest of the phoenix guard come in and prepare to assault demeched units.

 

In amticipation of it getting better as Book VI is released fixing everythingnthat is wrong with them (as they now sweep, and I5 S5 AP2, with either forcing a blind test thanks to Fulgrim or WS5 buff).

 

Of course, it may struggle against a cultist horde, but then again, they can stay in their vehicles all day long and just blat away with heat blast.